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The real tragedy is; people just stop caring.


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#126
devSin

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Filament wrote...

I'm glad I've never been terribly enthusiastic about this franchise so that I don't have to carry a bucket around to collect my tears for every time I think about the ME3 ending and agonize over what could have been.

I think I cared a little more than I typically would because I had just finished replaying the first two. The experience was fresh in my mind, and I still had the lingering "This is going to be good" feeling. Disaster.

Luckily I'm more of a Dragon Age fan in general. Mike and David know how to take care of business. I never have to worry with them.

Modifié par devSin, 15 mai 2012 - 05:21 .


#127
CARL_DF90

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We can only hope EA stupidity has not infected them yet.

#128
Guest_EternalAmbiguity_*

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CARL_DF90 wrote...

Yeah, faces made with loving attention to detail where you spent like 2 frakking hours making it all the way back in ME1 ruined in just a few seconds of EA/Bioware incompetence. Oy. I feel you there.


The OP isn't talking about that.

They're talking about the comic books, of all things.

#129
CARL_DF90

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I was in reference to a comment made by someone on page 5 my good man.

#130
Guest_EternalAmbiguity_*

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Ah.

#131
Dragonfable of Dain

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There is nothing left to do except pick yourself up and move on, hopefully staying clear of anything Bioware related in the process.

#132
bleachorange

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skittles!

#133
Guest_wastelander75_*

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The Grey Nayr wrote...

Out of three and a half million sales worldwide, only about 60 or so thousand are making complaints about the ending, and you say we're the 20%?


You're pulling the Shipped units number. That doesn't equal actual Sold units to the public.

EA/BioWare SHIPPED 3.5 million units to places like Gamestop, WalMart, Replay Games, etc etc etc.

That doesn't mean 3.5 million people have bought and are currently playing the game. Last I heard it SOLD a little over 1.5 million to the public. That's not what I would consider good. More like slightly-above-average.

#134
OverchargedTeslaCoil

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napushenko wrote...

i dont know, if someone burns itself screaming staaarchild in front of their company, maybe they will change the ending, even implement indocrination theory.. so, there is hope for humanity.

I'd volunteer, but I'm a bit far away from the office.

#135
ODST 5723

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When I got to the ending of ME3 I felt entirely underwhelmed. I wanted to find a way to like it, but ultimately, I don't.

There were simply too many missed opportunities and the execution was sloppy. It felt forced and out of place, which killed all the momentum leading up to that point. So instead of looking to the future of the ME universe I was left with a lack of satisfaction.

The endings did not feel like a culmination of all of my actions to that point. They seemed phone in and predetermined. They sucked the choice out of my choices. They left me unfulfilled and dissatisfied to the point that while I agreed with the general concept of the endings, there was nothing I could hold onto from an execution standpoint that would even let me rationalize that what I experienced was a good thing. The promised impact was minimal. The promised variation was minimal. The promised closure was minimal. It was like half of the ending was missing.

What upsets me most about the endings of ME3 was that they bring nothing to the table. They provided me with no sense of accomplishment. No sense of closure. No sense of hope for the future. At no point did I feel like my choices mattered. And that's a disenfranchising feeling in a series built on choices and the impact of those choices. The sad thing is, I do like the general concept of the endings. However, each one seems like a pulled punch and as a result seem lacking in passion and in purpose. There was so much more that could have been done here.

Which is why I've put down my copy and moved on to other games. I will need to see something significant before I pick it back up again, as I see no reason to go back and play ME1 or ME2 again and frankly, even though I'm big on achievements i don't see a reason to 100% this game. I've been playing video games for over 20 years and can't remember another game that has managed to disappoint me the way ME3 did.

Even Metro 2033. That is the only game I have ever refused to finish and even it didn't leave me with such a bad taste in my mouth.

#136
Guest_EternalAmbiguity_*

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wastelander75 wrote...

You're pulling the Shipped units number. That doesn't equal actual Sold units to the public.

EA/BioWare SHIPPED 3.5 million units to places like Gamestop, WalMart, Replay Games, etc etc etc.

That doesn't mean 3.5 million people have bought and are currently playing the game. Last I heard it SOLD a little over 1.5 million to the public. That's not what I would consider good. More like slightly-above-average.


There ya go

#137
iamthedave3

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HeroofTime55 wrote...


>believes that subjective things like asthetic value can be objectively good or bad
>calls other people obtuse

And this is why I'm no longer arguing with you.  Well, that, and, you know, I have other things to do with my life besides argue on the internet about a video game.


Ah, yes, the old 'art cannot be criticized' argument.

Good to know that centuries of literary criticism has contributed nothing to our understanding of said art form. Thank you for solving this issue of people being taught irrelevant critical thinking skills in universities across the world and wasting their time analyzing narratives, because after all it's art and such analysis can therefore not be relevant.

You can like something that's bad. Just don't try to sell me that it's good.

Modifié par iamthedave3, 15 mai 2012 - 05:28 .


#138
dirtdiver32318

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Trust me I'm just as pissed about te ending as anyone I am one of the most hardcore mass effect fan to ever life and I think I'm saying that lightly. Besides that after all bioware did to make mass effect it's one of their biggest accomplishments. Dont get me wrong they have amazing others but do you think they would ruin the franchise with this ending.

I am a mass effect fan I have all the respect for bioware so please don't call me a bioware fanboy because truthfully I'm not. There must be an explanation for the ending. I honestly don't believe they would destroy this game on purpose (not sayin it is destroyed but it was upsetting). bioware has listened to us fans for the other mass effects why do you think all of a sudden now they would stop. The EC DLC might be te answers we are looking for. Yes trust me it's hard to care about the games when you know the end of the third. Ie plaid 1-2 1000 times oer now I'm struggling because of it but have faith my brothers and sisters EC DLC shall deliver. And if it not well then we will make another petition :)

#139
iamthedave3

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I don't believe it was done on purpose. I just think on one particular day a pair or a half dozen or however many people it was all woke up on the wrong side of the bed and created something awful. Martin Scorsese does not always create amazing movies. People forget the bad ones, but they're still there.

Every creative person or creative team has its off days. The ME 3 ending was just that. Bad writing from otherwise good talent.

#140
Bluko

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 Well... all I can say is don't give into the despair of Indoctrination. Because that is what the ending is. It's horrible nightmare conjured by the Reapers to lead Shepard down the wrong path. It's also the Developers trying to make you feel a sense of hopelessness as well. The same feelings Shepard supposedly has had the entire time.

Thing is they took it a bit too far. If it were more obvious what was going on then it would be easier to forgive and  forget knowing full well "One more story" is coming to fix everything. The problem is Indoctrination is not an easy thing to piece together and even if you do "figure it out" you are still left wondering what's next anyways. It's not reassuring as you basically have to trust that Bioware isn't lying yet again. Either way it's a poor way to an end game that was basically promised to bring closure to everything in the trilogy. An Ending plays a very important role in bringing closure. If they had immediately given us the real ending afterwards you know that would have been fine.


I honestly have no clue what they were thinking. As clever is Indoctrination is... leaving people a brutal ending like this is very bad from a business perspective. The biggest issue is that this is going to turn away a lot of the more casual players.  These people are not going to stick around and wait for DLC. They'll sell ME3 and get something else. For them ME3 will be over for good. Perhaps Multiplayer will help keep a few people holding onto their copies. But for how long? I mean even if the EC really does make everything super fatastic it will be too little too late I think. 

Ultimately what Bioware should have done is simply delay the game until July or so and included the "Extended Cut" to begin with. I can honestly say ME3 trumps ME1 in glitchiness. I've never had a game freeze up on me that many times or missions get that bugged with objectives that I hard to restart them on the Xbox. Seriously ME3 gives Skyrim a good run for it's money in "buggyness". And at least Skyrim has the defence of being sandbox game. This stuff is simply unacceptable in what's largely a linear game. It is very evident ME3 needed a significant degree of more polish. About the only thing that truly feels functional is the combat, but even there's more then a few cases of bugs and poor trigger scripting.

It really is unfortunate this happened. Now we can all blame EA for rushing the game... but it's our fault as well. See when so many of  Pre-Ordered the damn game (it was like 900K) you removed the incentive for Bioware to really make a quality product. You basically gave them go ahead to release an unfinished game because you were foolish enough to pay for something that's not even on store shelves yet. Of course if EA were a little smarter they would realize the sheer amount of interest should be reason for them to put extra effort into the game. That way not only do they please the core fanbase but help grow the reputation. Word of mouth is how games sell. Not trailers, not ads, not reviews, but what the common everday schlub says to his friend about the game.

I hate to say it but Bioware's future is kind of in jeopardy due to how poorly both ME3 and DA2 have been handled. Granted I guess they have TOR still, but I don't think it's going to be the next WoW. Perhaps it's for the best Bioware simply transition to MMOs at this point as they've clearly lost their knack with singleplayer games. Making a sequel/expansion is one thing. But when you cut the story up to make DLC later you may just as well attach a monthly fee to play the game if you ask me.

Modifié par Bluko, 15 mai 2012 - 05:40 .


#141
Guest_wastelander75_*

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EternalAmbiguity wrote...

There ya go


Thank you. That's better than....wait...since when did we consider VGChartz "legitimate"? :lol:

I say that because the agument's always been "VGChartz is unreliable" whenever I've read posts from people responding to aguments that X game only sold X number.

Slightly more encouraging numbers though. :)

#142
dirtdiver32318

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Ya I get that. But to be honest as much as the ending pissed me right off mass effect will still be my favourite games. I still have some hope I guess we will see with the EC DLC. Hopefully they explain the ending so it is a bit more clear.

#143
AtreiyaN7

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I don't care about your rant, so hey, we're even!

#144
Jadebaby

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Kreidian wrote...

 At one point Mass Effect was considered THE Sci-Fi Saga of our generation. People would talk about it with the same level of reverence they once held for Star Wars back when it could do no wrong. 


Back then people poured over every scrap of the franchise. Every book, every comic, everything that had anything to do with Star Wars was rabidly devoured ( and thus paid for ) by the fans.


For a while people were hoping Mass Effect would reach such heights. Myself, along with many loyal fans, were eager to consume every bit of Mass Effect content we could find. I actually used to be excited for the possibility of the next ME comic series, the next book, or the next movie. 


But the ME3 ending changed all that.


Now I receive e-mails from BioWare's newsletter telling me about the next great Mass Effect comic series, I read the tweets talking about all the EXCITING things coming for ME3 DLC. I see all these tantalizing excerpts of things that I once sought with gusto.


And I just don't care.


Who cares about Vega's past before meeting Shepard? He'll just end up dying to Harbinger's lasers if he's lucky, an ultimately worthless sacrifice that allows you to pick the color that screws the galaxy.


Who cares what Tali was up to between ME2 and ME3? She'll likely die of starvation on some random planet for not good reason whatsoever.


You say there's an exciting new Anime coming out? I don't care.
You say there's some awesome work being done on future DLC? I don't care.


Even if you could explain all that stuff away with the EC DLC, none of that matters because in the end you still have to deal with an absolutely horrible ending to the entire story of Mass Effect. Clarifying it won't make it any less horrible, nor will it get people to start caring again.


And this is what your average non-vocal majority will be feeling for the most part. The average fan who never bothered to post here because they just don't care anymore. Because to be brutally honest, the vast non-vocal majority couldn't care less about your artistic integrity. 


These were the people that I used to champion the Mass Effect cause to, the people that I would strive tirelessly to play the game and get hooked by everything that was great about it. Now I can't honestly recommend this game to anyone, for the simple fact that I don't want to put them through that ending.


I'm sure to you this all seems like some "whiney entitled" rant. But in the end this is a fan who at one point represented guaranteed sales, not just of your product directly, but also many of the associated merchandise and content, on top of additional sales from all of the people I would convince to buy the game and DLCs. Not you no longer have those sales to rely on. 
Make of that what you will. I don't really care.


The real tradegy is YOU stopped caring, I still care passionately, which in turn is because I care.
I care about these characters, I care about Shepard, I care about the ME galaxy. And I wont stop believing (IDT) until they disprove it.

#145
Cutlass Jack

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AtreiyaN7 wrote...

I don't care about your rant, so hey, we're even!


I cared about his rant...until I got to the last paragraph. Which completely ruined it for me. I will never care about rants the same way ever again.

Modifié par Cutlass Jack, 15 mai 2012 - 05:48 .


#146
iamthedave3

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Ah, the internet, where one person's emotional upset is another person's amusement.

#147
AtreiyaN7

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Cutlass Jack wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

I don't care about your rant, so hey, we're even!


I cared about his rant...until I got to the last paragraph. Which completely ruined it for me. I will never care about rants the same way ever again.


I feel your pain - and your parrot's pain too. Let's go drown our sorrows with some grog!

#148
Persephone

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Cutlass Jack wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

I don't care about your rant, so hey, we're even!


I cared about his rant...until I got to the last paragraph. Which completely ruined it for me. I will never care about rants the same way ever again.


Ohhhhhhhhhh..........snap. Let's RETAKE the rant!

Ahem......:whistle::lol:

#149
dirtdiver32318

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iamthedave3 wrote...

Ah, the internet, where one person's emotional upset is another person's amusement.



^ enough said 

#150
Shajar

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The Grey Nayr wrote...

lillitheris wrote...

The Grey Nayr wrote...

It didn't ruin Mass Effect 3 either. You claim that Bioware ruined the ending when it's been revealed that the entire game was an ending. Everything Bioware claimed about the series conclusion was meant to apply to the entire game, not the last five minutes.


Look, we have no problems understanding that you and some 20% of other players were fine with it. More power to you.

Do you understand that the rest of us weren’t? That it actually does ruin the series for some person who is not you?


Out of three and a half million sales worldwide, only about 60 or so thousand are making complaints about the ending, and you say we're the 20%?


According to Devs on other game forums, Many of them says that only 5% from 100% buyers use forums and let their voices come out.

1. Many people dont know forums/know how to do it
2. Many people dont care anymore and wont buy from that game company again
3. Many people just let it be

But point is, only vocal minority uses forums.
I think if we think about this then its lots more than 60k angry people, and must be. It could be possible that people who enjoy are vocal minority and its easy to notice but it cant be proven because you never can ask all those millions of people opinion.

Its more easy for Devs to say, yeah stop whining you 1% forum users

Modifié par Shajar, 15 mai 2012 - 06:02 .