446 réponses à ce sujet

[shodiswe]

I've never thoguht much of the Indooctrination theory... However the endign is crap no matter what... That conversation with the catalyst was horrible, unsatisfying and railroaded on the player

Sure there are other parts of the game that could have used some polishing but that last conversation before you make you ending choice is poorly written and far too limiting, What wasn't shepard allowed more dialogue options and perhaps a renegade/paragon interrupt?

It's the final showdown with the reapers and it ends with shepard saying "I don't know" after a really uninspired conversation that seems way out of character for any shepard I know off and really weird for a reaper...

Therefor the ending was a fail and a let down imo Still enjoyed the game but the ending took a big chounk of the fun out of it... All that work and thats all it came down to?

[Icinix]

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

Thats only one type of indoctrination theory, its not the be all and end all with IT.

There are plenty who believe Shepard wakes up from indoctrination regardless of the choice made, and that that choice still leads to the same or other outcomes anyway.

[BatmanTurian]

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

There are middle-ground versions of the theory where you are not punished harshly by choosing control or synthesis and can be snapped out of it long enough to fight back and still save the galaxy. I usually try to push that version, because otherwise it makes people like you unhappy because your choice and beliefs are disregarded. In control, you are like TIM and fight against Hammer until you get talked down by Anderson or some other person. In Synthesis, it's the same thing but you're not warlike, you are just trying to get people to accept a peaceful negotiation and are snapped out of it.

IT can still happen without punishing the players who chose blue and green.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

ME2 punished you with Squadmate death and possibly even Shepards death for wrong choices and beeing ill prepared, why should ME3 be any different?

But on other notes several ways have been proposed for a people to get a "good" ending even if they picked what in accordance to the IT is a wrong choice. These ideas include the death of ones love interest to make Shepard break free long enough or simply a moments break through which allows Shepard to commit suicide Saren/TIM style and allowing his squad to finish the fight for him.

To give one of my personal theories. If say Shepard picks Control or Synthesis the Rachni queen if she lives in your save might interfere, interacting with Shepards mind (as we know she can do witha living creature from ME2) and grant him some of the strength which allows her to resist Indoctrination (like we know she canm from ME3.) The result is that you move on like you had picked Destroy, but the act of saving means the Rachni Queen dies (in the process of getting clsoe enough or similar)

This paticular theory arose within my mind due to the old quote from Bioware about "The rachni queen choice beeing important in the end."

Short version: Sometimes actions in games have bad consequences if you dont think them through, but sometimes you are also prepared enough to deal with bad choice so it dosent ruin everything.

[poundoffleshaa]

Indoctrination Theory fits better into the existing lore than the current ending it is perfectly possible in universe as opposed to synthesis which before Bioware pulled it out of its hat I would say it was impossible in universe.

[ArkkAngel007]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

ME2 punished you with Squadmate death and possibly even Shepards death for wrong choices and beeing ill prepared, why should ME3 be any different?

But on other notes several ways have been proposed for a people to get a "good" ending even if they picked what in accordance to the IT is a wrong choice. These ideas include the death of ones love interest to make Shepard break free long enough or simply a moments break through which allows Shepard to commit suicide Saren/TIM style and allowing his squad to finish the fight for him.

To give one of my personal theories. If say Shepard picks Control or Synthesis the Rachni queen if she lives in your save might interfere, interacting with Shepards mind (as we know she can do witha living creature from ME2) and grant him some of the strength which allows her to resist Indoctrination (like we know she canm from ME3.) The result is that you move on like you had picked Destroy, but the act of saving means the Rachni Queen dies (in the process of getting clsoe enough or similar)

This paticular theory arose within my mind due to the old quote from Bioware about "The rachni queen choice beeing important in the end."

Short version: Sometimes actions in games have bad consequences if you dont think them through, but sometimes you are also prepared enough to deal with bad choice so it dosent ruin everything.

If you haven't posted that in the main IT thread (Mark II), then you should do so post-haste.  

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

shodiswe wrote...

I've never thoguht much of the Indooctrination theory... However the endign is crap no matter what... That conversation with the catalyst was horrible, unsatisfying and railroaded on the player

Sure there are other parts of the game that could have used some polishing but that last conversation before you make you ending choice is poorly written and far too limiting, What wasn't shepard allowed more dialogue options and perhaps a renegade/paragon interrupt?

It's the final showdown with the reapers and it ends with shepard saying "I don't know" after a really uninspired conversation that seems way out of character for any shepard I know off and really weird for a reaper...

Therefor the ending was a fail and a let down imo Still enjoyed the game but the ending took a big chounk of the fun out of it... All that work and thats all it came down to?

I can only say to Shepards acceptance that it coresponds well to how we dont question what happens in a dream, really try thinking of how many times you see something strange ina dream, but take it for granted until you wake up.

Supposedly there is also a similar scene in comic/book about Mass Effect with a indoctrination victim slowly not questioning and going along with what a voice tells him. But dont take my word on that as I onloy saw it linked back in the old IT thread.

[macrocarl]

There's a lot of IT folks out there (including Mr. Me) who think that one possible interpretation of the ending is that it's IT but actual events are still going on, just not as you perceive them. Personally, I felt like Harby was projecting into Shep's mind............ But Destroy actually blew them up.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

ME2 punished you with Squadmate death and possibly even Shepards death for wrong choices and beeing ill prepared, why should ME3 be any different?

But on other notes several ways have been proposed for a people to get a "good" ending even if they picked what in accordance to the IT is a wrong choice. These ideas include the death of ones love interest to make Shepard break free long enough or simply a moments break through which allows Shepard to commit suicide Saren/TIM style and allowing his squad to finish the fight for him.

To give one of my personal theories. If say Shepard picks Control or Synthesis the Rachni queen if she lives in your save might interfere, interacting with Shepards mind (as we know she can do witha living creature from ME2) and grant him some of the strength which allows her to resist Indoctrination (like we know she canm from ME3.) The result is that you move on like you had picked Destroy, but the act of saving means the Rachni Queen dies (in the process of getting clsoe enough or similar)

This paticular theory arose within my mind due to the old quote from Bioware about "The rachni queen choice beeing important in the end."

Short version: Sometimes actions in games have bad consequences if you dont think them through, but sometimes you are also prepared enough to deal with bad choice so it dosent ruin everything.

If you haven't posted that in the main IT thread (Mark II), then you should do so post-haste.  

I did it allready in the first IT thread

Adrian who had longer write up on potential ending in EC even inlcuded the Rachni idea, giving me credit.

[Shepard Wins]

The endings are real, because the indoctrination is real...

O_o

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

ME2 punished you with Squadmate death and possibly even Shepards death for wrong choices and beeing ill prepared, why should ME3 be any different?

Because what you mentioned is already in ME3 in the EMS system? That is ME3's measurement of preformance and preparement? Lack the ems and you will might lose squadmates and be locked out of choices in the end. As it is, IT would be like having all Shepards who decided to save the Collector base fall to their death at the last jump.

Granted EMS was barely shown in the battle for Earth, but that just goes to show how ****** poor the entire last mission is in terms of quality.

[Makrys]

You know whats funny? Priestly JUST locked a thread about the end DLC sticker. Check it out. He says "Enough shouting. The ending does not end with a DLC sticker."

Soooo, we haven't seen the ending then have we? Because... to us... that WAS the ending. Idk, just thinking out loud. EC needs to get here damnit. But they need to take their time too. Conflicting!

Modifié par Makrys, 18 mai 2012 - 04:46 .

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

ME2 punished you with Squadmate death and possibly even Shepards death for wrong choices and beeing ill prepared, why should ME3 be any different?

Because what you mentioned is already in ME3 in the EMS system? That is ME3's measurement of preformance and preparement? Lack the ems and you will might lose squadmates and be locked out of choices in the end. As it is, IT would be like having all Shepards who decided to save the Collector base fall to their death at the last jump.

Granted EMS was barely shown in the battle for Earth, but that just goes to show how ****** poor the entire last mission is in terms of quality.

Even if you did every side mission and devery upgrade in ME2 your squad was not completely sceure. A wrong choice would still lead to a persons death.

If you look at ME3 the same way you could have 8000 EMS, but a wrong decision at the end could still potentially punish you in EC.

Modifié par Raistlin Majare 1992, 18 mai 2012 - 04:49 .

[jla0644]

Makrys wrote...

Its the same in NN as well. And if you didn't get the message at the end of control or synthesis, then it would be obvious something is up. People don't understand, THEY CAN'T POINT OUT THAT IT IS TRUE. They want YOU to figure it out, and connect the dots. So everyone who's asking "Where's the proof?", you're never going to get legimitate 'proof' because there is none. And you're not meant to know exactly how the ending happened until the EC. People forget... they wanted speculation! They wanted people having differeing opinions and disecting the game and its ending.

If they wanted us to figure it out, they wouldn't have made every so-called piece of evidence be able to be interpreted in different ways. To me, the most obvious way to interpret the dreams is that it's Shep's guilt and anxiety. Maybe they wanted speculation, but I doubt they wanted people to think their ending didn't really  happen. I firmly believe Hudson and Walters think their ending is brilliant.

Makrys wrote...

So no you'll never have definitive proof of the IT, because you can't prove a theory. All you will ever have are suggestions, hints, or clues that can lead you to think that there is something deeper going on throughout the game.

True, and all those suggestions, hints, and clues can just as easily lead you somewhere else other than indoctrination. I know you guys are fond of saying that your theory is the only way to make sense of things, but it simply isn't true. Every single person that doesn't believe it is proof of that. Your "evidence" is not as obvious as you like to think it is.

Makrys wrote...

I still have yet to hear someone explain the 'oily shadows' in Shepard's dreams, as well as the various Reaper noises, AND whispers. Because every single one of those has been described either in the codex, or previous lore of the universe, to be direct examples of attempts to indoctrinate someone. All 3 are related to indoctrination. So its just a coincidence they were in Shepard's dreams? Ok. But look who's grasping at straws now. In fact, there is A LOT in which the Anti-IT crowd are trying to simply toss out the window with 'bad writing' or 'coincidences' when the IT crowd is backing up their findings and opinions with facts from the lore. So while nothing remains proven, there are considerable events that can be defined and explained with the IT which simply cannot be without it. Unless you just think Bioware took a dump on their best franchise at the last minute, set fire to it, and ran. If you believe that, then I can't help you.

I've actually been wanting to comment on the oily shadows for awhile. Seems to me you guys leave out a very important part of the phrase -- "Songs the color of oily shadows". The rachni queen never suggests that they saw actual oily shadows in their dreams and that's how they became indoctrinated. As I'm sure you're aware, the rachni don't have language like the other species do, and the reapers' attempt to indoctrinate them produced a song the color of oily shadows, or a sour note. This is the same as saying someone would hear voices in their head. IMO, you guys are interpreting the oily shadows thing way too literally. In any event, those things look more like black pillars of smoke, not shadows.

Makrys wrote...

Bioware built this universe. They've exemplified amazing writing techniques all throughout the trilogy, with amazing ends to each game. So, why would they abandon that strategy now, when it all matters... at the end? They wouldn't. The EC was planned because the ending was rushed. There are tweets that were soon after deleted, from Bioware regarding this. Obviously they were later deleted because I'm sure they deemed them as revealing too much... and reveal they did. Both that A. They have been working on the EC for some time, and B. The dreamy state of the end was intended. If Bill Casey is hanging around, he's got a couple links for you.

Again, I don't think they believe there is anything wrong with the ending. I believe they think it's brilliant and they're shocked the rest of us don't realize the genius of it.

[balance5050]

Makrys wrote...

You know whats funny? Priestly JUST locked a thread about the end DLC sticker. Check it out. He says "Enough shouting. The ending does not end with a DLC sticker."

Soooo, we haven't seen the ending then have we? Because... to us... that WAS the ending. Idk, just thinking out loud. EC needs to get here damnit. But they need to take their time too. Conflicting!

I JUST saw that too... I can't wait to see what it DOES end with.

[ArkkAngel007]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
I did it allready in the first IT thread

Adrian who had longer write up on potential ending in EC even inlcuded the Rachni idea, giving me credit.

Awesome.  I ducked out for a month or so to see if things would chill (delusional I suppose), so that thread grew further than what I could sanely read.  Heck, most of the people talking on there are not the same ones I remember from the first 100 pages (DJ, Byne...that's about it off the top of my head).  A lot of people have taken up the slack since then.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

ME2 punished you with Squadmate death and possibly even Shepards death for wrong choices and beeing ill prepared, why should ME3 be any different?

Because what you mentioned is already in ME3 in the EMS system? That is ME3's measurement of preformance and preparement? Lack the ems and you will might lose squadmates and be locked out of choices in the end. As it is, IT would be like having all Shepards who decided to save the Collector base fall to their death at the last jump.

Granted EMS was barely shown in the battle for Earth, but that just goes to show how ****** poor the entire last mission is in terms of quality.

Even if you did every side mission and devery upgrade in ME2 your squad was not completely sceure. A wrong choice would still lead to a persons death.

If you look at ME3 the same way you could have 8000 EMS, but a wrong decision at the end could still punish you.

Too bad we don't got choices lack that during Priority: Earth? The only choice we get is the end choice, and those should not be "Right or wrong" decisions. They should be major decisions where we decide how we want the future to be.

Again. Bioware did not have Shepard fall to his death for arbitary reasons just because he deciced to save the base.

[balance5050]

jla0644 wrote...


True, and all those suggestions, hints, and clues can just as easily lead you somewhere else other than indoctrination. I know you guys are fond of saying that your theory is the only way to make sense of things, but it simply isn't true. Every single person that doesn't believe it is proof of that. Your "evidence" is not as obvious as you like to think it is.

Where ELSE could the evidence POSSIBLY lead? If it "easily" points to other things, you should be able to say ONE thing that fits with the story and themes just as easily as I.T..

[Makrys]

jla0644 wrote...

Makrys wrote...

Its the same in NN as well. And if you didn't get the message at the end of control or synthesis, then it would be obvious something is up. People don't understand, THEY CAN'T POINT OUT THAT IT IS TRUE. They want YOU to figure it out, and connect the dots. So everyone who's asking "Where's the proof?", you're never going to get legimitate 'proof' because there is none. And you're not meant to know exactly how the ending happened until the EC. People forget... they wanted speculation! They wanted people having differeing opinions and disecting the game and its ending.

If they wanted us to figure it out, they wouldn't have made every so-called piece of evidence be able to be interpreted in different ways. To me, the most obvious way to interpret the dreams is that it's Shep's guilt and anxiety. Maybe they wanted speculation, but I doubt they wanted people to think their ending didn't really  happen. I firmly believe Hudson and Walters think their ending is brilliant.

Makrys wrote...

So no you'll never have definitive proof of the IT, because you can't prove a theory. All you will ever have are suggestions, hints, or clues that can lead you to think that there is something deeper going on throughout the game.

True, and all those suggestions, hints, and clues can just as easily lead you somewhere else other than indoctrination. I know you guys are fond of saying that your theory is the only way to make sense of things, but it simply isn't true. Every single person that doesn't believe it is proof of that. Your "evidence" is not as obvious as you like to think it is.

Makrys wrote...

I still have yet to hear someone explain the 'oily shadows' in Shepard's dreams, as well as the various Reaper noises, AND whispers. Because every single one of those has been described either in the codex, or previous lore of the universe, to be direct examples of attempts to indoctrinate someone. All 3 are related to indoctrination. So its just a coincidence they were in Shepard's dreams? Ok. But look who's grasping at straws now. In fact, there is A LOT in which the Anti-IT crowd are trying to simply toss out the window with 'bad writing' or 'coincidences' when the IT crowd is backing up their findings and opinions with facts from the lore. So while nothing remains proven, there are considerable events that can be defined and explained with the IT which simply cannot be without it. Unless you just think Bioware took a dump on their best franchise at the last minute, set fire to it, and ran. If you believe that, then I can't help you.

I've actually been wanting to comment on the oily shadows for awhile. Seems to me you guys leave out a very important part of the phrase -- "Songs the color of oily shadows". The rachni queen never suggests that they saw actual oily shadows in their dreams and that's how they became indoctrinated. As I'm sure you're aware, the rachni don't have language like the other species do, and the reapers' attempt to indoctrinate them produced a song the color of oily shadows, or a sour note. This is the same as saying someone would hear voices in their head. IMO, you guys are interpreting the oily shadows thing way too literally. In any event, those things look more like black pillars of smoke, not shadows.

Makrys wrote...

Bioware built this universe. They've exemplified amazing writing techniques all throughout the trilogy, with amazing ends to each game. So, why would they abandon that strategy now, when it all matters... at the end? They wouldn't. The EC was planned because the ending was rushed. There are tweets that were soon after deleted, from Bioware regarding this. Obviously they were later deleted because I'm sure they deemed them as revealing too much... and reveal they did. Both that A. They have been working on the EC for some time, and B. The dreamy state of the end was intended. If Bill Casey is hanging around, he's got a couple links for you.

Again, I don't think they believe there is anything wrong with the ending. I believe they think it's brilliant and they're shocked the rest of us don't realize the genius of it.

I disagree. But thank you for responding in a mostly respectful and civil fashion. That's how it should be. I respect your opinion.

Modifié par Makrys, 18 mai 2012 - 04:56 .

[The Cheat]

Makrys wrote...

The Cheat wrote...

LTKerr wrote...

Nimpe wrote...

Oh my god the last words of the game really are Downloadable Content. I thought that was a joke.

Shepard's last words are "I don't know". Guess Bioware were on fire the day they wrote both lines.

I see this being thrown around a lot and it's incorrect (well, at least if you have high enough EMS to have all three options available). Shepard's last statement in the game is "Maybe..." which he says after the Catalyst questions Shepard about his hesitation after Synthesis is explained (said hesitation being the "I...don't know" you're referring to).

'Maybe' isn't really any better though. lol

Actually I was wrong; shows how much I remember the ending. I had an auto-save sitting on my most recent game right after Harbinger's beam strikes, so I played through it twice (once for the Paragon options and once for Renegade). The ending conversation with the Catalyst is mostly the same, and if all 3 paths are available then Shepard's final words are, "And there will be peace?" in both variants.

Modifié par The Cheat, 18 mai 2012 - 04:53 .

[RavenEyry]

Makrys wrote...

You know whats funny? Priestly JUST locked a thread about the end DLC sticker. Check it out. He says "Enough shouting. The ending does not end with a DLC sticker."

Soooo, we haven't seen the ending then have we? Because... to us... that WAS the ending. Idk, just thinking out loud. EC needs to get here damnit. But they need to take their time too. Conflicting!

Yet another vague message implying ending DLC was planned all along or just an exact words situation considering the popup technically comes before the ending due to popping you back in time first?

[Tom Lehrer]

Icinix wrote...

BioWare has had some very good twists in their games in the past. KOTOR could lead to most of your squad turning on you and you being forced to kill them a short time before the final stages. DAO could see a similar thing occur and DA2 has one of your squad commmit an amazingly bad act that you could then forgive him or stab him for.

This ****** poor theory you're referring to is well in line with what BioWare has done in the past, is a deep seated theme within the game, brought up and hinted at repeatedly, that has enough weight to have merit and the best part about this theory, its' based on the idea its making the player believe they're not. Making the player feel something their avatar is feeling. Which is something that was brought up at several stages during the marketing of Mass Effect.

The key difference hear being that these twists are in game and the truth is handed to us on a sliver platter. IT needs 84 minute long videos just to make it sound halfway plausible. I dont even think half the guys who wrote these twists even work for BioWare anymore.

As for their marketing promises. Remember what was said about the Rachni? The temporary squadmates? The trial on Earth? The smaller squad for more in depth character development? Worst of all 'your choices matter'.

Modifié par Tom Lehrer, 18 mai 2012 - 04:54 .

[Makrys]

The Cheat wrote...

Makrys wrote...

The Cheat wrote...

LTKerr wrote...

Nimpe wrote...

Oh my god the last words of the game really are Downloadable Content. I thought that was a joke.

Shepard's last words are "I don't know". Guess Bioware were on fire the day they wrote both lines.

I see this being thrown around a lot and it's incorrect (well, at least if you have high enough EMS to have all three options available). Shepard's last statement in the game is "Maybe..." which he says after the Catalyst questions Shepard about his hesitation after Synthesis is explained (said hesitation being the "I...don't know" you're referring to).

'Maybe' isn't really any better though. lol

Actually I was wrong; shows how much I remember the ending. I had an auto-save sitting on my most recent game right after Harbinger's beam strikes, so I played through it twice (once for the Paragon options and once for Renegade). The ending conversation with the Catalyst is mostly the same, and if all 3 paths are available then Shepard's final words are, "And there will be peace?" in both variants.

Either way, I think we all can agree that Shep went meekly into the night.

Totally out of his/her character, whether you're a paragon or renegade. Doesn't matter. Shepard would never act like that.

[BatmanTurian]

jla0644 wrote...

Makrys wrote...

I still have yet to hear someone explain the 'oily shadows' in Shepard's dreams, as well as the various Reaper noises, AND whispers. Because every single one of those has been described either in the codex, or previous lore of the universe, to be direct examples of attempts to indoctrinate someone. All 3 are related to indoctrination. So its just a coincidence they were in Shepard's dreams? Ok. But look who's grasping at straws now. In fact, there is A LOT in which the Anti-IT crowd are trying to simply toss out the window with 'bad writing' or 'coincidences' when the IT crowd is backing up their findings and opinions with facts from the lore. So while nothing remains proven, there are considerable events that can be defined and explained with the IT which simply cannot be without it. Unless you just think Bioware took a dump on their best franchise at the last minute, set fire to it, and ran. If you believe that, then I can't help you.

I've actually been wanting to comment on the oily shadows for awhile. Seems to me you guys leave out a very important part of the phrase -- "Songs the color of oily shadows". The rachni queen never suggests that they saw actual oily shadows in their dreams and that's how they became indoctrinated. As I'm sure you're aware, the rachni don't have language like the other species do, and the reapers' attempt to indoctrinate them produced a song the color of oily shadows, or a sour note. This is the same as saying someone would hear voices in their head. IMO, you guys are interpreting the oily shadows thing way too literally. In any event, those things look more like black pillars of smoke, not shadows.

That's a point of contention we'll have to disagree on. Regardless of how the rachni see the world through song and such, oily shadows describes the tendrils around the screen in ME1 fighting Saren's husk and in ME3 when TIM does his song-and-dance about the " power they wield". No offense, but the simularities in Shepard's dreams are also very intriguing. To say that neither of those two in-game effects are similar to the description of " oily shadows" is to be in denial or have a very eccentric interpretation of the ME Lore.

Modifié par BatmanTurian, 18 mai 2012 - 04:57 .

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Makrys wrote...
Lol. Ok. Whatever. The ending as is, is whats disrespectful and insulting. If you knew a lick about the IT you would know it is not these things in the slightest.

The current endings sucks and should be fixed. I do not think anyone is denying this, but doing it by completely negating and punishing 2 out of the 3 end choices is not the way to do it.

ME2 punished you with Squadmate death and possibly even Shepards death for wrong choices and beeing ill prepared, why should ME3 be any different?

Because what you mentioned is already in ME3 in the EMS system? That is ME3's measurement of preformance and preparement? Lack the ems and you will might lose squadmates and be locked out of choices in the end. As it is, IT would be like having all Shepards who decided to save the Collector base fall to their death at the last jump.

Granted EMS was barely shown in the battle for Earth, but that just goes to show how ****** poor the entire last mission is in terms of quality.

Even if you did every side mission and devery upgrade in ME2 your squad was not completely sceure. A wrong choice would still lead to a persons death.

If you look at ME3 the same way you could have 8000 EMS, but a wrong decision at the end could still punish you.

Too bad we don't got choices lack that during Priority: Earth? The only choice we get is the end choice, and those should not be "Right or wrong" decisions. They should be major decisions where we decide how we want the future to be.

Again. Bioware did not have Shepard fall to his death for arbitary reasons just because he deciced to save the base.

And yet Shepard will not die in the Destroy ending as opposed to the other endings if you had enough EMS. How do you explain that?