35 réponses à ce sujet

[Ekscom]

Is this possible?  
Should be...

I can imagine a new animation for sheathing and a new attachment point for the weapons, but how can we actually do this?

I bet whoever makes that mod will gain legendary popularity. 

[thestillwind]

Yes it will make that person a legend

[Ambaryerno]

I think there's people looking for it. Something to do with the armor nodes or something.

[Merwanor]

This is something i rely want in the game, i never understand why game developers don't add details like this. And the weird part is that a game called Mount & Blade has the weapon sheathed at the side and has a sheath for the weapons. And this is not a very high budget game im talking about.



How come a company with so many people and so much money put into a project can't have this in their game?

[ChewyGumball]

Probably has something to do with staves looking ridiculously bad riding on your hip. I don't know if there is a way to tell specific weapons which sheathing animation/node to use. If there isn't, any mod like this would require ALL weapons to sheath at the hip.

[Ambaryerno]

BITM_Base tells the game which node to use. It allows you to set nodes for both main hand and off-hand weapons. I'm sure if we can find the node for wearing at the hip we can set the position by base types.

[FictionalBreger]

I can't remember where, but a dev (for who else would know?), said something about weapons at the hip, with or without a sheath, looked horrendous in some cutscenes, sticking out of the body and so on so forth. It was in a thread similar to this.

Or, that's what I think I remember, I might be wrong, You better check, just in case.

[Ekscom]

Yeah, that's what i'm thinking. Different nodes for different weapons. Offhand weap's already have their own node on the left side on the back and the main on the right. If we can figure it out, i'm sure we can create a new attachment node and tell it to put one-handers on the hip (or on the head for that matter! LOL) and any other weapon on the back. so no staves or bows would be on the hip.

But even if the character puts the weapon on his back and it appears sheathed on the hip, even if cutscenes look like crap... i bet i'm not the only one who would love to see this done.



Any dev advice out there?

[Epantiras]

Uhm, where have I seen weapons on the back? Was it Mass Effect maybe? ;-)

Besides, axes or 2 handed swords at your hips might be a problem.

[Ambaryerno]

Generally, anything over the length of a typical arming sword or the smaller longswords (blade ~36") wouldn't have been worn on the person, anyway. Some of the longer longswords would have been more often carried on the saddle instead, although you'd obviously need it on your belt if you were walking. Generally, though, you'd leave the scabbard with the baggage when you went to the battlefield.



Contrary to pop culture, the "back scabbard" as we know it did NOT exist. Most representations show that the big greatswords were simply carried in the hand, maybe supported on the shoulder (think "carry arms" with a rifle) on the flat of the blade or ricasso. I think the only evidence of a back hangar is a handful of artifacts from late-Medieval Scotland, used for the big Claymores.



Polearms (staves, spears, pikes, hammers, etc.) would have been carried in the same manner as a greatsword, (in fact surviving manuals of the period show this specifically as part of their drills) and longaxes I believe would have doubled as a walking stick.

[Merwanor]

Developers rely should start to work more with physics on clothes, armor, weapons in games. So much has been done in that area but it is rarely implemented in games. Like one thing i am still waiting for in Fantasy games is real cloaks and capes. The havoc physics engine already has this feature to make clothes and such react to your body. I rely wonder why they never implement it in games.



I at least hope in the future, they will focus a bit more on aspects like scabards, and more realistic handling of your weapons and armor. Like i mage should use the staff as a walking stick and never carry it on their back. Looks idiotic to me.

[ladydesire]

Merwanor wrote...

Developers rely should start to work more with physics on clothes, armor, weapons in games. So much has been done in that area but it is rarely implemented in games. Like one thing i am still waiting for in Fantasy games is real cloaks and capes. The havoc physics engine already has this feature to make clothes and such react to your body. I rely wonder why they never implement it in games.

The main reason many don't do it is that it requires significantly more effort than what would have an apprecible financial return; cloaks, capes and long hair would all require models to be composed of separate pieces, with the external elements (cloaks, etc) having separate skeletons with animations. While these are potential draws for players, in general game developers are looking for things that will expand the story that they want to tell and not little details that add to the game's realism.

[A1x2e3l]

What sounds simple and obvious in reality could be very
difficult or not possible at all.Weapons and shields are attached to specific(fixed names)
bones(nodes) that are “recognized” by the game engine so it “knows” where to
place a weapon when a certain animation sequence is called by a gamer e.g.
unequip. There is no common base skeleton (gender/race specific) in DA:O:
information about bones is stored in every body/clothes/armor mesh file(s) and
is used when PC uses this particular armor/clothes. Hence, it would be
necessary to edit all these meshes, and there are numerous of them in the game.
How to name this new bone correctly that the game engine understands where to
place a sword: on the hip or on the back, what animation to execute for that.
We have no idea (tools as well: exporters, original templates) how to create
new animations for DA:O in general, can they be only replaced or there is a way
to add totally new ones, how to script them. There are few exchangeable PC/NPC
body/armor/clothes parts in DA:O, so we cannot use something like belts for
that – there is no such body part. Use torso mesh. In this case we are facing
similar situation as with weapon bones/skeletons…..
The task seems to be too complicated for a pure
eye-candy mod.

[ChewyGumball]

Adding a node like that to a model file is not hard before you compile it. Adding it after would require editing the compiled file which is not nearly as easy to do. Which model needs the node is another issue, but it sounds like you can specify that.

[Ambaryerno]

knyghteblades at DA Nexus figured it out. Set the mount point in BITM_base to 4 (left hip) and 7 (right hip) instead of 5 and 10.

Modifié par Ambaryerno, 10 décembre 2009 - 04:12 .

[DarthParametric]

ladydesire wrote...

[...]would all require models to be composed of separate pieces, with the external elements (cloaks, etc) having separate skeletons with animations.

Actually that's how it has always been done in the past and that is the problem. What they need to do is use proper physics simulations - no skeletons, no preset animations. The reason they don't is because of the processor and memory overheads it requires.

Here's an example of the sort of thing I'm talking about that I did years ago:



That's just a simple plane. No preset animation, no bones. Just some collision detection, gravity and a cloth simulation. Can't remember the poly count, but it was probably something like a couple of hundred quads. That's the sort of thing that should be used for capes and hair, but in large doses it's too much of a system killer, so it's impractical for a game engine designed to support legacy systems.

[EthrenDiak]

Where can I find this 'BITM_base', and how do I change it?



Forgive me for I am utterly incompetent when it comes to scripting, etc.

[Ambaryerno]

The BITM_base is one of the 2DA files. I'm not sure off-hand of the file locations, I don't have access to anything right now. However if you edit the XLS file you need to convert it to a 2DA for it to work. You can also modify the actual files using the Toolset, but again I don't know off-hand where they are without having access to my files.

[EthrenDiak]

...You lost me after 'one of the 2DA files.' Thanks, though. I don't suppose anyone can recommend a DA Toolset for Dummies tutorial?

[Ambaryerno]

Closest we have is the Toolset Wiki.

[EthrenDiak]

Thank you.

[Groposo]

please can someone upload the BITM_base thing already modded? i can't make the toolset work in my computer... tried everything and nothing works. if someone could do this favor i'd be really glad. thanks.

Modifié par Groposo, 10 décembre 2009 - 09:59 .

[EthrenDiak]

I was able to open the BITM_base.xls with Microsoft Spreadsheet and switch the values. I saved it, etc etc, but nothing happened. Is there any way to use the toolset to switch the values?

[Ambaryerno]

You would need to convert the BITM_base.xls to GDA format with Excelprocessor.exe, (look in one of the Tools folders under the directory where you installed Dragon Age) then copy the BITM_base.gda into the My Docs\\Bioware\\Dragon Age\\Packages\\Core\\Override folder

[EthrenDiak]

I'll try it as soon as I figure out how to keep ExcelProcessor from closing on me...