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[DahliaLynn]

I always wanted a thread which discussed the more artistic side of creating cutscenes. So, I'm attempting to start one I'll start by exploring basic how-to's of actual design. 

Game cutscenes follow the same rules as film with respect to their design. Implementation in a game, i.e. how long should they be, where appropriate, and general usage is up to the designer to decide. I actually started a similar thread in my group, but figured I'd repost in the cutscene forum for those who aren't members.

The following basic rules and guidelines are important to keep in mind when you design your cutscene:

Cameras:

1. Try to follow the 180 degree rule unless you purposely want to disorient the viewer.
2. Make sure your shot composition follows the rule of thirds . For conversations, framing is of utmost importance
3. Use camera angles and perspectives to enhance the feeling you wish to convey to the viewer.

This video describes the 180 degree rule, lighting techniques, and shot decisions.

Another cool video showing the various types of shots used can be found here:

Animation:

Always make sure the character looks as realistic as possible, from facial animations to body. Some of the tougher issues with the CS editor, is making animations transition smoothly. For this I make a much use of the curve editor. If it doesn't look natural, I hide it using camera angles/edits and usually move to a closeup to suggest a particular movement, like giving and receiving an object  here:

So with these basics out of the way, next comes the criticism portion. I for one am sometimes in need of double checking my work, especially when unsure of a particular sequence.

In my own experience, I'm always asking myself how does it feel. If something doesn't feel right, I change it until it does. Usually I use my instinct to determine whether or not it does. This instinct could come from a lifetime of watching films, formal education, or just an inner feeling. Whatever it is, I tap into my stomach and imagination to find that right shot and sequence I'm looking for. In designing a scene I always keep in mind sound effects to be added, and even musical moments that would enhance the scene.

In one of my videos, I can say for one that I'm really unhappy with one of my shots.
In this example.

-This one shot travels in the wrong direction in my opinion. Instead of opening up the space to the audience on the right side, it closes it up by moving towards it. What I should have done, is moved the camera back and to the left in order to prepare an "opening" or "breathing room" for the next shot. I guess next time..the mod is done

If anyone has any cutscene work they would like to share and discuss it would be awesome. I know that sometimes I feel like I'm utterly stuck at a particular point, and really need another perspective in order to understand if what I attempted to convey was communicated succesfully, both by non cinematic viewers and pros alike. Sometimes I miss details others can point out to me, so outside help is invaluable. 

This is just my own perspective. If anyone would like to add it would be more than welcome, as I've always wanted to discuss this aspect of CS design

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 21 mai 2012 - 10:50 .

[DahliaLynn]

This is an excellent post and definitely these are issues that one needs to keep in mind when designing scenes Thank you for sharing! Any examples you share can only enhance the value of this thread for any who are curious about Cutscene design (Lurkers too )

Edit:

I'll share this article since finally there's an appropriate thread for it

5 Filmschool violations in vdeo game cutscenes

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 20 mai 2012 - 09:57 .

[DahliaLynn]

@Allacia I most certainly get stuck! Though it gets much easier with experience. I'll answer your question and hopefully address the stuck issue at the same time.

In my own experience I've found, just as any film pre-production process, is that one of the most important parts of designing a scene is deciding what it's going to look like way before you even touch the editor. Similar to storyboarding, I usually envision as many shots and circumstances as possible in my mind. After that, designing the actual scene becomes relatively easy.

Once I've spent enough time thinking how I want each shot to look, I start working on it in the editor. Sometimes, you can't really foresee what the actual scene is going to be like, or possible technical issues encountered therefore changing what you *thought* would look good, apparently doesn't. That's when you start improvising, and trust me, some of the best moments can come from improvisation.

Sometimes, it takes a while for the solution to come to you, and attempting different shots can get tiring, which is why I usually allow myself a bit of rest during the tough times. I guarantee, eventually, the answer will finally come to you, and this gets easier with experience.

Edit: apparently I've been ninja'd Very good post Luc0s!

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 20 mai 2012 - 10:53 .

[DahliaLynn]

Very nice work Luc0s. It's great that you are fully aware of the flaws as well, and next time your production will be that much better. Sometimes it's alright to break the 180 degree rule, especially during action sequences where the characters are in constant motion, or during high speed cuts. For the non action sequences it can get pretty confusing though. You show wonderful creativity with your angles, shot choices and edits Can't ever overstress the importance of good sound effects and music

I'm thinking about sharing a few techniques I've learned and acquired as far as camera assisted movements, illusions and tricks are concerned

[DahliaLynn]

@Allacia I don't normally do this, but just so that you understand how changes are very typical until you reach the final product I'm going to show you one of the first versions of the Fenris Machinima. You will notice that aside from the obvious lack of Facefx, the entire beginning bar sequence was replaced with a whole new sequence.

The old rough version

The final release

The problems were numerous, from Fenris wobbling his sword like it was some featherweight, to his running animations looking odd, to the fact that the screaming woman was hardly convincing. The music was changed, and I completely removed the whole soldier walking up the stairs shot. I also fixed the shot in his room where he walks around, in order to show the audience where he actually was. The first overhead shot made that room ambiguous, and though I personally knew where he was, that doesn't mean the audience does. I was told when he jumped out of the window it seemed like he jumped straight to the ground, ninja style. Fixed that as well.

There were many problems with the first version, and it was tough to note each issue, but after some rest, a fresh outlook, and some outside opinions, I finally got it to the point where I became relatively happy with it

Will quickly mention a little camera trick I picked up while working. during his jump, I bobbed the camera up and down to accentuate the impact.

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 20 mai 2012 - 11:50 .

[DahliaLynn]

Luc0s wrote...

@DahliaLynn:

My god, that's some very good stuff you got there! You certainly have talent! I'm impressed!

I do think however that some of your shots take too long, while others are too short. The time balance between each shot is a bit off from time to time. But overall it's extremely well done!

Thanks   It's very very hard to create a scene based on a story primarily written to be read, not viewed. Though David Gaider definitely did an excellent job at choreographing the fight

I'm going to guess that one long shot you're referring to is the scene where he hits the wall in his room? And perhaps the woman smelling the bread? Too fast would probably be the music assisted overhead LS pan during the end sequence? Specific examples would be great. I'm so used to the scene (and after so much technical effort put into it)  it's hard for me to detect any flaws I left behind.

I do know that I purposely extended a few shots because of the story itself.

Also, some shot decisions were made due to certain objects or facial expressions simply not looking good..so I cut to MS from CU for example

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 21 mai 2012 - 11:15 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

Something that often bothers me to no end in cutscenes:

- cutscenes that ignore fluff/lore and simply follow holywood conventions and Rule of Cool (example in ME - no kinetic barriers, weapons removal, things taking far too long, ignoring the enviroment and other actors, etc..)
- trying to force an emotional reaction at the expense of everything else (pacing, believability, etc..)

[Firky]

Good topic. I've been fervently wishing there was a style/structure topic like this for the conversation editor.

It's probably not precisely a cutscene, although it comes across as a "conversation cutscene" if that is a thing, in game, but I've been struggling just setting one stage for conversations and this has given me an idea. Thanks. I'm familiar with rule of 3s, from visual arts days. Maybe I'll go back and try again from that perspective.

This is what I have, currently. It's terrible.



Also. The 180 rule thing has given me pause. Currently I have two groups of people and the cameras just look at one group then look at the other, vaguelly from the middle. I wonder if the cameras should actually be located further away and not in the middle somehow, so that the whole area is put into some kind of context. How, I have no idea, but I'll experiment.

(And, something else that sucks is that the cameras are all at the same height, but then that changes where people are framed in the shot because of distance - but I don't want to start moving the cameras up and down because I'll totally make it worse. This cutscene business is really hard. Oh, and the placeholder facing backwards is a talking dead body with a camera straight down. And the person in front of the group of five is the protagonist, to whom people are often talking, which is why so many cameras are near her shoulder. The closer cameras need to be located where she is standing otherwise people are asking you questions and looking elsewhere. And then, if the long cameras aren't in line with the close cameras, you forget who is who. It's a massive mess.)

But thanks! I have new ideas from the OP, at least.

[DahliaLynn]

Cinematic guidelines apply to anything that uses a "camera" and conversation cinematics are very much a part of this topic
Honestly, that looks like 180 degree hell to figure out It's really tough to maintain that with so many people talking to one another from various positions. 3 people is tough enough

Is there one person who is talking to everyone and vice versa or are the conversations happening between multiple people?  In general, if everything is around the protagonist, you can treat the protagonist as the one person in a 3 person group from which the cinematics can be rooted. The important thing to think about is, can the viewer follow who is standing where in the shot space.

I just added this video to the OP that further describes the 180 degree rule which includes the poster's solution for shooting 3 people.

Another good tactic to follow in shot composition is giving the character "look room" or lead room, which is decided based on the direction the actor is looking.

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 21 mai 2012 - 09:14 .

[Firky]

That was a good video you just added.

But. The problem is that there are 5 major conversations and all of them involve 7+ people talking, including the protagonist, who isn't really shown very often (because there are only occasional instances of protagonist dialogue you don't choose yourself, as player.)

There are some conversations just between the protagonist and one other person. I've just left these nodes as default os camera, to indicate a private conversation, which is fine. (By which I mean good enough.)

Oh man. It's because everyone is talking together that I need "conversation cinematics" at all, or it would just be a procession of switching between 7 heads talking to each other. Pleh. Thanks for discussion, but I don't actually know how much more coherent I can make it with this one stage model.

[DahliaLynn]

How much of this conversation is dynamic? Are the same actors talking to each other in the same way in every circumstance? I would really have to see how it looks as it plays out. You can also consider repositioning the characters if you find things are getting out of hand, so that their place in space would be easier to comprehend. But in truth, only way to tell (at least for me) is to see the actual order of events and how they're shot.

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 21 mai 2012 - 10:45 .

[Firky]

It's just really free. Because it's an improvised play, the actors interject/speak over each other etc. Then the audience cheers or boos or interrupts etc. So it might be 4 lines from person 1, 1 line from person 2, 2 lines from the audience, another 6 lines from person 1, 1 line from person 3 etc.

I wont derail your topic.

Apart from the horrible camera work, my minimod is actually finished now. I've been vaguelly considering putting it in the projects and recruiting forum and inviting people to play it. This would be for the purpose that if anyone with more expertise in a couple of areas (cinematics definitely being one) wants to, I can send them a builder load and they can work some magic on the bits I suck at. Like, pass the mod. I've made the bottom layer, the next person can make a layer on top, if you know what I mean.

Maybe. (I'm not entirely sure I have the guts. It's an odd little module. More like an adventure or visual novel.) I'll think on it.

[DahliaLynn]

Serves me right for taking establishing shots for granted and as a given. That is absolutely correct.

Though, it does depend how the conversation pans out. If something happens in between actors within the groups for a period of time, you will want to move the 180 degree line between the those conversing during those moments. Since stage cameras do not move, this will have to be done subtley, with angles that slowly suggest the change through time. 

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 21 mai 2012 - 12:13 .

[DahliaLynn]

I had a feeling you were interested in the bedroom:) I don't feel the need to have an establishing shot of the bedroom. I provided that perspective during the time he was pacing. The room was not important, but rather, how he felt. He was angry, and annoyed, and had to make a decision. The focus was on him, not where he was, since it was already established that he walked upstairs within a tavern environment and closed a door.

What Fenris actually does is, pace, contemplate, get angry, think, make a decision, gather his things and escape.

You could be right in desiring an establishing shot for that moment, but his time in that room was so short, I didn't find it necessary, as it would make the scene even longer than needed. I preferred to cut straight to a low angle of his pacing, because I wanted the drama to kick right in. I could be wrong though

As to your question, I asked him, showed him my work in progress/plan, and he agreed . Sweet guy!

Edit: I think what you are missing, is probably what I cut out in the first version, which was him hearing and us seeing soldiers coming up the stairs. That would have given more balance to the moment where he hit the wall and leaned against it in contemplation. So that shot might look needlessly long. In order to fix that, I cut to a close up to suggest a change/decision being made, and give it more timing balance, but it might not have been enough.

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 21 mai 2012 - 12:44 .

[DahliaLynn]

Luc0s wrote...

@DahliaLynn:

But what is Fenris actually doing there in that bedroom? What is the purpose of going there? Does Fenris actually live there in that bedroom? If that's the case, then the scene should have actually been longer, allowing Fenris to settle in and us, the audience, to understand that this is supposed to be his safe haven, his home, his own "safe" spot. Maybe he could have dropped his sword in the corner as soon as he entered? Or perhaps he could have crashed on the bed, being exhausted and everything? Then after establishing that this bedroom is his (temporary) home, the action can begin.

What you say makes perfect sense for any full fledged film. Only his entrance to the room, is after he understands the people outside are acting differently that what he's used to. They are noticing him, watching him, pitying him, and he realizes that he is about to be caught and comes to terms with his previous plan to escape. No time to relax in that room. In the actual story, he just walks right to his room and leaves through the window. Visually, I decided to add a bit of contemplation time. Had the backstory of this scene been shown, i.e. the days that have gone by with him living there, then all of this would have made sense. but because this story was plucked out of a visual magic stone at a particular moment in his life, when the Warden was viewing that moment in Fenris's life about to turn dangerous, then there was no time for extensive introductions and backstory. I had to get straight to the point and to the moments as they occured. He is definitely "doing" in that room, only he isn't doing it in the sense of this being the first time you are viewing the scene. We are actually watching a particular experience, through that looking stone.

Once again, if this had been a full machinima having nothing to do with a mod, I likely would have had the time to show where he lived, and how the people used to act as he walked through the tavern normally so that this scene would be viewed as a contrast.

Have a look at the actual story in the description. You'll notice the adjustments I had to make to make this work visually, while paying as much attention to story detail as possible.

Consider this scene as part of a larger storytelling and gameplay experience. 

Edit: You aren't the first one to ask what that room was when I showed an older version to friends. I attempted to fix that with a shot showing the bed and setting behind him. If that was too subliminal, and not directly stating he was in that room, then I guess it didn't work. Again, I felt the drama of that first moment of pacing in the room was more important to me, than establishing the room. But this was definitely a conscious choice I had made for the reasons stated above. If it didn't work, then it didn't. If I were to change it, I would likely add a long shot from the bed during the first moment of his pacing. (I tried this, but simply didn't like it.)

Modifié par DahliaLynn, 21 mai 2012 - 03:17 .