220 réponses à ce sujet

[Asebstos]

jreezy wrote...

AwesomeDudex64 wrote...

jreezy wrote...

AwesomeDudex64 wrote...
If you screw up the reload-cancel you're putting yourself in danger.

:huh:No you're not.

Yes, you are. Put yourself in a situation where you're not in cover and missing a reload means less time killing things and more time getting shot.

*Is about to unload a round of whoop-ass*
*Screws up the reload-cancel*
*Have to attempt the reload cancel again, use up more time and risk being shot up*

That's not a fault of reload canceling. Being out of cover period puts you in danger.

His main point is that if you mess up the reload by canceling too early it'll take you longer to reload than if you hadn't attempted to cancel.

[shpaiderman]

Bioware probably designed the reload cancel as feature for skilled players to consistently increase performance (just like strife-jumping in fps games)
I wonder if there are more such tricks

Modifié par shpaiderman, 17 mai 2012 - 06:31 .

[Master Xanthan]

rtizz6446 wrote...

 I was wondering, what peoples opionions are on the concept of reload cancelling? Personally i think that it is kind of cheap. To me it is just exploiting because it was not something that was meant to be in the game. It also gives PC players an unfair advantage in the game because medi-gel cancelling is far better than and cancel possible on the xbox. Opinions? 

PS I would appreciate it if people kept this conversation civil.

Calling it an exploit is a bit of a stretch. I mean are we going to start calling everything that is slightly useful an exploit now?

[Megachaz]

Well it looks like this has been pretty well resolved. Bioware says it's not an exploit. Nothing more to say.

[Atrocity]

I don't see how it even could be considered an exploit, since it can happen, and happens accidentally too. Like an infiltrator reloading and cloaking. That's how I ran across this feature first time, with no intention involved.

[elecmanexe001]

rtizz6446 wrote...

Vapaä wrote...

rtizz6446 wrote...

Huh???? Where? I wouldn't consider something that is possible on one platform but not another a game mechanic....

I reload cancel all the time and I'm on Xbox

I did not deny the fact that xbox players can do it. Its just a much beigger part of the PC game due to medi-gel cancelling which is far more efficient.

Its something people do on xbox all the time, I do it for my Widow. How is PC 'better' at doing it though that makes no sense to me.

And I am all for it, this isn't CoD or Halo we aren't fighting real people, it's hoards of AI it needs no balance.

[GroverA125]

It's the active reload of this game, it's present in quite a few games. The CoD franchise is well known for it. It simply exists to allow someone who knows their weapons reload parameters to speed up their reloads.

[uzivatel]

Influ wrote...

uzivatel wrote...

Well, you're certainly entitled to your opinion. As long as you don't go claiming it's a bug, exploit or something, it doesn't really matter what you think about it.

They write codex entries to explain all the space magic thats going on in the game. And then they implement animation cancelling that makes no sense whatsoever. And they implement it poorly.
If you guys did not provide the quotes, I would hardly ever believe you. Instead I would think you are justifying you favourite glitch, because there is no way BioWare would do such obvious **** on purpose. Little did I know.

[B3ckett]

Lima54 wrote...

It is an intended game mechanic, and that's the reason why.

*spills soda over the pa...keyboard *

[defleshing]

ya i have played both and the pc version is way easier because of it.

[defleshing]

all you master race players can have your master servers our peasant ones work way better.

[Prawny]

FS. (Yes I missed an 'F', shut up your gob!)

I know of 5 ways to reload cancel on xbox, it's not hard.
In order of effectiveness:

• During a power cooldown - this is great as your don't even do anything else to stop the reload; you just plain and simply stop the reload animation.
• Going into/out of cover - This is also a good way to do it, especially when going into cover increases accuracy.
• Using a power - Effective but ties you up for a second or so while you use the power.
• Combat roll/dodge - Obviously not ideal, but it works.
• Melee - As bad as a combat roll/dodge, but it works.

I figured these out myself, through normal gameplay. Seriously, have the "console reload-cancelling is not possible" people even played the game?!

[Tortugueta]

I think this issue would be easily solved by making the actual reload of the weapon happen at the very end of the animation rather than halfway through it.

That way you could still cancel the animation in case you need to quickly cast a power or sprint or whatever, but in order to get the weapon to actually reload you would be forced to perform the whole animation.

Or still better, the reload process could be broken down in three steps: eject thermal clip, insert new thermal clip, pump new thermal clip. Once you have completed one step it's done for good, so if you cancel you don't get to shoot because there are steps left to do but you can resume the process where you left it.

[LordOpic]

I don't use the medi gel button to do it, just run forward, so wait running forward is now an exploit?

[uzivatel]

Tortugueta wrote...

I think this issue would be easily solved by making the actual reload of the weapon happen at the very end of the animation rather than halfway through it.

That way you could still cancel the animation in case you need to quickly cast a power or sprint or whatever, but in order to get the weapon to actually reload you would be forced to perform the whole animation.

Or still better, the reload process could be broken down in three steps: eject thermal clip, insert new thermal clip, pump new thermal clip. Once you have completed one step it's done for good, so if you cancel you don't get to shoot because there are steps left to do but you can resume the process where you left it.

At none point did you introduce mechanism, that allows us hardcorez to shoot our weapon faster than teh noobz...

Other than that, I agree.

[Prawny]

GroverA125 wrote...

It's the active reload of this game, it's present in quite a few games. The CoD franchise is well known for it. It simply exists to allow someone who knows their weapons reload parameters to speed up their reloads.

No.
It exists because it's easier than writing another paragraph of code (or 3, if solving it by adding more reload steps) for each gun in the game. Then getting the art department to draw the guns in another (or 3) reloading animation sprites (then probably the audio guys to record more sound effects if you take the extra reload steps route).

Modifié par Prawny, 17 mai 2012 - 10:44 .

[No Snakes Alive]

AwesomeDudex64 wrote...

jreezy wrote...

AwesomeDudex64 wrote...
If you screw up the reload-cancel you're putting yourself in danger.

:huh:No you're not.

Yes, you are. Put yourself in a situation where you're not in cover and missing a reload means less time killing things and more time getting shot.

*Is about to unload a round of whoop-ass*
*Screws up the reload-cancel*
*Have to attempt the reload cancel again, use up more time and risk being shot up*

That's the whole ****ing point. You have to time it properly to reap its benefits or you're punished with an even longer reload. Just because Gears was the first game (at least that I can think of) to actively include this feature doesn't mean it hasn't been around in shooters since long prior. Does nobody seriously remember BxR in Halo 2?

Those who are still skeptical and think the developer literally lied to us to cover up an unintended broken game mechanic should do their research and tone down the cynicism. It's been around for a long time whether incorporated into the gameplay like Gears or kept somewhat of a secret like here, and its purpose is to give those players who can consistently pull it off an advantage, because as you can tell from some of the posts here, not everyone's having an easy time doing it.

That's really all there is to this thread. To those of you who don't like it: okay? I don't like the advantage Tactical Cloak canceling gives you, which is far more beneficial (take heavy-ass gun, worry not about cooldown) yet I'd never go and post a topic wondering if anyone considered it an exploit, because I wouldn't want anyone who does to out themselves as idiots. That too was an intended feature, like it or not.

It's time to move on and either ignore the feature or learn to utilize it.

[No Snakes Alive]

Prawny wrote...

GroverA125 wrote...

It's the active reload of this game, it's present in quite a few games. The CoD franchise is well known for it. It simply exists to allow someone who knows their weapons reload parameters to speed up their reloads.

No.
It exists because it's easier than writing another paragraph of code (or 3, if solving it by adding more reload steps) for each gun in the game. Then getting the art department to draw the guns in another (or 3) reloading animation sprites (then probably the audio guys to record more sound effects if you take the extra reload steps route).

Wow lmao. NO. You could not possibly be more wrong.

It would take developers two seconds to eliminate it if it wasn't intended. It's designed into the game, not the opposite: to difficult to design out. And whatever issue you've got about animations makes no sense. The whole point to it is to be able to shoot immediately, mid-animation, just like it has been in every major shooter for how many years now.

And the funny thing is, if you reload cancel but don't shoot you actually do lower your weapon into ready mode, so what the hell are you even talking about? What extra animations? The reload animation is complete already and this allows you to cancel that early, not begin a whole 'nother animation. That would defeat the purpose.

This thread is detroying my brain cells.

Modifié par No Snakes Alive, 17 mai 2012 - 10:59 .

[uzivatel]

No Snakes Alive wrote...

That's really all there is to this thread. To those of you who don't like it: okay? I don't like the advantage Tactical Cloak canceling gives you, which is far more beneficial (take heavy-ass gun, worry not about cooldown) yet I'd never go and post a topic wondering if anyone considered it an exploit, because I wouldn't want anyone who does to out themselves as idiots. That too was an intended feature, like it or not.

It's time to move on and either ignore the feature or learn to utilize it.

You mean you are protecting people you consider idiots from being perceived as idiots by **** such as yourself? How considerate...

Does the tactical cloak behave different on PC and consoles as well?

Modifié par uzivatel, 17 mai 2012 - 10:59 .

[No Snakes Alive]

uzivatel wrote...

No Snakes Alive wrote...

That's really all there is to this thread. To those of you who don't like it: okay? I don't like the advantage Tactical Cloak canceling gives you, which is far more beneficial (take heavy-ass gun, worry not about cooldown) yet I'd never go and post a topic wondering if anyone considered it an exploit, because I wouldn't want anyone who does to out themselves as idiots. That too was an intended feature, like it or not.

It's time to move on and either ignore the feature or learn to utilize it.

You mean you are protecting people you consider idiots from being perceived as idiots by **** such as yourself? How considerate...

Does the tactical cloak behave different on PC and consoles as well?

Speak of the devil. I hope you don't miss the forums too much, btw.

Is the activation button for tactical cloak in an ABSURDLY inconvenient location on a console gamepad? Maybe the reason they didn't allow for medigel canceling on consoles is that it would take either a mutant with a mangled claw for a hand or a complete moron to think attempting it would be more convenient than the options we already have?

Do you think about what you post first at all? Down on the d-pad? Seriously? No thanks, I'll stick to A. Complaining about that is like complaining about the advantage PC gamers have in aiming with a mouse and keyboard. It's RIDICULOUS. And the sad part is there are people such as myself who are able to reload cancel incredibly consistently on console, but rather than learn how and practice that, some people prefer to whine about the injustices of console vs PC gaming.

Stay salty, bro.

Modifié par No Snakes Alive, 17 mai 2012 - 11:08 .

[someN7orother]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

Just as a heads up for all those that are quoting Mrs Norman:

I don't make a habit of taking post-facto explanations at face value.

No reason not to take it at face value. They could have simply remained silent on the matter, but IIRC Christina not only stated it was a design feature, but she also made a nod to SSF2T where frame cancelling played a huge role past a certain skill threshold.

The mechanic doesn't punish those who don't do it, and it rewards skill for those who can apply it properly. Plus, how hard would it be to make reload animations un-cancellable if they actually wanted to?

[Prawny]

No Snakes Alive wrote...

Wow lmao. NO. You could not possibly be more wrong.

It would take developers two seconds to eliminate it if it wasn't intended. It's designed into the game, not the opposite: to difficult to design out. And whatever issue you've got about animations makes no sense. The whole point to it is to be able to shoot immediately, mid-animation, just like it has been in every major shooter for how many years now.

And the funny thing is, if you reload cancel but don't shoot you actually do lower your weapon into ready mode, so what the hell are you even talking about? What extra animations? The reload animation is complete already and this allows you to cancel that early, not begin a whole 'nother animation. That would defeat the purpose.

This thread is detroying my brain cells.

Please L2code before commenting about it.

Firing mid-animation ends the current animation... duh. It's called error-handling.

Of course your character will put the gun back to the usual position. The reload animation was initiated, so no matter how it happens, it goes back there.

More animations WOULD need to be added, if the reload was split up into stages (like some suggested earlier in the thread). Starting the current single, complete reload animation at a certain timeframes would just get too buggy.