Aller au contenu

Photo

Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark II!


55528 réponses à ce sujet

#16226
HellishFiend

HellishFiend
  • Members
  • 5 546 messages

DJBare wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

I'm going with hallucinations and warped perception getting worse and worse until either the mako crash or Harby's lazor. There are oddities on the cerberus base but not enough to make me think it's a dream and though the strangeness gets worse on Earth, I doubt the whole mission as a dream becuase it just seems like too much.


Perhaps, but if not, how do we explain the fact that the areas and events seem to be nearly carbon copies of things from Shepard's memory?

In particular, I find the husk-stuck-in-door with the nearby vent and letter from the boy to be a very compelling indicator that the occurrence of the scene itself is in question.

This is another I find highly suspicious, note that your squad mates totally ignore it's presence until you fire at it, I've had my Shepard stand staring at it a good 5 minutes before killing it and your squad mates are totally oblivious to it.


Yeah, I put a comment on that vid remarking how after all the times I've gone back to look at that vid expecting him to finally be dead, he's still stuck in that door! One would think you'd have killed him by now. ;)

#16227
UrgentArchengel

UrgentArchengel
  • Members
  • 2 392 messages
Hot damn! I gotta get me one of them infersound thingys! Hahahahahaha.

Okay, seriously, the infrasound stuff sounds pretty cool. Can't wait to see what comes out if it in the end.

#16228
HellishFiend

HellishFiend
  • Members
  • 5 546 messages

HellishFiend wrote...

Riot86 wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...
[...]
I'm continuing to work on the Normandy infrasound evidence, but I may simply not have what I need.
[...]

I have no idea what you are talking about, bit it sounds pretty interesting...can you explain what you are trying to find to a tech-noob like me? :)


Infrasound is one of the things cited by the codex as a Reaper Indoctrination tool.

Infrasound is a real life thing that can and does cause psychological effects. In fact, the same can be said about most, if not all of the things the codex entry cites. 

That's all well and good, but normally we rely on the game to tell or indicate to us when any of those things are present. However, most large speakers can reproduce infrasound, but it is usually a pointless affair since we cant hear it, and it can be damaging to the speakers at high volumes. TSA has some professional audio equipment that allows him to filter sound down to very specific ranges, and speakers that can safely reproduce them. He claims to have filtered out everything above 20hz, and is still getting heavy woofer movement. 

What we need is either a video like this that proves the existence of infrasound on the Normandy through woofer movement, or something like this (the view in the upper right corner), which displays a visual representation of the frequencies within the audio signal. 


Reposting on new page for curious lurkers. (we love you, lurkers!<3)

#16229
DJBare

DJBare
  • Members
  • 6 510 messages

HellishFiend wrote...

Yeah, I put a comment on that vid remarking how after all the times I've gone back to look at that vid expecting him to finally be dead, he's still stuck in that door! One would think you'd have killed him by now. ;)

Oh man I'm getting senile, totally forgotten I uploaded that vid.

Btw, here's another possible hallucination association, the big swirly mass at the top of the beam, kinda like the big swirly mass that makes up the galaxy map.

#16230
HellishFiend

HellishFiend
  • Members
  • 5 546 messages

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Hot damn! I gotta get me one of them infersound thingys! Hahahahahaha.

Okay, seriously, the infrasound stuff sounds pretty cool. Can't wait to see what comes out if it in the end.


Same here!

#16231
HellishFiend

HellishFiend
  • Members
  • 5 546 messages

DJBare wrote...

Btw, here's another possible hallucination association, the big swirly mass at the top of the beam, kinda like the big swirly mass that makes up the galaxy map.


I'd have to take another look to see what you're referring to. But it honestly wouldnt surprise me. It's starting to seem like everything in London is a rehash from Shepard's past with some lore-breaking elements thrown in to add to the surreality. 

The one thing I cant figure is how Major Coates would fit into it. He seems to be the one and only unique element that cant possibly have been from Shepard's past.

Modifié par HellishFiend, 10 juin 2012 - 05:41 .


#16232
paxxton

paxxton
  • Members
  • 8 445 messages

HellishFiend wrote...

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Hot damn! I gotta get me one of them infersound thingys! Hahahahahaha.

Okay, seriously, the infrasound stuff sounds pretty cool. Can't wait to see what comes out if it in the end.


Same here!

Did someone post a video with that sound?

#16233
HellishFiend

HellishFiend
  • Members
  • 5 546 messages

paxxton wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Hot damn! I gotta get me one of them infersound thingys! Hahahahahaha.

Okay, seriously, the infrasound stuff sounds pretty cool. Can't wait to see what comes out if it in the end.


Same here!

Did someone post a video with that sound?


No, I worked on it a bit today, but my initial guess was correct. I simply dont have the equipment to get the proof myself. Read my post on the last page to see why, and how people can help. 

#16234
Dwailing

Dwailing
  • Members
  • 4 566 messages
I'm on my phone, but I have a minute. What's new?

#16235
balance5050

balance5050
  • Members
  • 5 245 messages
I still think the leaked script was a red herring.

Modifié par balance5050, 10 juin 2012 - 06:11 .


#16236
Dwailing

Dwailing
  • Members
  • 4 566 messages

balance5050 wrote...

I still think the leaked script was a red herring.



That wouldn't surprise me. Does anyone know exactly WHEN the script was leaked?

#16237
ivenoidea

ivenoidea
  • Members
  • 243 messages

balance5050 wrote...

I still think the leaked script was a red herring.


That would explain the red herring they posted on their fb.

#16238
paxxton

paxxton
  • Members
  • 8 445 messages

Dwailing wrote...

I'm on my phone, but I have a minute. What's new?

Can your phone speaker reproduce infrasound? Posted Image

#16239
paxxton

paxxton
  • Members
  • 8 445 messages

balance5050 wrote...

I still think the leaked script was a red herring.

Might be. It would have been pretty clumsy of BioWare to leak a script for their greatest of the greatest games.

#16240
delldo

delldo
  • Members
  • 109 messages
You guys might want to be careful in your quest for finding infrasounds... It does intrigue me after reading this link:

www.lowertheboom.org/trice/infrasound.htm

#16241
RavenEyry

RavenEyry
  • Members
  • 4 394 messages

paxxton wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I still think the leaked script was a red herring.

Might be. It would have been pretty clumsy of BioWare to leak a script for their greatest of the greatest games.

And, as DJBare likes to remind us, it is the only thing to ever be leaked over xbox live.

#16242
MaximizedAction

MaximizedAction
  • Members
  • 3 293 messages

delldo wrote...

You guys might want to be careful in your quest for finding infrasounds... It does intrigue me after reading this link:

www.lowertheboom.org/trice/infrasound.htm


Another good reason to not always build complicated sound devices that can be broken during the process but just get a nice spectrum diagramm to look at.

#16243
TJBartlemus

TJBartlemus
  • Members
  • 2 308 messages

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

prettz wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

Sorry Arian, I've been off exploring some concepts in relation to the Citadel beam being a mass indoctrination device, not unlike the Arch Monolith that Desolas and Saren found in Shanxi.


this was the only reason I could think why joker would book it. after being told by Edi that a mass indoctrination wave was heading his way or something... :(


I dont think Indoctrination is something you can make into a wave. I mean even the fastest cases of Indoctrination (that is, cases hwere you are not simply reduced to a mindless husk by beeing impaled on spike of doom) take some time.



Just to be clear, I didn't actually mean the wave we see once the crucible blesses the cosmos with its plot-rays of space magic.

I was referring to the beam in london the citadel extrudes when it arrives at earth, the beam that Shepard Incorporated™ charge towards in london. My assumption being that the citadel, once shooting it’s beam acts as mass indoctrination device, which would explain why Shepard’s hallucinations suddenly ramp up once (s)he’s gaining proximity to it. Also keep in mind Vega’s thoughts (foreshadowing) about the culture on the Citadel being too apathetic about the war, which could possibly indicate that the citadel had already been causing some kind of low level indoctrination in it’s more dormant state. This concept could also explain the motivation behind the Reapers moving the citadel to earth in the first place.


Other than simple guesswork, do we have any reason to belive the beam is an indoctrination device? Do we have prior examples? Cases where we see beams in reaper tech or architecture?


The only thing I based my guesswork on was that Reaper Tech (generall speaking) can emit an Indoctrination Signal. And as you've said, the Beam is a big honking piece of Reaper Tech (paraphrasing). But really, it's just a guess at why things seem a little "odd" during London, like Anderson's "I was born in London" and "Really?". and all that. Hm, y'know that might also explain why Coates suddenly decided retreat was an option after Hammer gets wiped out. That's assuming Coates isn't already a Reaper agent but who knows really.


I was going through the posts last night and found this interesting. So here is my idea. In previous posts people have noticed similarities in the devices that protected the Rachni queen in comparison to the beam up to the  citadel. (The giant shield like things blocking your path in the rachni mission) And the Rachni queen was complaining about hearing "voices" until you disabled all of them to get to her. So is that proof that the beam is also for indoctrination?

It could also be proof that your mind is just putting up images that look similar, like with the apartment in Priority Earth and your cabin.

#16244
balance5050

balance5050
  • Members
  • 5 245 messages

RavenEyry wrote...

paxxton wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I still think the leaked script was a red herring.

Might be. It would have been pretty clumsy of BioWare to leak a script for their greatest of the greatest games.

And, as DJBare likes to remind us, it is the only thing to ever be leaked over xbox live.


Yeah. THAT really makes little sense to me....... They pulled the subtitles from a demo version or something?

#16245
paxxton

paxxton
  • Members
  • 8 445 messages

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

UrgentArchengel wrote...

Hot damn! I gotta get me one of them infersound thingys! Hahahahahaha.

Okay, seriously, the infrasound stuff sounds pretty cool. Can't wait to see what comes out if it in the end.


Same here!

Did someone post a video with that sound?


No, I worked on it a bit today, but my initial guess was correct. I simply dont have the equipment to get the proof myself. Read my post on the last page to see why, and how people can help. 

Wow. Those X-540 aren't anything professional and still the subwoofer shakes like a mad cow.

#16246
Turbo_J

Turbo_J
  • Members
  • 1 217 messages

HellishFiend wrote...

DJBare wrote...

Btw, here's another possible hallucination association, the big swirly mass at the top of the beam, kinda like the big swirly mass that makes up the galaxy map.


I'd have to take another look to see what you're referring to. But it honestly wouldnt surprise me. It's starting to seem like everything in London is a rehash from Shepard's past with some lore-breaking elements thrown in to add to the surreality. 

The one thing I cant figure is how Major Coates would fit into it. He seems to be the one and only unique element that cant possibly have been from Shepard's past.


I'm back. Did a little MP marathon to get my readiness rating back up to 100 and promote a few classes. I figure once I hit 2K for the N7 I won't need to play MP to get decent endings... it will be optional like it really should have been.

For the record: I'm pretty sure the clock does not exist in the breath scene. Hellish and I both looked into it the best we could and the only clear view of whatever object is in the background does not have the correct structure. It looks like a round circle surrounded by flared out corners. That first image is compelling but it's inconclusive at best.

So clock = debunked so far.

One thing I did find while I was digging around was that the time on Big Ben and the clock at the LZ are the same 10:05. We can argue it's a static image, but the time changes in the final cut scene when you see the color coded shock wave wash over it. It reads 11:45.

So... London. Seems we've poked enough about this to get peoples attention that it may not real... or could be a waking dream like others have suggested. Even though there is more to investigate within London itself, I think a few key events leading up to it are important.

Cronos.

It's odd, that goes without saying. Even EDI acts a little strange, but I think she just may be trying to prove herself. Her knowledge of what is on the console recordings is a little unsettling.

The creaking sounds:

The breath scene has creaking sounds. Now I know Cronos does not (may not) have concrete - Humans didn't build it so who knows what's in there, but would the ground in London creek? - This is one of the reasons inferring that the hallucinations start after the shuttle crash or the transport truck crash make sense... they could make creaking noises.

Last chat at the QEC:

Hackett boards the Normandy with armed guards and they have their guns drawn. Some claimed this was a re-purposed scene because BW had originally planned for Shep to be taken into custody prior to the trial that never happened... I hope not. So if it really is not re-purposed, why would Hackett board with armed men... why would he board the ship of his most trusted soldier with an escort at all.

The conversation with Hackett and Anderson prior to London:

This is really really odd. The dialog, the sideways glaces from them both. I just got the sense that they were setting Shepard up. Could the Alliance be smart enough to use Shepard as a diversion, or is all this odd for another reason.

The fleet dropping into Sol:

So 2K ships can enter the Sol system through a relay with almost no time between them and they can appear hundreds of kilometers from the relay itself. Looks like FTL to me... did they travel the long way from the nearest relay to Sol and just not explain it? Could be argued as scene aesthetics. It sure did look good.

When I first started suspecting Indoctrination, Cronos was my very first suspect of where it started. Not necessarily hallucinations, just the start of where everything in the game feel shifted. The tone undeniably changes here. It was bad on Horizon, but Cronos just makes my skin crawl.  I'm starting to lean back in that direction. I'm not there completely, but I really think Cronos as a key component in the alteration of Shepards perceptions. The proto-Reaper being there - and the entire feeling of that area... *shivers*

Modifié par Turbo_J, 10 juin 2012 - 06:49 .


#16247
paxxton

paxxton
  • Members
  • 8 445 messages
Weekends always put this thread in slo-mo.

#16248
ThisOneIsPunny

ThisOneIsPunny
  • Members
  • 446 messages

Turbo_J wrote...

The fleet dropping into Sol:

So 2K ships can enter the Sol system through a relay with almost no time between them and they can appear hundreds of kilometers from the relay itself. Looks like FTL to me... did they travel the long way from the nearest relay to Sol and just not explain it? Could be argued as scene aesthetics. It sure did look good.

You know what that scene seems identical too?

The geth heretics and Sovereign assaulting the Citadel.

#16249
TJBartlemus

TJBartlemus
  • Members
  • 2 308 messages

Turbo_J wrote...

One thing I did find while I was digging around was that the time on Big Ben and the clock at the LZ are the same 10:05. We can argue it's a static image, but the time changes in the final cut scene when you see the color coded shock wave wash over it. It reads 11:45.

So... London. Seems we've poked enough about this to get peoples attention that it may not real... or could be a waking dream like others have suggested. Even though there is more to investigate within London itself, I think a few key events leading up to it are important.

Cronos.

It's odd, that goes without saying. Even EDI acts a little strange, but I think she just may be trying to prove herself. He knowledge of what is on the console recordings is a little unsettling.

The creaking sounds:

The breath scene has creaking sounds. Now I know Cronos does not (may not) have concrete - Humans didn't build it so who knows what's in there, but would the ground in London creek? - This is one of the reasons inferring that the hallucinations start after the shuttle crash or the transport truck crash make sense... they could make creaking noises.

Last chat at the QEC:

Hackett boards the Normandy with armed guards and they have their guns drawn. Some claimed this was a re-purposed scene because BW had originally planned for Shep to be taken into custody prior to the trial that never happened... I hope not. So if it really is not re-purposed, we would Hackett board with armed men... why would he board the ship of is most trusted soldier with an escort at all.

The fleet dropping into Sol:

So 2K ships can enter the Sol system through a relay with almost no time between them and they can appear hundreds of kilometers from the relay itself. Looks like FTL to me... did they travel the long way from the nearest relay to Sol and just not explain it? Could be argued as scene aesthetics. It sure did look good.

When I first started suspecting Indoctrination, Cronos was my very first suspect of where it started. Not necessarily hallucinations, just the start of where everything in the game feel shifted. The tone undeniably changes here. It was bad on Horizon, but Cronos just makes my skin crawl.  I'm starting to lean back in that direction. I'm not there completely, but I really think Cronos as a key component in the alteration of Shepards perceptions. The proto-Reaper being there - and the entire feeling of that area... *shivers*


I really think indoctrination on Crono station seems quite unlikely and counter productive to the entire end of the game. Sure there might be a device on Cronos station but Shepard spends so little time on it, it really wouldn't matter.

I like the idea that the closer to the beam you get the more the influence is on you. This would also make sense because you actually can see the beam affect the rockets when you fire them at the reaper, so there is no doubt there is some type of invisible field around the beam that affects objects and I assume people. Look previous for the letter about guy fighting indoctrination. He obviously comments about wanting to go there but he is fighting it. So there is something indoctrinating. No doubt. It would also explain how Reapers could make harvesting effecient. Let the prey come to you.

What is the significance of the time on Big Ben? :huh: So what if an hour and 40 min. has passed?

#16250
Razhael

Razhael
  • Members
  • 38 messages
Im still trying to figure out how does the part on Arrival DLC where you get captured by the indoctrinated scientist in ME3.
They have you captive for quite enough time to do god knows what kind of things (not talking about probes, you perverts :P)