294 réponses à ce sujet

[Taboo]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Bioware did say things that are not really true, that I can forgive, but they should NOT be surprised that people called them out on it.

Certainly. In ME2, I was definitely one of the ones on the more critical side of 'consequences', and the 'no right way' balance between Paragon and Renegade.

At the same time, however, there are issues claimed as lies that are as much a fault of selective interpretation on the fans part as anything on Bioware's.

You also reiterated my point when you responded. Both sides are at fault.

Yes. But the onus to reconcile is on both as well.

This is true. But at some point subjectivity becomes moot. We're in a bit of a pickle right now.

Bioware has made attempts to reconcile with us, but not in the capacity that some people think they should. I'm just happy that we're getting something at all.

I do hope that in the coming weeks Bioware plans on releasing more information, at least tidbits, as the fire on the BSN needs.....some water every once and while.

[Dean_the_Young]

Sublyminal wrote...

Wow, talk about a buzz killington... 



Not really, it can't be turned around. Because I bought the game the day it came out, I had no idea the ending was going to suck the way it did. So again, no you can't just flip my argument on it's head.

Except that I, too, bought DA2 the day it came out, and I had no idea about the ending. Once again, we are in directly comparable situations... except for my purchase of DA2 marks me as a fanboy, while your purchase of ME3 is excusable out of ignorance of the endings even though the game script was leaked monthes in advance and was on the public domain for some time.

Because the challenger, always provides his proof first, it's like a game of hold-em. If you're the player that is all in first in a two man hand, you're the one that has to show first, simple as that.

In poker, perhaps, but in debates the first to claim evidence has to be able to show his. The burden of the validity of proof is on the supporter, not the challenger: this is to avoid fallacies based on first claim of non-falsifiable claims.

[KotorEffect3]

They would be more responsive if the fanbase wasn't so insulting towards them

[Dean_the_Young]

Taboo-XX wrote...


This is true. But at some point subjectivity becomes moot. We're in a bit of a pickle right now.

Bioware has made attempts to reconcile with us, but not in the capacity that some people think they should. I'm just happy that we're getting something at all.

I do hope that in the coming weeks Bioware plans on releasing more information, at least tidbits, as the fire on the BSN needs.....some water every once and while.

On the other hand, it can also be deprived of oxygen. Fire extinguishers aren't water-canisters, after all.

[Sublyminal]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

I realize I'm jumping in here, and I only wanted to provide a quick point before leaving, but...

Sublyminal wrote...

Wow, talk about a buzz killington... 



Not really, it can't be turned around. Because I bought the game the day it came out, I had no idea the ending was going to suck the way it did. So again, no you can't just flip my argument on it's head. 


Because the challenger, always provides his proof first, it's like a game of hold-em. If you're the player that is all in first in a two man hand, you're the one that has to show first, simple as that. 

However, if you aren't going to show your source, I'm damn sure not going to dig through thousands of posts to see if I can find the link I clicked on.

Actually, yes it can. He had no proof DA ][ "sucked" until he played it.

Or do you believe everything you see on the Internet.

I believe half of what I see and none of what I hear. And since we have no idea of knowing when he bought the game, he can just say. Yea, I bought it day of release and didn't know. So again, it's up to him to provide proof. I can provide proof of the day I bought ME3, if anyone wants a screenie of my origin. 

[Dean_the_Young]

Sublyminal wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...


I have not seen them even once try to reconcile with us, that's just it. All we want is for them to communicate with us. They had the audacity to take our money. But, when something goes south, they're no-where to be found AND when they do communicate, they speak to us in a condenscending manner.

The irony escaping you is what makes you such an excellent example of the problem within the fanbase.

Where is the irony at?

If it wasn't escaping you, it wouldn't be ironic.

The fanbase has steadily approached them trying to reconcile by asking questions, wondering what happened to our beloved series. They are the ones that have ignored these attempts, thus keeping this war alive. If Casey or Mac brought their asses in here or even on twitter and stated. "Ok, guys and girls, this is what's up. We're going to be doing this and we're going to try to correct our mistakes" Everything would instantly be forgiven. But, when the Lead Writer and the series Creator don't even think enough of their fanbase to do that, then why should we continue to try and reconcile?

Ah, bliss...

[Sublyminal]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...

Wow, talk about a buzz killington... 



Not really, it can't be turned around. Because I bought the game the day it came out, I had no idea the ending was going to suck the way it did. So again, no you can't just flip my argument on it's head.

Except that I, too, bought DA2 the day it came out, and I had no idea about the ending. Once again, we are in directly comparable situations... except for my purchase of DA2 marks me as a fanboy, while your purchase of ME3 is excusable out of ignorance of the endings even though the game script was leaked monthes in advance and was on the public domain for some time.

Because the challenger, always provides his proof first, it's like a game of hold-em. If you're the player that is all in first in a two man hand, you're the one that has to show first, simple as that.

In poker, perhaps, but in debates the first to claim evidence has to be able to show his. The burden of the validity of proof is on the supporter, not the challenger: this is to avoid fallacies based on first claim of non-falsifiable claims.

I admit I'm an ME fanboy through and through though. I said you're a bioware fanboy, not just a series fanboy big difference. 

As I have previously stated, I am much too lazy to go through thousands of posts to try to find that one little article where it said the majority of test audiences disliked it, and thought it should be changed. 

[Taboo]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...


This is true. But at some point subjectivity becomes moot. We're in a bit of a pickle right now.

Bioware has made attempts to reconcile with us, but not in the capacity that some people think they should. I'm just happy that we're getting something at all.

I do hope that in the coming weeks Bioware plans on releasing more information, at least tidbits, as the fire on the BSN needs.....some water every once and while.

On the other hand, it can also be deprived of oxygen. Fire extinguishers aren't water-canisters, after all.

You and I both know what the results of that have been.

A fascinating sociological problem.

Bioware hasn't been as good as they could have with relaying information but they are more than capable of delivering a satisfactory product. This is why I belive in supporting the Extended Cut. It just doesn't make sense to criticize something that hasn't come out yet.

The fanbase is fractured right now. People are going to be unhappy whatever Bioware does at this point.

[Dean_the_Young]

Sublyminal wrote...

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

I realize I'm jumping in here, and I only wanted to provide a quick point before leaving, but...

Sublyminal wrote...

Wow, talk about a buzz killington... 



Not really, it can't be turned around. Because I bought the game the day it came out, I had no idea the ending was going to suck the way it did. So again, no you can't just flip my argument on it's head. 


Because the challenger, always provides his proof first, it's like a game of hold-em. If you're the player that is all in first in a two man hand, you're the one that has to show first, simple as that. 

However, if you aren't going to show your source, I'm damn sure not going to dig through thousands of posts to see if I can find the link I clicked on.

Actually, yes it can. He had no proof DA ][ "sucked" until he played it.

Or do you believe everything you see on the Internet.

I believe half of what I see and none of what I hear. And since we have no idea of knowing when he bought the game, he can just say. Yea, I bought it day of release and didn't know. So again, it's up to him to provide proof. I can provide proof of the day I bought ME3, if anyone wants a screenie of my origin. 

Ah, so once again you jump to a conclusion and insult me rather than try and seek any clarification by anything as simple as a question.

Alas, I do not have DA2 or Origin installed anymore, and so could not give you a picture. Now, you can call me a liar if you wish... but you'd need to support the claim. A lack of evidence is not evidence of lack, after all.

[Sublyminal]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...


I have not seen them even once try to reconcile with us, that's just it. All we want is for them to communicate with us. They had the audacity to take our money. But, when something goes south, they're no-where to be found AND when they do communicate, they speak to us in a condenscending manner.

The irony escaping you is what makes you such an excellent example of the problem within the fanbase.

Where is the irony at?

If it wasn't escaping you, it wouldn't be ironic.

The fanbase has steadily approached them trying to reconcile by asking questions, wondering what happened to our beloved series. They are the ones that have ignored these attempts, thus keeping this war alive. If Casey or Mac brought their asses in here or even on twitter and stated. "Ok, guys and girls, this is what's up. We're going to be doing this and we're going to try to correct our mistakes" Everything would instantly be forgiven. But, when the Lead Writer and the series Creator don't even think enough of their fanbase to do that, then why should we continue to try and reconcile?

Ah, bliss...

There is no irony there. I get what you're trying to say, but to say it's ironic is pretty inaccurate. As I am not making contradictary statements, irony does not fit in with anything that is posted. 

Now if you're inferring that the few in the fanbase that are being immature babies about this aren't trying to reconcile, then yes, I'd have to agree with you. But, they don't speak for the majority of us.

[Sublyminal]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

I realize I'm jumping in here, and I only wanted to provide a quick point before leaving, but...

Sublyminal wrote...

Wow, talk about a buzz killington... 



Not really, it can't be turned around. Because I bought the game the day it came out, I had no idea the ending was going to suck the way it did. So again, no you can't just flip my argument on it's head. 


Because the challenger, always provides his proof first, it's like a game of hold-em. If you're the player that is all in first in a two man hand, you're the one that has to show first, simple as that. 

However, if you aren't going to show your source, I'm damn sure not going to dig through thousands of posts to see if I can find the link I clicked on.

Actually, yes it can. He had no proof DA ][ "sucked" until he played it.

Or do you believe everything you see on the Internet.

I believe half of what I see and none of what I hear. And since we have no idea of knowing when he bought the game, he can just say. Yea, I bought it day of release and didn't know. So again, it's up to him to provide proof. I can provide proof of the day I bought ME3, if anyone wants a screenie of my origin. 

Ah, so once again you jump to a conclusion and insult me rather than try and seek any clarification by anything as simple as a question.

Alas, I do not have DA2 or Origin installed anymore, and so could not give you a picture. Now, you can call me a liar if you wish... but you'd need to support the claim. A lack of evidence is not evidence of lack, after all.

Why would I want to call you a liar? Just because I used an old saying doesn't mean I don't believe you. As I can see you own them since they are under your avatar. That would be petty on my part.

[Dean_the_Young]

Taboo-XX wrote...


You and I both know what the results of that have been.

A fascinating sociological problem.

Bioware hasn't been as good as they could have with relaying information but they are more than capable of delivering a satisfactory product. This is why I belive in supporting the Extended Cut. It just doesn't make sense to criticize something that hasn't come out yet.

The fanbase is fractured right now. People are going to be unhappy whatever Bioware does at this point.

Indeed, which is a large part of why I'm in that 'brown-nosing' club that seems to be defined by not joining a particular hate club. I made my peace with ME3 disillusionment a year before it's release, when it became apparent what they were using Cerberus for.


The fanbase has been amazingly entertaining though, vitriole non-withstanding. I can't find it at the moment, but I remember writing a topic musing on what the Hold the Line movement would do when Bioware actually did make a movement. It went about what I expected: the movement died as a lot of people were satisfied by a promise of explanation of the current endings, leaving the new-ending faction in the lurch.

Interestingly, a lot of those people migrated to Indoctronation Theory. That itself is an interesting sociological phenomenum.

[Sublyminal]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...


I believe half of what I see and none of what I hear. And since we have no idea of knowing when he bought the game, he can just say. Yea, I bought it day of release and didn't know. So again, it's up to him to provide proof. I can provide proof of the day I bought ME3, if anyone wants a screenie of my origin. 

And, if he does the same, then how does buying a game he knows nothing about (since he believes none of what he hears) make him a "fanboy?"

Though this is irrelevant as he has answered you. Though the point remains. But feel free to ignore.

I wont ignore you, it would make him awesome, if he were like me. But, no on a serious note, I did commit the mother of all **** ups, I assumed. 

[Sublyminal]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...


You and I both know what the results of that have been.

A fascinating sociological problem.

Bioware hasn't been as good as they could have with relaying information but they are more than capable of delivering a satisfactory product. This is why I belive in supporting the Extended Cut. It just doesn't make sense to criticize something that hasn't come out yet.

The fanbase is fractured right now. People are going to be unhappy whatever Bioware does at this point.

Indeed, which is a large part of why I'm in that 'brown-nosing' club that seems to be defined by not joining a particular hate club. I made my peace with ME3 disillusionment a year before it's release, when it became apparent what they were using Cerberus for.


The fanbase has been amazingly entertaining though, vitriole non-withstanding. I can't find it at the moment, but I remember writing a topic musing on what the Hold the Line movement would do when Bioware actually did make a movement. It went about what I expected: the movement died as a lot of people were satisfied by a promise of explanation of the current endings, leaving the new-ending faction in the lurch.

Interestingly, a lot of those people migrated to Indoctronation Theory. That itself is an interesting sociological phenomenum.

HTL is very much alive, and even though Bioware has made it's promises, there are always other companies that wrong their consumers. Crapcom for example.

[Dean_the_Young]

Sublyminal wrote...

Why would I want to call you a liar?

If you doubted that I was a day 1 player of DA2.

Just because I used an old saying doesn't mean I don't believe you. As I can see you own them since they are under your avatar. That would be petty on my part.

Yes, it would.

I mean, you might call someone a ****sucker and make ignorant accusations and leaps of logic, but at least you aren't petty.

[Taboo]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...


You and I both know what the results of that have been.

A fascinating sociological problem.

Bioware hasn't been as good as they could have with relaying information but they are more than capable of delivering a satisfactory product. This is why I belive in supporting the Extended Cut. It just doesn't make sense to criticize something that hasn't come out yet.

The fanbase is fractured right now. People are going to be unhappy whatever Bioware does at this point.

Indeed, which is a large part of why I'm in that 'brown-nosing' club that seems to be defined by not joining a particular hate club. I made my peace with ME3 disillusionment a year before it's release, when it became apparent what they were using Cerberus for.


The fanbase has been amazingly entertaining though, vitriole non-withstanding. I can't find it at the moment, but I remember writing a topic musing on what the Hold the Line movement would do when Bioware actually did make a movement. It went about what I expected: the movement died as a lot of people were satisfied by a promise of explanation of the current endings, leaving the new-ending faction in the lurch.

Interestingly, a lot of those people migrated to Indoctronation Theory. That itself is an interesting sociological phenomenum.

I merely believe that Bioware can do better and that's all I can really ask for. A great majority of the people you criticize are in the "new endings" group however. All sides have their.............oddities but not everyone is insane. At least the Indoctrination People keep to themselves.

I like seeing what everyone has to say and like commenting on everything even though I really don't belong to much of anything.

[Dean_the_Young]

Sublyminal wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...


I have not seen them even once try to reconcile with us, that's just it. All we want is for them to communicate with us. They had the audacity to take our money. But, when something goes south, they're no-where to be found AND when they do communicate, they speak to us in a condenscending manner.

The irony escaping you is what makes you such an excellent example of the problem within the fanbase.

Where is the irony at?

If it wasn't escaping you, it wouldn't be ironic.

The fanbase has steadily approached them trying to reconcile by asking questions, wondering what happened to our beloved series. They are the ones that have ignored these attempts, thus keeping this war alive. If Casey or Mac brought their asses in here or even on twitter and stated. "Ok, guys and girls, this is what's up. We're going to be doing this and we're going to try to correct our mistakes" Everything would instantly be forgiven. But, when the Lead Writer and the series Creator don't even think enough of their fanbase to do that, then why should we continue to try and reconcile?

Ah, bliss...

There is no irony there. I get what you're trying to say, but to say it's ironic is pretty inaccurate. As I am not making contradictary statements, irony does not fit in with anything that is posted. 

Now if you're inferring that the few in the fanbase that are being immature babies about this aren't trying to reconcile, then yes, I'd have to agree with you. But, they don't speak for the majority of us.

Ah, more bliss...

[Sublyminal]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...

Why would I want to call you a liar?

If you doubted that I was a day 1 player of DA2.

Just because I used an old saying doesn't mean I don't believe you. As I can see you own them since they are under your avatar. That would be petty on my part.

Yes, it would.

I mean, you might call someone a ****sucker and make ignorant accusations and leaps of logic, but at least you aren't petty.

No, I don't believe in insulting people like that. I keep it PG. There are kids on this forum after all.

[Xemnas07]

i would respect them if they owned up to what they did and fixed it, but that wont ever happen... if this EC fails, im done with bioware permanently

[Dean_the_Young]

Logan Cloud wrote...

This thread is in dire need of some hate sex. I'll get the music started...

Only if it's Nikopol.

[Sublyminal]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...


I have not seen them even once try to reconcile with us, that's just it. All we want is for them to communicate with us. They had the audacity to take our money. But, when something goes south, they're no-where to be found AND when they do communicate, they speak to us in a condenscending manner.

The irony escaping you is what makes you such an excellent example of the problem within the fanbase.

Where is the irony at?

If it wasn't escaping you, it wouldn't be ironic.

The fanbase has steadily approached them trying to reconcile by asking questions, wondering what happened to our beloved series. They are the ones that have ignored these attempts, thus keeping this war alive. If Casey or Mac brought their asses in here or even on twitter and stated. "Ok, guys and girls, this is what's up. We're going to be doing this and we're going to try to correct our mistakes" Everything would instantly be forgiven. But, when the Lead Writer and the series Creator don't even think enough of their fanbase to do that, then why should we continue to try and reconcile?

Ah, bliss...

There is no irony there. I get what you're trying to say, but to say it's ironic is pretty inaccurate. As I am not making contradictary statements, irony does not fit in with anything that is posted. 

Now if you're inferring that the few in the fanbase that are being immature babies about this aren't trying to reconcile, then yes, I'd have to agree with you. But, they don't speak for the majority of us.

Ah, more bliss...

You saying ah, bliss and more bliss does nothing to further your cause. You might be a lot more like me than I imagined, if so this will never end. 

[Sohlito]

AntonioA9011 wrote...

Sohlito wrote...



Best describes their reaction.

Yup, yup. I wonder if that's how it looks when someone comes into their offices at BioWare.

I would certainly hope so.

[Sublyminal]

Logan Cloud wrote...

This thread is in dire need of some hate sex. I'll get the music started...

I admit, I laughed.