702 réponses à ce sujet

[mauro2222]

llbountyhunter wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

what your describing isnt evolution. its the opposite actually because it makes humans weaker.

Evolution making species stronger is a conceit from the days of social darwinism.

Evolution isn't the strengthening of a species: it's the development and change of a species over time. This isn't done by being stronger, better, or faster: it's done by specializing to the environment, whatever that environment is. This is why species can actually lose capabilities over time: flightless birds, hairless mammals, everything that used to live in the sea but now requires oxygen without hydrogen.

Evolution isn't a process of constant improvement of capability. Evolution is simply the reflection of what bred most: in high-attrition environments in which you must be fit in order to survive, that goes well with physical ability. In environments where it isn't, it doesn't.

changing to become more specialized to your environment IS becomeing better.  evolution has never been about becoming stronger faster or smarter just because. its been about becoming faster/smarter, only when iits needed to survive.

why are we even arguing?

I don't really know. Both are telling the same.

Better for the enviroment does not mean stronger or faster.
Fittest for the enviroment = better.

[EricHVela]

balance5050 wrote...

The mutations are but animals specifically chooose their mates for their redeeming qualities.

That seems to say that the basis of evolution is random trial and error rather than deliberate, intended trial and error.

Random is unpredictable. Given that one cannot predict the mutation, one cannot predict what will be tried and found to be wanting or successful. Only after the random event has happened can one attempt to predict what will be successful. That still leaves the following forumula:

If RND() > 0.5 then TRUE else FALSE

You cannot predict (with the exception of seeding the random value) when that statement is TRUE.

[Shepardtheshepard]

balance5050 wrote...

Shepardtheshepard wrote...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shark#Evolution

"The first sharks looked very different from modern sharks"

Nope. No evolution there


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crocodilia#Evolution_and_classification

"review of their fossil record in the last decade has shown that their snout morphology has been continuously changing throughout evolutionary history."

Nope. No evolution there either.

Evolution can happen anywhere, it just happens a lot slower for some.

That's what I and everyone else has been saying (as well as pointing out it's random)!
We're responding to you (or your friend, sorry if I made that mistake) basically claiming evolution can stop. As if it had a peek or what have you.

[The Night Mammoth]

balance5050 wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

You have officially lost the right to discuss evolution.

The mutations are but animals specifically chooose their mates for their redeeming qualities.

Sometimes. 

Although that has little to do with what actual traits are passed on within a species. 

[balance5050]

ReggarBlane wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

The mutations are but animals specifically chooose their mates for their redeeming qualities.

That seems to say that the basis of evolution is random trial and error rather than deliberate, intended trial and error.

Random is unpredictable. Given that one cannot predict the mutation, one cannot predict what will be tried and found to be wanting or successful. Only after the random event has happened can one attempt to predict what will be successful. That still leaves the following forumula:

If RND() > 0.5 then TRUE else FALSE

You cannot predict (with the exception of seeding the random value) when that statement is TRUE.

If tree have black bark, black moths will become dominant and the gene that says they will be black is prevalent, if the trees are white the moths will evolve to carry the white gene over time.

[llbountyhunter]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

You have officially lost the right to discuss evolution.

The mutations are but animals specifically chooose their mates for their redeeming qualities.

Sometimes. 

Although that has little to do with what actual traits are passed on within a species. 

ah ha! so there are diffrent ways to evolve...

[balance5050]

Shepardtheshepard wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Shepardtheshepard wrote...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shark#Evolution

"The first sharks looked very different from modern sharks"

Nope. No evolution there


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crocodilia#Evolution_and_classification

"review of their fossil record in the last decade has shown that their snout morphology has been continuously changing throughout evolutionary history."

Nope. No evolution there either.

Evolution can happen anywhere, it just happens a lot slower for some.

That's what I and everyone else has been saying (as well as pointing out it's random)!
We're responding to you (or your friend, sorry if I made that mistake) basically claiming evolution can stop. As if it had a peek or what have you.

Right, so the notion that synthesis is the pinnacle of evolutionary frame work is false.

[RyrineaNara]

I would've loved to have one of the squaddies becoming Indoctrinated it should've been the VS or Vega in my own opinion since were not sure they were around the drop site of Harby's collectors friends in ME2 game play on Horizon so in doing that it would've confirmed it little. You would've to watch your LI/friend shoot his/her brains out after you convinced them they were indoctrinated that would've been awesome.
Since Kaidan has Headaches all the time you wouldn't have been thinking Indoctrination since him getting a headache every now again

Since it would show us the cycle repeating itself time and again after the fact Javaki tells us he killed his own squad one by one after they became indoctrinated.

I tend to agree with the people that we should've been playing Javaki reapers cycle it sounding more interesting

[Dean_the_Young]

balance5050 wrote...

LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

It ended up as stripes, but it didn't start as stripes. What it would have started as was benign, nearly indistinguishable pigment changes that occured randomly and didn't get wiped out for other reasons.

Evolution is a long process. A lot of things that evolved to become useful didn't start that way, or anywhere close to it.

[The Night Mammoth]

llbountyhunter wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

You have officially lost the right to discuss evolution.

The mutations are but animals specifically chooose their mates for their redeeming qualities.

Sometimes. 

Although that has little to do with what actual traits are passed on within a species. 

ah ha! so there are diffrent ways to evolve...

Eh, yeah. 

It is random, after all. 

[Dean_the_Young]

llbountyhunter wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

what your describing isnt evolution. its the opposite actually because it makes humans weaker.

Evolution making species stronger is a conceit from the days of social darwinism.

Evolution isn't the strengthening of a species: it's the development and change of a species over time. This isn't done by being stronger, better, or faster: it's done by specializing to the environment, whatever that environment is. This is why species can actually lose capabilities over time: flightless birds, hairless mammals, everything that used to live in the sea but now requires oxygen without hydrogen.

Evolution isn't a process of constant improvement of capability. Evolution is simply the reflection of what bred most: in high-attrition environments in which you must be fit in order to survive, that goes well with physical ability. In environments where it isn't, it doesn't.

changing to become more specialized to your environment IS becomeing better.  evolution has never been about becoming stronger faster or smarter just because. its been about becoming faster/smarter, only when iits needed to survive.

why are we even arguing?

Because your previous disagreement staked a position that evolution can't lead to species becoming weaker over time as well.

[balance5050]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Eh, yeah. 

It is random, after all. 

Your sig is like saying "I chose to use these nuclear missles for good."

[balance5050]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

You have officially lost the right to discuss evolution.

The mutations are but animals specifically chooose their mates for their redeeming qualities.

Sometimes. 

Although that has little to do with what actual traits are passed on within a species. 

ah ha! so there are diffrent ways to evolve...

Eh, yeah. 

It is random, after all. 

Just the mutations. The species choose whether to carry that mutation into the future or not.

[Dean_the_Young]

balance5050 wrote...

Right, so the notion that synthesis is the pinnacle of evolutionary frame work is false.

False, because there's a paradigm shift of both composition and ideology. Synthesis-lifeforms don't need to be subject to the same random mutations of purely organic evolution.

[The Night Mammoth]

balance5050 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Eh, yeah. 

It is random, after all. 

Your sig is like saying "I chose to use these nuclear missles for good."

I don't intend on killing anyone, so no. 

[The Night Mammoth]

balance5050 wrote...

Just the mutations. The species choose whether to carry that mutation into the future or not.

The species doesn't choose anything. 

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 21 mai 2012 - 07:57 .

[balance5050]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

It ended up as stripes, but it didn't start as stripes. What it would have started as was benign, nearly indistinguishable pigment changes that occured randomly and didn't get wiped out for other reasons.

Evolution is a long process. A lot of things that evolved to become useful didn't start that way, or anywhere close to it.

Right, the bright yellow cats had a hard time hunting so they died first, over time the cats that had pigment in the right spots had an easier time hunting, got to breed more, and carried the stipe gene until we have what we see today.

[Shepardtheshepard]

balance5050 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

You have officially lost the right to discuss evolution.

The mutations are but animals specifically chooose their mates for their redeeming qualities.

Sometimes. 

Although that has little to do with what actual traits are passed on within a species. 

ah ha! so there are diffrent ways to evolve...

Eh, yeah. 

It is random, after all. 

Just the mutations. The species choose whether to carry that mutation into the future or not.

Which is why no man has a small willy or hairy back anymore.     

[balance5050]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Just the mutations. The species choose whether to carry that mutation into the future or not.

The species doesn't choose anything. 

Well, beneficial mutations were carried on because of selective breeding.

[Dean_the_Young]

balance5050 wrote...

Just the mutations. The species choose whether to carry that mutation into the future or not.

Don't antromorphize collectives. The only species in history that has made efforts to choose have been various eugenics groups of Humans, and they didn't even understand what genetic evolution actually entailed and affected.

Evolution is so incrimental that even we don't recognize it as its going on, and we're the only species with the minds to understand evolution as an abstract in the first place.

[balance5050]

Shepardtheshepard wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

You have officially lost the right to discuss evolution.

The mutations are but animals specifically chooose their mates for their redeeming qualities.

Sometimes. 

Although that has little to do with what actual traits are passed on within a species. 

ah ha! so there are diffrent ways to evolve...

Eh, yeah. 

It is random, after all. 

Just the mutations. The species choose whether to carry that mutation into the future or not.

Which is why no man has a small willy or hairy back anymore.     

Were talking animals, humans are a strange case because we no longer have to fight the elements, and we just let anyone with Neandertal genes keep going in our society.

Also, speak for your self on the tiny willy thing;)

[Dean_the_Young]

balance5050 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

LOL, evolution is not random it is only the preserverance of succesful genes. Tigers developed stipes over time because it made them better hunters, etc.

It ended up as stripes, but it didn't start as stripes. What it would have started as was benign, nearly indistinguishable pigment changes that occured randomly and didn't get wiped out for other reasons.

Evolution is a long process. A lot of things that evolved to become useful didn't start that way, or anywhere close to it.

Right, the bright yellow cats had a hard time hunting so they died first, over time the cats that had pigment in the right spots had an easier time hunting, got to breed more, and carried the stipe gene until we have what we see today.

The mutations to the DNA that led to any pigment changes, let alone where the pigment changes were, was a random process. There was no deliberate process that brought forth or initiated the development of tiger stripes: it was a random mutation that didn't even look like tiger stripes when it started.

[balance5050]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Just the mutations. The species choose whether to carry that mutation into the future or not.

Don't antromorphize collectives. The only species in history that has made efforts to choose have been various eugenics groups of Humans, and they didn't even understand what genetic evolution actually entailed and affected.

Evolution is so incrimental that even we don't recognize it as its going on, and we're the only species with the minds to understand evolution as an abstract in the first place.

It's pretty much given that beneficial traits will be carried on whether the species "choose" or not.

[malakim2099]

Jawsomebob wrote...

Explain to me this?

In 3 games Bioware never even gets into the topic of "Shepard" being indoctornated. People around him go to the reaper side but the game never even goes in a direction where it even CONSIDERS shepard even ebing partially indoctrianated.

Why is that?

Why is shepard excluded from indoctronation. He isn't. Do you really think Bioware would end the series without Shepard and why he is able to resist indoctronation being addressed.

Liara, the doctor, joker, anderson...no one ever goes "hey shepard I have been thinking. I am suprised you are unable to be indoctronated. Are you that strong willed? That's amazing!"

The ending addresses this.

I'd just like them to stop juvenile vitriol. You'd think they owned stock in EA or something.

[The Night Mammoth]

balance5050 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Just the mutations. The species choose whether to carry that mutation into the future or not.

The species doesn't choose anything. 

Well, beneficial mutations were carried on because of selective breeding.

Ha, no. 

Selective breeding is different, moving into genetic engineering, which is far from natural.

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 21 mai 2012 - 08:06 .