9089 réponses à ce sujet

[Ieldra]

About the "Reaper implants" mentioned:

"Nanomachines" is really a very broad category, and if you want changes on the cellular level, it's an obvious type of tool to use in SF universes. There are almost unlimited applications. If two different scenarios use nanomachines that says absolutely nothing about any similarity in those scenarios.

Synthesis can use nanomachines to make connections between organic and non-organic structures, Reaper implants can use them to indoctrinate. Saying it's the same is comparable to saying that a propeller-driven airplane is the same as a motorcycle because both use combustion engines to get moving.

[masster blaster]

Xilizhra wrote...

Exactly what relevance does that have to this thread?

Also, Hackett's good, but he's not omniscient.

He tells you to kill Reapers at all cost in ME3. Never did he say make peace with them, hell your whole team would say kill the Reapers, not make peace with them. Through our ME the Reapers have used people, and now you want to SAVE the Reapers all because your are afride of the Reapers. You can't kill them can you because your afrid of killing the Geth, and EDi, yet they are willing to give their lives to save everyone FROM the Reapers.

[masster blaster]

Lord Aesir wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Hackett, and his speeches are just amazing. Let me explain.


" The Reapers will show us no mercy. We must give them no quarter. They will terrorize our populations. we must stand fast in the face of that terror. They will advance until our last city falls, but we will fail. We will prevail. Each of us will be defined by our actions in the coming battle. Stand fast. Stand strong. Stand together. Hackett out."

One Hackett tells everyone, including Shepard/us that we can show them no mercy, and kill them all.

Two Hackett is remind Shepard, and the player, that the Reapers will harvest/kill every advanced race, and will not stop until the last city fails.

Three foreshadowing at the end, when Hackett says " Each of us will be defined by our actions in the coming battle.' The end is our actions/ Shepard's, and the endings we pick is defining us, and the Reapers.

Here is the video. www.youtube.com/watch

Why are you here?  <_<

Because have to remind people what Reapers are, and what they would do to get what they want.

[Xilizhra]

A. Hackett is not a god, and is operating on incomplete information: he assumes that the Crucible can only be used to destroy the Reapers.
B. The Reapers are mind-controlled and not actually responsible for their actions.
C. Didn't you tell me to leave your thread? Why are you here?

[Ieldra]

Of course nobody says to make peace with the Reapers. Everyone believes it's impossible. Shepard's the only one who comes to know better in the end.

Nice foreshadowing by Garrus btw:

"You're a peacemaker, Shepard. A rare thing these days. Now if you'll pacify the Reapers, we'll make you a saint".

[Xilizhra]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Of course nobody says to make peace with the Reapers. Everyone believes it's impossible. Shepard's the only one who comes to know better in the end.

Nice foreshadowing by Garrus btw:

"You're a peacemaker, Shepard. A rare thing these days. Now if you'll pacify the Reapers, we'll make you a saint".

Ah, yes... we need to quote that more often.
By the way, why do you think the Reapers exhibit... well, malevolent personalities? I suspect it's a side effect of the mind control, but both Sovereign and Harbinger seemed to exhibit some sort of pleasure in their work. Given the numerous inaccuracies of Sovereign's speech, in its case it may just have been trying to intimidate Shepard, but Harbinger talks far too often for it to just be that. Maybe it's a side effect of Harbinger being made from Leviathans?

[masster blaster]

Xilizhra wrote...

A. Hackett is not a god, and is operating on incomplete information: he assumes that the Crucible can only be used to destroy the Reapers.
B. The Reapers are mind-controlled and not actually responsible for their actions.
C. Didn't you tell me to leave your thread? Why are you here?

SO you would believe in the REAPER Leader, and not what your friends
tell you. I never said leave my thread. That was Spotless not me. Also
your erase everyone mind in Synthesis. Why isn't Javik killing Reapers,
why isn't everyone still fighting. You say Synthesis is the best, but
it's not. How many children will have to group with the Reapers, not knowing THEIR family's were harvested, killed, and turned into HUSK. You
say Synthesis is peaceful, and your right, but it's wrong.

Reapers lie, they cheat, and they are manipulative to the core.

[masster blaster]

www.youtube.com/watch
This is the scene where Shepard survives the pieces from Sovereign. And look at 7:33 keep watching and look at Shepard's left arm. Look where the hand is.

Now tell me Shepard does cover this same spot when Shepard is holding his/her side, where a gun shot is present.



www.youtube.com/watch

i want you to watch the Renegade ending for ME2 again and pay attention.



okay this is the Conversation Shepard, and Saren have at Virmire.

And it has Spanish sub titles, but English dub.

It's very interesting



Now watch this. This is from the final battle in ME1/last Conversation with Saren. Renegade

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HH4E_wpgtlA
Now this is the same scene, but with Paragon Shepard. .

From video 2 at the end of ME2 Shepard tells TIM that if " You start
being selfish, dreaming about power, and we will all pay the price."
Correct
me if I am wrong, but didn't TIM crave power, and lead him to believe
that he can Control the Reapers, and we did pay the price because he got
corrupted by the lust of power to Control the Reapers.

Now in
Video 3 Saren is telling Shepard that what he is doing is to save
everyone in the galaxy, by helping the Reapers, which Shepard can do at
the end of ME3 Synthesis.Now when Shepard ask do you expect the Reapers
will let us live, Saren tells Shepard " .....We Organics are driven by
emotion instead of logic, and we will fight even though we can not win,
but if we work with the Reapers. Make our self useful. Think how many
lives can be spared."
Synthesis, and Control spare everyone's lives.
Then
Shepard tells Saren" You are afraid Sovereign is Controlling you. You
are afraid he is Controlling your thoughts." well isn't that the same boat
we are in at the ending. We are afraid that the Catalyst is Contriving
us to pick his choices he likes, and we begin to question maybe the
Catalyst is right.
Then Saren tells Shepard that " I've studied the
affect of Indoctrination. The more Control Sovereign exerts, The less
capable the subject becomes......Sovereign needs me to find the Conduit.
my mind is still my own for now.The transformation between ally to servant can be unsettling. I will not let that happen to me"

One
the Catalyst needs Shepard to find a NEW Solution, and Shepard's mind
is still our own for now, until you pick Control, and Synthesis. And we
serve the Reapers in Control, and Synthesis because we are not their ally's, but we serve them in the end.

Then Shepard tells Saren "Sovereign is manipulating you, and you don"t even now it"

The Catalyst try's to manipulate both Shepard, and the player, into agreeing with his logic.

then
Saren says " NO Sovereign needs me. If I find the Conduit
I HAVE BEEN PROMISED TO
BE FREE FROM THE INEVITABLE.THIS IS MY ONLY HOPE"

The Catalyst promises that the cycle will end inSynthesis.

Then
after Shepard tells Saren that he is a Specter Saren tells Shepard " my
way is the ONLY WAY any of us will survive. I am forging an alliance
between us and the Reapers between ORGANICS AN MACHINES, and in doing so
I WILL SAVE more LIVES than ever existed."

Now didn't the
Catalyst say that this is the only way we can find peace. Where organics
and machines can live together, and he promises that Shepard will save everyone, by offering his choice.



in
Video 4 renegade Shepard tells Saren you could have fought. You could
have resisted.Instead you surrendered. You quit. Somkingotter took the
words right out of my mouth,


"I like how ME1 Renegade Shepard outlines the choices you have at the end of ME3

You could have fought: destroy
You could have resisted: control
Instead you surrendered: synthesis
You quit: refuse"

Modifié par masster blaster, 07 octobre 2012 - 09:51 .

[Xilizhra]

You ITers put way, way, way more stock in the minutiae of various quotes than Bioware itself does, I'm fairly sure.

[Heimdall]

masster blaster wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

A. Hackett is not a god, and is operating on incomplete information: he assumes that the Crucible can only be used to destroy the Reapers.
B. The Reapers are mind-controlled and not actually responsible for their actions.
C. Didn't you tell me to leave your thread? Why are you here?

SO you would believe in the REAPER Leader, and not what your friends
tell you. I never said leave my thread. That was Spotless not me. Also
your erase everyone mind in Synthesis. Why isn't Javik killing Reapers,
why isn't everyone still fighting. You say Synthesis is the best, but
it's not. How many children will have to group with the Reapers, not knowing THEIR family's were harvested, killed, and turned into HUSK. You
say Synthesis is peaceful, and your right, but it's wrong.

Reapers lie, they cheat, and they are manipulative to the core.

So, basically, you're saying that Hackett knows everything?

And you've pulled the idea that synthesis erases minds completely out of thin air.

Maybe Javik tried, we don't know, or maybe the synthesis provided him a new perspective

Right, I hope everyone will join with me in saying:

Hit the road Jack

[Heimdall]

You really think Bioware thinks that far ahead don't you? That's cute

[masster blaster]

Lord Aesir wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

A. Hackett is not a god, and is operating on incomplete information: he assumes that the Crucible can only be used to destroy the Reapers.
B. The Reapers are mind-controlled and not actually responsible for their actions.
C. Didn't you tell me to leave your thread? Why are you here?

SO you would believe in the REAPER Leader, and not what your friends
tell you. I never said leave my thread. That was Spotless not me. Also
your erase everyone mind in Synthesis. Why isn't Javik killing Reapers,
why isn't everyone still fighting. You say Synthesis is the best, but
it's not. How many children will have to group with the Reapers, not knowing THEIR family's were harvested, killed, and turned into HUSK. You
say Synthesis is peaceful, and your right, but it's wrong.

Reapers lie, they cheat, and they are manipulative to the core.

So, basically, you're saying that Hackett knows everything?

And you've pulled the idea that synthesis erases minds completely out of thin air.

Maybe Javik tried, we don't know, or maybe the synthesis provided him a new perspective

Right, I hope everyone will join with me in saying:

Hit the road Jack

Javik is doing nothing, the whole GALAXY is doing NOTHING. They forgot the Reapers were killing them, and harvesting their races. I am sure Javik would NEVER bow donw to the Reapers, or consider them his friends.

[masster blaster]

Lord Aesir wrote...

You really think Bioware thinks that far ahead don't you? That's cute

Then why are you here?

[His Name was HYR!!]

The Twilight God wrote...


Doesn't really matter what you think. It is.

It was taken from the collector base based on experiments they were doing on humans. Miranda's father says that dragon's teeth use nanites. Did you think reapers were sorcerers that magically changed people into husks. You the tubes and light in Paul Graysons body materialized out of thin air? Read the codex and listen to what's being said in-game.

Except Reaper nanites don't work the way you're pretending they do in Synthesis.

Modifié par HYR 2.0, 07 octobre 2012 - 09:52 .

[Heimdall]

masster blaster wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

A. Hackett is not a god, and is operating on incomplete information: he assumes that the Crucible can only be used to destroy the Reapers.
B. The Reapers are mind-controlled and not actually responsible for their actions.
C. Didn't you tell me to leave your thread? Why are you here?

SO you would believe in the REAPER Leader, and not what your friends
tell you. I never said leave my thread. That was Spotless not me. Also
your erase everyone mind in Synthesis. Why isn't Javik killing Reapers,
why isn't everyone still fighting. You say Synthesis is the best, but
it's not. How many children will have to group with the Reapers, not knowing THEIR family's were harvested, killed, and turned into HUSK. You
say Synthesis is peaceful, and your right, but it's wrong.

Reapers lie, they cheat, and they are manipulative to the core.

So, basically, you're saying that Hackett knows everything?

And you've pulled the idea that synthesis erases minds completely out of thin air.

Maybe Javik tried, we don't know, or maybe the synthesis provided him a new perspective

Right, I hope everyone will join with me in saying:

Hit the road Jack

Javik is doing nothing, the whole GALAXY is doing NOTHING. They forgot the Reapers were killing them, and harvesting their races. I am sure Javik would NEVER bow donw to the Reapers, or consider them his friends.

Maybe, but please stop talking in absolutes that you've clobbered together in your head.  It makes you look foolish.

As for what Javik would do, maybe he continued to fight and was killed.  Or maybe he came to realize that the death of each reaper annihilated all that remained of an entire lost species and that shook his world veiw.

We don't know.

You seem rather intent on acting like you do though.

[His Name was HYR!!]

masster blaster wrote...

Hackett, and his speeches are just amazing. Let me explain.


" The Reapers will show us no mercy. We must give them no quarter. They will terrorize our populations. we must stand fast in the face of that terror. They will advance until our last city falls, but we will fail. We will prevail. Each of us will be defined by our actions in the coming battle. Stand fast. Stand strong. Stand together. Hackett out."

One Hackett tells everyone, including Shepard/us that we can show them no mercy, and kill them all.

Two Hackett is remind Shepard, and the player, that the Reapers will harvest/kill every advanced race, and will not stop until the last city fails.

Three foreshadowing at the end, when Hackett says " Each of us will be defined by our actions in the coming battle.' The end is our actions/ Shepard's, and the endings we pick is defining us, and the Reapers.

Here is the video. www.youtube.com/watch

The ending reveals that all the conventional-wisdom about the Reapers is false.

Hackett was wrong. Anderson was wrong. Even Shepard was wrong.

And, "So, the Illusive Man was right afterall."

Destroy is not the only way. It's just one way.

Also, Hackett's speech was quite underwhelming.

[masster blaster]

Okay I was playing my Krogan home world mission again, and Eve's speech was just epic, and this is another reason why i think Destroy is the best with or with out IT, and the others ( well maybe not refuse) are plan wrong.


Eve " You can stay here and let old wounds fester as Krogan have always done.... or you can fight the enemy you were born to Destroy...... and win a new future for our children. I choose to fight. Who will join me?"


Shepard: " I will."

Wrex : "And so will I. Now hold your heads high like true Krogan! There is a Reaper that needs killing!"

Hell in Destroy we fight for a future for the children of the future, and maybe in refuse to, but in Destroy Shepard/ us choose to fight. Refuse is like a give up and hope for the best. Also hell Shepard agrees that " I WILL FIGHT!"

Also in the video, Eve tells Shepard/ the player that Eve: " We had dreams...a future to look forward to." Mordin talks, then Eve: " No we destroyed Tuchanka ourselves. Technology changed us. It made life to easy."

Dam everyone had dreams, including Shepard/ the player, that in Me3 after the war was over. We would have our Shepard/ the future of ME to look forward to. Also I like that Eve said " .... Technology changed us, It made life to easy.

Synthesis life is very easy.

Control life is easy.

Destroy life is hard.

Refuse life is very hard, but not sure on this ending.

Here is the video

Also what Eve says about staying here, is like refuese, so ya Destroy for the win.


www.youtube.com/watch

Garrus:"And Shepard. Forgive the insubordination, but this old friend has an order for you. Go out there and go give them hell. You were born to do this."

Eve "Or you can fight the enemy you were born to Destroy."

Modifié par masster blaster, 07 octobre 2012 - 09:54 .

[Heimdall]

masster blaster wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

You really think Bioware thinks that far ahead don't you? That's cute

Then why are you here?

Because you are adorably desperate to get this baseless point of yours across

[masster blaster]

Lord Aesir wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

You really think Bioware thinks that far ahead don't you? That's cute

Then why are you here?

Because you are adorably desperate to get this baseless point of yours across

Me too.

[His Name was HYR!!]

Oh, and if you want to talk about foreshadowing:

"Do not waver. Victory is never won without difficult choices." - Javik.

IT rejects this notion of choice entirely by dismissing all options other than Destroy.

[Heimdall]

masster blaster wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

You really think Bioware thinks that far ahead don't you? That's cute

Then why are you here?

Because you are adorably desperate to get this baseles point of your across

Me too.

You are here because you are adorably desperate to get this baseless point of yours across?  Happy that we agree

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 07 octobre 2012 - 09:58 .

[Heimdall]

masster blaster wrote...

Okay I was playing my Krogan home world mission again, and Eve's speech was just epic, and this is another reason why i think Destroy is the best with or with out IT, and the others ( well maybe not refuse) are plan wrong.


Eve " You can stay here and let old wounds fester as Krogan have always done.... or you can fight the enemy you were born to Destroy...... and win a new future for our children. I choose to fight. Who will join me?"


Shepard: " I will."

Wrex : "And so will I. Now hold your heads high like true Krogan! There is a Reaper that needs killing!"

Hell in Destroy we fight for a future for the children of the future, and maybe in refuse to, but in Destroy Shepard/ us choose to fight. Refuse is like a give up and hope for the best. Also hell Shepard agrees that " I WILL FIGHT!"

Also in the video, Eve tells Shepard/ the player that Eve: " We had dreams...a future to look forward to." Mordin talks, then Eve: " No we destroyed Tuchanka ourselves. Technology changed us. It made life to easy."

Dam everyone had dreams, including Shepard/ the player, that in Me3 after the war was over. We would have our Shepard/ the future of ME to look forward to. Also I like that Eve said " .... Technology changed us, It made life to easy.

Synthesis life is very easy.

Control life is easy.

Destroy life is hard.

Refuse life is very hard, but not sure on this ending.

Here is the video

Also what Eve says about staying here, is like refuese, so ya Destroy for the win.


www.youtube.com/watch

Garrus:"And Shepard. Forgive the insubordination, but this old friend has an order for you. Go out there and go give them hell. You were born to do this."

Eve "Or you can fight the enemy you were born to Destroy."

If you want to talk about Garrus quotes:

"You're a peacemaker, Shepard. A rare thing these days. Now if you'll pacify the Reapers, we'll make you a saint".

[masster blaster]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Oh, and if you want to talk about foreshadowing:

"Do not waver. Victory is never won without difficult choices." - Javik.

IT rejects this notion of choice entirely by dismissing all options other than Destroy.

Yet Destroy difficult chocies to, and can you kill EDI, and the GETH in Destroy now can you. Wait if IT is real, then they are alive not deade.

Modifié par masster blaster, 07 octobre 2012 - 10:00 .

[masster blaster]

Lord Aesir wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Okay I was playing my Krogan home world mission again, and Eve's speech was just epic, and this is another reason why i think Destroy is the best with or with out IT, and the others ( well maybe not refuse) are plan wrong.


Eve " You can stay here and let old wounds fester as Krogan have always done.... or you can fight the enemy you were born to Destroy...... and win a new future for our children. I choose to fight. Who will join me?"


Shepard: " I will."

Wrex : "And so will I. Now hold your heads high like true Krogan! There is a Reaper that needs killing!"

Hell in Destroy we fight for a future for the children of the future, and maybe in refuse to, but in Destroy Shepard/ us choose to fight. Refuse is like a give up and hope for the best. Also hell Shepard agrees that " I WILL FIGHT!"

Also in the video, Eve tells Shepard/ the player that Eve: " We had dreams...a future to look forward to." Mordin talks, then Eve: " No we destroyed Tuchanka ourselves. Technology changed us. It made life to easy."

Dam everyone had dreams, including Shepard/ the player, that in Me3 after the war was over. We would have our Shepard/ the future of ME to look forward to. Also I like that Eve said " .... Technology changed us, It made life to easy.

Synthesis life is very easy.

Control life is easy.

Destroy life is hard.

Refuse life is very hard, but not sure on this ending.

Here is the video

Also what Eve says about staying here, is like refuese, so ya Destroy for the win.


www.youtube.com/watch

Garrus:"And Shepard. Forgive the insubordination, but this old friend has an order for you. Go out there and go give them hell. You were born to do this."

Eve "Or you can fight the enemy you were born to Destroy."

If you want to talk about Garrus quotes:

"You're a peacemaker, Shepard. A rare thing these days. Now if you'll pacify the Reapers, we'll make you a saint".

You do realize he was joking, and to hell would he let Shepard pick Synthesis. I can pull more qoutes, Conversations, then you can.

[His Name was HYR!!]

masster blaster wrote...

Also in the video, Eve tells Shepard/ the player that Eve: " We had dreams...a future to look forward to." Mordin talks, then Eve: " No we destroyed Tuchanka ourselves. Technology changed us. It made life to easy."

Dam everyone had dreams, including Shepard/ the player, that in Me3 after the war was over. We would have our Shepard/ the future of ME to look forward to. Also I like that Eve said " .... Technology changed us, It made life to easy.

You missed the point entirely.

The problem was not the fact that the krogan had technology, it was the fact they had bad cultural attitudes. Bad attitudes gave way to them using technology in a bad way.

If you think technology is a terrible thing, why do you use a computer? Go live in a teepee if that's so much better.