176 réponses à ce sujet

[Elhanan]

Read of this in the news earlier. My guess is that it will be Wonder Woman.

[TheJester000]

I hate when people do stupid publicity stunts like this and change an established character for no reason. I've got no problem with having gay characters in comic books but do they really have to destroy all previous canon just to get a headline or please a certain crowd. Its just like when the author of Harry Potter came out and said Dumbledore was gay well after she was done writing the books just so she could get an award from the gay and lesbian community. It's nonsense, I'm sure DC is only doing it because they think it will up sales within that demographic. Why not just make a new badass hero that happens to be gay instead of changing an exsisting one, that would be a win win on all fronts.

[Inquisitor Recon]

From the same line of thinking that brought you French Muslim Spiderman and I'm sure much other insanity. It wins support from the politcally correct crowd who will be "outraged" by any sort of negative reaction. They'll blog about it while at Starbucks or the Apple Store.

And poor Batman has enough baggage in his closet.

But Wonder Woman was always probably a lesbian. I mean look at the outfit.

[HoonDing]

android654 wrote...

I'm not sure about Cassandra, but they forgot about her the last time I was reading comics.

Nope, she used to have a thing with Superboy.

[Blacklash93]

TheJester000 wrote...
Its just like when the author of Harry Potter came out and said Dumbledore was gay well after she was done writing the books just so she could get an award from the gay and lesbian community.

Rowling has recieved no award to my knowledge for that.

And Rowling actually revealed that in response to a general question (in an open fan interview on a stage) pertaining to Dumbledore's love life. She had no way of knowing that question was going to be asked and answered it honestly. It's not like she made it up on the spot (really how could she?) seeing as she had to get a line or two rewritten on the set of one of the movies in reaction to a bit of dialogue that implied Dubledore was heterosexual.

If that question had not been asked, we'd probably never even know to this day.

From the same line of thinking that brought you French Muslim Spiderman...

French Muslim Spiderman...? I'd buy it. Peter moving to France and finding hope and peace in the almighty Allah would make a nice change of pace for our hero. The inevitable French-styled spider-hijab would be especially fabulous!

Edit: And I thought the spider-hijab might be an original idea... *sigh*

Modifié par Blacklash93, 22 mai 2012 - 08:22 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

Meh..stupid sunts are stupid. Writers/publisher run out of ideas and try to graner interest in any way they can.


If you write a character, stick to it.

[Blacklash93]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
If you write a character, stick to it.

I wonder if this is kind of getting harder to do with these characters in their native field (comic books). They've been starring in published works for decades and anything that goes on for that long will get stale without exception.

Sure, the publishers and writers seem to have those handy "Reboot" and "Launch Alternate Canon" buttons in their offices at all times, but for how long can that really work without making serious changes to the characters' image?

But yeah I'm not well researched into this stuff so excuse me if I'm being ignorant here or seem to be exagerrating things. This is just my opinion formed from what I've passively gathered on the CB industry during my ventures on the interwebz (TV Tropes in particular).

Modifié par Blacklash93, 22 mai 2012 - 08:52 .

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

Changing the alignment of characters (that have clear history), to gain more fans is absurd and irrational.

And if you oppose this decision, you'll get bashed by political correctness and become a bigot automatically.

[whykikyouwhy]

I think a lot can be said for the exploration of identity - addressing ever increasing self-awareness. There are countless stories about people who, much later in life, fully acknowledged or became aware of (and embraced) their feelings and attraction to the same sex.

Perhaps this is what DC is seeking to portray with this. And yes, perhaps some of their intention may be to broaden their audience, but the core reason could be simply because a writer/team of writers wants to explore this sort of character development.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Blacklash93 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
If you write a character, stick to it.

I wonder if this is kind of getting harder to do with these characters in their native field (comic books). They've been starring in published works for decades and anything that goes on for that long will get stale without exception.

Sure, the publishers and writers seem to have those handy "Reboot" and "Launch Alternate Canon" buttons in their offices at all times, but for how long can that really work without making serious changes to the characters' image?

But yeah I'm not well researched into this stuff so excuse me if I'm being ignorant here or seem to be exagerrating things. This is just my opinion formed from what I've passively gathered on the CB industry during my ventures on the interwebz (TV Tropes in particular).

Any series that runs too long will eventually get run into ground. That is the bittersweet truth.

Sometimes it is best to have a definitive end to a story. No sequels. Nothing to despoil/ruin the universe/characters in the future.
And it WILL happen.
As writers chagne adn bring in new ideas, as fans start writing, more and mroe bad ideas will creep in. In the end end it becomes a sea of crap with an occasional good bit.

[Blacklash93]

Imperial Sentinel Arian wrote...
Changing the alignment of characters (that have clear history), to gain more fans is absurd and irrational.

I'm sure the only thing they care about is if it works or not.

And if you oppose this decision, you'll get bashed by political correctness and become a bigot automatically.

I feel bad for political correctness. No one ever acknoledges his good side. Sure, he can jump to conclusions about people and see an argument the wrong way sometimes, but he's really just trying to teach us to be more aware of our behavior so we can be more sensitive and kind to others who are different from us.

Any series that runs too long will eventually get run into ground. That is the bittersweet truth.

Sometimes it is best to have a definitive end to a story. No sequels. Nothing to despoil/ruin the universe/characters in the future.

My thoughts too, but I know these companies are dead-set to milk these icons until the money well in every one of the alternate universes they've made and ever will make runs dry.

With that in mind I'm just wondering what degree of change would be necessary to keep them fresh assuming fans will eventually get sick of the standard reboot/altcanon.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 22 mai 2012 - 11:46 .

[android654]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Cthulhu42 wrote...

This reminds me of what happened to Willow in "Buffy the Vampire Slayer". Was suddenly lesbian (not even just bi, IIRC) even though she'd previously been written as straight and had a heterosexual relationship. Always seemed a little strange to me, although it didn't take too long for me to get used to it.

Hold on there mister! There's a reason, one that was well explained as to why Willow was gay. She was pushed away from the only 2 men she had any affection for. In that she was left cast-off from the rest of the scoobies and was back to feeling invisible like she did before she found Oz. Then Terra comes in and Willow feels affection in a way she hadn't previously. She found that affection and care in one woman that she was unable to find in two men. That's really where it began, in the show it's fleshed out in much more detail and never feels forced as if it were there to be provocative.

I know; it still felt a little like it came out of left field to me all the same. I did end up liking the Willow/Tara relationship eventually though.

Now that person she ends up hooking up with in the final season though, that's another story entirely.

I think everyone ended up liking it since after so much tme you finally get to see Willow find her place in the group and was no longer on the feringes by herself. That and Tara was nothing but a big sweetheart, so when things went south you found yourself confused as to whether hate poor little Willow even though she totally went down a bad road.

That hook-up, to me at least, was showing a "grown-up" willow finally taking care of someone else rather than needing to be cared for. That and the world was going to end, for real this time, and I didn't expect her to go it alone.

[hoorayforicecream]

I actually think it is Kyle Rayner as well, if only because he fits the target group.

Facts:
The Bat-family has a lesbian already - Batwoman. They also had Renee Montoya. If I was editorial at DC, I'd spread the gay around and not put all my gays in one basket.

The Superman-family lacks super heroes who could be considered gay. Someone like a member of the supporting cast (Perry, Jimmy, Pete, etc.) could be outed, but I think it would dull the announcement if it was just an ordinary human. One might make a case for somebody like Cyborg or Steel though.

Wonder Woman, despite having so much potential as a lesbian, is too close to the public eye. I don't think that DC is progressive enough to have one of their 'trinity' come out, considering that LGBT characters in the past have always been C-listers at best.

The Green Lantern Corps. have *three* green lanterns - the original (and most popular, Hal Jordan), the minority guy (John Stewart), and the Other Guy (Rayner). Rayner lacks the history and anything that makes him stand out. He's more-or-less a C-lister, and he's the weakest character of the three human lanterns. He deals with alien things on a regular basis, which is where homosexuality wouldn't be out of place. He doesn't headline his own book, he shares it with the minority lantern. It would be a good fit for him to be gay, from a marketing perspective (drum up more interest in a flagging title), as well as spread the gay to a distinctly un-gay up-to-this-point brand.

Just my 2 cents.

Edit: 

PS. I think that this is a direct response to Marvel hinting that Northstar is going to marry his boyfriend.

Further edit:

Retconning the characters now is actually perfectly fine, because they just (fairly recently) rebooted the entire DC Universe precisely to jettison a lot of old continuity. Those complaining about a retcon now is kind of pointless. They already did it, might as well use it.

Modifié par hoorayforicecream, 22 mai 2012 - 02:30 .

[Elhanan]

Blacklash93 wrote...


I feel bad for political correctness. No one ever acknoledges his good side. Sure, he can jump to conclusions about people and see an argument the wrong way sometimes, but he's really just trying to teach us to be more aware of our behavior so we can be more sensitive and kind to others who are different from us.

Wouldn't this be 'she'?

[Blacklash93]

Elhanan wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...


I feel bad for political correctness. No one ever acknoledges his good side. Sure, he can jump to conclusions about people and see an argument the wrong way sometimes, but he's really just trying to teach us to be more aware of our behavior so we can be more sensitive and kind to others who are different from us.

Wouldn't this be 'she'?

Why not? The lack of gender diversity and relatable females in today's world of personified sociopolitical terms is ridiculous! This is surely something women care about.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 22 mai 2012 - 11:08 .

[Cutlass Jack]

hoorayforicecream wrote...

I actually think it is Kyle Rayner as well, if only because he fits the target group.

Facts:
The Bat-family has a lesbian already - Batwoman. They also had Renee Montoya. If I was editorial at DC, I'd spread the gay around and not put all my gays in one basket.

The Superman-family lacks super heroes who could be considered gay. Someone like a member of the supporting cast (Perry, Jimmy, Pete, etc.) could be outed, but I think it would dull the announcement if it was just an ordinary human. One might make a case for somebody like Cyborg or Steel though.

Wonder Woman, despite having so much potential as a lesbian, is too close to the public eye. I don't think that DC is progressive enough to have one of their 'trinity' come out, considering that LGBT characters in the past have always been C-listers at best.

The Green Lantern Corps. have *three* green lanterns - the original (and most popular, Hal Jordan), the minority guy (John Stewart), and the Other Guy (Rayner). Rayner lacks the history and anything that makes him stand out. He's more-or-less a C-lister, and he's the weakest character of the three human lanterns. He deals with alien things on a regular basis, which is where homosexuality wouldn't be out of place. He doesn't headline his own book, he shares it with the minority lantern. It would be a good fit for him to be gay, from a marketing perspective (drum up more interest in a flagging title), as well as spread the gay to a distinctly un-gay up-to-this-point brand.

Just my 2 cents.

Edit: 

PS. I think that this is a direct response to Marvel hinting that Northstar is going to marry his boyfriend.

Further edit:

Retconning the characters now is actually perfectly fine, because they just (fairly recently) rebooted the entire DC Universe precisely to jettison a lot of old continuity. Those complaining about a retcon now is kind of pointless. They already did it, might as well use it.

Still be surprised on Rayner since he's the GL with the largest history of hetrosexual romance next to Hal Jordan. (bisexual maybe, but they did say same sex.) There is a fourth lantern possiblity: Guy Gardner. That one just makes me giggle to think about. It would explain much. But there was minimal amount of retconning in the GL books. They all pretty much continued as they were in the new 52 era.

But I'm sure it will be a female coming out anyways. Its the much safer option. And they already have a 'Northstar' level openly gay male member of the current Teen Titans. For it to matter it would have to be someone who's a bigger name...but not too big.. 

I think you're right that Wonder Woman would fall in the 'too big' category. But Supergirl might be another matter entirely. She was completely retconned anyway, and such a move could only improve her book's sales. Power Girl and/or Huntress might be another possiblity now that they're both over in World's Finest together. And acting overly chummy.

Modifié par Cutlass Jack, 23 mai 2012 - 01:59 .

[Ninja Stan]

hoorayforicecream wrote...

The Green Lantern Corps. have *three* green lanterns - the original (and most popular, Hal Jordan), the minority guy (John Stewart), and the Other Guy (Rayner). Rayner lacks the history and anything that makes him stand out. He's more-or-less a C-lister, and he's the weakest character of the three human lanterns. He deals with alien things on a regular basis, which is where homosexuality wouldn't be out of place. He doesn't headline his own book, he shares it with the minority lantern. It would be a good fit for him to be gay, from a marketing perspective (drum up more interest in a flagging title), as well as spread the gay to a distinctly un-gay up-to-this-point brand.

What about Guy Gardner?

[Clover Rider]

Ninja Stan wrote...

hoorayforicecream wrote...

The Green Lantern Corps. have *three* green lanterns - the original (and most popular, Hal Jordan), the minority guy (John Stewart), and the Other Guy (Rayner). Rayner lacks the history and anything that makes him stand out. He's more-or-less a C-lister, and he's the weakest character of the three human lanterns. He deals with alien things on a regular basis, which is where homosexuality wouldn't be out of place. He doesn't headline his own book, he shares it with the minority lantern. It would be a good fit for him to be gay, from a marketing perspective (drum up more interest in a flagging title), as well as spread the gay to a distinctly un-gay up-to-this-point brand.

What about Guy Gardner?

Yeah Guy is the best GL there is! But I don't think they will make him gay since he still has a thing for Tora.

[The Hierophant]

I'm calling it now, Killer Croc.

[Maria Caliban]

It's going to be Poison Ivy. I thought everyone knew that?

Volus Warlord wrote...

This worked out so well for them with Batgirl.

1. Batwoman
2. The gay Batwoman was a new character. Barbara Gordan is still into men.

hoorayforicecream wrote...

Wonder Woman, despite having so much potential as a lesbian, is too close to the public eye. I don't think that DC is progressive enough to have one of their 'trinity' come out, considering that LGBT characters in the past have always been C-listers at best.

Bisexual. She's already talked about having relations with women, they've just never showed her in a relationship with one.

Then again, in many versions, Diana is practically asexual.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 23 mai 2012 - 09:46 .

[HoonDing]

I thought it would be "one of its iconic heroes"

Calling out Aquaman.

Modifié par HoonDing, 23 mai 2012 - 09:58 .

[The Hierophant]

This reeks of momentary publicity and i can bet that by the end of this everyone will shrug their shoulders at the revelation.

greengoron i just got it, lmao @ the Guy Gardner pun.

[hoorayforicecream]

Ninja Stan wrote...

hoorayforicecream wrote...

The Green Lantern Corps. have *three* green lanterns - the original (and most popular, Hal Jordan), the minority guy (John Stewart), and the Other Guy (Rayner). Rayner lacks the history and anything that makes him stand out. He's more-or-less a C-lister, and he's the weakest character of the three human lanterns. He deals with alien things on a regular basis, which is where homosexuality wouldn't be out of place. He doesn't headline his own book, he shares it with the minority lantern. It would be a good fit for him to be gay, from a marketing perspective (drum up more interest in a flagging title), as well as spread the gay to a distinctly un-gay up-to-this-point brand.

What about Guy Gardner?

Guy Gardner would also totally qualify. He's got practically the same qualifications as Rayner (being the other other lantern), and doesn't even headline his own lantern book. I was actually thinking of Gardner when I wrote the thing above, because I had him confused with Rayner. So... Gay Guy Gardner? I'd believe it. 

[Seagloom]

It will be interesting to see which iconic male reveals he is gay. Not so much for the revelation as for how it is handled. That a publicity statement was made about it tells me to expect a spectacle; which will be disappointing if so. It would have been nice if it was no big thing. Just another character detail that may or may not become a relevant plot point in later stories. Sadly that is almost never the case in mainstream comics.

I will totally sup on the tears of outraged fans while quietly giggling if it turns out Superman or Batman is gay, though. My inner sadist wouldn't be able to resist.