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[MegumiAzusa]

IsaacShep wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Not to mention that again in this scene dream foliage is present.

Yes, Bioware reuses textures all over their games. What's weird/shocking about it?

Because it could be that it isn't just reused but used on purpose because Sheps reality isn't as real as it should be. There are special plant types for the Presidium, so using dream stuff in addition can be taken as a hint of this mixed reality.

So a hint of a mised reality is placed in a game file name that 99% of players won't know about because they will never see the file names?

The player can still notice that some types of plants are used in nearly any part of the game. Combine that with the nudge that you can ask Avina about the plants on the Citadel. That makes it very much seem like it was done on purpose.

EpyonX3 wrote...
I remember having a discussion with Dante about normandy parts of the Citadel. We were trying to establish the parts that belong to the Citadel and those that belong to the crucible. It's possible that the platform you're standing on is all crucible. This would explain the human and geth(which can also be quarian) parts in that chamber.

No it's not possible as just this bit proves:

[DJBare]

EpyonX3 wrote...

It wasn't my suggestion, it was actually Dante's. I just never continued the investigation. I might look into it again.

If taken at face value, then Shepard is definitely on the citadel, you have to look up while on the starbinger level and you will see the crucible above you.

[HellishFiend]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

The player can still notice that some types of plants are used in nearly any part of the game. Combine that with the nudge that you can ask Avina about the plants on the Citadel. That makes it very much seem like it was done on purpose.

That's a really good point, actually. It seemed pretty random that you could ask Avina about plants. It does make sense as a "nudge" though, like you describe. 

[MegumiAzusa]

HellishFiend wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

The player can still notice that some types of plants are used in nearly any part of the game. Combine that with the nudge that you can ask Avina about the plants on the Citadel. That makes it very much seem like it was done on purpose.

That's a really good point, actually. It seemed pretty random that you could ask Avina about plants. It does make sense as a "nudge" though, like you describe.

Who knows, maybe the cubemap of the Citadel walls in ME1 (showing a nice mountain panorama) was done on purpose too.

[Dwailing]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

The player can still notice that some types of plants are used in nearly any part of the game. Combine that with the nudge that you can ask Avina about the plants on the Citadel. That makes it very much seem like it was done on purpose.

That's a really good point, actually. It seemed pretty random that you could ask Avina about plants. It does make sense as a "nudge" though, like you describe.

Who knows, maybe the cubemap of the Citadel walls in ME1 (showing a nice mountain panorama) was done on purpose too.

Wait, there was a cubemap of a mountain panorama on the Citadel in ME1?   I must say, though, that thing about the plants DID seem out of place.  When I saw it, I was trying to figure out its significance.

Modifié par Dwailing, 24 mai 2012 - 03:08 .

[MaximizedAction]

It's actually a nice coincidence that Grissom Academy, the station that has dreamy plants all over the place on it, is also the place where we hear how Cerberus is trying to brainwash the kids.

I think it is just a coincidence, since neither the plants nor the brainwashing are out of place. But nonetheless, a nice coincidence.

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 24 mai 2012 - 03:09 .

[MegumiAzusa]

Dwailing wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

The player can still notice that some types of plants are used in nearly any part of the game. Combine that with the nudge that you can ask Avina about the plants on the Citadel. That makes it very much seem like it was done on purpose.

That's a really good point, actually. It seemed pretty random that you could ask Avina about plants. It does make sense as a "nudge" though, like you describe.

Who knows, maybe the cubemap of the Citadel walls in ME1 (showing a nice mountain panorama) was done on purpose too.

Wait, there was a cubemap of a mountain panorama on the Citadel in ME1?   I must say, though, that thing about the plants DID seem out of place.  When I saw it, I was trying to figure out its significance.

Ya some of the walls have it, you can see it on some in the Wards if I remember correctly.

[SmawgSS]

1st, I support the indoctrination theory, there's lots of evidence for it (and I think that's why Bioware stated that they stood behind their ending).

2nd, anyone ever see the movie Inception? It's an interesting concept....

[Dantexr3]

But, what if the Crucible is really a secondary plan from the Reapers to guarantee a victory? They assure that all species are busy working on that device, and at the moment where they counter-attack the Reapers, at the same time the Crucible makes the Reapers win with Control, Synthesis and even Destroy (yes, the attacking Reapers get destroyed, but we don't really know if all of them do, or if the Catalyst is still alive).

That should add points to the IT.

[dreamgazer]

HellishFiend wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

The player can still notice that some types of plants are used in nearly any part of the game. Combine that with the nudge that you can ask Avina about the plants on the Citadel. That makes it very much seem like it was done on purpose.

That's a really good point, actually. It seemed pretty random that you could ask Avina about plants. It does make sense as a "nudge" though, like you describe. 

In the previous games, we were allowed to ask Avina about periphery elements that had next to nothing to do with the actual progression of the narrative.  That was then, though; in the third game, Avina's delivery of information seems to pivot entirely on purpose after purpose tying into the actual game's progression, from general descriptions of environments to pointing out things for side-missions.   The plants would be one of the only specific things that's kinda just dangling there. 

You can see that as laziness on BioWare's fault in not giving Avina more of a "thorough tour-guide" role, or you can see it as acknowledgment that we've already roladexed our way through everything Avina could tell us---but that's easily explainable, given that Avina keeps a tally of when Shepard recently checked in to the Citadel.  

Point being: the plants seem like they have a purpose, and unless I'm neglecting to remember something, directing our awareness to the flora and fauna of the Citadel didn't tie directly to a side-mission. 

Modifié par dreamgazer, 24 mai 2012 - 03:35 .

[DJBare]

Got some images of inconsistency perhaps?, I'm not up on military ranks for ME3, but is not Anderson an admiral from the moment ME3 begins?
Anderson 3 stripes

admiral Hackett 4 stripes

And now admiral Anderson 4 stripes

Modifié par DJBare, 24 mai 2012 - 03:35 .

[Dwailing]

DJBare wrote...

Got some images of inconsistency perhaps?, I'm not up on military ranks for ME3, but is not Anderson an admiral from the moment ME3 begins?
Anderson 3 stripes

admiral Hackett 4 stripes

And now admiral Anderson 4 stripes

Interesting, although I'm not really sure if this means anything since we see Anderson in this outfit every time we talk to him on the Normandy.  I mean, I guess it's possible that Shep was already seeing things, but I'm thinking this one is not a clue.

Edit: It could be a field promotion that we just never hear about.

Modifié par Dwailing, 24 mai 2012 - 03:39 .

[DJBare]

Dwailing wrote...

DJBare wrote...

Got some images of inconsistency perhaps?, I'm not up on military ranks for ME3, but is not Anderson an admiral from the moment ME3 begins?
Anderson 3 stripes

Interesting, although I'm not really sure if this means anything since we see Anderson in this outfit every time we talk to him on the Normandy.  I mean, I guess it's possible that Shep was already seeing things, but I'm thinking this one is not a clue.

Edit: It could be a field promotion that we just never hear about.

Don't forget there is further inconstancy that we know of, he is not to referred to as admiral until Shepard speaks to him on the citadel, all earlier dialogue just uses "Anderson:" on the citadel it becomes "Admiral Anderson:"

Edit: Note the third image, in the vehicle.

Modifié par DJBare, 24 mai 2012 - 03:45 .

[Dwailing]

DJBare wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

DJBare wrote...

Got some images of inconsistency perhaps?, I'm not up on military ranks for ME3, but is not Anderson an admiral from the moment ME3 begins?
Anderson 3 stripes

Interesting, although I'm not really sure if this means anything since we see Anderson in this outfit every time we talk to him on the Normandy.  I mean, I guess it's possible that Shep was already seeing things, but I'm thinking this one is not a clue.

Edit: It could be a field promotion that we just never hear about.

Don't forget there is further inconstancy that we know of, he is not to referred to as admiral until Shepard speaks to him on the citadel, all earlier dialogue just uses "Anderson:" on the citadel it becomes "Admiral Anderson:"

Yeah, I remember that being mentioned before.  Honestly, the thing that always got me was how he was always seen wearing his captain uniform even after he was promoted.  What was up with that?

Modifié par Dwailing, 24 mai 2012 - 03:46 .

[HellishFiend]

Dantexr3 wrote...

But, what if the Crucible is really a secondary plan from the Reapers to guarantee a victory? They assure that all species are busy working on that device, and at the moment where they counter-attack the Reapers, at the same time the Crucible makes the Reapers win with Control, Synthesis and even Destroy (yes, the attacking Reapers get destroyed, but we don't really know if all of them do, or if the Catalyst is still alive).

That should add points to the IT.

Yeah, many of us have come to the conclusion that the Crucible is actualy a reaper trap, but we think it's more likely to be some sort of mass indoctrination device rather than a device that operates the way we see in the hallucination. 

[shepskisaac]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

The player can still notice that some types of plants are used in nearly any part of the game. Combine that with the nudge that you can ask Avina about the plants on the Citadel. That makes it very much seem like it was done on purpose.

Yeah, he could notice the same textures being used in ME2 and ME1 as well. Same crates in all 3 games, same vehicles, same clothes etc etc. Guess the entire trilogy was one giant indoctrination.

[MaximizedAction]

HellishFiend wrote...

Dantexr3 wrote...

But, what if the Crucible is really a secondary plan from the Reapers to guarantee a victory? They assure that all species are busy working on that device, and at the moment where they counter-attack the Reapers, at the same time the Crucible makes the Reapers win with Control, Synthesis and even Destroy (yes, the attacking Reapers get destroyed, but we don't really know if all of them do, or if the Catalyst is still alive).

That should add points to the IT.

Yeah, many of us have come to the conclusion that the Crucible is actualy a reaper trap, but we think it's more likely to be some sort of mass indoctrination device rather than a device that operates the way we see in the hallucination. 

BTW, tried to play Arrival without music on and heard those high pitch notes already in the hangar while Kenson was hacking that elevator.
You know, the notes that were posted about yesterday (while the Crucible beam is charging).

So +1 from me for the Crucible acting like something along the lines of Object Rho.

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 24 mai 2012 - 03:54 .

[BatmanTurian]

MrStoob wrote...

There are no timescales provided in the closing sections, so stating that Shep wouldn't be able to do X thing in Y time because it was Z distance away is futile.

This is the biggest load of crock... seriously, this is what you guys are down to? The arguments are getting more and more ridiculous. The sheer denial... ugh.

[Dwailing]

BatmanTurian wrote...

MrStoob wrote...

There are no timescales provided in the closing sections, so stating that Shep wouldn't be able to do X thing in Y time because it was Z distance away is futile.

This is the biggest load of crock... seriously, this is what you guys are down to? The arguments are getting more and more ridiculous. The sheer denial... ugh.

I know, the literalist arguments are getting so ludicrous lately that it isn't even funny.

[RavenEyry]

BatmanTurian wrote...

MrStoob wrote...

There are no timescales provided in the closing sections, so stating that Shep wouldn't be able to do X thing in Y time because it was Z distance away is futile.

This is the biggest load of crock... seriously, this is what you guys are down to? The arguments are getting more and more ridiculous. The sheer denial... ugh.

Even in the unlikely event there was an hour between the first explosion and the citadel explosion, I still doubt Shep would be able to escape.

[D.Sharrah]

Since there is some coversation regarding Anderson going on...as I am doing a rengade playthrough (started all the way back in ME 1, up to Tuchanka in ME 3 now), I remembered one of the conversations that you have with Chakwas at the very beginning of the trilogy...its about Anderson is more than just a typical soldier, how he is reserved and measured - you would think that with TIM's information network he would be aware of this personality trait - and more to the point that Shepard having served under Anderson would be aware of this as well...yet when it comes down to ME 3 confrontation, TIM very clearly tries to convince Shepard that Anderson is just a gun (a very renegade perception, despite the majority of the trilogy giving the player the feeling that the opposite is true - that he is the epitome of paragon)...at the very least (and if especially if take this scene to be very literal) wouldn't this be a very clear example of manipulation. A tactic very common to indoctrination...

[llbountyhunter]

DJBare wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

DJBare wrote...

Got some images of inconsistency perhaps?, I'm not up on military ranks for ME3, but is not Anderson an admiral from the moment ME3 begins?
Anderson 3 stripes

Interesting, although I'm not really sure if this means anything since we see Anderson in this outfit every time we talk to him on the Normandy.  I mean, I guess it's possible that Shep was already seeing things, but I'm thinking this one is not a clue.

Edit: It could be a field promotion that we just never hear about.

Don't forget there is further inconstancy that we know of, he is not to referred to as admiral until Shepard speaks to him on the citadel, all earlier dialogue just uses "Anderson:" on the citadel it becomes "Admiral Anderson:"

Edit: Note the third image, in the vehicle.

i thought the "admiral anderson" thingy stopped bieng considerd evidence because apparently it happens quite frequently in other parts of the game.

[EpyonX3]

Shepard was on the Crucible! Not the Citadel, I shall render evidence of this shortly.

[blooregard]

HellishFiend wrote...

Dantexr3 wrote...

But, what if the Crucible is really a secondary plan from the Reapers to guarantee a victory? They assure that all species are busy working on that device, and at the moment where they counter-attack the Reapers, at the same time the Crucible makes the Reapers win with Control, Synthesis and even Destroy (yes, the attacking Reapers get destroyed, but we don't really know if all of them do, or if the Catalyst is still alive).

That should add points to the IT.

Yeah, many of us have come to the conclusion that the Crucible is actualy a reaper trap, but we think it's more likely to be some sort of mass indoctrination device rather than a device that operates the way we see in the hallucination. 

I personally think is was made during the very first cycle by the people fighting the Reapers. since there wouldn't have been as many Reapers the war would have lasted much longer. The first cycle managed to figure out how indoctrinaiton worked (to an extent at least) and they rigged the crucible to target that. The crucible would overload the indoctrination generator (think object Rho). The result would have been an overload of power in the indoctrination generator which would then cause a large internal explosion that would shred everything apart or damage it to the point where it wouldn't take much to bring down. The loss of the indoctrination device would make all of their technology inert, disable their ground forces, and release all indoctrinated organics from Reaper control; the result of that would be temporary coma followed by varying brain damage (Shepard may forget a couple things while TIM would become a vegetable)

As a point I wanted to add to my "ME2 were the machinations of an elaborate Reaper plot" theory when you defeat the Collectors (either through explosion or radiatoin pulse) Harbinger says "YOU HAVE FAILED...WE WILL FIND ANOTHER WAY". This could be pointing to the Collectors were unable to capture/kill/indoctrinate Shepard so he could lead the galaxy to destruction.

Modifié par blooregard, 24 mai 2012 - 04:03 .

[RavenEyry]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Shepard was on the Crucible! Not the Citadel, I shall render evidence of this shortly.

I hope thats a joke since you only have to look up to see the crucible above you.