55528 réponses à ce sujet

[HellishFiend]

You know, I just noticed something I hadnt noticed before, since I've watched that first dream sequence several dozen times today. That first sound that scares the kid away? The kid is terrified, yet it has absolutely no effect on Shepard. I believe this is consistent across all 3 dreams as well. 

I suggested a short while ago that maybe the kid was being scared off by "Anderson", or rather Shepard's willpower. Well the more I look at these dream sequences, the more I believe that to be the case. 

The Sounds of Possession

Modifié par HellishFiend, 18 juin 2012 - 07:39 .

[Lakeshow1986]

That video just blew my mind, awesome job!

[Auralius Carolus]

HellishFiend wrote...

You know, I just noticed something I hadnt noticed before, since I've watched that first dream sequence several dozen times today. That first sound that scares the kid away? The kid is terrified, yet it has absolutely no effect on Shepard. I believe this is consistent across all 3 dreams as well. 

I suggested a short while ago that maybe the kid was being scared off by "Anderson", or rather Shepard's willpower. Well the more I look at these dream sequences, the more I believe that to be the case. 

The Sounds of Possession

Hmmm. Generally I have just assumed the Shepard doppleganger in Dream 3 to be just that- a traditional harbinger of doom, as well as a symptom of EMF exposure. With your observation, it takes on an additional light- most people I've talked to, (IT crowd), believe it to be a narrative tool trying to warn Shepard; in your observation, it is more likely that the doppleganger could very well be a representation that part of Shepard has come to embrace the child- a new Shepard, to replace the old one.

The child gravitates to the new form, but rejects the old- a telling symbolism. Also, there is a hint of contemporary horror pop culture there: instead of a harold of impending doom, the doppleganger is a sinister force that has the potential to destroy it's look alike and replace him/her.

[HellishFiend]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

You know, I just noticed something I hadnt noticed before, since I've watched that first dream sequence several dozen times today. That first sound that scares the kid away? The kid is terrified, yet it has absolutely no effect on Shepard. I believe this is consistent across all 3 dreams as well. 

I suggested a short while ago that maybe the kid was being scared off by "Anderson", or rather Shepard's willpower. Well the more I look at these dream sequences, the more I believe that to be the case. 

The Sounds of Possession

Hmmm. Generally I have just assumed the Shepard doppleganger in Dream 3 to be just that- a traditional harbinger of doom, as well as a symptom of EMF exposure. With your observation, it takes on an additional light- most people I've talked to, (IT crowd), believe it to be a narrative tool trying to warn Shepard; in your observation, it is more likely that the doppleganger could very well be a representation that part of Shepard has come to embrace the child- a new Shepard, to replace the old one.

The child gravitates to the new form, but rejects the old- a telling symbolism. Also, there is a hint of contemporary horror pop culture there: instead of a harold of impending doom, the doppleganger is a sinister force that has the potential to destroy it's look alike and replace him/her.

Yes, those concepts do add significantly to the idea. I think we're getting much closer to the symbolism that Bioware actually intended with the dream sequences. The effects that are frightening and burning the child are "Anderson", and the doppleganger from the 3rd dream represents "TIM" starting to manifest himself. Fortunately at that point "Anderson" still has enough power to burn them to a crisp and allow Shepard to wake up! But, once "Anderson" is out of the picture, the only one that can wake Shepard up... is the player. 

[HellishFiend]

Lakeshow1986 wrote...

That video just blew my mind, awesome job!

Glad you liked it! Thank you!

[WolfyZA]

wow brilliant find really, just shows how muffled up every sound gets when the music and dialogue is thrown into the mix. I remember on a other thread where a guy aid you could hear whispers and sometimes screams on the Normandy as signs of indoctrination, but this takes it to a new level.

[gunslinger_ruiz]

Question for everyone in  general:

Concerning the song Starchild by Wintersun I doubt it was written with Mass Effect in mind (since the album came out before ME1) but does anyone else get the feeling some/most of the song is singing about the Reapers/origin of the Reapers or even the "Catalyst" AI? I know the song was discussed before but I'm positive I missed most of it. Know there's some of the lyrics that seem to be speaking of "waking up" and "escaping" and such but I found some ways to relate some of the lyrics to what could be the Reapers origins. Or maybe I'm just looking too far into it .

Edit: just a heads up that youtube link has a lot of rage comments about casey hudson/me3 so watch out.

Modifié par gunslinger_ruiz, 18 juin 2012 - 08:27 .

[TSA_383]

HellishFiend wrote...

 Aaaand it's done!

The Sounds of Possession

Let me know what you guys think! I'm especially interested in feedback from those who are NOT already knowledgable on infrasound. Do my explanations make sense? Or is there anything you arent clear on? If so, please let me know so I can alter it and reupload. 

Thank you!

Sweeeeet
Two things I would say as constructive criticisim:

On the first bit with Coates you've highlighted the extreme (<6Hz) low end, which is likely just analysis noise, in addition to the main low peak.

It'd be cool to have some of those pitch-shifted dream sounds in there just for the hell of it

But seriously, good work!

HellishFiend wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...

I just found something interesting.
Remember the chimes at the end?
I just found a use of them in the game - it plays when you take the VS back onto the normandy after they've been injured.

Can't work out why it plays though, it seems out of place for the scene.

Video link for this:
http://www.sendspace.com/file/8itl5a

When do the chimes occur during the video?

52-55 seconds in, right after you get back on the normandy.

Big Bad wrote...

edit: 
Also, if Bioware released DLC that made FemShep slightly less insanely
skinny, I would totally shell out cash for it.  Looking at her arms and
trying to imagine her putting the mele smack down on a Brute is
completing immersion-breaking!  Somebody give that girl some protein!

[HellishFiend]

TSA_383 wrote...

Sweeeeet
Two things I would say as constructive criticisim:

On the first bit with Coates you've highlighted the extreme (<6Hz) low end, which is likely just analysis noise, in addition to the main low peak.

It'd be cool to have some of those pitch-shifted dream sounds in there just for the hell of it

But seriously, good work!

Thanks! Seems like the concept is intact, though, so it's probably not a significant enough problem to redo the video. 

Couldnt think of a way to work the pitch-shifted sounds in there without interrupting the flow of the video. Directing is a fine art.  I designed the video to follow a typical exposition, rising action, climax, and conclusion flow to maximize the dramatic impact of your find. Based on the reactions so far, it seems like I was successful. :happy:

[David7204]

Forgive me if this has already been answered, but there's no way those noises could have been there on accident? I don't know a thing about signal processing or anything like that, so I'd just like to be sure they couldn't be a 'by-product' of recording other sounds.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

HellishFiend wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

You know, I just noticed something I hadnt noticed before, since I've watched that first dream sequence several dozen times today. That first sound that scares the kid away? The kid is terrified, yet it has absolutely no effect on Shepard. I believe this is consistent across all 3 dreams as well. 

I suggested a short while ago that maybe the kid was being scared off by "Anderson", or rather Shepard's willpower. Well the more I look at these dream sequences, the more I believe that to be the case. 

The Sounds of Possession

Hmmm. Generally I have just assumed the Shepard doppleganger in Dream 3 to be just that- a traditional harbinger of doom, as well as a symptom of EMF exposure. With your observation, it takes on an additional light- most people I've talked to, (IT crowd), believe it to be a narrative tool trying to warn Shepard; in your observation, it is more likely that the doppleganger could very well be a representation that part of Shepard has come to embrace the child- a new Shepard, to replace the old one.

The child gravitates to the new form, but rejects the old- a telling symbolism. Also, there is a hint of contemporary horror pop culture there: instead of a harold of impending doom, the doppleganger is a sinister force that has the potential to destroy it's look alike and replace him/her.

Yes, those concepts do add significantly to the idea. I think we're getting much closer to the symbolism that Bioware actually intended with the dream sequences. The effects that are frightening and burning the child are "Anderson", and the doppleganger from the 3rd dream represents "TIM" starting to manifest himself. Fortunately at that point "Anderson" still has enough power to burn them to a crisp and allow Shepard to wake up! But, once "Anderson" is out of the picture, the only one that can wake Shepard up... is the player. 

Indeed the doppleganger is an old oment of doom, but I think it is even more interesting that seeing ones own doppleganger is often seen as a sign of ones impending death, though in cases where the doppleganger is real it is not certain wether it is the death of the person or the doppleganger. So could it be an oment of Shepards litteral death or an omen of Shepard succumbing to Indoctrination essentially the death of the non indoctrinated Shepard or him overcoming Indoctrination, killing the Indoctrinated part of himself.

God there is a ton of symbolism wich can be placed on this game.

[HellishFiend]

David7204 wrote...

Forgive me if this has already been answered, but there's no way those noises could have been there on accident? I don't know a thing about signal processing or anything like that, so I'd just like to be sure they couldn't be a 'by-product' of recording other sounds.

Nope. I'm not exaggerating at all when I say in the video that the infrasonic sound in there is not an accident. There is such a thing as what you label a "by-product", small amounts of sounds that bleed across the spectrum down into the infrasonic range, but not to this extent. Moreover, we've isolated and pitch shifted the infrasonic sounds so that we could be sure they were actually sounds and not just static. They are quite audibly intentional sounds. 

[Deputy Secretary of Awesome]

HellishFiend wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

You know, I just noticed something I hadnt noticed before, since I've watched that first dream sequence several dozen times today. That first sound that scares the kid away? The kid is terrified, yet it has absolutely no effect on Shepard. I believe this is consistent across all 3 dreams as well. 

I suggested a short while ago that maybe the kid was being scared off by "Anderson", or rather Shepard's willpower. Well the more I look at these dream sequences, the more I believe that to be the case. 

The Sounds of Possession

Hmmm. Generally I have just assumed the Shepard doppleganger in Dream 3 to be just that- a traditional harbinger of doom, as well as a symptom of EMF exposure. With your observation, it takes on an additional light- most people I've talked to, (IT crowd), believe it to be a narrative tool trying to warn Shepard; in your observation, it is more likely that the doppleganger could very well be a representation that part of Shepard has come to embrace the child- a new Shepard, to replace the old one.

The child gravitates to the new form, but rejects the old- a telling symbolism. Also, there is a hint of contemporary horror pop culture there: instead of a harold of impending doom, the doppleganger is a sinister force that has the potential to destroy it's look alike and replace him/her.

Yes, those concepts do add significantly to the idea. I think we're getting much closer to the symbolism that Bioware actually intended with the dream sequences. The effects that are frightening and burning the child are "Anderson", and the doppleganger from the 3rd dream represents "TIM" starting to manifest himself. Fortunately at that point "Anderson" still has enough power to burn them to a crisp and allow Shepard to wake up! But, once "Anderson" is out of the picture, the only one that can wake Shepard up... is the player. 

This is really interesting. I was always curious what the "flames" could be symbolising. A warning? An attempt to fight the indoctrination? A premonition of doom? The idea that it represents "Anderson" and that kind of fit with Anderson as the "renegade" representation, plus his associations with the explosive Destroy option is an intriguing concept.

The doppleganger Shep is also completely creepy. That look he/she gives just felt sooo off. Not to mention the Catalyst "dopplegangers" Shepard's voice (both male and female) in the final scene...

[HellishFiend]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Indeed the doppleganger is an old oment of doom, but I think it is even more interesting that seeing ones own doppleganger is often seen as a sign of ones impending death, though in cases where the doppleganger is real it is not certain wether it is the death of the person or the doppleganger. So could it be an oment of Shepards litteral death or an omen of Shepard succumbing to Indoctrination essentially the death of the non indoctrinated Shepard or him overcoming Indoctrination, killing the Indoctrinated part of himself.

God there is a ton of symbolism wich can be placed on this game.

Yup, and thats why I simply cant get enough of all this. I feel like it's a once in a lifetime experience that will never come again. I just cant imagine this sort of thing ever being duplicated on this large a scale. I want to savor every moment!

[Auralius Carolus]

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Question for everyone in  general:

Concerning the song Starchild by Wintersun I doubt it was written with Mass Effect in mind (since the album came out before ME1) but does anyone else get the feeling some/most of the song is singing about the Reapers/origin of the Reapers or even the "Catalyst" AI? I know the song was discussed before but I'm positive I missed most of it. Know there's some of the lyrics that seem to be speaking of "waking up" and "escaping" and such but I found some ways to relate some of the lyrics to what could be the Reapers origins. Or maybe I'm just looking too far into it .

Edit: just a heads up that youtube link has a lot of rage comments about casey hudson/me3 so watch out.

I honestly don't put much weight into the idea of the song painting Shepard's path/ Reapers, (which is what I've heard before). It is, however, not uncommon for authors/creative designers to listen to music for influence in their work.

I personally wouldn't put too much thought into the weight of the song; the abstraction needed vs. the speculation is simply two awkward, and I scarcely see more than a passing reference to the events in the game.

[nightcobra]

HellishFiend wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Indeed the doppleganger is an old oment of doom, but I think it is even more interesting that seeing ones own doppleganger is often seen as a sign of ones impending death, though in cases where the doppleganger is real it is not certain wether it is the death of the person or the doppleganger. So could it be an oment of Shepards litteral death or an omen of Shepard succumbing to Indoctrination essentially the death of the non indoctrinated Shepard or him overcoming Indoctrination, killing the Indoctrinated part of himself.

God there is a ton of symbolism wich can be placed on this game.

Yup, and thats why I simply cant get enough of all this. I feel like it's a once in a lifetime experience that will never come again. I just cant imagine this sort of thing ever being duplicated on this large a scale. I want to savor every moment!

wait a sec....could anyone see if there are infrasounds when shepard meets the kid in the duct at the intro?

[LisuPL]

My Shepard looked like this after seeing the ending:

Modifié par LisuPL, 18 juin 2012 - 09:03 .

[HellishFiend]

Deputy Secretary of Awesome wrote...


This is really interesting. I was always curious what the "flames" could be symbolising. A warning? An attempt to fight the indoctrination? A premonition of doom? The idea that it represents "Anderson" and that kind of fit with Anderson as the "renegade" representation, plus his associations with the explosive Destroy option is an intriguing concept.

The doppleganger Shep is also completely creepy. That look he/she gives just felt sooo off. Not to mention the Catalyst "dopplegangers" Shepard's voice (both male and female) in the final scene...

"We destroy them... or they destroy us..."

Fire seems like an appropriate symbolic tool to use against the manipulative Reaper presence masquerading as a child, I would think. 

[HellishFiend]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Indeed the doppleganger is an old oment of doom, but I think it is even more interesting that seeing ones own doppleganger is often seen as a sign of ones impending death, though in cases where the doppleganger is real it is not certain wether it is the death of the person or the doppleganger. So could it be an oment of Shepards litteral death or an omen of Shepard succumbing to Indoctrination essentially the death of the non indoctrinated Shepard or him overcoming Indoctrination, killing the Indoctrinated part of himself.

God there is a ton of symbolism wich can be placed on this game.

Yup, and thats why I simply cant get enough of all this. I feel like it's a once in a lifetime experience that will never come again. I just cant imagine this sort of thing ever being duplicated on this large a scale. I want to savor every moment!

wait a sec....could anyone see if there are infrasounds when shepard meets the kid in the duct at the intro?

I dont believe we've looked into that one yet, but it wouldnt surprise me. We'll have to check it out and see!

[Domanese]

HellishFiend wrote...

You know, I just noticed something I hadnt noticed before, since I've watched that first dream sequence several dozen times today. That first sound that scares the kid away? The kid is terrified, yet it has absolutely no effect on Shepard. I believe this is consistent across all 3 dreams as well. 

I suggested a short while ago that maybe the kid was being scared off by "Anderson", or rather Shepard's willpower. Well the more I look at these dream sequences, the more I believe that to be the case. 

The Sounds of Possession

Hold me! Thank God I picked Destroy first!

[HellishFiend]

Domanese wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

You know, I just noticed something I hadnt noticed before, since I've watched that first dream sequence several dozen times today. That first sound that scares the kid away? The kid is terrified, yet it has absolutely no effect on Shepard. I believe this is consistent across all 3 dreams as well. 

I suggested a short while ago that maybe the kid was being scared off by "Anderson", or rather Shepard's willpower. Well the more I look at these dream sequences, the more I believe that to be the case. 

The Sounds of Possession

Hold me! Thank God I picked Destroy first!

[gunslinger_ruiz]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Question for everyone in  general:

Concerning the song Starchild by Wintersun I doubt it was written with Mass Effect in mind (since the album came out before ME1) but does anyone else get the feeling some/most of the song is singing about the Reapers/origin of the Reapers or even the "Catalyst" AI? I know the song was discussed before but I'm positive I missed most of it. Know there's some of the lyrics that seem to be speaking of "waking up" and "escaping" and such but I found some ways to relate some of the lyrics to what could be the Reapers origins. Or maybe I'm just looking too far into it .

Edit: just a heads up that youtube link has a lot of rage comments about casey hudson/me3 so watch out.

I honestly don't put much weight into the idea of the song painting Shepard's path/ Reapers, (which is what I've heard before). It is, however, not uncommon for authors/creative designers to listen to music for influence in their work.

I personally wouldn't put too much thought into the weight of the song; the abstraction needed vs. the speculation is simply two awkward, and I scarcely see more than a passing reference to the events in the game.

I'll try and put together an analysis of the lyrics sometime, it's quite a long song. There's more than a few verses I can relate to ME-themes, but I know it's semi-reaching. Still, can't help but wonder why Bioware would use that wallpaper aside from "it looked cool"

Edit: all comes back to thinking of the entire ending sequence as a puzzle.

Modifié par gunslinger_ruiz, 18 juin 2012 - 09:03 .

[Rosewind]

LisuPL wrote...

My Shepard looked like this after seeing the ending:

*snip*

Stuff of nightmares

[Starbuck8]

HellishFiend wrote...

Yup, and thats why I simply cant get enough of all this. I feel like it's a once in a lifetime experience that will never come again. I just cant imagine this sort of thing ever being duplicated on this large a scale. I want to savor every moment!

I know what you mean! The first time I played ME3, I almost didn't want to keep playing it because you only get the experience of playing an amazing game for the first time once. But I couldn't stop! IT just adds a whole new sense of discovery to the game that really won't end until EC comes out. I'm so glad I got around to playing ME3 before EC, and finally have gotten my boyfriend to get back into Mass Effect now on his summer break. We'll finally be able to discuss the endings and IT!

[Auralius Carolus]

Deputy Secretary of Awesome wrote...

This is really interesting. I was always curious what the "flames" could be symbolising. A warning? An attempt to fight the indoctrination? A premonition of doom? The idea that it represents "Anderson" and that kind of fit with Anderson as the "renegade" representation, plus his associations with the explosive Destroy option is an intriguing concept.

The doppleganger Shep is also completely creepy. That look he/she gives just felt sooo off. Not to mention the Catalyst "dopplegangers" Shepard's voice (both male and female) in the final scene...

Flames can represent much in this case: To be consumed, (to be overtaken with indoctrination); to be purged, (to remove the taint of what's bothing Shepard); to destroy or forshadow destruction, etc.

As to the Catalyst/Child's voice, it could easily be construed as a sign that he is a partial manifestation of Shepard's mind, thus taking on an element of his voice. Aside from that, the act of indoctrination appears to be heavily based upon demonic possession: mimicry, subtle twisting influence, the dissecting of families/friends, the loss of control of one's being, the hallucinations, nightmares, delusions, the EMF/ISF/USF factors, etc. all are elements of extreme hauntings/possession.

In the case of the child burning in Shepard's presence, this could easily be seen as symbolic of a temptation and rejection: traditionally, a demon cannot dwell within a pure vessel but will continue to tempt the target until its will is weakened, then beginning its takeover- Shepard may still cast out the indoctrination attempt in the last dream, but it already has its foot in the door, making its next attempt more likely to succeed. Shepard's will is weakened and the Reapers now have his number, so to speak.