55528 réponses à ce sujet

[BleedingUranium]

DJBare wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

I stayed faithful to Liara for three games, but that would actually be a respectable twist, as much as I hate to say it...

I'm thinking about the mandatory crew members now...

The three squad members you are guaranteed to have are Liara, James and EDI...
Traynor, Adams and Joker are also still around on everyone's playthrough...

It's what I've been hoping for since ME2, not that I relish the idea dealing with LI's or friends that turn traitor, but from a story perspective it would really add a lot, imagine Joker being one of those traitors, probably the last person most people think of, I place characters like Hackett at the top of my suspects list because of his position, but Joker with his jokes and brittle bone disease, what harm could he be?

I think you guys are going a little overboard with the betrayal ideas now  There's pretty good evidence to suggest Coats is indoctrinated, and some to suggest Anderson as well, but honestly, even Anderson would be pushing it from a reaction and believability point of view. If Shep isn't very indoctrinated, and only might become actually indoctrinated at the end, I doubt any squadmates are. Maybe EDI, but with all her character development and talk about rather dying than becoming like the Reapers, I doubt it.

For anyone but Coats or Anderson it'd be as out of place as how the current (face value) endings feel.

[MaximizedAction]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

WinterCrow wrote...

Icinix wrote...

OneWithTheAssassins wrote...

Hey guys, anything new?

When choosing Destroy, carnifex changes mid in game cutscene to Predator....think thats been the big recent development.

I've been following all the screen captures about this and I still can't figure why this happens. It is way too hard to detect and doesn't directly imply anything, so I find hard to believe this was an intended clue. Does it make any sense code wise?

Like, there's a "dreamy" model of Shepard with one pistol, and then the "real life" Shepard with the other, and it changes cause the code says "dream ends here" right at that moment. Am I even making sense? lol

The Predator is a standard-issue pistol that is far more fitting for Shepard to stumble upon than the Carnifex. It may be seen as symbolic of that which is real and true to Shepard's nature, or (if you believe that the end is a true hallucination instead of a dream), a sign that the hallucination is giving way, as Shepard acts.

If you decide to release the Rachni queen Shepard takes a look at his gun (which is at that point a Good Guy Predator) from the sides, inspecting it. You know, like in the movies when someone looks at something that that person finds strange.
He then shoots that generator thingy that releases the queen.

[DJBare]

BleedingUranium wrote...

For anyone but Coats or Anderson it'd be as out of place as how the current (face value) endings feel.

What, you don't think it's possible that Hackett is indoctrinated? to paraphrase the codex, "if a respected person in a position of power is subverted......"; Hackett would be a priority target for the reapers if they really want that crucible built and delivered, of course this assumes the crucible is another reaper trap, but I continue to question why the reapers left the citadel unguarded at a crucial moment, the citadel itself belongs to the reapers, we learn this in ME1, and now we suddenly find the mysterious plans to a device that connects to the citadel, and it was Hackett who sent us to obtain those plans, too convenient.

[MegumiAzusa]

pirate1802 wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DJBare wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

A part of me agrees with you. I'd have considered that gun-swapping evidence clinching if the swapping was visible without using flycam.

While the physical switch goes unnoticed, it is possible to see that Shepard has a different weapon during the explosion, but you have to have a quick eye, flycam not needed, this image did not require flaycam, but it happens so fast you need to record it and pause.

You've got way over a second, more than enough time to see it, especially if you know what you are looking for.

WTF So let be get this straight; the carnifax changes into a predator in the "perfect" destroy ending, but remains unchanged in the bad destroy and breath-less destroy scene?
:blink::blink::blink:
Mother of galaxy...

No it always changes, even in the vaporized ending:
@ 0:31

[BleedingUranium]

DJBare wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

For anyone but Coats or Anderson it'd be as out of place as how the current (face value) endings feel.

What, you don't think it's possible that Hackett is indoctrinated? to paraphrase the codex, "if a respected person in a position of power is subverted......"; Hackett would be a priority target for the reapers if they really want that crucible built and delivered, of course this assumes the crucible is another reaper trap, but I continue to question why the reapers left the citadel unguarded at a crucial moment, the citadel itself belongs to the reapers, we learn this in ME1, and now we suddenly find the mysterious plans to a device that connects to the citadel, and it was Hackett who sent us to obtain those plans, too convenient.

True, I think he could be too, I guess I didn't mention it because I doubt he'd do it in person, and Shep would probably not fight him. Though, I do think that it's understandable for him to want to build the Cruscible. He was in command of the human fleets when the Reapers attacked, and he had to sacrifice the entire Second Fleet just to allow the Third and Fifth to escape. If anyone doesn't believe we'll defeat them otherwise, it's Hackett. We really are out of other options, at least, ones the allied forces could come up with.

I think the Crucible is a trap of some kind, and Hackett could be indoctrinated, but he might not be, it wouldn't be important to the project. If the Crucible does turn out to be a trap, I honestly don't know what the allies would do.

[ArmeniusLOD]

I just finished the game last night and I was awestruck by the ending. I had no idea where all the hate is coming from. I had the indoctrinated idea spinning around in my head as the credits were rolling, and came to the forum looking to see if anyone else had the same conclusion. The video by Acayvos is amazing because it perfectly presents all the reasoning behind the IT.

I think one thing that isn't explained in that video is in the Destroy ending when we see Shepard's armor and he takes a breath. To me he is clearly laying in rubble from the destruction of the Conduit on Earth. So the fight occurred in his mind and he wakes up after successfully defeating the indoctrination. I have not seen the Synthesis ending yet, but this scene was shown in the Destroy ending and not the Control ending, leading me to believe the Destroy ending is the good ending and not the Synthesis ending as I've been reading so much about on these forums.

Also I remember seeing a story somewhere on ME3 where Bioware says "keep your saves," and I believe that the ending leaves open the possibility of another direct sequel that can be the ultimate conclusion to Shepard's story.

[MegumiAzusa]

TSA_383 wrote...

DJBare wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Coates was in there for 3 days. He says something along those lines in the ambient dialogue at the end.

The problem I have with his line is, three days alone without being overwhelmed?, it's not like his position was that safe, from the moment he took the first couple of shots the hoard would have eventually homed in on his location, Coats is definitely on my suspects list along with Hackett, Liara, EDI and Anderson, sucks really, I like EDI.

*tries to imagine the level of fan outcry if Liara turns out to be indoctrinated and shep has to kill her*

....

Add Vega and the Virmire Surviver to that list.

[UrgentArchengel]

All I remembered was a red light, then I woke up on Earth...I
Think I may have a metal rod in my leg. Ouch! I wonder what we are all going to figure out next on, The Mystery of the Ending...Mass Effect 3 edition.

[Icinix]

MaximizedAction wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

WinterCrow wrote...

Icinix wrote...

OneWithTheAssassins wrote...

Hey guys, anything new?

When choosing Destroy, carnifex changes mid in game cutscene to Predator....think thats been the big recent development.

I've been following all the screen captures about this and I still can't figure why this happens. It is way too hard to detect and doesn't directly imply anything, so I find hard to believe this was an intended clue. Does it make any sense code wise?

Like, there's a "dreamy" model of Shepard with one pistol, and then the "real life" Shepard with the other, and it changes cause the code says "dream ends here" right at that moment. Am I even making sense? lol

The Predator is a standard-issue pistol that is far more fitting for Shepard to stumble upon than the Carnifex. It may be seen as symbolic of that which is real and true to Shepard's nature, or (if you believe that the end is a true hallucination instead of a dream), a sign that the hallucination is giving way, as Shepard acts.

If you decide to release the Rachni queen Shepard takes a look at his gun (which is at that point a Good Guy Predator) from the sides, inspecting it. You know, like in the movies when someone looks at something that that person finds strange.
He then shoots that generator thingy that releases the queen.

I think its definitely a symbolic thing.

The first gun you get in the game is a Predator.

TIM shoots himself with a Predator.

Freeing the Rachni Queen is done with the Predator.

Scanning youtube for more moments in game where the Predator is used.

Modifié par Icinix, 16 mai 2012 - 10:22 .

[Icinix]

UrgentArchengel wrote...

All I remembered was a red light, then I woke up on Earth...I
Think I may have a metal rod in my leg. Ouch! I wonder what we are all going to figure out next on, The Mystery of the Ending...Mass Effect 3 edition.

Speaking of the rod in the leg, those events that were part of the original leak may actually yet come to pass.

It was interesting when they said they changed the endings after the leak that when the game came out, the ending was the same as the leak.

But events leading up to those endings were altered or removed. The breath scene could be indicative of those events occuring in the ending dlc.

[ArmeniusLOD]

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reapers' control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

Modifié par ArmeniusLOD, 16 mai 2012 - 10:27 .

[Icinix]

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reaper's control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

Nah - its an Alliance Interceptor.

[MadRabbit999]

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reapers' control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

I thought the same thing while watching that recently, but then I thought "not a chance in hell BW would use such deep symbolysm based on something like the IT that only a few people would really get".

BW metaphors are usually right in your face, and not very subtle at all, I doubt they changed it just for this one example.

Modifié par MadRabbit999, 16 mai 2012 - 10:30 .

[BleedingUranium]

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reapers' control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

After seeing your above post (About getting the endings) wow, I wish more people realised things as quickly as you

It's actually a model fighter, but the symbolism is similar. The game opens with a fighter (sounds and all) that turns out to be a toy the kid is playing with. This shows two things:

-When it comes to the kid, all is not as it seems

-The kid is controlling what you think is reality

Modifié par BleedingUranium, 16 mai 2012 - 10:30 .

[ArmeniusLOD]

Icinix wrote...

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reaper's control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

Nah - its an Alliance Interceptor.

Ah, you're right.  In all my excitement I remembered it incorrectly, but the symbolism could still hold true.

Modifié par ArmeniusLOD, 16 mai 2012 - 10:30 .

[Arian Dynas]

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

Icinix wrote...

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reaper's control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

Nah - its an Alliance Interceptor.

Ah, you're right.  In all my excitement I remembered it incorrectly, but the symbolism could still hold true.

Welcome to the brotherhood. 
http://social.biowar...scussions#group 

[ArmeniusLOD]

BleedingUranium wrote...

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reapers' control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

After seeing your above post (About getting the endings) wow, I wish more people realised things as quickly as you

It's actually a model fighter, but the symbolism is similar. The game opens with a fighter (sounds and all) that turns out to be a toy the kid is playing with. This shows two things:

-When it comes to the kid, all is not as it seems

-The kid is controlling what you think is reality

I think the problem is people ONLY see the ending.  They don't look back at the rest of the game and take the story as a whole.  I actually started thinking back when I saw the Catalyst represented as the child, and then the most obvious thing popped up:  the dreams Shepard has following the child, and the further in the game you get the more shadows and voices surround you during the dream.  It all came fast and furious at that point and it clicked for me.

[Salient Archer]

 Fingers crossed on the legitimacy of the leaked script. Anyway, although I do believe Shepard’s leg is indeed damaged I don’t actually agree that images being posted represent it. The section of Shep’s leg that everyone says is pierced is in fact a leg strap from the N7 armor [just check out the comparison pictures].



Here’s one from ME2 just to help illustrate


Although I don’t feel it disproves anything in the leaked script it does however hint at three things 

1)The armor we see Shepard wearing after (s)he’s hit by Harbinger’s beam [during the hallucination] is in fact replicated in fine detail in the breathing scene, down to the cuts on the inside of the thigh.

2)There is no new damage on Shep’s armor, which one would suspect (s)he would have after coping an explosions to the face as shown when we choose destroy. So the breathing scene could not take place after this event as one would assume that the amor would sustain more damage after an explosion like this as Shepard clearly doesn’t have any kinetic barriers at this point. Once again proving that everything from Harbinger's beam onwards mustn't have actually happened.

3)It shows that events from the real world have indeed bled through and affected Shepard’s hallucination. Proof being that we can have any arrangement of custom armor but after Harbinger’s beam we’re all left with the same design. Leaving Shep with only the non modular parts of the armor. But, Once again, there isn't any new damage on the armor that would surly have been inflicted from destroying the red-magic-tube.

EDIT: [engage sarcasm filter] Unless the red-magic-tube only inflicted it on the side of Shepard we can't see ... hmm 

Modifié par Salient Archer, 16 mai 2012 - 10:50 .

[Icinix]

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

Icinix wrote...

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reaper's control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

Nah - its an Alliance Interceptor.

Ah, you're right.  In all my excitement I remembered it incorrectly, but the symbolism could still hold true.

Yeah - I thought that as well. Its possible. But I think that may be the only time the kid is actually real.

[gunslinger_ruiz]

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I just finished the game last night and I was awestruck by the ending. I had no idea where all the hate is coming from. I had the indoctrinated idea spinning around in my head as the credits were rolling, and came to the forum looking to see if anyone else had the same conclusion. The video by Acayvos is amazing because it perfectly presents all the reasoning behind the IT.

I think one thing that isn't explained in that video is in the Destroy ending when we see Shepard's armor and he takes a breath. To me he is clearly laying in rubble from the destruction of the Conduit on Earth. So the fight occurred in his mind and he wakes up after successfully defeating the indoctrination. I have not seen the Synthesis ending yet, but this scene was shown in the Destroy ending and not the Control ending, leading me to believe the Destroy ending is the good ending and not the Synthesis ending as I've been reading so much about on these forums.

Also I remember seeing a story somewhere on ME3 where Bioware says "keep your saves," and I believe that the ending leaves open the possibility of another direct sequel that can be the ultimate conclusion to Shepard's story.

Welcome to the cause soldier *salute*

But seriously, a heads up we did used to have a 2000+ page thread on this same topic but it was locked since it was too big for everyone to read up on the Theory much. A lot has been discussed since then but we're still finding little things to add to the Theory so I'm sure you're more than welcome to mention things some of us might have already noticed.

The "Shepard Alive" scene has been discussed several times and still being discussed. I've watched my own recording of the scene ....well I lost count but lets say a lot (around 200 times I think but guessing).

London/Breath scene rubble comparison is linked in my sig, for me that further confirms the scene takes place on Earth BUT, another comparison I did on the Reaper cable in the scene also in the sig suggest Reaper tech in the area. I've looked all throughout the ending level and only ever seen Reaper cable on the Citadel corridor. The only other place it could come from is inside the Beam/Conduit structure we just can't see it on the outside.

[BleedingUranium]

Icinix wrote...

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

Icinix wrote...

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I also wanted to mention this, and I don't know if anyone else has. The very first image we see in the game is the child making the Normandy model fly around as he plays with it, symbolizing the Reaper's control over it and its crew in my opinion. Very powerful stuff. The writers for Mass Effect are better than a lot of people give them credit for.

Nah - its an Alliance Interceptor.

Ah, you're right.  In all my excitement I remembered it incorrectly, but the symbolism could still hold true.

Yeah - I thought that as well. Its possible. But I think that may be the only time the kid is actually real.

He may or may not be real in that scene, but it doesn't matter at all. Either way, the symbolism still works.

[ArmeniusLOD]

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

ArmeniusLOD wrote...

I just finished the game last night and I was awestruck by the ending. I had no idea where all the hate is coming from. I had the indoctrinated idea spinning around in my head as the credits were rolling, and came to the forum looking to see if anyone else had the same conclusion. The video by Acayvos is amazing because it perfectly presents all the reasoning behind the IT.

I think one thing that isn't explained in that video is in the Destroy ending when we see Shepard's armor and he takes a breath. To me he is clearly laying in rubble from the destruction of the Conduit on Earth. So the fight occurred in his mind and he wakes up after successfully defeating the indoctrination. I have not seen the Synthesis ending yet, but this scene was shown in the Destroy ending and not the Control ending, leading me to believe the Destroy ending is the good ending and not the Synthesis ending as I've been reading so much about on these forums.

Also I remember seeing a story somewhere on ME3 where Bioware says "keep your saves," and I believe that the ending leaves open the possibility of another direct sequel that can be the ultimate conclusion to Shepard's story.

Welcome to the cause soldier *salute*

But seriously, a heads up we did used to have a 2000+ page thread on this same topic but it was locked since it was too big for everyone to read up on the Theory much. A lot has been discussed since then but we're still finding little things to add to the Theory so I'm sure you're more than welcome to mention things some of us might have already noticed.

The "Shepard Alive" scene has been discussed several times and still being discussed. I've watched my own recording of the scene ....well I lost count but lets say a lot (around 200 times I think but guessing).

London/Breath scene rubble comparison is linked in my sig, for me that further confirms the scene takes place on Earth BUT, another comparison I did on the Reaper cable in the scene also in the sig suggest Reaper tech in the area. I've looked all throughout the ending level and only ever seen Reaper cable on the Citadel corridor. The only other place it could come from is inside the Beam/Conduit structure we just can't see it on the outside.

Thanks!  I've been engrossed in the multiplayer for a long time, so I'm a little late to the bandwagon because I didn't want to spoil anything for myself.  And I'm glad because the story was really powerful and it would not have had the same effect had I known anything beforehand.  Mass Effect is my favorite game series to date.  It's the kind of sci-fi epic I had always dreamed of.

[Rifneno]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

Heh. And I'll be headed to Point Pleasant later today and will be staying at the Lowe Hotel. Aside from Mothman and UFOs, the Hotel is allegedly haunted.

As a fan of the paranormal, I would like to add that Mothman is a pile of lies that would shock the most hardened politician. While a few people did see something weird, almost all of the events associated with the legend are the mocking ramblings of legendary **** (believe me, that censored word is a vile one) Gray Barker. If there is a hell, I do hope Barker is burning in it right now.

Orange Tee wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...

It's also identified as the ultimate pistol for renegades - so interesting that the switch back to the "good" pistol the predator occurs on the "renegade" destroy option

I would have to say that's a massive stretch to say the least... Not to say that the pistol swap isn't odd, but that's taking it a step overboard.

Then you haven't been paying attention to which gun Shepard uses in which cutscene. I wouldn't have said it as paragon/renegade because renegade doesn't strictly mean "bad" and the carnifex generally means flat out bad. Shepard usually only uses the carnifex when s/he's doing something that's downright disgusting. Like murdering Mordin or shooting Wrex (albeit in self defense, but... well, you know). It works for other characters too. VS protecting Udina uses a carnifex. Henry Lawson uses a carnifex. Admittedly there are a few that defy the rule, like Shepard uses a predator when murdering Samara's last daughter. But generally speaking, carnifex = bad juju.

BleedingUranium wrote...

I think you guys are going a little overboard with the betrayal ideas now

Agreed. I don't want to see any fan favorite characters (or even less popular ones if LI's) turn traitor. It's more of a betrayal from the writer to the fans than it is crew member to Shepard. I'm not saying bad stuff shouldn't happen, but fans that have learned to love a character that BW has been trying to get them attached to for six years shouldn't have the rug pulled out from under them.

[TSA_383]

MadRabbit999 wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

DJBare wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

Soo.. we have a leak of the EC?

At this point, if there is any leak, then it's what Bioware wants us to see.

I would suspect that to be the case with most "leaks" within the gaming industry as a whole, at least from my experience.

Most "leaks" seems to only confirm the development of certain games allready rumored in development shortly before their official announcement or similar.

Also certain companies seem to almost never "leak" anything (Nintendo and Valve beeing two).

This is purely my own observations, but I think more often than not that a "leak" is intentional to start building hype towards a certain game or to get a certain reaction from the target audience.

"Official" leaks in most cases also means infrigment of NDA which can result in the closure of the thread and they can legally force people to take disclosed NDA files down from their websites...

Being as this "leak" is still on these forums, I doubt it is legit...

Can I just clarify what I said earlier:

-YES the audio files for a lot of this stuff is already in the game.
-BUT some (well...most) was in the script leak from last year, so whilst it is a leak, it's old news.

I can totally see how they might decide to use it for EC, since they already have a bunch of the assets in place, but this isn't necessarily an "OMG NEW ENDING MATERIAL WAS ALREADY IN THE GAME" sort of leak and I'd really rather not start a rumor like that.

The original leak ending had Shep and Anderson going into the conduit together, then they find themselves coming under reaper control and pointing guns at each other, from there on out it was pretty similar.

If they were going to be using it for EC/Indoctrination all along, it obviously wouldn't make sense to have Anderson go up with you if the scene's going to end up not being real, so I can see why they'd have to make that change - the journey into Shepard's own mind is one he must take alone.

[TSA_383]

Rifneno wrote...

Then you haven't been paying attention to which gun Shepard uses in which cutscene. I wouldn't have said it as paragon/renegade because renegade doesn't strictly mean "bad" and the carnifex generally means flat out bad. Shepard usually only uses the carnifex when s/he's doing something that's downright disgusting. Like murdering Mordin or shooting Wrex (albeit in self defense, but... well, you know). It works for other characters too. VS protecting Udina uses a carnifex. Henry Lawson uses a carnifex. Admittedly there are a few that defy the rule, like Shepard uses a predator when murdering Samara's last daughter. But generally speaking, carnifex = bad juju.

I was going more by the fact that it's notably favoured by pirates and mercenaries in the game's description of it