446 réponses à ce sujet

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Seboist wrote...

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
But why was such plotholes not present on Tuchanka and Rannoch? because they ran out of time? A game is not made chronolgically.

Didn't the final hour app mention that they were struggling with making the ending as late as November?

And there is already poor writing in other areas of ME3. Such as Cerberus in the time span of 6 months becoming an empire, Shepard getting away with killing 300.0000 Batarians with no punishment.

They explained Shepard's "amnesty" of that incident.

And the Cerberus being an empire is hyperbole.  The only significant operation they launched on a large scale was the Citadel, and Shepard even says in an interview that Cerberus put their all into it and are no longer a significant threat due to the losses they sustained.  If it weren't for their subterfuge of CSEC, Cerberus wouldn't have even gotten within the arms of the Citadel.  Everything else were isolated operations.

You wish it was a hyberbole fanboy. A small organization of 150 that was financially setback by Lazarus/SR-2 and severely crippled in Retribution coming out with fleets of battlecruisers, mechs, gunships and supersoldiers that's capable on launching attacks all over the galaxy and even raiding the freaking Salarian homeworld while the most important VIPs are present is by definition a galactic power.

The whole citadel "coup" was completely moronic and nonsensical. Cerberus is capable of taking on several hundred thousand c-sec personnel that are mostly Turian and not to mention there's a whole citadel defense force in orbit around the damn station.

This is not taking into account that the whole objective of the "coup" is also completely moronic. Cerberus and Udina expect the citadel races to just lockstep behind them because they took out the council? Just freaking.... LOL.

And you people wonder why others don't take the notion that the only thing wrong about this game is the endings seriously.

Thank you Seboist.

[llbountyhunter]

http://masseffectind...n.blogspot.com/

Modifié par llbountyhunter, 18 mai 2012 - 05:39 .

[balance5050]

jla0644 wrote...

Yes, many of you are are saying that.

And no, it does not. You think it does, and that's fine. But you thinking that doesn't make it true. I have no problem with you guys believing whatever you want. I suspect that many of you will continue to believe it even when the EC comes out and shows nothing to support your theory. But quit telling me that your theory is the only way to explain things, that the evidence is overwhelming and cannot be disputed, because it's not.

And yet you still fail to come up with any other thing the evidence points to besides "Bioware sucks", we just happen to think that bioware may not suck as much as some like to think.

Problem?

Modifié par balance5050, 18 mai 2012 - 05:40 .

[llbountyhunter]

Valentia X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...


shepard died in me2.... the revival was plausible because he had his full armor, helmet, and kinetic barriers. not to mention that the planet he landed on was both lighter and had a thinner atmosphere than earth. the revival itself is not so far fetched considering the advances in science today, however his body needed to be intact for it to work (thanks to his armor)

in me3 shepard has no armor, no helmet, no barriers. he must first suvive a medium explosion around the size of a grenade, then a much lager nuke-sized explosion.... THEN a re-entry on a larger planet WITHOUT shields or a helmet.



so no, I dont think shepard has survived anything quite like it before.

And the problem with your statement- again- is that he's on Earth.

i dont see the problem if he never left earth in the first place.

 

[jla0644]

BatmanTurian wrote...

Then you are wrong, because that's exactly what Indoctrination Theory does. Fan Fiction does not even apply. You use that false term to impugn it's viability and commit a logical fallacy.

Balance5050 wrote...

Then you are purposefully being ignorant to the meaning of those words.

lol, you guys need to relax

[llbountyhunter]

jla0644 wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...


much better.

and were not saying IT is true- just that its a plausible theory. the evidence favors IT.

Yes, many of you are are saying that.

And no, it does not. You think it does, and that's fine. But you thinking that doesn't make it true. I have no problem with you guys believing whatever you want. I suspect that many of you will continue to believe it even when the EC comes out and shows nothing to support your theory. But quit telling me that your theory is the only way to explain things, that the evidence is overwhelming and cannot be disputed, because it's not.

do you have any evidence that contradicts IT? please show it to us.

[BatmanTurian]

jla0644 wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

jla0644 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

jla0644 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Sigh... you said "all those suggestions, hints, and clues can just as easily lead you somewhere else other than indoctrination."  and I'm asking "WHERE ELSE?"

Guns change from scene to scene yes... but NEVER in the middle of a scene, the gun assets were specifically loaded in the files under the destroy ending. It was intentional.

Almost every part of the end is asset reuse because the environment is being reconstructed from your memories. Legion tells you why machines do this in the Geth consensus mission.

Lol really? It leads to the ending that we got, not a speulative piece of fan fiction.

So if it was intentional, what does it mean? What's the signifigance of the gun changing?

Noo.. the hints are actually pointing away from the endings we got.... Like the kill beam starting in the viper system (The Arrival) and the asset reuse meant to remind you of other part of the game, direct contradictions by the catalyst, etc.

The Predetor is considered Shepards default pistol unless he is doing a more renegade or scumbag action. The gun changes from a carnifex, typically used by bad guys, and the it changes to the good guy predetor once for the final shot in the destroy option. 

Because that's how you choose to see it.  Fine. I don't.

I think you guys are reading way too much into things that simply don't matter. I think the endings really are as bad as they see. I think it's filled with plot holes and Bioware didn't think we would care. Why is your interpretaion more valid than mine?

much better.

and were not saying IT is true- just that its a plausible theory. the evidence favors IT.

Yes, many of you are are saying that.

And no, it does not. You think it does, and that's fine. But you thinking that doesn't make it true. I have no problem with you guys believing whatever you want. I suspect that many of you will continue to believe it even when the EC comes out and shows nothing to support your theory. But quit telling me that your theory is the only way to explain things, that the evidence is overwhelming and cannot be disputed, because it's not.

Actually, almost all of us who are reasonable will completely abandon IT if the EC falsifies it.

[balance5050]

jla0644 wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

Then you are wrong, because that's exactly what Indoctrination Theory does. Fan Fiction does not even apply. You use that false term to impugn it's viability and commit a logical fallacy.

Balance5050 wrote...

Then you are purposefully being ignorant to the meaning of those words.

lol, you guys need to relax

Nope, just making observations.

[PsyrenY]

llbountyhunter wrote...

do you have any evidence that contradicts IT? please show it to us.

Disproving "it was all a dream" is impossible, because dreams by their very nature are capable of showing (or hiding) any detail they need to.

[balance5050]

Bottom line is we like to debate what we see in the game and are always hungry for anyone to challenge this hypothesis because it just works that well.

Modifié par balance5050, 18 mai 2012 - 05:44 .

[BatmanTurian]

jla0644 wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

Then you are wrong, because that's exactly what Indoctrination Theory does. Fan Fiction does not even apply. You use that false term to impugn it's viability and commit a logical fallacy.

Balance5050 wrote...

Then you are purposefully being ignorant to the meaning of those words.

lol, you guys need to relax

I'm completely relaxed. You are using the wrong terms and so I am correcting you. You look ignorant when you claim a literary interpretation is fan fiction. If literary interpretation is fanfiction, then every English Lit professor who has ever interpreted a classic and wrote a thesis about it is writing fan fiction.

[llbountyhunter]

Optimystic_X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

do you have any evidence that contradicts IT? please show it to us.

Disproving "it was all a dream" is impossible, because dreams by their very nature are capable of showing (or hiding) any detail they need to.

so why is this thread even open?

[balance5050]

BatmanTurian wrote...


Actually, almost all of us who are reasonable will completely abandon IT if the EC falsifies it.

Yep, if the EC falsifies it, a lot of us will probably join you in saying that "Bioware sucks" but until then I.T. stands to fix the ending.

[Raiil]

llbountyhunter wrote...

Valentia X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...


shepard died in me2.... the revival was plausible because he had his full armor, helmet, and kinetic barriers. not to mention that the planet he landed on was both lighter and had a thinner atmosphere than earth. the revival itself is not so far fetched considering the advances in science today, however his body needed to be intact for it to work (thanks to his armor)

in me3 shepard has no armor, no helmet, no barriers. he must first suvive a medium explosion around the size of a grenade, then a much lager nuke-sized explosion.... THEN a re-entry on a larger planet WITHOUT shields or a helmet.



so no, I dont think shepard has survived anything quite like it before.

And the problem with your statement- again- is that he's on Earth.

i dont see the problem if he never left earth in the first place.

 

And in order for that to be true, you need proof, either through WoG via the developers or through hypotheses that can be proved in-game. We have neither. All you have is an idea with no substantial evidence.

[ArkkAngel007]

Seboist wrote...

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
But why was such plotholes not present on Tuchanka and Rannoch? because they ran out of time? A game is not made chronolgically.

Didn't the final hour app mention that they were struggling with making the ending as late as November?

And there is already poor writing in other areas of ME3. Such as Cerberus in the time span of 6 months becoming an empire, Shepard getting away with killing 300.0000 Batarians with no punishment.

They explained Shepard's "amnesty" of that incident.

And the Cerberus being an empire is hyperbole.  The only significant operation they launched on a large scale was the Citadel, and Shepard even says in an interview that Cerberus put their all into it and are no longer a significant threat due to the losses they sustained.  If it weren't for their subterfuge of CSEC, Cerberus wouldn't have even gotten within the arms of the Citadel.  Everything else were isolated operations.

You wish it was a hyberbole fanboy. A small organization of 150 that was financially setback by Lazarus/SR-2 and severely crippled in Retribution coming out with fleets of battlecruisers, mechs, gunships and supersoldiers that's capable on launching attacks all over the galaxy and even raiding the freaking Salarian homeworld while the most important VIPs are present is by definition a galactic power.

The whole citadel "coup" was completely moronic and nonsensical. Cerberus is capable of taking on several hundred thousand c-sec personnel that are mostly Turian and not to mention there's a whole citadel defense force in orbit around the damn station.

This is not taking into account that the whole objective of the "coup" is also completely moronic. Cerberus and Udina expect the citadel races to just lockstep behind them because they took out the council? Just freaking.... LOL.

And you people wonder why others don't take the notion that the only thing wrong about this game is the endings seriously.

I never said it wasn't stupid.  I just said that it's far from an empire.  Those events in ME2 made Cerberus popular, which drove recruitment.  We don't know the size of their "fleets" (I highly doubt it could be called even one fleet).  The coup, I thought we were talking about how Cerberus could pull it off, not the validity of their end game (which I agree is downright ridiculous).  And most of all, it's a game.  BioWare isn't afraid of ditching lore for gameplay purposes.  I'm not saying I agree with it, it's just what they have done in the past and did again.

You're just making yourself look like an idiot (and fanboy) for getting overly offended by my answer, which wasn't negative or confrontational.  Congrats for making yourself an *** in front of everyone.

[BatmanTurian]

Lizardviking wrote...

Seboist wrote...

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
But why was such plotholes not present on Tuchanka and Rannoch? because they ran out of time? A game is not made chronolgically.

Didn't the final hour app mention that they were struggling with making the ending as late as November?

And there is already poor writing in other areas of ME3. Such as Cerberus in the time span of 6 months becoming an empire, Shepard getting away with killing 300.0000 Batarians with no punishment.

They explained Shepard's "amnesty" of that incident.

And the Cerberus being an empire is hyperbole.  The only significant operation they launched on a large scale was the Citadel, and Shepard even says in an interview that Cerberus put their all into it and are no longer a significant threat due to the losses they sustained.  If it weren't for their subterfuge of CSEC, Cerberus wouldn't have even gotten within the arms of the Citadel.  Everything else were isolated operations.

You wish it was a hyberbole fanboy. A small organization of 150 that was financially setback by Lazarus/SR-2 and severely crippled in Retribution coming out with fleets of battlecruisers, mechs, gunships and supersoldiers that's capable on launching attacks all over the galaxy and even raiding the freaking Salarian homeworld while the most important VIPs are present is by definition a galactic power.

The whole citadel "coup" was completely moronic and nonsensical. Cerberus is capable of taking on several hundred thousand c-sec personnel that are mostly Turian and not to mention there's a whole citadel defense force in orbit around the damn station.

This is not taking into account that the whole objective of the "coup" is also completely moronic. Cerberus and Udina expect the citadel races to just lockstep behind them because they took out the council? Just freaking.... LOL.

And you people wonder why others don't take the notion that the only thing wrong about this game is the endings seriously.

Thank you Seboist.

Don't give a known troll credit.

[llbountyhunter]

Valentia X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Valentia X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...


shepard died in me2.... the revival was plausible because he had his full armor, helmet, and kinetic barriers. not to mention that the planet he landed on was both lighter and had a thinner atmosphere than earth. the revival itself is not so far fetched considering the advances in science today, however his body needed to be intact for it to work (thanks to his armor)

in me3 shepard has no armor, no helmet, no barriers. he must first suvive a medium explosion around the size of a grenade, then a much lager nuke-sized explosion.... THEN a re-entry on a larger planet WITHOUT shields or a helmet.



so no, I dont think shepard has survived anything quite like it before.

And the problem with your statement- again- is that he's on Earth.

i dont see the problem if he never left earth in the first place.

 

And in order for that to be true, you need proof, either through WoG via the developers or through hypotheses that can be proved in-game. We have neither. All you have is an idea with no substantial evidence.

thats why were not calling it PROOF..... were labeling it as evidence.  

[balance5050]

Valentia X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Valentia X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...


shepard died in me2.... the revival was plausible because he had his full armor, helmet, and kinetic barriers. not to mention that the planet he landed on was both lighter and had a thinner atmosphere than earth. the revival itself is not so far fetched considering the advances in science today, however his body needed to be intact for it to work (thanks to his armor)

in me3 shepard has no armor, no helmet, no barriers. he must first suvive a medium explosion around the size of a grenade, then a much lager nuke-sized explosion.... THEN a re-entry on a larger planet WITHOUT shields or a helmet.



so no, I dont think shepard has survived anything quite like it before.

And the problem with your statement- again- is that he's on Earth.

i dont see the problem if he never left earth in the first place.

 

And in order for that to be true, you need proof, either through WoG via the developers or through hypotheses that can be proved in-game. We have neither. All you have is an idea with no substantial evidence.

LOL, I like how you can't even be bothered to talk about the evidence, whats wrong buddy?

[ArkkAngel007]

llbountyhunter wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

do you have any evidence that contradicts IT? please show it to us.

Disproving "it was all a dream" is impossible, because dreams by their very nature are capable of showing (or hiding) any detail they need to.

so why is this thread even open?

Because the mods are sick of keeping up with it, and IsaacShep didn't want to ignore IT any longer so he had to start another feud thread.

By the way, any "PROOF!" thread is retarded.  People hate when the IT nutters do it, but they love doing it themselves.  It's up to BioWare to make the final call, not us.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

BatmanTurian wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Seboist wrote...

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
But why was such plotholes not present on Tuchanka and Rannoch? because they ran out of time? A game is not made chronolgically.

Didn't the final hour app mention that they were struggling with making the ending as late as November?

And there is already poor writing in other areas of ME3. Such as Cerberus in the time span of 6 months becoming an empire, Shepard getting away with killing 300.0000 Batarians with no punishment.

They explained Shepard's "amnesty" of that incident.

And the Cerberus being an empire is hyperbole.  The only significant operation they launched on a large scale was the Citadel, and Shepard even says in an interview that Cerberus put their all into it and are no longer a significant threat due to the losses they sustained.  If it weren't for their subterfuge of CSEC, Cerberus wouldn't have even gotten within the arms of the Citadel.  Everything else were isolated operations.

You wish it was a hyberbole fanboy. A small organization of 150 that was financially setback by Lazarus/SR-2 and severely crippled in Retribution coming out with fleets of battlecruisers, mechs, gunships and supersoldiers that's capable on launching attacks all over the galaxy and even raiding the freaking Salarian homeworld while the most important VIPs are present is by definition a galactic power.

The whole citadel "coup" was completely moronic and nonsensical. Cerberus is capable of taking on several hundred thousand c-sec personnel that are mostly Turian and not to mention there's a whole citadel defense force in orbit around the damn station.

This is not taking into account that the whole objective of the "coup" is also completely moronic. Cerberus and Udina expect the citadel races to just lockstep behind them because they took out the council? Just freaking.... LOL.

And you people wonder why others don't take the notion that the only thing wrong about this game is the endings seriously.

Thank you Seboist.

Don't give a known troll credit.

I disapprove of Seboist attitude, but what he said still held truth to it.

[jla0644]

balance5050 wrote...

jla0644 wrote...

Yes, many of you are are saying that.

And no, it does not. You think it does, and that's fine. But you thinking that doesn't make it true. I have no problem with you guys believing whatever you want. I suspect that many of you will continue to believe it even when the EC comes out and shows nothing to support your theory. But quit telling me that your theory is the only way to explain things, that the evidence is overwhelming and cannot be disputed, because it's not.

And yet you still fail to come up with any other thing the evidence points to besides "Bioware sucks", we just happen to think that bioware may not suck as much as some like to think.

Problem?

I said you'd need to be more specific, and you've only brought up one thing, the breathing scene. And  yes, my interepretation is that it's a plot hole, but not a very important one since I don't believe that clip to be anything other than an easter egg for those with high enough EMS, and Bioware never intended for it to lead anywhere.

Does that mean my interpretation for all your "evidence" is "Bioware sucks"? No. You can ask about more if you'd like, and if this thread is still around next time I visit, I might answer them. Or you can assume that I'm aware of all your evidence, and find it all unconvincing. And I'll assume that any of my answers will be unsatisfactory for you.  Deal?

[mauro2222]

BatmanTurian wrote...

Don't give a known troll credit.

I have yet to see Seboist trolling, if anything he's a Cerberus follower (that's crazy enough) with lots of snarky comments. But his point still stands and he's right, the ending is just one freaking problem with the story... and the technical problems wich are laughable.

[balance5050]

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

do you have any evidence that contradicts IT? please show it to us.

Disproving "it was all a dream" is impossible, because dreams by their very nature are capable of showing (or hiding) any detail they need to.

so why is this thread even open?

Because the mods are sick of keeping up with it, and IsaacShep didn't want to ignore IT any longer so he had to start another feud thread.

By the way, any "PROOF!" thread is retarded.  People hate when the IT nutters do it, but they love doing it themselves.  It's up to BioWare to make the final call, not us.

Most of the ITer's don't like that either, they stress on calling things potential evidence to help our case.

[BatmanTurian]

Valentia X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Valentia X wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...


shepard died in me2.... the revival was plausible because he had his full armor, helmet, and kinetic barriers. not to mention that the planet he landed on was both lighter and had a thinner atmosphere than earth. the revival itself is not so far fetched considering the advances in science today, however his body needed to be intact for it to work (thanks to his armor)

in me3 shepard has no armor, no helmet, no barriers. he must first suvive a medium explosion around the size of a grenade, then a much lager nuke-sized explosion.... THEN a re-entry on a larger planet WITHOUT shields or a helmet.



so no, I dont think shepard has survived anything quite like it before.

And the problem with your statement- again- is that he's on Earth.

i dont see the problem if he never left earth in the first place.

 

And in order for that to be true, you need proof, either through WoG via the developers or through hypotheses that can be proved in-game. We have neither. All you have is an idea with no substantial evidence.

BatmanTurian wrote...

A giant blast megatons in magnitude would not blast Shepard through
walls, it would incinerate and vaporize him. Also, Shepard did not
survive being killed in space. That's why he had to be brought back to
life by the Lazerus Project. That's just rediculous. The whole premise
of ME2's beginning is that we owe something to the Illusive man for
bringing Shepard back to life and it took two years, implants, and the
very best scientists to do so and Shepard was the only subject.

So
no, Shepard did not survive re-entry. Shepard was decapitated and all
that was left was his torso, limbs, and head flung everywhere, his brain
intact only because of his helmet.

BatmanTurian wrote...
A person, whether they have armor and shields or not, would not be able
to survive a multimegaton blast like that. You have no answer. Even if
Shepard was in a Mass Effect field holding in oxygen, a) Shepard is at
ground zero and the force of the explosion on the air around it would
pop Shepard's lungs like baloons so Shepard would not even be able to
take a breath, and c) even if Shepard was blown away from the blast into
one of the wards, the force of the blast would make Shepard a greasy
red smear.

When you have to ignore basic physics to prove your point, it looks like denial.

Modifié par BatmanTurian, 18 mai 2012 - 05:52 .

[GethPrimeMKII]

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
But why was such plotholes not present on Tuchanka and Rannoch? because they ran out of time? A game is not made chronolgically.

Didn't the final hour app mention that they were struggling with making the ending as late as November?

And there is already poor writing in other areas of ME3. Such as Cerberus in the time span of 6 months becoming an empire, Shepard getting away with killing 300.0000 Batarians with no punishment.

Well she was grounded for months and had her ship taken away. Were it not for the delayed reaper invasion she'd have been left to rot in prison, as stated by Anderson himself.

And no, Cerberus didnt just up and build an empire from scratch in 6 months. You're talking about an organization with the resources and connections to bring a human being back to life and recreate the alliance's most powerful frigate in secret. While empire is the wrong word to describe Cerberus, they are clearly shown to be a large and capable group with vast resources.