55528 réponses à ce sujet

[Andromidius]

Dendio1 wrote...

Yea im done. Ive been avoiding taking sides, but I think we have enough counter evidence to abandon the theory

Don't stop thinking.  Those 'debunked' evidences aren't debunked at all, they are easily explainable.  And have been, over and over again.

Its not a case of 'taking sides', its a case of critical thinking and working out what's not instantly apparent.

[HellishFiend]

paxxton wrote...

Actually, have you considered that we are drawing some conclusions from various evidence and by repeating and reliving them constantly we create a mental force that persuades others to embrace IT? If enough people believes IT is true, BioWare will have to implement it regardless of whether they planned for it or want it.

[Andromidius]

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Actually, have you considered that we are drawing some conclusions from various evidence and by repeating and reliving them constantly we create a mental force that persuades others to embrace IT? If enough people believes IT is true, BioWare will have to implement it regardless of whether they planned for it or want it.

Yeah...  No.  Bioware have made it clear that its their way or no way when it comes to the story.

IT isn't wishlisting.  Its trying to figure out what was actually intended, in the hopes that it leads to the ending not being what they seemed.

[senshi420]

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Actually, have you considered that we are drawing some conclusions from various evidence and by repeating and reliving them constantly we create a mental force that persuades others to embrace IT? If enough people believes IT is true, BioWare will have to implement it regardless of whether they planned for it or want it.

pax, as big of a fan as i am of your UNIT  please oh please keep this new age stuff out of our mass effect

[HellishFiend]

FreddyCast wrote...
That was exactly my point. Hellish mistakenly thought that saving or not saving Anderson somehow increases or decreases the EMS, which is not true. And again, the game looks at the READINESS RATING of the EMS, NOT the EMS itself.
If you have 4000 EMS, but your RR is 99%, then you will not get the breath scene. In this case, you must have 100% Readiness Rating in order to get the Breath Scene, as well as save Anderson.

Seriously, based on the tone of your posts, it sounds like you have an emotional need for me to admit that I'm wrong or something, even though your "correction" doesnt change the gist, effect, or result of the information I provided in the first place.  But as a favor, here you go:

FreddyCast is right, I was wrong. Sorry for the misinformation everyone.

[balance5050]

Andromidius wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Actually, have you considered that we are drawing some conclusions from various evidence and by repeating and reliving them constantly we create a mental force that persuades others to embrace IT? If enough people believes IT is true, BioWare will have to implement it regardless of whether they planned for it or want it.

Yeah...  No.  Bioware have made it clear that its their way or no way when it comes to the story.

IT isn't wishlisting.  Its trying to figure out what was actually intended, in the hopes that it leads to the ending not being what they seemed.

Besides I think they already have a rough idea of how many want IT to be true.

http://www.holdtheli...on-theory.1909/ 

[byne]

Dendio1 wrote...

Im starting to see indoctrination as nothing more than really good fanon.

-The final hours app says they wanted shepards emotions to be shown in me3. That explains the dream sequences.

I dont see how. The only emotions Shep ever displays in the dreams is surprise when the kid randomly bursts into flames.

-Star kid is supposed to represent those shepard could not save according to final hours.

How this differs from IT saying the Reapers are using the image of the child she couldnt save to get into her head I dont know, so I dont see why you even brought it up

-The TIM eye's = indoctrination is proved false by benezia and edi and the indoctrination codex never mentions eyes anyway.

I could say that Benezia was never 100% indoctrinated, which is true, but I'll just say the eyes are more Reaper tech than proof of indoctrination. Having Shep's eyes replaced by Reaper tech in Control and Synthesis is more symbolic of accepting indoctrination than something that happens to all indoctrinated agents.

As for EDI, I dont get your point. TIM probly used Reaper tech to build the Eva robot, and EDI herself was also built with Reaper tech.

Now we show that the gun swap is something present in other parts of the game...its a bug nothing more.

I dont know why people are acting like the gun swap with Wrex is something new. We've known about it for ages.

The thing is, neither of the shotguns are symbolic of anything, whereas the Predator is symbolic of breaking free of indoctrination. The Carnifex turning into a Predator as you pick destroy is pretty intriguing.

Slowly every piece of evidence is being debunked...what do we have left?

Shep: 'Without hope, we might as well be machines.'
Godchild: 'You have hope, more than you know.'

Modifié par byne, 08 juin 2012 - 10:23 .

[MegumiAzusa]

btw does this look about right? ^^

Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 08 juin 2012 - 10:22 .

[SS2Dante]

olshi wrote...

The gun swap is like the weakest argument of them all. IT doesn't need it.

The dream sequences could still be effects of indoctrination. Why does Shepard see herself burn in the third dream? Could be interpreted in many ways.

The child that died on earth in the intro is supposed to represent those Shepard could not save. Not the catalyst. Why does the catalyst look like the child?

Whether TIM's eyes are the mark of an indoctrinated or not doesn't matter much. If they are just implants, why does Shepard get eye implants after she chooses Control/Synthesis right before she desintegrates?

There are still many other pieces of evidence left, the strongest being:
- breath scene
- dead bodies after Shepard gets hit by Harbinger
- Shepard's wound after he shot Anderson
- weapon bob
- squad on the Normandy
- countless other inconsistencies, plotholes and space magic

Nobody claims it's "evidence" in that sense.

yes, but no non-interpretation of the dream explains why the other Shepard smirks at you as they burn. Not without stretching.

Why indeed does the catalyst look like the child? IT explains this, literal doesn't bother to.

No, TIMS eyes were the result of exposure to a Reaper artefact.

I personally don't think the piles of bodies matter (they are there before you get hit), but the other stuff is true. Personally, I consider the "wound transfer" and child vent scene to be the most convincing part (aside from the way the end choices all line up with indoctrination, I mean).

[FreddyCast]

HellishFiend wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...
That was exactly my point. Hellish mistakenly thought that saving or not saving Anderson somehow increases or decreases the EMS, which is not true. And again, the game looks at the READINESS RATING of the EMS, NOT the EMS itself.
If you have 4000 EMS, but your RR is 99%, then you will not get the breath scene. In this case, you must have 100% Readiness Rating in order to get the Breath Scene, as well as save Anderson.

Seriously, based on the tone of your posts, it sounds like you have an emotional need for me to admit that I'm wrong or something, even though your "correction" doesnt change the gist, effect, or result of the information I provided in the first place.  But as a favor, here you go:

FreddyCast is right, I was wrong. Sorry for the misinformation everyone.

I'm sorry my friend, but I wasn't being emotional. I just saw something that was incorrect and wanted to help you and your friend understand how getting the breath scene actually works. There is nothing wrong about being corrected. You seriously do not need to make a scene of it.

[TSA_383]

Do you ever see reasoning that just defies belief?
http://social.biowar.../index/12417449

[estebanus]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

btw does this look about right? ^^

It's very good! (which I just told you a few moments ago! )

[Big Bad]

Ok, just one more comment. Besides the breath scene, I think the strongest evidence in favor of IT is thematic. The ending sequence takes many of the major themes of the series and does a complete 180 degree turn with them. It is basically thematic betrayal, and it could only have been done on purpose. IT is the only view that I have seen that adequately explains the purpose.

[dreamgazer]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

btw does this look about right? ^^

I dunno what you're doing, but it looks snappy to me.

[estebanus]

TSA_383 wrote...

Do you ever see reasoning that just defies belief?
http://social.biowar.../index/12417449

What did you expect? It's the same person who made the control ending support threrad, who said that Deus Ex Machina is a good plot device, And who thinks that the more ambiguous and nonsensical an ending is, the better.

There is no reason in talking to people like that.

[HellishFiend]

TSA_383 wrote...

Do you ever see reasoning that just defies belief?
http://social.biowar.../index/12417449

The pro-control camp really worries me sometimes. But then again I'm sure they say the same thing about us. C'est la vie....

[byne]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

btw does this look about right? ^^

I read her last name and the first thing that came to mind was the paladin tier 1 Lawbringer set in WoW:



That stupid banana suit might be the dumbest looking armor in WoW.

And I had to wear it for way too long in Vanilla WoW.

[estebanus]

dreamgazer wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

btw does this look about right? ^^

I dunno what you're doing, but it looks snappy to me.

That's Guild Wars 2. She named the Character "Miranda Lawbringer." The character looks like Miranda.

[paxxton]

senshi420 wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Actually, have you considered that we are drawing some conclusions from various evidence and by repeating and reliving them constantly we create a mental force that persuades others to embrace IT? If enough people believes IT is true, BioWare will have to implement it regardless of whether they planned for it or want it.

pax, as big of a fan as i am of your UNIT  please oh please keep this new age stuff out of our mass effect

LOL. Maybe I oversimplified a bit.  I didn't mean any magical will power or Dragon Ball stuff. Rather by reading what we write here people start to see that it all makes sense and become ITists.

EDIT: You are welcome to post in the UNIT thread.
http://social.biowar.../index/12089259

Modifié par paxxton, 08 juin 2012 - 10:33 .

[estebanus]

byne wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

btw does this look about right? ^^

I read her last name and the first thing that came to mind was the paladin tier 1 Lawbringer set in WoW:



That stupid banana suit might be the dumbest looking armor in WoW.

And I had to wear it for way too long in Vanilla WoW.

The "Lawbringer" comes from "LOTSB." In the computer terminal about Miranda, there is an entry where Miranda goes onto a dating site and names herself "Lawbringer SR2."

[HellishFiend]

byne wrote...


That stupid banana suit might be the dumbest looking armor in WoW.

And I had to wear it for way too long in Vanilla WoW.

So I take it you arent doing that armor customization thing to make your latest epic gear look like lawbringer? 

This makes me glad ME games have typically been quite good with character appearances. Only problem is I really like the stats of the Dragon Age armor in ME3, but I dont think the look suits Shepard. Oh well. 

[byne]

estebanus wrote...


The "Lawbringer" comes from "LOTSB." In the computer terminal about Miranda, there is an entry where Miranda goes onto a dating site and names herself "Lawbringer SR2."

Yeah, I know, but it doesnt change the fact that hearing Lawbringer still makes me think of all that time my paladin spent cosplaying as a banana.

[paxxton]

balance5050 wrote...

Besides I think they already have a rough idea of how many want IT to be true.

http://www.holdtheli...on-theory.1909/ 

Those results are uplifting. 4:1 for IT.

[Andromidius]

HellishFiend wrote...

byne wrote...


That stupid banana suit might be the dumbest looking armor in WoW.

And I had to wear it for way too long in Vanilla WoW.

So I take it you arent doing that armor customization thing to make your latest epic gear look like lawbringer? 

This makes me glad ME games have typically been quite good with character appearances. Only problem is I really like the stats of the Dragon Age armor in ME3, but I dont think the look suits Shepard. Oh well. 

Transmogrification is pretty awesome for WoW.  Though people will always complain that people are wearing gear they 'didn't earn'.  Which is nonsense.

Mass Effect needs a bit more armour customisation.  Even if its 'allow helmets to be removed during dialogue' - its the one reason I NEVER wear a helmet.  Despite the big stat loss, I can't stand not being able to see Shep's face.

[byne]

HellishFiend wrote...

byne wrote...


That stupid banana suit might be the dumbest looking armor in WoW.

And I had to wear it for way too long in Vanilla WoW.

So I take it you arent doing that armor customization thing to make your latest epic gear look like lawbringer? 

This makes me glad ME games have typically been quite good with character appearances. Only problem is I really like the stats of the Dragon Age armor in ME3, but I dont think the look suits Shepard. Oh well. 

I did once for a joke, and tanked a few instances as the superhero Bananaman, but that got old pretty quickly.

I'm pretty sure designing Pally armor is Blizz's favorite joke.

Seriously, go look at that stuff!

Only tier 2 and tier 12 really look all that great.