55528 réponses à ce sujet

[DJBare]

Ravereth wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

@Ravereth Great screenshots! If it changed between shots it could have been a mistake in editing, but those shots show it changes on screen. I don't think that's possible to do by accident.

Actually it's not even the explosion which changes the gun but this strange white light




I'm scared now...

Yes, that's the concussion wave from the explosion, you can see it visually move toward Shepard.

[Wyatt Shepard]

Ok question, and forgive my noobness: lets assume that IT is true, or some version of it is true (which makes a great deal of sense to me). You reach the full destroy ending, Shepard lives and wakes up in the rubble left by Harbinger's blast.

This means, I think, that the Citadel never blew up. The relay's never destroyed or disabled, and critically, the Crucible never used and the Reapers never beaten. Sooooo...what then?

I'm curious because if the extended cut isn't new game play material, does that mean another DLC is coming to lay a beat down on the Reapers, or despite what Bioware said ME4 will be in the works and the fight against the Reapers continue....basically I just don't see how IT, as much as it makes sense, fits with what we know about the game and it's apparent ending/future.

[UrgentArchengel]

Lord Luc1fer wrote...

FamilyManFirst wrote...

 I hate to say it, but I don't think that IT is true.  I'd love it if it was, but I chalk up all of the inconsistencies and hints to one thing: time pressure.

As we all know, the devs have publicly stated that they had planned on an Indoctrination Sequence at one time, but that the gameplay didn't work out.  I think that the decision that the gameplay wouldn't work out was made very late in game development - like, say, October or November of 2011.  BioWare had already done a lot of work on the game to set up the Indoctrination Sequence, including all of the hints, the dreams, etc., and also including much of the ending sequence, and just didn't have time to rework everything.  Therefore, they filed to fit and painted to cover.  Remember that Martin Sheen was retained until very late, November 2011 I believe, to complete his VO work for TIM.  I think that, instead of an Indoctrination Sequence (probably with TIM involved) they tweaked the ending into the Dialog Sequence with TIM instead and just pretended that everything after Harbinger's beam was real instead of imagined.

This would account for all of the issues, large and small, that point to Indoctrination in the final sequence: it originally *was* going to be indoctrination.  However, sadly, the ending as-is is the real, actual ending to the game. 

Close the thread guys! we've just been proved wrong...

Well, at least he was nice in how he told us.  Unlike some Anti IT's out there.

[RavenEyry]

WinterCrow wrote...

Thanks for the shot!

I assume the similarity then comes with the ramp part, the scenario on the sides that "move" or something like that?

Yes, the bridge over the chasm just before the room with TIM and Anderson. There's electrical thingummies very similar to the ones in that screenshot.

[Arian Dynas]

SirRaven10 wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

"Bioware is lazy" is a cop-out at this point. Try something more substantial. The ending wouldn't be rushed because it was likely finished in the middle of development, not at the end.

I'm not defending them so it isn't a cop-out. It's just flat out truth. As for the ending, it very much was rushed. They've already gone on record saying they delayed Martin Sheen's audio session from August to November to tweak the script. The game came out in March. There's no doubt they were in serious crunch time to meet a deadline.

The flaws with ME3 aren't just in the ending...it's just that's all people are focusing on. There are plenty of hints of laziness throughout the game that no one cares to mention.......well not laziness but just shortcuts because of time.

cop-out also cop·out[/b] (kpout)n. Slang1. A failure to fulfill a commitment or responsibility or to face a difficulty squarely.2. A person who fails to fulfill a commitment or responsibility.3. An excuse for inaction or evasion.
In other words, you continue to fail to provide a further excuse than "Bioware was lazy" when you, not being an employee of Bioware, nor involved with the development process in any way, shape or form cannot make this claim with any degree of reliablilty. You site various graphical glitches and bugs, which to be honest I have personally never seen, at all in the game (perhaps your computer just sucks, or mayhaps it's the graphical limitiations of consoles) as evidence, even though minor, rare graphical glitches follow the very definition of shippable bugs. Something far more trouble to fix than it is worth.

In fact, part of why Bioware was not rushed was more than likely good time management, knowing when NOT to bother with things, hence why we can call the maps of trees evidence because removing them would have likely been no more complex than switching off a checkbox.

You spend your time citing two pieces of evidence that Bioware was lazy (what you expect a perfect game entirely free of glitches? Not going to happen buddy, not in this market) in the actual game design, and yet neither is paticularly significant, or all that detrimental. We on the other hand cite TONS of evidence that Bioware is anything BUT lazy when it comes to game design, and the simple fact that it is a logical fail to beleive that a company that is a multi-national company with a billion dollar a year buisness like EA or Bioware could choose to be "lazy" on its cash cow.

Mass Effect 3 likely got QA testing up the wazoo to come out as clean and smooth running as it did, and for me at least it runs smoother than fresh churned butter. It is one of the most bug free games I have ever seen, and having played The Temple of Elemental Evil, I've seen ALOT of very buggy games.

But the fact is, even if this is all crazy, A). We're going to keep doing it for the simple fact that it's fun, is this really so hard to understand? And . We only found the evidence we have by doing this sort of stuff, and as the sheer number of things that could only have been done intentionally shows, there is still more to find, and we will keep doing so.

[DJBare]

Wyatt Shepard wrote...

Ok question, and forgive my noobness: lets assume that IT is true, or some version of it is true (which makes a great deal of sense to me). You reach the full destroy ending, Shepard lives and wakes up in the rubble left by Harbinger's blast.

This means, I think, that the Citadel never blew up. The relay's never destroyed or disabled, and critically, the Crucible never used and the Reapers never beaten. Sooooo...what then?

That's a whole other thread in ragards to defeating the reapers conventionally, I believe there is a thread on such a topic, some of us are even hypethesizing within this thread that the crucible is a reaper weapon/trap/test.

[DJBare]

A reminder, this thread is about I.T and NOT Bioware!

[Arian Dynas]

FamilyManFirst wrote...

 I hate to say it, but I don't think that IT is true.  I'd love it if it was, but I chalk up all of the inconsistencies and hints to one thing: time pressure.

As we all know, the devs have publicly stated that they had planned on an Indoctrination Sequence at one time, but that the gameplay didn't work out.  I think that the decision that the gameplay wouldn't work out was made very late in game development - like, say, October or November of 2011.  BioWare had already done a lot of work on the game to set up the Indoctrination Sequence, including all of the hints, the dreams, etc., and also including much of the ending sequence, and just didn't have time to rework everything.  Therefore, they filed to fit and painted to cover.  Remember that Martin Sheen was retained until very late, November 2011 I believe, to complete his VO work for TIM.  I think that, instead of an Indoctrination Sequence (probably with TIM involved) they tweaked the ending into the Dialog Sequence with TIM instead and just pretended that everything after Harbinger's beam was real instead of imagined.

This would account for all of the issues, large and small, that point to Indoctrination in the final sequence: it originally *was* going to be indoctrination.  However, sadly, the ending as-is is the real, actual ending to the game. 

Oh, so the fact that the Carnifex morphs into a predator on screen is a time crunch thing. Ok.

So that also means that the fact that Shepard gets indoctrinated eyes in the Synthesis and Control endings a time crunch thing too.

Oh and all the literary buildup, TIME CRUNCH!

The fact that the ending sequence has magical quick growing trees. TIME CRUNCH!

Want me to keep going? I can do this all day.

[DJBare]

Geeze Arian, let it go and lets stick to the topic yeah?

[Dwailing]

Arian Dynas wrote...

FamilyManFirst wrote...

 I hate to say it, but I don't think that IT is true.  I'd love it if it was, but I chalk up all of the inconsistencies and hints to one thing: time pressure.

As we all know, the devs have publicly stated that they had planned on an Indoctrination Sequence at one time, but that the gameplay didn't work out.  I think that the decision that the gameplay wouldn't work out was made very late in game development - like, say, October or November of 2011.  BioWare had already done a lot of work on the game to set up the Indoctrination Sequence, including all of the hints, the dreams, etc., and also including much of the ending sequence, and just didn't have time to rework everything.  Therefore, they filed to fit and painted to cover.  Remember that Martin Sheen was retained until very late, November 2011 I believe, to complete his VO work for TIM.  I think that, instead of an Indoctrination Sequence (probably with TIM involved) they tweaked the ending into the Dialog Sequence with TIM instead and just pretended that everything after Harbinger's beam was real instead of imagined.

This would account for all of the issues, large and small, that point to Indoctrination in the final sequence: it originally *was* going to be indoctrination.  However, sadly, the ending as-is is the real, actual ending to the game. 

Oh, so the fact that the Carnifex morphs into a predator on screen is a time crunch thing. Ok.

So that also means that the fact that Shepard gets indoctrinated eyes in the Synthesis and Control endings a time crunch thing too.

Oh and all the literary buildup, TIME CRUNCH!

The fact that the ending sequence has magical quick growing trees. TIME CRUNCH!

Want me to keep going? I can do this all day.

No no, I think you made your point.  Oh who am I kidding, keep going!  I want to see what you come up with, it will be fun to watch. 

Edit: And besides, who knows what points will be brought up that we might have forgotten.

Modifié par Dwailing, 15 mai 2012 - 10:42 .

[paxxton]

Arian Dynas wrote...

FamilyManFirst wrote...

 I hate to say it, but I don't think that IT is true.  I'd love it if it was, but I chalk up all of the inconsistencies and hints to one thing: time pressure.

As we all know, the devs have publicly stated that they had planned on an Indoctrination Sequence at one time, but that the gameplay didn't work out.  I think that the decision that the gameplay wouldn't work out was made very late in game development - like, say, October or November of 2011.  BioWare had already done a lot of work on the game to set up the Indoctrination Sequence, including all of the hints, the dreams, etc., and also including much of the ending sequence, and just didn't have time to rework everything.  Therefore, they filed to fit and painted to cover.  Remember that Martin Sheen was retained until very late, November 2011 I believe, to complete his VO work for TIM.  I think that, instead of an Indoctrination Sequence (probably with TIM involved) they tweaked the ending into the Dialog Sequence with TIM instead and just pretended that everything after Harbinger's beam was real instead of imagined.

This would account for all of the issues, large and small, that point to Indoctrination in the final sequence: it originally *was* going to be indoctrination.  However, sadly, the ending as-is is the real, actual ending to the game. 

Oh, so the fact that the Carnifex morphs into a predator on screen is a time crunch thing. Ok.

So that also means that the fact that Shepard gets indoctrinated eyes in the Synthesis and Control endings a time crunch thing too.

Oh and all the literary buildup, TIME CRUNCH!

The fact that the ending sequence has magical quick growing trees. TIME CRUNCH!

Want me to keep going? I can do this all day.

The fact that Mass Effect 3 was ever created is due to crunch time too.

Modifié par paxxton, 15 mai 2012 - 10:43 .

[Big Bad]

It's all about the breath scene - IMHO most of the IT hinges on and flows flows from that. And ther is absolutely no way that the breath scene is a product of laziness or lack of time. it was unquestionably planned out. the only question is...why?

[gunslinger_ruiz]

DJBare wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

DJBare wrote...

I've been going through the breath scene in a further attempt to pick out visual evidence, but there is a sound that is curious, I'm not sure Shepard is alone in that rubble, if you listen extremely carefully after the initial cacophony of noise dies down, I think someone is breathing, slow and laboured, it's quite distinct just before Shepard takes a breath, but listen from the point the cacophony dies down.

www.youtube.com/watch

I hear no other breathing sounds aside from Shepard's. I hear a building settling/reaper howl, what could be footsteps on a metal surface or something I can't think a word for (the sound goes 12-3--4), and eerie wind in the background.

It is likely I'm hearing it incorrectly, the sound I'm picking up is very much mixed in with all the other ambient(especially the wind, wind on the citadel? uh huh), but to me it sounds like two breaths, ......one in one out, pause, one in, one out, pause, one in, one out, then Shepards breath.

I'm watching my own vid of the scene with maxed volume and trying to hear what you're describing and just can't pick out any sounds out of the ordinary. I'm using these expensive things with 7.1 surround and such and can only pick out the sounds we already know about.

[RavenEyry]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Oh, so the fact that the Carnifex morphs into a predator on screen is a time crunch thing. Ok.

So that also means that the fact that Shepard gets indoctrinated eyes in the Synthesis and Control endings a time crunch thing too.

Oh and all the literary buildup, TIME CRUNCH!

The fact that the ending sequence has magical quick growing trees. TIME CRUNCH!

Want me to keep going? I can do this all day.

His point isn't 'bugs and mistakes caused by time crunch', it's 'had to scrap planned ending at last moment and tack something on due to time crunch'.

Which, of course, doesn't preclude DLC that adds to the ending.

[Big G13]

prettz wrote...

Ok I did a vid on the gun speculation hope it dose not come off corny. let me know if I got anything wrong or miss anything.
I call it
Mass Effect 3 mystery of the gun

www.youtube.com/watch

when we were talking about this yesterday I thought it was really interesting, but holy crap, to see the gun change like that right in front of my eyes, I mean, holy crap. Thanks for putting that together.

[Arian Dynas]

DJBare wrote...

Ravereth wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

@Ravereth Great screenshots! If it changed between shots it could have been a mistake in editing, but those shots show it changes on screen. I don't think that's possible to do by accident.

Actually it's not even the explosion which changes the gun but this strange white light

*snip*


I'm scared now...

Yes, that's the concussion wave from the explosion, you can see it visually move toward Shepard.

Well, point proven, there is air in there, and Shepard would be dead before he was ever even vaporized from the pressure wave alone.

HellishFiend wrote...

Naseilen wrote...

estebanus wrote...
So anyway, here's what I found: Carnifex is actually a latin word. 
And guess what that word means? 

It means "Executioner." 

Carnifex in Polish version was translated as "Kat" which, exactly, means executioner. Whops, I feel guilty now, I should mention this earlier.

That seems pretty deliberate. Why translate it unless the meaning of the word is of specific importance? The must have wanted the name of the gun to reflect it's symbolic purpose in every translation. 

 

Carnifex is also the name of a trademarked Games Workshop Tyranid model, but that's probably unrelated.

DJBare wrote...

A reminder, this thread is about I.T and NOT Bioware!

 

They are inextricable my friend.

[gunslinger_ruiz]

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

DJBare wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

DJBare wrote...

I've been going through the breath scene in a further attempt to pick out visual evidence, but there is a sound that is curious, I'm not sure Shepard is alone in that rubble, if you listen extremely carefully after the initial cacophony of noise dies down, I think someone is breathing, slow and laboured, it's quite distinct just before Shepard takes a breath, but listen from the point the cacophony dies down.

www.youtube.com/watch

I hear no other breathing sounds aside from Shepard's. I hear a building settling/reaper howl, what could be footsteps on a metal surface or something I can't think a word for (the sound goes 12-3--4), and eerie wind in the background.

It is likely I'm hearing it incorrectly, the sound I'm picking up is very much mixed in with all the other ambient(especially the wind, wind on the citadel? uh huh), but to me it sounds like two breaths, ......one in one out, pause, one in, one out, pause, one in, one out, then Shepards breath.

I'm watching my own vid of the scene with maxed volume and trying to hear what you're describing and just can't pick out any sounds out of the ordinary. I'm using these expensive things with 7.1 surround and such and can only pick out the sounds we already know about.

Just tweaked my balance settings a bit and while I can't hear any more breath sounds I can definitley hear what sounds like a drawn out almost-silent whistling sound in the background just before Shepard takes a breath. Almost like tires skreeching from blocks away (yes I replayed it to make sure it wasn't just Actually tires skreeching in real life)

[UrgentArchengel]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Oh, so the fact that the Carnifex morphs into a predator on screen is a time crunch thing. Ok.

So that also means that the fact that Shepard gets indoctrinated eyes in the Synthesis and Control endings a time crunch thing too.

Oh and all the literary buildup, TIME CRUNCH!

The fact that the ending sequence has magical quick growing trees. TIME CRUNCH!

Want me to keep going? I can do this all day.

All the hateful anti-IT hate mongering is also crunch time.  Especially all that supposed denial.

[RavenEyry]

UrgentArchengel wrote...

All the hateful anti-IT hate mongering is also crunch time.  Especially all that supposed denial.

Next time I'm about to eat, I'm gonna shout "IT'S CRUNCH TIME!"

Your hilarious choice of words caused me to go off topic, you dirty rotten swine you.

[paxxton]

OK, nevermind.

Modifié par paxxton, 15 mai 2012 - 11:13 .

[DJBare]

Arian Dynas wrote...

They are inextricable my friend.

Not when arguing whether they have been lazy or not, if people want to discuss Biowares motives, then I suggest making another topic on that subject, one of the things that goes wrong with this discussion is sidetracking, I recommend focusing on the topic, evidence for I.T, otherwise it just becomes convoluted again.

[MaximizedAction]

DJBare wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

DJBare wrote...

I've been going through the breath scene in a further attempt to pick out visual evidence, but there is a sound that is curious, I'm not sure Shepard is alone in that rubble, if you listen extremely carefully after the initial cacophony of noise dies down, I think someone is breathing, slow and laboured, it's quite distinct just before Shepard takes a breath, but listen from the point the cacophony dies down.

www.youtube.com/watch

I hear no other breathing sounds aside from Shepard's. I hear a building settling/reaper howl, what could be footsteps on a metal surface or something I can't think a word for (the sound goes 12-3--4), and eerie wind in the background.

It is likely I'm hearing it incorrectly, the sound I'm picking up is very much mixed in with all the other ambient(especially the wind, wind on the citadel? uh huh), but to me it sounds like two breaths, ......one in one out, pause, one in, one out, pause, one in, one out, then Shepards breath.

You mean those subtle sounds that sound approx like these high note noises?
Sorry, but it's this that I remembered hearing whistling like this originally.

But couldn't it be just the wind whistling, after all London is quite the rubblehole, a lot of places for the wind to whistle.

[Arian Dynas]

Dwailing wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

FamilyManFirst wrote...

 I hate to say it, but I don't think that IT is true.  I'd love it if it was, but I chalk up all of the inconsistencies and hints to one thing: time pressure.

As we all know, the devs have publicly stated that they had planned on an Indoctrination Sequence at one time, but that the gameplay didn't work out.  I think that the decision that the gameplay wouldn't work out was made very late in game development - like, say, October or November of 2011.  BioWare had already done a lot of work on the game to set up the Indoctrination Sequence, including all of the hints, the dreams, etc., and also including much of the ending sequence, and just didn't have time to rework everything.  Therefore, they filed to fit and painted to cover.  Remember that Martin Sheen was retained until very late, November 2011 I believe, to complete his VO work for TIM.  I think that, instead of an Indoctrination Sequence (probably with TIM involved) they tweaked the ending into the Dialog Sequence with TIM instead and just pretended that everything after Harbinger's beam was real instead of imagined.

This would account for all of the issues, large and small, that point to Indoctrination in the final sequence: it originally *was* going to be indoctrination.  However, sadly, the ending as-is is the real, actual ending to the game. 

Oh, so the fact that the Carnifex morphs into a predator on screen is a time crunch thing. Ok.

So that also means that the fact that Shepard gets indoctrinated eyes in the Synthesis and Control endings a time crunch thing too.

Oh and all the literary buildup, TIME CRUNCH!

The fact that the ending sequence has magical quick growing trees. TIME CRUNCH!

Want me to keep going? I can do this all day.

No no, I think you made your point.  Oh who am I kidding, keep going!  I want to see what you come up with, it will be fun to watch. 

Edit: And besides, who knows what points will be brought up that we might have forgotten.

Ok how about this one? When you walk down the collector base hallway and reach the door just before the SB section, turn around. The room fades to gray. Like a black and white film.

Clearly a mistake that wouldn't require extra programming.

[Wyatt Shepard]

DJBare wrote...

Wyatt Shepard wrote...

Ok question, and forgive my noobness: lets assume that IT is true, or some version of it is true (which makes a great deal of sense to me). You reach the full destroy ending, Shepard lives and wakes up in the rubble left by Harbinger's blast.

This means, I think, that the Citadel never blew up. The relay's never destroyed or disabled, and critically, the Crucible never used and the Reapers never beaten. Sooooo...what then?

That's a whole other thread in ragards to defeating the reapers conventionally, I believe there is a thread on such a topic, some of us are even hypethesizing within this thread that the crucible is a reaper weapon/trap/test.

Could be. The Citadel itself was a Reaper trap after all and even after the Prothean sabotage, the Reapers could still control it (with TIM help of course).

However, lets assume that is true. What then? The extended cut won't give us a "new' ending. So my question is that being the case does that on it's own invalidate IT, or will we see more content down the road that plays out the "real" last fight against the Reapers or a ME4? Just curious about what the consquences of IT being true would be.

[gunslinger_ruiz]

MaximizedAction wrote...

DJBare wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

DJBare wrote...

I've been going through the breath scene in a further attempt to pick out visual evidence, but there is a sound that is curious, I'm not sure Shepard is alone in that rubble, if you listen extremely carefully after the initial cacophony of noise dies down, I think someone is breathing, slow and laboured, it's quite distinct just before Shepard takes a breath, but listen from the point the cacophony dies down.

www.youtube.com/watch

I hear no other breathing sounds aside from Shepard's. I hear a building settling/reaper howl, what could be footsteps on a metal surface or something I can't think a word for (the sound goes 12-3--4), and eerie wind in the background.

It is likely I'm hearing it incorrectly, the sound I'm picking up is very much mixed in with all the other ambient(especially the wind, wind on the citadel? uh huh), but to me it sounds like two breaths, ......one in one out, pause, one in, one out, pause, one in, one out, then Shepards breath.

You mean those subtle sounds that sound approx like these high note noises?
Sorry, but it's this that I remembered hearing whistling like this originally.

But couldn't it be just the wind whistling, after all London is quite the rubblehole, a lot of places for the wind to whistle.

I can hear that paticular type of whistling for all maybe a whole second. It's right before Shepard's breath but hard to hear without max volume (almost hurt my ears cranking this thing up).

No idea what the whistle means though, or where it could come from in the Breath scene.