Luc0s wrote... Here is another good example of what cutscenes in video-games can bring us in the near future:
Would make a great short film, but IMO this is a bit too long for a game opening. I would hope at least it is skippable.
I can enjoy watching this kind of linear movie once, but not multiple times. I simply don't watch movies or television programming, etc., over and over. Now that I've already seen this opening, if I ever end up playing this particular game I will be trying to press spacebar like mad in order to skip what I've already seen and attempt to start actually playing the game.
Luc0s wrote... The powerful emotions in that little cutscene are unmatched. That little scene almost made me cry. *sob* [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/crying.png[/smilie] Such powerful emotions could NEVER EVER be shown in traditional gameplay footage.
Why not? It's simply NPCs speaking to each other.
Games don't need to freeze the player in place when this happens.
Luc0s wrote... Here is another good example of what cutscenes in video-games can bring us in the near future:
Would make a great short film, but IMO this is a bit too long for a game opening. I would hope at least it is skippable.
I can enjoy watching this kind of linear movie once, but not multiple times. I simply don't watch movies or television programming, etc., over and over. Now that I've already seen this opening, if I ever end up playing this particular game I will be trying to press spacebar like mad in order to skip what I've already seen and attempt to start actually playing the game.
That scene is not an opening to a game. It's simply a tech demonstration from Quantic Dreams (makers of Heavy Rain) to show what they can do with their new technology. They vastly improved their face-animation techniques, as you can see. The lighting and textures are also extremely well done, considering that this is a PS3 tech demo, not a PC tech demo.
naughty99 wrote...
Luc0s wrote... The powerful emotions in that little cutscene are unmatched. That little scene almost made me cry. *sob* Such powerful emotions could NEVER EVER be shown in traditional gameplay footage.
Why not? It's simply NPCs speaking to each other.
Games don't need to freeze the player in place when this happens.
This is more, much more than just 2 people talking. About 90% of all the drama and emotions that you experience during that little scene about Kara is purely from the camera positions and pacing of the scene. It's the close-ups of her gentle smile, her beautiful eyes and her curious face that makes that scene so powerful. And then that close-up of her scared face when she started to cry. At that moment, I felt a manly tear in my eye.
If you only realized how important the camera positions and movements are in that particular scene. Without those close-ups, this scene wouldn't even have 1/10th the amount of emotional power as it has now.
So yes, you do need to "freeze the player in place" when this happens, or else 90% of the power and emotion of this scene will be lost.
Cutscenes are a crutch. Innovative and brilliant stories can be told in-game with little reliance on mini-movies, its just harder. (See Bioshock).
It depends on the genre and on the story that you're trying to tell in your game. In BioShock's case it worked beautifully without the need of any real cutscene at all. But I don't see how Mass Effect or The Witcher 2 could ever be a succes without cutscenes.
Luc0s wrote... Here is another good example of what cutscenes in video-games can bring us in the near future:
Would make a great short film, but IMO this is a bit too long for a game opening. I would hope at least it is skippable.
I can enjoy watching this kind of linear movie once, but not multiple times. I simply don't watch movies or television programming, etc., over and over. Now that I've already seen this opening, if I ever end up playing this particular game I will be trying to press spacebar like mad in order to skip what I've already seen and attempt to start actually playing the game.
That scene is not an opening to a game. It's simply a tech demonstration from Quantic Dreams (makers of Heavy Rain) to show what they can do with their new technology. They vastly improved their face-animation techniques, as you can see. The lighting and textures are also extremely well done, considering that this is a PS3 tech demo, not a PC tech demo.
I see, so this is not any sort of cut scene, but simply a short standalone CGI film. It's a good fit for this format and an interesting concept.
If this were a cut scene in a game, I could appreciate it, but as I mentioned, since I've already seen it I'd be pressing space bar like mad in order to skip it.
Luc0s wrote...
naughty99 wrote...
Luc0s wrote... The powerful emotions in that little cutscene are unmatched. That little scene almost made me cry. *sob* Such powerful emotions could NEVER EVER be shown in traditional gameplay footage.
Why not? It's simply NPCs speaking to each other.
Games don't need to freeze the player in place when this happens.
This is more, much more than just 2 people talking. About 90% of all the drama and emotions that you experience during that little scene about Kara is purely from the camera positions and pacing of the scene. It's the close-ups of her gentle smile, her beautiful eyes and her curious face that makes that scene so powerful. And then that close-up of her scared face when she started to cry. At that moment, I felt a manly tear in my eye.
If you only realized how important the camera positions and movements are in that particular scene. Without those close-ups, this scene wouldn't even have 1/10th the amount of emotional power as it has now.
So yes, you do need to "freeze the player in place" when this happens, or else 90% of the power and emotion of this scene will be lost.
I'm very familiar with framing and camera placement, as I've worked at a film studio for a number of years. When we are engaged emotionally with a film like this, there are many other elements at play.
Although the example you used is not a cut scene from a game, there are cut scenes which use similar editing and subjective framing techniques, such as extreme close-ups, circular tracking, dutch angle, etc. and clearly some of these choices require footage edited into a short movie.
However, the essence of a scene like this is simply two characters with conflicting goals, the newly created android and the QA tester who gives voice to the menacing factory machinery.
In any film, game, or even a book, if we are discussing what sort of narrative techniques result in emotional engagement with the viewer (or player), obviously, the most essential thing is the structure of the underlying story itself. A great story might have mixed results, depending upon the execution, but without strong dramatic conflict in the underlying story it will never have an emotional impact, regardless of the medium and regardless of the techniques used.
There are a lot of wonderful feature films, short films, TV programming, and cut scenes from games that may inspire emotional reactions. However, to suggest that the only way to emotionally engage a player in a videogame is by locking them down with a passive cut scene is absurd.
Do you not experience emotions in life? The last time you had a fight with your girlfriend, or experienced some intense emotional reaction, did you render control of your body to someone else and sit down passively to watch everything like a movie? Or were you able to retain control of your visual perspective and proximity to the other person?
Cinema has been around for more than 100 years and there is a great wealth of knowledge and expertise about its techniques for expression. Narrative 3D perspective games are still in their infancy by comparison and we still have much to learn.
Pre-rendered cut scenes require a lot of hard work and artistry to pull off and I certainly mean no disrespect to the devs who make them. However, it is a more elegant solution to find a way to express the narrative through the gameplay instead.
Perhaps you lose the specific planned sequence of camera angles, since the player is controlling the perspective and it is a long continuous shot, but there are so many other elements still in play: production design, lighting, animation, voice acting, music, sound effects, and you gain the most important and challenging element, player choice, which you lose when forcing someone to watch a passive cut scene.
Try to think instead of the entire game as a sort of cut scene that you can actively control.
Do you think cutscenes make video-games more immersive and emotional? Or do you think cutscenes take away from the immerison and emotional investment?
Cutscenes have nothing to do with playing games. Good graphics, art design, sound effects, music and so on can make playing games more enjoyable (while playing). Cutscenes are not bad but they are on the same level as watching a movie with the occasional mini-game interruption. Do those mini-games make it a better movie? I don't think so.
Stuff like ME's conversations (which look like cutscenes, more or less) are cool. They are part of a gameplay system (conversation / decision making). But watching cutscenes like a movie (with no interaction whatsoever) are pretty bad and should be kept to a minimum. Games are about gameplay, everything else is a nice bonus at best and therefore don't deserve too much attention.
Try to think instead of the entire game as a sort of cut scene that you can actively control.
Good post naughty99, very good post. I have some experience as a film maker too. I've studied Audiovisual-media for 4 years and I've worked at a film studio for 1 year. However, you certainly sound like you have a lot more experience than I do. I won't deny it, I'm but a mediocre film maker, which is why I stopped and started doing something else (game-design is what I study now).
To address your real-life fight with your girlfriend example: Yes, it is true that my life isn't a movie nor a cutscene. Yes, everything I see and do happens real-time, just like in a video-game without cutscenes. And yes, conflicts with my girlfriend are indeed emotionally engaging, But when I see 2 other people fight in real-life, I'm not really emotionally engaged in their conflict.
When I see 2 people fight in real-life, I feel like an outsider, not an insider. This would also be true for a video-game. If I saw 2 people fight in a video-game and I just stood there with my character watching it all happen, I wouldn't really feel emotionally engaged. A cutscene would be better in such a situation, because a cutscene can make you, the player/viewer, part of the fight between these 2 people. With the correct camera-angels and shots in a well-done cutscene, you'll feel as an insider in the conflict instead of an outsider and thus you'll feel more emotionally engaged in the conflict.
I hope you understand what I mean and I hope that what I said makes sense.
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