55528 réponses à ce sujet

[paxxton]

Big Bad wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

If you people don't shape up, I'm going to start making Buffy the Vampire Slayer jokes. And it won't be pretty!

I have an uncle who used to be angel's stunt double actually.

Pffft!  **** Angel...now if he had been Spike's stunt double, then I'd be impressed!

(I'm totally kidding.  That's actually really awesome!)

My memory could be faulty, but either way, it's this guy;

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0244781/ 

He remains my favorite uncle. 

I have no reason to doubt your memorry. I was just making a silly reference to the long-standing rivalry between Angel fans and Spike fans.

I know you're discussing Buffy series but I never actually liked it or watched it. Is it really worth the time? I mean...vampires...we have dismissed that claim.

Modifié par paxxton, 15 juin 2012 - 03:08 .

[Salient Archer]

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

[paxxton]

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Modifié par paxxton, 15 juin 2012 - 03:17 .

[Corik]

I don't understand anything about sound in games. Is it really weird to have low freq sounds in ME3?

[HellishFiend]

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

That takes the concept of "Player indoctrination" to a whole new level... 

[Big Bad]

@paxxton - Buffy is my favorite show ever, but it is definitely an acquired taste. Are you familiar with Joss Whedon's other work such as Firefly or the new Avengers movie? If you like his style, you might very well like Buffy.

The show has very strong characterization. Also it changes tone on a dime, which I really enjoy. It is not unusual to get some serious drama, comedy, action horror and heart-breaking sadness all in the span of a single episode.

[HellishFiend]

Corik wrote...

I don't understand anything about sound in games. Is it really weird to have low freq sounds in ME3?

Yes, it is weird, to say the least! Did you see my intial analysis post yesterday?

http://social.biowar...32/771#12581175 

That evidence is fairly conclusive in and of itself that Coates' character is associated with the presence of an infrasonic indoctrination signal. Exciting stuff!

Modifié par HellishFiend, 15 juin 2012 - 03:23 .

[Salient Archer]

HellishFiend wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

That takes the concept of "Player indoctrination" to a whole new level... 

Well they wanted to make the player feel what Shepard did; so maybe we're all indoctrinated, right now ... and there's no way for us to even be sure of it either. 

[Corik]

HellishFiend wrote...

Corik wrote...

I don't understand anything about sound in games. Is it really weird to have low freq sounds in ME3?

Yes, it is weird, to say the least! Did you see my intial analysis post yesterday?

http://social.biowar...32/771#12581175 

That evidence is fairly conclusive in and of itself that Coates' character is associated with the presence of an infrasonic indoctrination signal. Exciting stuff!

that could be explained with the codex. Reapers use indoctrinated guys to intensify their signal, or something like that, right? Poor Coates.

[Corik]

Salient Archer wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

That takes the concept of "Player indoctrination" to a whole new level... 

Well they wanted to make the player feel what Shepard did; so maybe we're all indoctrinated, right now ... and there's no way for us to even be sure of it either. 

I don't know... I still want to destroy the reapers and watch them explode 

[HellishFiend]

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Sound isnt proceduraly generated, to my knowledge. It's created by a sound studio, not an algorithm. Maybe at some point in the future, but not now, and not like this. 

And I agree with Salient that there is an inordinate amount of "pressure" in the infrasonic range in that sample you took.

It's nearly getting to the point where we need to try and find examples where there isnt any infrasonic noise so we can use it as a differentiation. 

Still very excited. 

Modifié par HellishFiend, 15 juin 2012 - 03:26 .

[HellishFiend]

Corik wrote...

I don't know... I still want to destroy the reapers and watch them explode 

Damnit Corik, destroying the Reapers gains us nothing!  

[paxxton]

Big Bad wrote...

@paxxton - Buffy is my favorite show ever, but it is definitely an acquired taste. Are you familiar with Joss Whedon's other work such as Firefly or the new Avengers movie? If you like his style, you might very well like Buffy.

The show has very strong characterization. Also it changes tone on a dime, which I really enjoy. It is not unusual to get some serious drama, comedy, action horror and heart-breaking sadness all in the span of a single episode.

I'm actually unfamiliar with any of his works. At least any that I know of which is none.  I watched LOST a couple of years ago.

The problem with series is that you get sucked in and can't resist watching another episode. Which effectively takes hundreds of hours from your life.

Modifié par paxxton, 15 juin 2012 - 03:29 .

[ZerebusPrime]

Corik wrote...

Poor Coates.

Yes, a Turned Coates is a serious threat to all we hold dear...








*snicker*

[MaximizedAction]

paxxton wrote...

I've been analyzing the sound spectrum of the Proto-Reaper room on Cronos Station. I'm not really sure what to think. I probably did something wrong.

I loaded a save after I fought my way through the room. Then I went into it and recorded the sound. I also muted all music and dialog so that only sound effects are played. I finished the recording just before the ramp 2 floors below the door to the green room.

I don't know why but FRAPS is recording only 30-second videos.

Nah, it looks fine to me.
I myself have been digging through the ogg files but am not sure what to think of the results. In short:

- a sound file for with white noise for higher frequencies for the dreams, effective range: 100Hz-3000Hz. As I found out, white noise is often used for obscuring frequencies.
- sometimes low peaks at 12-13Hz (similar to above). For example, that music while you're making your end choice. I also found out that 12Hz is the lowest frequency you can hear.
- nearly every tune, background noise, soundtrack file in the ME3 files has a very prominent bass. No real patterns, besides low peaks at either 10Hz or 12/13Hz. And the fact that ME3 has a lot of bass makes it difficult to differentiate between usual and non-usual occurence.
So, I we don't find spectra with really obvious peaks at low frequencies, I don't know if this isn't the same as watching the fog in the breath scene.

[HellishFiend]

ZerebusPrime wrote...

Corik wrote...

Poor Coates.

Yes, a Turned Coates is a serious threat to all we hold dear...








*snicker*

Remember his name is actually "Coats", too, not Coates. Not sure when the e got added in there, really.

TurnCoats...  <_<

Modifié par HellishFiend, 15 juin 2012 - 03:30 .

[paxxton]

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Sound isnt proceduraly generated, to my knowledge. It's created by a sound studio, not an algorithm. Maybe at some point in the future, but not now, and not like this. 

And I agree with Salient that there is an inordinate amount of "pressure" in the infrasonic range in that sample you took.

It's nearly getting to the point where we need to try and find examples where there isnt any infrasonic noise so we can use it as a differentiation. 

Still very excited. 

LOL. Sound can be generated procedurally. Just input numerical data into sound card memory buffer and make it play that. I'm not talking about voice or something sophisticated, rather about noise (that could be used to simulate indoctrination).

Modifié par paxxton, 15 juin 2012 - 03:35 .

[Salient Archer]

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

EDIT: I should add that the reason sub 20hz frequencies are usually shelfed with a low pass filter is because subwoofers can only produce frequencies between 20hz~200hz and it fatigues the driver.

Modifié par Salient Archer, 15 juin 2012 - 03:39 .

[TSA_383]

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Nah, a lot of the stuff down at <10Hz is just noise - you get it in every signal due to the way the hanning window works.

That said, the dream sequence "whisper" files are actually mostly infrasonic - I tried pitch-shifting them and they have a load of sweeping tones in the <20Hz range.

MaximizedAction wrote...
I am looking forward to the analysis of the Normandy background sounds, Catalyst scene, ProtoReaper on Cronos, etc.

A quick thought (although I don't have time to check just now but maybe someone else could).
The reaper conversation on rannoch - any unusual audio there?

BatmanTurian wrote...

Random Reaper: ARE YOU SURE WE SHOULDN'T JUST TRY TO INDOCTRINATE SHEPARD, HARBINGER?

Harbinger: 
NO. SHEPARD IS MY ONE TRUE LOVE. INDOCTRINATING HIM WOULD CHANGE HIM
TOO MUCH.  IT JUST WOULDN'T BE THE SAME. I WOULDN'T EVEN BE ABLE TO
STALK HIM LIKE A CREEP ANYMORE.

HellishFiend wrote...

plfranke wrote...

Hey
guys if on my first playthrough I was dead set on controlling the
Reapers but picked to destroy them by accident because I did't know
where I was going... Was I or was I not indoctrinated?

Good
question... To be fair, according to the metagaming experience we think
Bioware planned out, you were indoctrinated since you wanted to pick
Control (I know that feel...), but you may be off the hook since you
wound up picking Destroy.

Speaking of that, did we ever determine
if the LegendSave locks in your initial decision and that it cant be
changed? Or was that debunked?

Debunked....ish.
We did find out two important things:

-The Newgame+ file saves your ending choice.
-The game records your ending choice and sends it to Bioware if you have the game feedback feature turned on.

[HellishFiend]

paxxton wrote...

LOL. Sound can be generated procedurally. Just input numerical data into sound card memory buffer and make it play that. I'm not talking about voice or something, rather about noise (that could be used to simulate indoctrination).

Perhaps, but I stand by saying "not like this", because so far we've found corresponding sound files for all the sounds in the game.... right?

[TSA_383]

Salient Archer wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

The reason every audio file shows infrasound to some extent is because of this:
http://en.wikipedia....pectral_leakage

[MaximizedAction]

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

LOL. Sound can be generated procedurally. Just input numerical data into sound card memory buffer and make it play that. I'm not talking about voice or something, rather about noise (that could be used to simulate indoctrination).

Perhaps, but I stand by saying "not like this", because so far we've found corresponding sound files for all the sounds in the game.... right?

Well....I still can't find the bachground sound from Normandy's cargo bay...

[HellishFiend]

Salient Archer wrote...
 Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

Yeah this is something that I've mentioned as well. In fact, my subwoofer has a built in filter that heavily reduces those frequencies from any incoming signal. 

[MaximizedAction]

TSA_383 wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

The reason every audio file shows infrasound to some extent is because of this:
http://en.wikipedia....pectral_leakage

Then it's a lot of leakage going on here:



That's the average over the whole playtime of the decision making beat (not the Catalyst track).

[paxxton]

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

LOL. Sound can be generated procedurally. Just input numerical data into sound card memory buffer and make it play that. I'm not talking about voice or something, rather about noise (that could be used to simulate indoctrination).

Perhaps, but I stand by saying "not like this", because so far we've found corresponding sound files for all the sounds in the game.... right?

Oh, but I didn't mean they are generated in real-time (on the players computer) though it may be so as well (I don't know). I meant that the devs embedded procedurally generated infrasounds in the sound files.