702 réponses à ce sujet

[Taboo]

You'll have to remember that not everyone has time to go over every bit of information.

Some people don't obsess over everything.

[mauro2222]

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

 
Too much technologial progress=stop of biologiacl evolution.

And...? You really are lost.

Comparing Prothean huskification to technological advancement is... stupid.
And no, biological evolution can never be stopped.

*Points to the reapers.
*Point to the vorcha
Yes, it can.
You not getting the fact that evolution is caused by need. It does just happen. If your race is put is a state of knoe need, then evolution stops.

Jesus... is so hard to make sense of any of your posts.

The Vorcha? what the hell they have to do with this?

As long as the enviroment changes, evolution exists. And unless that we live in an empty universe with nothing, with us being all equal grey balls, evolution exists. And eviroment is not just "nature".

Vorcha are evolutionarily inert. It because they can sevive anything except for the vaccums of space They are an example of evolution stopping. 
The reaper say that they are the pinical of evolution....They are also an example of evolution stopping.
I can go on with sharks, red wood trees, sea animals, and plancton.
My point is that it can slow and stop.

Oh... wait wait. You are talking Mass Effect "in" universe evolution.
Fine, that true in Mass Effect universe, but not in reality.

And please explain how does this creatures ceased the evolutionary process, a mean to adapt.

[dreman9999]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Right, species select partneers that have qualities conducive  to survival. 

Breeding.

Evolution is about breeding, not survival: you can survive all you want, but without breeding it's an evolutionary irrelevance. Breeding is what evolution is carried by, and breeding occurs even with high levels of technology.

And who breeds...The one who can servive.....By defualt it's still about  servival of the fittest. They are to only ones left to breed.

[The Night Mammoth]

balance5050 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

 
Too much technologial progress=stop of biologiacl evolution.

Make your own argument, or detail what the video says. 

Relying on something else to argue against an opponent is annoying. 

He's just bringing up in game proof to back up his assertions, something that I.T. guys tend to do, provide evidence.

He's linking to a random video of Mordin without detailing how it's relevant to the discussion.

Make the argument whilst referring to the fact Mordin says it. 

Don't rely on it to argue for you. 

[dreman9999]

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

 
Too much technologial progress=stop of biologiacl evolution.

And...? You really are lost.

Comparing Prothean huskification to technological advancement is... stupid.
And no, biological evolution can never be stopped.

*Points to the reapers.
*Point to the vorcha
Yes, it can.
You not getting the fact that evolution is caused by need. It does just happen. If your race is put is a state of knoe need, then evolution stops.

Jesus... is so hard to make sense of any of your posts.

The Vorcha? what the hell they have to do with this?

As long as the enviroment changes, evolution exists. And unless that we live in an empty universe with nothing, with us being all equal grey balls, evolution exists. And eviroment is not just "nature".

Vorcha are evolutionarily inert. It because they can sevive anything except for the vaccums of space They are an example of evolution stopping. 
The reaper say that they are the pinical of evolution....They are also an example of evolution stopping.
I can go on with sharks, red wood trees, sea animals, and plancton.
My point is that it can slow and stop.

Oh... wait wait. You are talking Mass Effect "in" universe evolution.
Fine, that true in Mass Effect universe, but not in reality.

And please explain how does this creatures ceased the evolutionary process, a mean to adapt.

You do understand that Shark haven't evolved for eons, right?

[balance5050]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

 
Too much technologial progress=stop of biologiacl evolution.

Make your own argument, or detail what the video says. 

Relying on something else to argue against an opponent is annoying. 

He's just bringing up in game proof to back up his assertions, something that I.T. guys tend to do, provide evidence.

He's linking to a random video of Mordin without detailing how it's relevant to the discussion.

Make the argument whilst referring to the fact Mordin says it. 

Don't rely on it to argue for you. 

He wasn't, he wanted you to watch it so you can maybe draw your own conclusions and add to the convo.

[LucasShark]

Jawsomebob wrote...

Explain to me this?

In 3 games Bioware never even gets into the topic of "Shepard" being indoctornated. People around him go to the reaper side but the game never even goes in a direction where it even CONSIDERS shepard even ebing partially indoctrianated.

Why is that?

Why is shepard excluded from indoctronation. He isn't. Do you really think Bioware would end the series without Shepard and why he is able to resist indoctronation being addressed.

Liara, the doctor, joker, anderson...no one ever goes "hey shepard I have been thinking. I am suprised you are unable to be indoctronated. Are you that strong willed? That's amazing!"

The ending addresses this.

Ahem: BECAUSE, Shepard is the bloody player character.  Everything which happens to Shepard is something we as the player are prithy to.  See the partin Overlord when Shepard's perception is altered by the Overlord VI: THat is made plainly evident to us.  Furthermore: you can't force the player character in an RPG like Mass Effect to really do anything given they have told us choice is involved.  If we wanted to we could stay in the citadel back in ME1 shooting a rifle through the ring of the relay monument, and they couldn't force us to move on from there.  To do otherwise is to alter the type of game and story they have been telling all along.

Take KOTOR for an example: in the starwars universe, falling to the dark-side is often a one-way path, and takes massive mental fortitude to pull back from.  However: because of the type of game KOTOR is, even at the very end, there HAS to be a potential for that to be one of the player's choices.

[Taboo]

There is no pinnacle to evolution.

What the Catalyst suggests...

That's a weird one.

[Malditor]

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

 
Too much technologial progress=stop of biologiacl evolution.

And...? You really are lost.

Comparing Prothean huskification to technological advancement is... stupid.
And no, biological evolution can never be stopped.

*Points to the reapers.
*Point to the vorcha
Yes, it can.
You not getting the fact that evolution is caused by need. It does just happen. If your race is put is a state of knoe need, then evolution stops.

Jesus... is so hard to make sense of any of your posts.

The Vorcha? what the hell they have to do with this?

As long as the enviroment changes, evolution exists. And unless that we live in an empty universe with nothing, with us being all equal grey balls, evolution exists. And eviroment is not just "nature".

Vorcha are evolutionarily inert. It because they can sevive anything except for the vaccums of space They are an example of evolution stopping. 
The reaper say that they are the pinical of evolution....They are also an example of evolution stopping.
I can go on with sharks, red wood trees, sea animals, and plancton.
My point is that it can slow and stop.

Oh... wait wait. You are talking Mass Effect "in" universe evolution.
Fine, that true in Mass Effect universe, but not in reality.

And please explain how does this creatures ceased the evolutionary process, a mean to adapt.

You do understand that Shark haven't evolved for eons, right?

Sharks are still evolving, see the "jumping" great whites. They evolved a new tactic for hunting to survive......

[llbountyhunter]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...


grayson had nanites directly injected into his bloodstream. one would think they would have different effects.

There is no known or suggested form of Reaper implant that does NOT use nanites.

but actually if you recall graysons last moments, he had the reaper tech but not the reaper influence, even though he was still techically :indoctrinated"

You'll have to be more specific to what you're thinking of, because I'm not: I recall Grayson being increasingly manipulated by his own thoughts, and trapped in an ever shrinking corner of his own mind in the face of any Reaper attention.

which is what I have been saying: after the artifact was destroyid the decay stopped, and TIM has essentially been indoctrinated for decads.

Indoctrination is a binary cumulative, not a transitory progressive, affliction. You are either indoctrinated, or you are not. If you are indoctrinated, you will degrade. There is no such thing as being on pause.

If TIM was indoctrinated from the start, he would have been indoctrinated for decades. Indoctrination does not last for decades: the thrall will die before then.

Nor has TIM shown indicators of indoctrinated thought patterns or actions during that time, both in times when we could read his own thoughts (books) and in other media where his own actions are directly responsible for preventing Reaper successes.

saren did not have nanits untill he was implanted with them

when grason was dying he said he no longer felt the reaper presence, yet he still had the implants. 

[dreman9999]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

 
Too much technologial progress=stop of biologiacl evolution.

Make your own argument, or detail what the video says. 

Relying on something else to argue against an opponent is annoying. 

He's just bringing up in game proof to back up his assertions, something that I.T. guys tend to do, provide evidence.

He's linking to a random video of Mordin without detailing how it's relevant to the discussion.

Make the argument whilst referring to the fact Mordin says it. 

Don't rely on it to argue for you. 

But it is true....Evolution is based on needs. If you have no needs, no evolution happens. That's my point.

[mauro2222]

dreman9999 wrote...

You do understand that Shark haven't evolved for eons, right?

WTF?

No of course, they are the same individuals that the dinosaurs met.

[balance5050]

IT - the game after the game.

[mauro2222]

Taboo-XX wrote...

There is no pinnacle to evolution.

What the Catalyst suggests...

That's a weird one.

That's the problem. How do you achieve the pinnacle of evolution in a ever changing universe?

[balance5050]

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

You do understand that Shark haven't evolved for eons, right?

WTF?

No of course, they are the same individuals that the dinosaurs met.

So there you go, things only evolve if it's to adapt for survival.

[dreman9999]

Malditor wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

 
Too much technologial progress=stop of biologiacl evolution.

And...? You really are lost.

Comparing Prothean huskification to technological advancement is... stupid.
And no, biological evolution can never be stopped.

*Points to the reapers.
*Point to the vorcha
Yes, it can.
You not getting the fact that evolution is caused by need. It does just happen. If your race is put is a state of knoe need, then evolution stops.

Jesus... is so hard to make sense of any of your posts.

The Vorcha? what the hell they have to do with this?

As long as the enviroment changes, evolution exists. And unless that we live in an empty universe with nothing, with us being all equal grey balls, evolution exists. And eviroment is not just "nature".

Vorcha are evolutionarily inert. It because they can sevive anything except for the vaccums of space They are an example of evolution stopping. 
The reaper say that they are the pinical of evolution....They are also an example of evolution stopping.
I can go on with sharks, red wood trees, sea animals, and plancton.
My point is that it can slow and stop.

Oh... wait wait. You are talking Mass Effect "in" universe evolution.
Fine, that true in Mass Effect universe, but not in reality.

And please explain how does this creatures ceased the evolutionary process, a mean to adapt.

You do understand that Shark haven't evolved for eons, right?

Sharks are still evolving, see the "jumping" great whites. They evolved a new tactic for hunting to survive......

That's an evolution of thinking not of genectics....That like using how  a person way of thinking from child to adult is proof of evolution.

[Malditor]

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Right, species select partneers that have qualities conducive  to survival. 

Breeding.

Evolution is about breeding, not survival: you can survive all you want, but without breeding it's an evolutionary irrelevance. Breeding is what evolution is carried by, and breeding occurs even with high levels of technology.

And who breeds...The one who can servive.....By defualt it's still about  servival of the fittest. They are to only ones left to breed.

While that may be true of animals and primitive man, most of the time human breeding is about attractiveness, money, or compatiblity. That, however, doesn't stop us from evolving because we are still mixing dna and creating new life and possiblities with every conception/birth.

[dreman9999]

balance5050 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

You do understand that Shark haven't evolved for eons, right?

WTF?

No of course, they are the same individuals that the dinosaurs met.

So there you go, things only evolve if it's to adapt for survival.

That's my point.

[Taboo]

mauro2222 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

There is no pinnacle to evolution.

What the Catalyst suggests...

That's a weird one.

That's the problem. How do you achieve the pinnacle of evolution in a ever changing universe?

Bioware seems to think they have the answer.

I belive many years of peer review disagree with them.

Snythesis.........

[balance5050]

dreman9999 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

You do understand that Shark haven't evolved for eons, right?

WTF?

No of course, they are the same individuals that the dinosaurs met.

So there you go, things only evolve if it's to adapt for survival.

That's my point.

I know and it's sad that you have to teach how evolution works to these kids, no wonder they don't understand the I.T.

[SubAstris]

Quite frankly, having Shepard indoctrinated at the end isn't key to the story at all, it is BW's creative decision to put it in or not. The fact is that the ending does lead to Shepard being indoctrinated

[dreman9999]

Malditor wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Right, species select partneers that have qualities conducive  to survival. 

Breeding.

Evolution is about breeding, not survival: you can survive all you want, but without breeding it's an evolutionary irrelevance. Breeding is what evolution is carried by, and breeding occurs even with high levels of technology.

And who breeds...The one who can servive.....By defualt it's still about  servival of the fittest. They are to only ones left to breed.

While that may be true of animals and primitive man, most of the time human breeding is about attractiveness, money, or compatiblity. That, however, doesn't stop us from evolving because we are still mixing dna and creating new life and possiblities with every conception/birth.

That still goes to the level of the fittest...It's just what fittest is changed with use.The fittest get the best mates while the rest get whats left over.

[mauro2222]

dreman9999 wrote...

But it is true....Evolution is based on needs. If you have no needs, no evolution happens. That's my point.

Natural selection leads to the adaptation of species over time, but the
process does not involve effort, trying, or wanting. Natural selection
naturally results from genetic variation in a population and the fact
that some of those variants may be able to leave more offspring in the
next generation than other variants.

Modifié par mauro2222, 21 mai 2012 - 07:22 .

[balance5050]

SubAstris wrote...

Quite frankly, having Shepard indoctrinated at the end isn't key to the story at all, it is BW's creative decision to put it in or not. The fact is that the ending does lead to Shepard being indoctrinated

Then where does it lead to?

[Dean_the_Young]

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Right, species select partneers that have qualities conducive  to survival. 

Breeding.

Evolution is about breeding, not survival: you can survive all you want, but without breeding it's an evolutionary irrelevance. Breeding is what evolution is carried by, and breeding occurs even with high levels of technology.

And who breeds...The one who can servive.....By defualt it's still about  servival of the fittest. They are to only ones left to breed.

Son, the world isn't a warzone. We aren't even in a resource-scarcity scenario. We live in a world where even fifty years ago a cripple who couldn't walk could not only survive, but become the most powerful alpha-male in the world.

Technology has increasingly supplemented the physical requirements that used to be an evolutionary factor for humans. Can't run fast? We have bikes and cars. Can't fly? We invented planes. Don't have a fur coat? We'll give you clothes. Sick? We have medicine for it.


Evolution was once confused with survival of the fittest because we thought that only the fittest survived. Past a point, this simply isn't true: otherwise, we'd live in a world with super-beings. We don't. We live in a world where tools reduce the need for inherent biological strength, and evolution has more than a few alternatives as well. Numbers, for example: the most prolific species on Earth isn't the mighty human, but bugs that simply breed really, really fast. Teamwork is another: not simply in pack animals, but also in symbiosis: you can't digest everything you eat, but the bacteria in your stomach do it far better than you.