55528 réponses à ce sujet

[UrgedDuke]

Lord Goose wrote...

If you don't believe that dreams are a part of indoctrination then replay Arrival and Reaper IFF missions, in both situations the workers complained of nightmares and false memories

Nightmares and false memories are quite different from complex hallucinations.

The workers were experiencing an early form of indoc. as was Shepard with his nightmares. Shepards dreams got progressivly worse as his Will became damaged Reaper influence grew stronger. The final scene is the end result of this. The reapers increased pressure with defeat close. You should be able to deduce this

[UrgedDuke]

Lord Goose wrote...

They are trying to trick him into accepting their ideology and by doing so he sucumbs to indoctrination.

Reapers idelogy can be summed up to this: "harvest all advanced beings". I don't see how Shepard agrees with them in any ending.

Ok now I'm starting to wonder if your trolling, you can't be serious

[Corik]

UrgedDuke wrote...

Lord Goose wrote...

They are trying to trick him into accepting their ideology and by doing so he sucumbs to indoctrination.

Reapers idelogy can be summed up to this: "harvest all advanced beings". I don't see how Shepard agrees with them in any ending.

Ok now I'm starting to wonder if your trolling, you can't be serious

he's just taking everything too literal. I don't think he's trolling.

[boeloe]

byne wrote...

I still wanna know why Shepard wasnt even sleeping during the second dream.

When it ends she's sitting at that coffee table thing in the middle of the room, holding a datapad.

So apparently she isnt just dreaming about the kid at night, she randomly zones out and thinks about him.

I'm not sure but i think Shephard is sitting up on the bed, perhaps he fell a sleep while working or something like that.

[byne]

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

I still wanna know why Shepard wasnt even sleeping during the second dream.

When it ends she's sitting at that coffee table thing in the middle of the room, holding a datapad.

So apparently she isnt just dreaming about the kid at night, she randomly zones out and thinks about him.

I'm not sure but i think Shephard is sitting up on the bed, perhaps he fell a sleep while working or something like that.

Except when he looks at the datapad, you can see the coffee table thing with wine glasses on it.

[UrgedDuke]

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

I still wanna know why Shepard wasnt even sleeping during the second dream.

When it ends she's sitting at that coffee table thing in the middle of the room, holding a datapad.

So apparently she isnt just dreaming about the kid at night, she randomly zones out and thinks about him.

I'm not sure but i think Shephard is sitting up on the bed, perhaps he fell a sleep while working or something like that.

Except when he looks at the datapad, you can see the coffee table thing with wine glasses on it.

Very simular to Anakin's vision in episode III. he was looking at a datapad while sitting on his couch just like shepard.... if you all get what im talking about

Modifié par UrgedDuke, 27 mai 2012 - 10:35 .

[llbountyhunter]

UrgedDuke wrote...

Lord Goose wrote...

If you don't believe that dreams are a part of indoctrination then replay Arrival and Reaper IFF missions, in both situations the workers complained of nightmares and false memories

Nightmares and false memories are quite different from complex hallucinations.

The workers were experiencing an early form of indoc. as was Shepard with his nightmares. Shepards dreams got progressivly worse as his Will became damaged Reaper influence grew stronger. The final scene is the end result of this. The reapers increased pressure with defeat close. You should be able to deduce this

a manipulated dream, is a form of halucinaiton. and actually the scientists in the derelict reaper DID experience a "full" halucination.

[boeloe]

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

I still wanna know why Shepard wasnt even sleeping during the second dream.

When it ends she's sitting at that coffee table thing in the middle of the room, holding a datapad.

So apparently she isnt just dreaming about the kid at night, she randomly zones out and thinks about him.

I'm not sure but i think Shephard is sitting up on the bed, perhaps he fell a sleep while working or something like that.

Except when he looks at the datapad, you can see the coffee table thing with wine glasses on it.

Which you can see if you sit up at the end of the bed.

[OH-UP-THIS!]

Lord Goose wrote...

Still they need to break their willpower.

Yes, and?
None of the options is about "submitting to Reapers". Even Synthesis.

Seriously? you actually believe that allowing those arrogant self-entitled space-squids to live is NOT submitting to them?

Somebody slept thru class again.

[byne]

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

I still wanna know why Shepard wasnt even sleeping during the second dream.

When it ends she's sitting at that coffee table thing in the middle of the room, holding a datapad.

So apparently she isnt just dreaming about the kid at night, she randomly zones out and thinks about him.

I'm not sure but i think Shephard is sitting up on the bed, perhaps he fell a sleep while working or something like that.

Except when he looks at the datapad, you can see the coffee table thing with wine glasses on it.

Which you can see if you sit up at the end of the bed.

It looks way closer than it would be if you were sitting on the bed, though.

[llbountyhunter]

ok, heres what I think happened. how it started.

-shuttle crashes, shepard gets knocked out
- shepard envisions the run toward beam
-the beginning of the reapers manupulation begins with harbys laser
-the dream loses more reality, it becomes more of a reaper construct.
-the rest develops according to classical IT.

Modifié par llbountyhunter, 27 mai 2012 - 10:43 .

[MegumiAzusa]

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

I still wanna know why Shepard wasnt even sleeping during the second dream.

When it ends she's sitting at that coffee table thing in the middle of the room, holding a datapad.

So apparently she isnt just dreaming about the kid at night, she randomly zones out and thinks about him.

I'm not sure but i think Shephard is sitting up on the bed, perhaps he fell a sleep while working or something like that.

Except when he looks at the datapad, you can see the coffee table thing with wine glasses on it.

Which you can see if you sit up at the end of the bed.

It looks way closer than it would be if you were sitting on the bed, though.

Full hallucinations are expected when you are fully indoctrinated but no one seems to read my comments *serious fishing for attention*

[boeloe]

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

I still wanna know why Shepard wasnt even sleeping during the second dream.

When it ends she's sitting at that coffee table thing in the middle of the room, holding a datapad.

So apparently she isnt just dreaming about the kid at night, she randomly zones out and thinks about him.

I'm not sure but i think Shephard is sitting up on the bed, perhaps he fell a sleep while working or something like that.

Except when he looks at the datapad, you can see the coffee table thing with wine glasses on it.

Which you can see if you sit up at the end of the bed.

It looks way closer than it would be if you were sitting on the bed, though.

Depth of Field effect maybe? UE3 does have shaders that simulate this effect.

[byne]

llbountyhunter wrote...

ok, heres what I think happened. how it started.

-shuttle crashes, shepard gets knocked out
- shepard envisions the run toward beam
-the beginning of the reapers manupulation begins with harbys laser
-the dream loses more reality, it becomes more of a reaper construct.
-the rest develops according to classical IT.

Starting at the shuttle crash makes more sense than starting after getting hit by Harby to me.

Gets rid of Shep somehow surviving what should be a lethal laser blast, as well as Anderson's horrible tactics of 'Lets rush straight at the beam in a single file line, screaming at the top of our lungs!'

That tactic doesnt seem like something Anderson would do.

[Munsterlander]

Everyones is having a go at trying to explain IT so I thaught I might have a go.
It's quite late so I don't know how this will turn out.

Since the developers are not able to indoctrinate us players, they had to come up with another way of indoctrinating. This other way is the choice system we see at the end of the game. The reason no other character apears to have this choice as shepard did was because they didn't have a person controling them who was in fact out of the experiance. So to do this every thing after being beemed by Harby is trying to convince the player that the other two options are better than destroy (I wont mention examples because we all know them). So after all these hints (many subtle) the player should be feeling that control or synth are the best corse of action... UNLESS they have had the will power (that I lacked) to see past all the b*** ***t and think nothing more than "I came here to destroy the reapers, and that's what I'm gunna do!" So then, in the developers eyes you have enough will power to not be indoctrinated... Am I making any sence here?

[D.Sharrah]

byne wrote...

snip..

Does he have a strict 'One laser per customer' policy?

snip..

Yes...its in his evil villian contract...but that's not the reason that he really hates his contract, its because he doesn't have unlimited kills anymore...

[Lord Goose]

he's just taking everything too literal. I
don't think he's trolling.

Yes, I'm trying to be as close to the text as possible, because interpretations are highly subjective.

Personally, I don't remember any instance about Reapers going into details what are their goals. Why did they have killed Protheans? Why they want to wipe out current cycle? What do they feel about it? No answers. They were like force of nature for me.

So, I don't think that they really care that Saren, TIM and anybody else think of them. They only needed them to be valuable tools, so they have allowed them to harbour delusions because they were useful. Much as they did with the geth, who worshipped them.

[D.Sharrah]

Corik wrote...

byne wrote...
Yeah, thats what I said.

Sorry, I misunderstood.

Seconded...

[byne]

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

boeloe wrote...

byne wrote...

I still wanna know why Shepard wasnt even sleeping during the second dream.

When it ends she's sitting at that coffee table thing in the middle of the room, holding a datapad.

So apparently she isnt just dreaming about the kid at night, she randomly zones out and thinks about him.

I'm not sure but i think Shephard is sitting up on the bed, perhaps he fell a sleep while working or something like that.

Except when he looks at the datapad, you can see the coffee table thing with wine glasses on it.

Which you can see if you sit up at the end of the bed.

It looks way closer than it would be if you were sitting on the bed, though.

Depth of Field effect maybe? UE3 does have shaders that simulate this effect.

Shep also appears to be leaning back, not fully lying down, which would make sense if she was sitting in that reclining chair right next to the coffee table

[Lord Goose]

those arrogant self-entitled
space-squids to live is NOT submitting to
them?

Personally, my Shepard choose Control ONLY because destroy ending reminded him about Han'Gerrel. Admiral was willing to sacrifice him and his squad in order to weaken the geth, and sacrificing geth and EDI would be the same thing. He may have done it if there were no other option, though.

[Corik]

Munsterlander wrote...

Everyones is having a go at trying to explain IT so I thaught I might have a go.
It's quite late so I don't know how this will turn out.

Since the developers are not able to indoctrinate us players, they had to come up with another way of indoctrinating. This other way is the choice system we see at the end of the game. The reason no other character apears to have this choice as shepard did was because they didn't have a person controling them who was in fact out of the experiance. So to do this every thing after being beemed by Harby is trying to convince the player that the other two options are better than destroy (I wont mention examples because we all know them). So after all these hints (many subtle) the player should be feeling that control or synth are the best corse of action... UNLESS they have had the will power (that I lacked) to see past all the b*** ***t and think nothing more than "I came here to destroy the reapers, and that's what I'm gunna do!" So then, in the developers eyes you have enough will power to not be indoctrinated... Am I making any sence here?

Indeed you are. In my first playthrough I said that and destroyed them. For some reason, I really thought the child was lying. So I just destroyed everything, as planned.

[Arian Dynas]

byne wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

ok, heres what I think happened. how it started.

-shuttle crashes, shepard gets knocked out
- shepard envisions the run toward beam
-the beginning of the reapers manupulation begins with harbys laser
-the dream loses more reality, it becomes more of a reaper construct.
-the rest develops according to classical IT.

Starting at the shuttle crash makes more sense than starting after getting hit by Harby to me.

Gets rid of Shep somehow surviving what should be a lethal laser blast, as well as Anderson's horrible tactics of 'Lets rush straight at the beam in a single file line, screaming at the top of our lungs!'

That tactic doesnt seem like something Anderson would do.

Harbinger's beam is an obvious transition for several reasons, and as I have pointed out, Anderson's tactic is more along the lines of "He can't possibly stop all of us, we just need someone to get there and we don't have much time. Our only option? Charge!"

[byne]

Lord Goose wrote...

those arrogant self-entitled
space-squids to live is NOT submitting to
them?

Personally, my Shepard choose Control ONLY because destroy ending reminded him about Han'Gerrel. Admiral was willing to sacrifice him and his squad in order to weaken the geth, and sacrificing geth and EDI would be the same thing. He may have done it if there were no other option, though.

Destroy reminds you of Han'Gerrel, but Control doesnt remind you of Xen?

Wanting to Control of the geth was literally Xen's entire reason for voting in favor of the war.

[EpyonX3]

Modifié par EpyonX3, 27 mai 2012 - 10:53 .

[Lord Goose]

Since the developers are not able to
indoctrinate us players, they had to come
up with another way of indoctrinating.

So, their message is ''you have to be able to Han'Gerrel if you wanna win''? Gosh. In that case I would hate them with passion.