Ok, we have NO idea how indoctrination works on a corpse (not a husk, obviously). Do the nanites go dormant? Clearly not enough of them in the body to animate it.
My one beef with Anti-I.T people
Débuté par
Jawsomebob
, mai 20 2012 08:54
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#677
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 04:59
The Night Mammoth
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dreman9999 wrote...
You clearly going in circle. Saying it's not cannon even if it always happens no matter what makes no sense.
That like say ME's main character is Shepardis non-cannon. Or Shepard becaoming a spectre is non-cannon.
Erm, no, I'm saying nothing is 'canon', not that certain things aren't but others are, which is the distinction.
#678
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:00
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llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
Well, it would be if certain points of the story were valued over others.
It's just that every eventuality, every variable, every different outcome this game allows is no better than any other. There's no one playthrough or story that prevails over others.
Hence, 'canon' by its conventional meaning doesn't apply.
but some points are favored.. the shepard in the books/comics,
made anderson counsler
kept the collector base
destroyed relay in arrival
And the games allow for a completely different story on those terms, so the books are just like an alternate way of things, no favoured over something else.
#679
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:01
llbountyhunter
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Hadeedak wrote...
Ok, we have NO idea how indoctrination works on a corpse (not a husk, obviously). Do the nanites go dormant? Clearly not enough of them in the body to animate it.
i dont think it works on a corpse. or it does, the reapers never do it.
#680
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:02
Humanoid_Typhoon
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My one beef with anti-IT people is that they want to think that the IT makes any less sense than the current ending.
#681
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:03
llbountyhunter
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The Night Mammoth wrote...
llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
Well, it would be if certain points of the story were valued over others.
It's just that every eventuality, every variable, every different outcome this game allows is no better than any other. There's no one playthrough or story that prevails over others.
Hence, 'canon' by its conventional meaning doesn't apply.
but some points are favored.. the shepard in the books/comics,
made anderson counsler
kept the collector base
destroyed relay in arrival
And the games allow for a completely different story on those terms, so the books are just like an alternate way of things, no favoured over something else.
no, because the books dont cover shepard, they cover anderson, grayson, and TIM.... they add more detail. there NEEDED to get the full story. and in the the full story, there is a ideal shepard.
Modifié par llbountyhunter, 22 mai 2012 - 05:05 .
#682
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:04
dreman9999
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How would it make less sense? It's far more logic then the endings we got.Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
My one beef with anti-IT people is that they want to think that the IT makes any less sense than the current ending.
#683
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:04
Hadeedak
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Yeah, I personally wouldn't be using ANY of Shepard's ME1 contact. Dying seems more like a do-over for Reaper infection.
#684
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:05
dreman9999
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...Different story? The games don't nagate or change anything that happen in the books. How can you say the games change the results of the books?The Night Mammoth wrote...
llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
Well, it would be if certain points of the story were valued over others.
It's just that every eventuality, every variable, every different outcome this game allows is no better than any other. There's no one playthrough or story that prevails over others.
Hence, 'canon' by its conventional meaning doesn't apply.
but some points are favored.. the shepard in the books/comics,
made anderson counsler
kept the collector base
destroyed relay in arrival
And the games allow for a completely different story on those terms, so the books are just like an alternate way of things, no favoured over something else.
#685
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:06
The Night Mammoth
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llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
Well, it would be if certain points of the story were valued over others.
It's just that every eventuality, every variable, every different outcome this game allows is no better than any other. There's no one playthrough or story that prevails over others.
Hence, 'canon' by its conventional meaning doesn't apply.
but some points are favored.. the shepard in the books/comics,
made anderson counsler
kept the collector base
destroyed relay in arrival
And the games allow for a completely different story on those terms, so the books are just like an alternate way of things, no favoured over something else.
no, because the books dont cover shepard, they cover anderson, grayson, and TIM.... they add more detail. there NEEDED to get the full story. and the the full story, there is a ideal shepard.
And a suitable story could be written with the opposite choices included. One where Anderson isn't councillor, the Collector Base was blown up, and the Relay destroyed by marins instead of Shepard.
The writer chose these variables, but there was nothing stopping him/her from choosing the alternatives.
#686
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:07
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dreman9999 wrote...
...Different story? The games don't nagate or change anything that happen in the books. How can you say the games change the results of the books?The Night Mammoth wrote...
llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
Well, it would be if certain points of the story were valued over others.
It's just that every eventuality, every variable, every different outcome this game allows is no better than any other. There's no one playthrough or story that prevails over others.
Hence, 'canon' by its conventional meaning doesn't apply.
but some points are favored.. the shepard in the books/comics,
made anderson counsler
kept the collector base
destroyed relay in arrival
And the games allow for a completely different story on those terms, so the books are just like an alternate way of things, no favoured over something else.
The game presents a different story. Anderson no councillor, the Collector base destroyed, Arrival taken care of by the Alliance etc.....
#687
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:08
Hadeedak
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Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
My one beef with anti-IT people is that they want to think that the IT makes any less sense than the current ending.
My one beef with IT people is that a cigar is never just a cigar with them...
#688
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:08
dreman9999
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No , it does not...Look at Saren's body or any husk.Hadeedak wrote...
Yeah, I personally wouldn't be using ANY of Shepard's ME1 contact. Dying seems more like a do-over for Reaper infection.
#689
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:08
llbountyhunter
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Hadeedak wrote...
Yeah, I personally wouldn't be using ANY of Shepard's ME1 contact. Dying seems more like a do-over for Reaper infection.
I thought you were asking if the reapers try to indoctrinate corpses... they dont.... however if they indoctrinate a living person who dies, and then comes back, I'd assume the effects are still there.
#690
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:09
llbountyhunter
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Hadeedak wrote...
Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
My one beef with anti-IT people is that they want to think that the IT makes any less sense than the current ending.
My one beef with IT people is that a cigar is never just a cigar with them...
or that a cigar is always a cigar.... there has to be some middle ground.
#691
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:09
Humanoid_Typhoon
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Well when one cigar smells like ass and the other smells like fish.Hadeedak wrote...
Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
My one beef with anti-IT people is that they want to think that the IT makes any less sense than the current ending.
My one beef with IT people is that a cigar is never just a cigar with them...
#692
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:09
dreman9999
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My one beef ih anti-iter's is how they don't see how maniulitive reapers are and the fact that they wantyou to think a cigar is just a cigar.Hadeedak wrote...
Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
My one beef with anti-IT people is that they want to think that the IT makes any less sense than the current ending.
My one beef with IT people is that a cigar is never just a cigar with them...
#693
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:13
Hadeedak
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Knee-jerk reaction: If I can smoke it, it's a cigar. I don't care what you want to believe it means, because it's a damn good smoke.
Well, it would be if I smoked cigars.
Well, it would be if I smoked cigars.
#694
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:14
llbountyhunter
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The Night Mammoth wrote...
llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
Well, it would be if certain points of the story were valued over others.
It's just that every eventuality, every variable, every different outcome this game allows is no better than any other. There's no one playthrough or story that prevails over others.
Hence, 'canon' by its conventional meaning doesn't apply.
but some points are favored.. the shepard in the books/comics,
made anderson counsler
kept the collector base
destroyed relay in arrival
And the games allow for a completely different story on those terms, so the books are just like an alternate way of things, no favoured over something else.
no, because the books dont cover shepard, they cover anderson, grayson, and TIM.... they add more detail. there NEEDED to get the full story. and the the full story, there is a ideal shepard.
And a suitable story could be written with the opposite choices included. One where Anderson isn't councillor, the Collector Base was blown up, and the Relay destroyed by marins instead of Shepard.
The writer chose these variables, but there was nothing stopping him/her from choosing the alternatives.
was there? maybe there was.......
#695
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:16
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llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
And a suitable story could be written with the opposite choices included. One where Anderson isn't councillor, the Collector Base was blown up, and the Relay destroyed by marins instead of Shepard.
The writer chose these variables, but there was nothing stopping him/her from choosing the alternatives.
was there? maybe there was.......
Such as...........................?
BioWare? Deception shows they give a pretty large amount of freedom to their authors.
#696
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:16
llbountyhunter
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I just dont see how anyone can think shepard survives this in a literal interpetation.
#697
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:16
llbountyhunter
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The Night Mammoth wrote...
llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
And a suitable story could be written with the opposite choices included. One where Anderson isn't councillor, the Collector Base was blown up, and the Relay destroyed by marins instead of Shepard.
The writer chose these variables, but there was nothing stopping him/her from choosing the alternatives.
was there? maybe there was.......
Such as...........................?
BioWare? Deception shows they give a pretty large amount of freedom to their authors.
Im just saying that we realy dont know... it could be either way.
#698
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:20
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llbountyhunter wrote...
I just dont see how anyone can think shepard survives this in a literal interpetation.
It looks like he's on Earth at that point.
I don't subscribe to the Idoctrination Theory, but the evidence for this specific part is quite convincing.
#699
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:21
The Night Mammoth
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llbountyhunter wrote...
The Night Mammoth wrote...
Such as...........................?
BioWare? Deception shows they give a pretty large amount of freedom to their authors.
Im just saying that we realy dont know... it could be either way.
Maybe, but given Deception and the novels in general, the comics especially, BioWare are quite liberal. I doubt they or anyone else told the writers what to choose.
#700
Posté 22 mai 2012 - 05:33
Aiyie
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The Night Mammoth wrote...
Aiyie wrote...
how so? i always thought of canon as being fixed events that the authors decided happened, irregardless of what the reader/player does.
sort of like how, in Kotor, even if you make your Revan a woman and go dark side... its canon that he was a dude and went back to the light side in the end... because the writers wanted it to be that way.
edit: this also happens to be why i never really had a problem with the lack of choice in ME3... to me it was never my story, it was someone's else's story that i was being allowed to view from different angles.
Well, it would be if certain points of the story were valued over others.
It's just that every eventuality, every variable, every different outcome this game allows is no better than any other. There's no one playthrough or story that prevails over others.
Hence, 'canon' by its conventional meaning doesn't apply.
i would say that the authors, the actual writers... which we are not, are the determining factor of what is canon and what is not.
in-game examples being Sovereign's destruction at the end of ME1, Shepard death at the beginning of ME2 and the quarian-geth war in ME3.
nothing the player does can alter the fact that those events take place, hence they would be canon in the conventional sense.
