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[robertthebard]

sjpelkessjpeler wrote...

Yup, I know that the war is the story. This thread is about why Hawke should be the main character in DA3.

And I did not write 'prevent' but 'possibility to prevent'. If Hawke could have really make a difference then the character could be the MC in the next installment for me. But Hawke was the MC just as a prelude to the next installment imho to give the story more flow; to be an arc of some kind I think. That's why Hawke will not be the next MC.

This is what I believe they intend to do with it as well.  I find it sad that people want to limit DA to just Ferelden, or Kirkwall though.  To me, that's like limiting Baldur's Gate to Candlekeep.  You just barely start to figure out what the story's about, and it's over.  I don't understand the obssession with "I have to play the same character, or the game is bad".

[nubbers666]

 yes and no 
it really depends on where the story is heading 
if it was  just about one person then yes having a single mc would be a crucial part of the story

but from what i can see  they are having it show storys over the years  that eventualy lead up to a bigger event 
somthing more than just one person 

but at the same time with how da2 ends   it makes me think hawk will be playing some part in da3 or one of the later dao 

[robertthebard]

katie916 wrote...

 yes and no 
it really depends on where the story is heading 
if it was  just about one person then yes having a single mc would be a crucial part of the story

but from what i can see  they are having it show storys over the years  that eventualy lead up to a bigger event 
somthing more than just one person 

but at the same time with how da2 ends   it makes me think hawk will be playing some part in da3 or one of the later dao 

I'm sure you could do a dev tracker search and find more than a few posts by them stating that this isn't about one character, but about Thedas.  Baldur's Gate was about one character, not having the same character would indeed be nonsensical, but since this is a story about a whole new world, having one character is more limiting than neccessary.  So my responses are gauged to the topic title, and it insists it does need Hawke.  It doesn't, and shouldn't.  It would cut down what can be done later, since you'd end up either with stupidly powerful characters, which means stupidly powerful encounters, or, and this is done sometimes as well, amnesia, and you have to start over at level 1, completing negating the benefits of having a continuation of the MC.

[Pistolized]

I've thought about this before.  The Dragon Age franchise fundamental structure is not like Mass Effect.  Mass Effect is the story of one-person (Shepard), and it was designed that way.  Dragon Age has the potential and aim (whether from the start or as of now) to cover an entire "universe."  

 ME1-3 is more like Harry Potter1-X.  It follows one person with lots of supporting characters.  Has a beginning and an end.   

Consider the scope of the "Dungeons and Dragons" franchise, or Star Wars Expanded Universe, or Marvel Comics, or DC.
Warden is to Dragon Age  as  Drizzt is to DnD  -->> Just one person - "insignificant" in the grand scheme of things
DA -> Hawke/Warden/Orlesian/muliple-future-PC's  /  Star Wars -> Revan/ Luke/ Starkiller/ Exile/Han/all the others
Marvel == X-Men / Spider Man / Iron Man / Hulk / so many others
DC == Superman / Batman / Flash / Wonder Woman / so many others
All have different stories but they all fill in the continuity of a universe.  And let me be clear about what a universe is; it is the amalgamation of many different stories, which in inherently grander than a single story.


In summation, although I could go on, people are focusing too closely and can't see the big picture that could be.  Each game should be viewed as just a piece of the puzzle, not the puzzle itself.

Modifié par Pistolized, 27 mai 2012 - 07:45 .

[FlyinElk212]

Pistolized wrote...

I've thought about this before.  The Dragon Age franchise fundamental structure is not like Mass Effect.  Mass Effect is the story of one-person (Shepard), and it was designed that way.  Dragon Age has the potential and aim (whether from the start or as of now) to cover an entire "universe." 

This is a good point that I see a couple of people bringing up, in that Dragon Age isn't so much meant to be a continual storyline as it is a series of storylines that take place within the same universe. With that in mind, yes, I don't have a problem with a changing protagonist.

However, from what I've seen and the foreshadowing placed onto the story from both origins and DA2, I'm lead to believe that the continual storyline is there and heading in a big, big direction. It would be silly to not focus on the conflict b/w the mages and templars in DA3, as it would be silly not to focus on Flemeth and her underlying plan. Then throw in the potential for a return of the darkspawn, Morrigan's plan, and the Seeker's attempts to track down the Warden and Hawke and it sounds to me like you've got a pretty continual storyline...

...that I believe would benefit greatly from having 1 consistent protagonist to relate to. Wouldn't be as satisfying to end the Templar-Mage conflict that Hawke personally saw begin as anyone other than himself, right?

Modifié par FlyinElk212, 28 mai 2012 - 03:49 .

[robertthebard]

FlyinElk212 wrote...

Pistolized wrote...

I've thought about this before.  The Dragon Age franchise fundamental structure is not like Mass Effect.  Mass Effect is the story of one-person (Shepard), and it was designed that way.  Dragon Age has the potential and aim (whether from the start or as of now) to cover an entire "universe." 

This is a good point that I see a couple of people bringing up, in that Dragon Age isn't so much meant to be a continual storyline as it is a series of storylines that take place within the same universe. With that in mind, yes, I don't have a problem with a changing protagonist.

However, from what I've seen and the foreshadowing placed onto the story from both origins and DA2, I'm lead to believe that the continual storyline is there and heading in a big, big direction. It would be silly to not focus on the conflict b/w the mages and templars in DA3, as it would be silly not to focus on Flemeth and her underlying plan. Then throw in the potential for a return of the darkspawn, Morrigan's plan, and the Seeker's attempts to track down the Warden and Hawke and it sounds to me like you've got a pretty continual storyline...

...that I believe would benefit greatly from having 1 consistent protagonist to relate to. Wouldn't be as satisfying to end the Templar-Mage conflict that Hawke personally saw begin as anyone other than himself, right?

I don't know about you, but by the time the game was done, I was sick of mages and Templars.  So it wouldn't be surprising to me that Hawke would just as soon be lost at sea as dealing with the Seekers/Chantry/Templars/Mages/Flemeth/Morrigan et al.  It would just be "Not another person looking for help" kinda thing.

[standardpack]

I can see the points being presented, but honestly I think it would be better to start with another MC since that is the direction Dragon Age seems to be taking. Not everyone liked Hawk and not everyone liked the Warden and the reverse holds true. Either way DA3 is going to have some dissapointed fans in this case it's up to the devs.

On a personal note I don't give 2 pounds of monkey **** on what happens to Hawk. So I would be a fan who wouldn't buy DA3 if Hawk was in fact the MC.

Modifié par standardpack, 28 mai 2012 - 07:16 .

[AkiKishi]

I really hope it goes in another direction entirely. Mage/Templars sick of the lot of them. DA2 did not present it as well as the Witcher2, shades of grey and all that stuff. More like both were totally fruitloop.

Bioware should probably stick to nice clear boundries of good and evil, seems to be what they are best at.

Modifié par BobSmith101, 28 mai 2012 - 07:57 .

[robertthebard]

sjpelkessjpeler wrote...

robertthebard wrote...
I don't know about you, but by the time the game was done, I was sick of mages and Templars.  So it wouldn't be surprising to me that Hawke would just as soon be lost at sea as dealing with the Seekers/Chantry/Templars/Mages/Flemeth/Morrigan et al.  It would just be "Not another person looking for help" kinda thing.

Think that the beginning of the story will revolve around the mage/templar war but that it will change into something else.

With this I mean the kind of setup that is used in DA2. It starts with the Qunari problem while the mage/templar problem lingers and at the beginning of act 3 when they are defeated the mage/temlar conflict kicks in.

The mage/templar conflict will bring the new MC together with (most of) his companions to have a common goal to start with imo. The story will evolve from there.

Trying to think that far ahead gives me a headache.  But the game could easily evolve around the mage/templar conflict, which is supposed to be nearly Thedas wide, and branch off from there, with no need for Hawke at all.  Events could even start in 3, as they did in 2, during part of the events of 2, making Hawke impossible, or at the very least implausible.  For myself, I'm curious to see where they go.

[Thor Rand Al]

HiroVoid wrote...

Just about positive the original plan was to have Hawke as a continuous MC like Shepard, but that kind of changes when DA2's reception came in.

That was a rumour I heard too, kinda why they may have set Hawke up like that story wise but if that was the plan then ya I gotta agree about the bad reception DA2 had which truly disappoints me because I really got into Hawke and would of loved more then anything to see them go forward more in the world.

[darthnick427]

Main Character should have been the Warden. I don't really care what happens to Hawk at all... His companions I care about sure. But Hawke himself? Nope. Bring me back my Warden and I'll be happy

[Thor Rand Al]

As far as I'm concerned my Warden's story's done. There's really not much more they can do. I either sacrificed my Warden with the AD, married into royalty n became the commander in Awakenings but went bk to my spouse after the ending. N with a few of my male Wardens decided to run off with Morrigan in WH. Their stories are done for me, not sure what more there is for my Wardens, ya I got the baby but who's to say that child will even have a future in the games.

Now for Hawke there's so much that they can do, especially with how DA2 ended. It wasn't complete, there's more for Hawke to do especially with what's going on in Orlais. You got a mage/templar rebellion going on, you got Cory plus the Qunari mixed in all of this. Hawke has had a bigger hand in all of this then did the Warden but Hawke's basically been left in the dirt so to speak. Start something but not finish it. At least the Warden got to finish the Blight, got to finish with Awakening n defeated the Mother. What did Hawke really finish?
All I'm saying is I felt/feel that my Warden got their closure but Hawke didn't, also got more game time with the Warden then Hawke so it was easier to end my Wardens story.

[TehMerc]

I really just hope they never bring back the warden. As Thor pointed out, their story is pretty closed. Even if it's not the warden's a pretty boring character without a lot of potential.

"oh hai I'm recruiting wardens, your mine nao!" no matter what origin, and even after the fereldan chapter get's itself killed in a quick and dumb manner I still have to help out because I drank some guy's random saucer of blood? Talk about weak willed.

I can't think of a more railroaded beginning. I just didn't find the premise of wardens interesting at all and really could do without them in any future games. Anything but the warden.

As far as different protagonists goes, it might work if they didn't half ass how the story changed according to your choices as far as how events go down in later games.

That makes a bit more sense when you have an established protagonist and the benefits/"negatives" that brings but if we can't keep the same PC each game at least have the choices mean something.

If Thedas is the main character I really want to see it change through each game.

[Sabariel]

I'm tired of Hawke. Time for a new protagonist. Preferably a dwarven protagonist.....

Modifié par Sabariel, 29 mai 2012 - 03:49 .

[wsandista]

Sabariel wrote...

I'm tired of Hawke. Time for a new protagonist. Preferably a dwarven protagonist.....

Better yet, racial options. With Kossith as a possibility.

[Melca36]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

As far as I'm concerned my Warden's story's done. There's really not much more they can do. I either sacrificed my Warden with the AD, married into royalty n became the commander in Awakenings but went bk to my spouse after the ending. N with a few of my male Wardens decided to run off with Morrigan in WH. Their stories are done for me, not sure what more there is for my Wardens, ya I got the baby but who's to say that child will even have a future in the games.

Now for Hawke there's so much that they can do, especially with how DA2 ended. It wasn't complete, there's more for Hawke to do especially with what's going on in Orlais. You got a mage/templar rebellion going on, you got Cory plus the Qunari mixed in all of this. Hawke has had a bigger hand in all of this then did the Warden but Hawke's basically been left in the dirt so to speak. Start something but not finish it. At least the Warden got to finish the Blight, got to finish with Awakening n defeated the Mother. What did Hawke really finish?
All I'm saying is I felt/feel that my Warden got their closure but Hawke didn't, also got more game time with the Warden then Hawke so it was easier to end my Wardens story.

I never sacrificed my Wardens, Theres always potential for the Warden to return. I would love to have a choice between our Warden and Hawke since I love them **equally**.


Its not going to happen though and Im preparing myself for a new companion. I suspect we will get closure to our Hawkes if one of the other companions from DA:2 is in DA:3

[Melca36]

Sabariel wrote...

I'm tired of Hawke. Time for a new protagonist. Preferably a dwarven protagonist.....

Considering 80-85% played humans in Origins that will never happen. Word is only 5% played dwarves.

[Melca36]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Just about positive the original plan was to have Hawke as a continuous MC like Shepard, but that kind of changes when DA2's reception came in.

That was a rumour I heard too, kinda why they may have set Hawke up like that story wise but if that was the plan then ya I gotta agree about the bad reception DA2 had which truly disappoints me because I really got into Hawke and would of loved more then anything to see them go forward more in the world.

Actually no...that is not true. I remember them saying each game would have a different protagonist. They always sad to NOT expect Dragon Age to be like Mass Effect.

But that said, there is potential for both the Warden and Hawke to return if they wanted to do it.

I suspect if they brought back the Warden, it would be retconned that only the most popular races would be used which would ****** off alot of people.

[AkiKishi]

Melca36 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

I'm tired of Hawke. Time for a new protagonist. Preferably a dwarven protagonist.....

Considering 80-85% played humans in Origins that will never happen. Word is only 5% played dwarves.

That's not really important. What is important is how many people would not play the game if it only had a dwarven protagonist. The other problem with the stats is that human is the default which means anyone choosing default will also choose human.

I don't mind either way as long as the protaganist is interesting.

[Sabariel]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Melca36 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

I'm tired of Hawke. Time for a new protagonist. Preferably a dwarven protagonist.....

Considering 80-85% played humans in Origins that will never happen. Word is only 5% played dwarves.

That's not really important. What is important is how many people would not play the game if it only had a dwarven protagonist. The other problem with the stats is that human is the default which means anyone choosing default will also choose human.

I don't mind either way as long as the protaganist is interesting.

I didn't mean "dwarf only". I meant "bring back race choice pls."

And 102.63% of statistics are made up

[AkiKishi]

Sabariel wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

Melca36 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

I'm tired of Hawke. Time for a new protagonist. Preferably a dwarven protagonist.....

Considering 80-85% played humans in Origins that will never happen. Word is only 5% played dwarves.

That's not really important. What is important is how many people would not play the game if it only had a dwarven protagonist. The other problem with the stats is that human is the default which means anyone choosing default will also choose human.

I don't mind either way as long as the protaganist is interesting.

I didn't mean "dwarf only". I meant "bring back race choice pls."

And 102.63% of statistics are made up

A non human protagonist would be a good chance to see the world from another direction. Like the Origins, but carried through the game. This is why I don't think it can really be a choice. Things would need to be written for each race.
I'd like to play a Dalish Elf, maybe one who's tribe has been misplaced by the conflict and is sent out to look for a new home, maybe something lost and legendary. Dwarf would work too, maybe investigating the mysteries of lyrium as a start point.