55528 réponses à ce sujet

[HellishFiend]

MaximizedAction wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

LOL. Sound can be generated procedurally. Just input numerical data into sound card memory buffer and make it play that. I'm not talking about voice or something, rather about noise (that could be used to simulate indoctrination).

Perhaps, but I stand by saying "not like this", because so far we've found corresponding sound files for all the sounds in the game.... right?

Well....I still can't find the bachground sound from Normandy's cargo bay...

Interesting. Do we know if that sound follows a definite pattern, or is it actually somewhat random? I know there are several distinct loops, but havent paid attention to the pattern behind them. 

Here is Prettz' video:

Modifié par HellishFiend, 15 juin 2012 - 03:42 .

[Salient Archer]

TSA_383 wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

The reason every audio file shows infrasound to some extent is because of this:
http://en.wikipedia....pectral_leakage

I'm reading it but I just came home from playing a gig and my 2am eyes can't process the words I'm reading into clear thoughts but are you saying that despite the fact that an engineer spends days in a studio mastering the audio files so that frequencies don't and wont clash and shelving the frequencies that don't or shouldn't be produced that they'll show up anyway? Those sneaky little infrasonic b*stards!!

[HellishFiend]

paxxton wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

LOL. Sound can be generated procedurally. Just input numerical data into sound card memory buffer and make it play that. I'm not talking about voice or something, rather about noise (that could be used to simulate indoctrination).

Perhaps, but I stand by saying "not like this", because so far we've found corresponding sound files for all the sounds in the game.... right?

Oh, but I didn't mean they are generated in real-time (on the players computer) though it may be so as well (I don't know). I meant that the devs embedded procedurally generated infrasounds in the sound files.

Ah, yeah, that makes sense. 

[HellishFiend]

Salient Archer wrote...
I'm reading it but I just came home from playing a gig and my 2am eyes can't process the words I'm reading into clear thoughts but are you saying that despite the fact that an engineer spends days in a studio mastering the audio files so that frequencies don't and wont clash and shelving the frequencies that don't or shouldn't be produced that they'll show up anyway? Those sneaky little infrasonic b*stards!!

Yes, but only to a minor extent. Certainly nothing to the extent that we see from Coats or the dream sequences, etc. What we need is a basis of comparison so we know how much leakage there is during scenes where there should not be any intentional infrasonic noise present..

[paxxton]

Salient Archer wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

EDIT: I should add that the reason sub 20hz frequencies are usually shelfed with a low pass filter is because subwoofers can only produce frequencies between 20hz~200hz and it fatigues the driver.

I should try ME2 and the Collector Base + the dead Reaper.

[Corik]

The pattern is there, buried in the audio.

[Salient Archer]

HellishFiend wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...
I'm reading it but I just came home from playing a gig and my 2am eyes can't process the words I'm reading into clear thoughts but are you saying that despite the fact that an engineer spends days in a studio mastering the audio files so that frequencies don't and wont clash and shelving the frequencies that don't or shouldn't be produced that they'll show up anyway? Those sneaky little infrasonic b*stards!!

Yes, but only to a minor extent. Certainly nothing to the extent that we see from Coats or the dream sequences, etc. What we need is a basis of comparison so we know how much leakage there is during scenes where there should not be any intentional infrasonic noise present..

I just called my friend (who thankfully never sleeps) but he happens to be both a trained audio and acoustics engineer, and is also a studying physicist. Anyway, I ran the question past him and he did say that that some infrasonic noise should be present to some extent but not in the consistency or the db levels being presented in that spectra. He said there should be the occasional spike in particular frequencies as trade offs for higher frequencies but nothing of tangible consistency, not without some degree of deliberation being involved that is.

[Dwailing]

HellishFiend wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...
I'm reading it but I just came home from playing a gig and my 2am eyes can't process the words I'm reading into clear thoughts but are you saying that despite the fact that an engineer spends days in a studio mastering the audio files so that frequencies don't and wont clash and shelving the frequencies that don't or shouldn't be produced that they'll show up anyway? Those sneaky little infrasonic b*stards!!

Yes, but only to a minor extent. Certainly nothing to the extent that we see from Coats or the dream sequences, etc. What we need is a basis of comparison so we know how much leakage there is during scenes where there should not be any intentional infrasonic noise present..

That would be helpful.  You should get on that Hellish. 

[TSA_383]

Salient Archer wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

The reason every audio file shows infrasound to some extent is because of this:
http://en.wikipedia....pectral_leakage

I'm reading it but I just came home from playing a gig and my 2am eyes can't process the words I'm reading into clear thoughts but are you saying that despite the fact that an engineer spends days in a studio mastering the audio files so that frequencies don't and wont clash and shelving the frequencies that don't or shouldn't be produced that they'll show up anyway? Those sneaky little infrasonic b*stards!!

*First of all - my apologies for not replying to your PM yet, I'm just about to go out (damn time differences)*

Almost - it 's an artefact of using a short window - for example the window I've used captures lots of chunks ~0.4 seconds long and averages out the frequency peaks from those - so if the sound is at a different level at the start and end of lots of those 0.4 second windows it'll create very low-frequency peaks that aren't really there.

However...

MaximizedAction wrote...


Then it's a lot of leakage going on here:



That's the average over the whole playtime of the decision making beat (not the Catalyst track).

^When you get a signal like this one you can see that there most certainly IS a peak at ~12Hz, ~21 & ~26 (from now on to be known as the Coates frequency  ).

At a hunch, I'd guess that these peaks come up at different points in the playtime - you'd get much more clearly defined peaks looking at a shorter part of the sound file...

[paxxton]

HellishFiend wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...
 Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

Yeah this is something that I've mentioned as well. In fact, my subwoofer has a built in filter that heavily reduces those frequencies from any incoming signal. 

But if subwoofers have their own protecttive filters the signal doesn't have to be pre-filtered before being sent to the speakers. That way the more insightful part of the fanbase can find it and speculate about what it might mean for their huskification process.

[HellishFiend]

Dwailing wrote...

That would be helpful.  You should get on that Hellish. 

My ability to assist is stymied because I dont have the PC version , but I'll do what I can... 

[Salient Archer]

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

@paxxton: with so much audio pressure in the sub 20hz range I'm starting to wonder if BioWare isn't trying to turn us (the players) into an army of husks. I find it interesting that someone felt the need to boost 10hz.

I'm not a sound specialist so I'm not sure if the smooth edges of the curve don't mean that there's nothing there. Or maybe it means that the sounds there are procedurally generated and are so perfect. It may be so that the sharp unevenness in higher frequencies is what's causing the sound (like rapidly changing pressure). So maybe the smooth edges in lower frequencies mean that the sound isn't changing so rapidly (the pressure change is slower) and thus the perception of these sounds is subliminal.

Could you take a sample from an area that doesn't contain any infrasonic frequencies ... not sure exactly where, but we definitely need it for comparison. These frequencies shouldn't be there as they should have been cut with a low pass filter (from 20hz down) to preserve audio bandwidth and quality and as well as protecting home theater system (usually the subwoofer) from unpredictable spikes coming from infrasonic frequencies. My understanding is that those frequencies should only be present because the audio file contains them (kind of like hidden text in a system file) and not due to naturally occurring acoustics.

EDIT: I should add that the reason sub 20hz frequencies are usually shelfed with a low pass filter is because subwoofers can only produce frequencies between 20hz~200hz and it fatigues the driver.

I should try ME2 and the Collector Base + the dead Reaper.

Sounds good

[HellishFiend]

paxxton wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Yeah this is something that I've mentioned as well. In fact, my subwoofer has a built in filter that heavily reduces those frequencies from any incoming signal. 

But if subwoofers have their own protecttive filters the signal doesn't have to be pre-filtered before being sent to the speakers. That way the more insightful part of the fanbase can find it and speculate about what it might mean for their huskification process.

Remember, Not all subwoofers have that filter. 

[Dwailing]

HellishFiend wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

That would be helpful.  You should get on that Hellish. 

My ability to assist is stymied because I dont have the PC version , but I'll do what I can... 

Ah, well then, TSA, get on it. 

[paxxton]

Does anyone know why FRAPS is recording only 30-second videos?

Modifié par paxxton, 15 juin 2012 - 04:07 .

[HellishFiend]

paxxton wrote...

Does anyone know why FRAPS is recording only 29-second videos?

Have you bought a license, or are you using the trial version?

[paxxton]

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Does anyone know why FRAPS is recording only 29-second videos?

Have you bought a license, or are you using the trial version?

I thought it was freeware.

EDIT: Yeah, it's a trial.

Modifié par paxxton, 15 juin 2012 - 04:10 .

[Salient Archer]

@TSA_383: That's cool about not getting back to me yet, I'm more than sympathetic to having long days. As it's very late where I am my tired brain never realised that the audio being captured was being taken over a time period and hence the consistency in the wave form, I'd be inclined to say that we need to try and take timestamped snapshots of the audio but that could be very, very time consuming. I'm still curious to see if Infrasonic frequencies start to peak more the closer we get to the london beam.

@Paxxton: The deliberation in hiding infrasound is what I'm hoping for. The idea of the game containing audio that doesn't need to be there as it can't be replicated by most sound systems but at the same time is the very core to the mechanics of how the Reapers indoctrinate people.

[HellishFiend]

paxxton wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Does anyone know why FRAPS is recording only 29-second videos?

Have you bought a license, or are you using the trial version?

I thought it was freeware.

EDIT: Yeah, it's a trial.

There are other freeware programs that perform a function similar to FRAPS, but FRAPS is highly regarded as one of the best because of its low overhead. Freeware programs sometimes take up more processing power and produce choppy videos.

[TSA_383]

http://social.biowar.../index/12417449
What?
I don't even...

[HellishFiend]

TSA_383 wrote...

http://social.biowar.../index/12417449
What?
I don't even...

Yeah...that... 

[MaximizedAction]

Wall of comparison incoming:

For comparison, here's the full playtime average of the track from when you choose what weapons to equip, power upgrades, etc.:



I chose this as a comparison, because to me it has enough bases to make out what bass within music can have.

Another comparison, to make out whether there are absormalities in the game files, it's An End Once and For All:

Soundtrack download from Origin:


From the game files:


Over all the spectrum, the OST version (first pic) is slightly louder.

But, as you can see, in the >50Hz intervall both match up in the frequency coordinate. For <=50Hz, however, they don't really seem to be the same, anymore. Could mean that the game sound is supposed to be different in that domain of frequencies. Especially, notice that minimum at 16 or 10Hz, depending on the file? I think they are supposed to be the same phenomena, as the frequencies around this low also follow that low.

So it seems to me, that at lower frequencies are extended to have more presence in the lower domain.
But that could be intentional in the sense of aesthetics, i.e. moar bass, bass is fashionable now, see dubstep sound effects on biotic powers.

But otherwise, no real big differences. So, what I take from this it that the in game files seem to have no odd artifacts, extremalities, especially high peaks somewhere, they shouldn't...


Coming up: the spectra from the three high pitch notes from the Joker/Anderson/x flashbacks...

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 15 juin 2012 - 04:32 .

[paxxton]

HellishFiend wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...

http://social.biowar.../index/12417449
What?
I don't even...

Yeah...that... 

LOL. The crew is calm, almost happy. I rather saw them as completely taken by surprise and lost.

Modifié par paxxton, 15 juin 2012 - 04:30 .

[HellishFiend]

paxxton wrote...

LOL. The crew is calm, almost happy. I rather saw them as completely taken by surprise and lost.

In the sage words of one James Vega, "It looks pretty, calm, and peaceful. But its not right. Its all just an illusion"

Modifié par HellishFiend, 15 juin 2012 - 04:32 .

[Corik]

HellishFiend wrote...

paxxton wrote...

LOL. The crew is calm, almost happy. I rather saw them as completely taken by surprise and lost.

In the sage words of one James Vega, "It looks pretty, calm and peaceful but its not right, its all just an illusion"

Hah, actually now those words sound like a clue.

Modifié par Corik, 15 juin 2012 - 04:33 .