49 réponses à ce sujet

[Drawrof]

modok8 wrote...

Dying is inefficient

So is waiting for shield to recharge. So is one shot/power duck,  omg omg omg, peek and take a second shot. 

This is efficient.  AA and AJ reave throw boom reave throw boom, AA glass cannon goes down in barrage from ravager. AA tells AJ "I warped that ravager and got a couple rounds from paladin prior to going down". AJ spots ravager and reave boom, ravager is dead, quickly picks up AA. 

[eye basher]

The one going down isn't a problem is the idiot who try's to revive him when there's a whole army camping on his dying ass.

[Malkeor]

Well people are just afraid of what happens after death is all. IT's a scary thought to alot of people.

[DeadeyeCYclops]

i like dying,(if i only had one health bar), at least i do come back with 2, and if its b4 end of the wave, ill come back with 4 bars, if i can survive one more wave, or use a instant heal....i am at full health.?? actually this does happen, quite enough times to make it kinda useful, so yeah.

but i don't wanna rely solely on this, to where im constantly "trying" to die, because  i am always getting shot/hit.

Modifié par DeadeyeCYclops78, 23 mai 2012 - 05:39 .

[MajorBlazkowicz]

Have you ever been in a Silver or Gold Match were teammates, including yourself, rarley get downed or survived 5 waves or more? Let me tell you it is way easier to survive when everyone is doing there job and stick close to the team.

If someone likes the high risk, gets lots of kills, get downed alot path, they are not a team player even if they got the highest score.

Bioware should make a new medal in the game called TOUGH so you know who died the least and UNLUCKY for someone who dies the most.

[scheherazade]

Dying time to time is not a problem.

Dying over and over, and being a reckless kill whor is a problem.

It's selfish. You make other players drop what they're doing to go baby sit you.

You're basically forcing someone to follow you around rezzing, while you run around worry-free.

Other players want to play the game too. Not just babysit and pander to the reckless kill-whor ego.

If you're making teammates spend their time rezzing, and preventing them from getting kills, then it's no wonder you're #1 on the scoreboard...



Also, 0 fitness adept should not be dying any more than any other class.
And your power cooldowns are long enough to use cover without diminishing your DPS any meaningful amount.

-scheherazade

Modifié par scheherazade, 23 mai 2012 - 05:36 .

[jae112200]

I was playing with an assari vanguard today on silver, and other than constantly using nova in the "basement" of firebase white, and constantly dying, they didn't contribute anything. My teammates and I revived them a few times, but in the end stopped doing so because it was every round, essentially making it a 3 man crew. We ended up with a partial extraction because the person couldn't even be bothered to attempt to make it to the extraction point. So no dying isn't an issue, but expecting everyone else to revive you all the time and not contributing, that may become an issue.

[MajorBlazkowicz]

jae112200 wrote...

I was playing with an assari vanguard today on silver, and other than constantly using nova in the "basement" of firebase white, and constantly dying, they didn't contribute anything. My teammates and I revived them a few times, but in the end stopped doing so because it was every round, essentially making it a 3 man crew. We ended up with a partial extraction because the person couldn't even be bothered to attempt to make it to the extraction point. So no dying isn't an issue, but expecting everyone else to revive you all the time and not contributing, that may become an issue.

I think you mean Human Vanguards, they have Nova.

[HellishFiend]

I dont have a big problem with my teammates getting downed, as long as they get downed in a place that I can get to, or if they have a medigel they can use if necessary.

The only time it really bothers me is if the death was avoidable and was just caused by a careless, inattentive mistake.

[Mizzie466]

Dying is not exactly free. When someone goes down, everyone else is distracted by the message and has to start analyzing the situation, figuring out if he needs to change position or start running, or whether it's possible/worth it to run over and revive you. The efficacy of the whole team goes down in that instant. Many times it's not just one guy who tries to revive you, but two.

Sure you get one more bar of HP, but for what? HP is there so you can fight longer. But what's fighting longer, between wasting several seconds and diverting everyone's attention to get one more bar of HP, or just continue shooting with your last bar?

Besides, if you want bars, tap that survival pack.

As for 0 fitness, depends on many things. Are you the host? Are you infiltrator? You have shield restore on your adrenaline rush? It's certainly viable but you have to know your limits. But I wouldn't advocate going for 0 fitness just because you can be revived if you die.

[xtorma]

Neegs wrote...

Why do people have such a hang up on dieing in MP. This is linked to the current 0 in fitness topic but is seperate matter and so thought i would post separately. Obviously you want to be alive as much as possible but dieing is not the end of the world

So i play 0 fitness on gold in almost everything other than a few classes where melee damage is preferred. However i dont see the issue with going down. Its a game mechanic, you can go down, in fact you revive with more health, 2 bars. I play AA or AJ mainly and the way i see it and have said before this is a team game. My job is to blow as much up as possible, debuff enemies and cover choke points be it my big bubble or stassis bubble.

I personally have no issue with people going down as long as they are holding their own and they are not trying to be Rambo. im not saying i go down contantly as playing gold i know to use cover where possible. However i am happy to take risk as long as its not at a key stage in the game and i am with my team.

I would rather see an offensive player that is taking mofos down than constantly hiding. Its part of the game its not a hack or glitch you have unlimited lives as long as you are not insta killed. So why not use this to your advantage???

The more you are dead, the less you are making other things dead.

[jaydubs67]

The problem isn't people who die. It's people who push up over-aggressively and don't know their limits, expecting their teammates to happily revive them whenever it gets them in trouble. A good aggressive player doesn't die very much, and when they do it's either close to their team or solved with a medigel. An over-aggressive player will die all over the place all the time.

These people are best ignored rather than risking your safety to help them. It only takes a round or two bleeding out and having the rest of us finish the round for them to get the message. They usually either start staying closer to the team, or they ragequit. Win-win.

[Neegs]

xtorma wrote...
The more you are dead, the less you are making other things dead.

The more you are waiting for your shields to recover the less you are making things dead.

Sgt SuperWae wrote...
If you're picking yourself up with medigels then dying isn't an issue.  But if putting yourself in precarious situations means a teammate has to risk his/her neck to save you over and over again it makes survival a lot harder.  Scores don't dictate how difficult it was to reach extraction.  I don't care how high your score is, if you're making my life harder I don't want you on my team

I wouldnt expect anyone to take a massive risk to rev me. This is up to them, you should always kill the enemy before trying to revive anyone anyway. I did also say the i would take risks as long as its not a  "key stage in the game and i am with my team." So i am not going to be playing recklessly on extraction etc. Also the fact that i would reeve everything in sight or preoccupy that banshee so she stays in my bubble makes life easier for the rest of my team to pick her off. I am not comparable to a Vanguad which a lot of responses have used as examples

scheherazade wrote...
Other players want to play the game too. Not just babysit and pander to the reckless kill-whor ego.

If you're making team mates spend their time rezzing, and preventing them from getting kills, then it's no wonder you're #1 on the scoreboard...

Interesting to see peoples thoughts. I wouldnt say that i was a kill ****, in fact i figured the point of the game was to wipe the enemies out as quickly as possible. I dont care if anyone steels a kill as this isnt a real concept. No enemy is yours, it was never your kill in the first place.

Claiming that the team are not high on the scoreboard cos they are spending time rezzing me is a joke. If im down im not killing anything so our time spent shooting using powers is the same give or take. Its is rarely the same person that rezzes me, it doesnt need to be an infiltrator as i stick with the team. So the number of times i go down is not the same number of times each player will pick me up (its impossible) so i truly cannot see how your logic works here. Anyway i wasnt saying im top of the table to swing my dick and say look how big i am. I was using it to prove i was still holding my own whilst being the person who has also died the most

I think when i said i dont have a problem with dying (i got it right) people took me the wrong way. I dont die to the point it annoys people and if i do go down more times than I would exoect I apologize and use a medigel so no one has to break cover. I dont go down in early Waves as its easy and i dont go down 2 or 3 times in latter waves. I never go down on extraction through playing recklessly and again this is what the medigel is for. All i am saying is dying isnt that big of an issue if the person is also blowing the crap out of everything that moves and isnt the other end of the map

Modifié par Neegs, 24 mai 2012 - 10:37 .

[xtorma]

Neegs wrote...

xtorma wrote...
The more you are dead, the less you are making other things dead.

The more you are waiting for your shields to recover the less you are making things dead.

Sgt SuperWae wrote...
If you're picking yourself up with medigels then dying isn't an issue.  But if putting yourself in precarious situations means a teammate has to risk his/her neck to save you over and over again it makes survival a lot harder.  Scores don't dictate how difficult it was to reach extraction.  I don't care how high your score is, if you're making my life harder I don't want you on my team

I wouldnt expect anyone to take a massive risk to rev me. This is up to them, you should always kill the enemy before trying to revive anyone anyway. I did also say the i would take risks as long as its not a  "key stage in the game and i am with my team." So i am not going to be playing recklessly on extraction etc. Also the fact that i would reeve everything in sight or preoccupy that banshee so she stays in my bubble makes life easier for the rest of my team to pick her off. I am not comparable to a nova which a lot of responses have used as examples

scheherazade wrote...
Other players want to play the game too. Not just babysit and pander to the reckless kill-whor ego.

If you're making team mates spend their time rezzing, and preventing them from getting kills, then it's no wonder you're #1 on the scoreboard...

Interesting to see peoples thoughts. I wouldnt say that i was a kill ****, in fact i figured the point of the game was to wipe the enemies out as quickly as possible. I dont care if anyone steels a kill as this isnt a real concept. No enemy is yours, it was never your kill in the first place.

Claiming that the team are not high on the scoreboard cos they are spending time rezzing me is a joke. If im down im not killing anything so our time spent shooting using powers is the same give or take. Its is rarely the same person that rezzes me, it doesnt need to be an infiltrator as i stick with the team. So the number of times i go down is not the same number of times each player will pick me up (its impossible) so i truly cannot see how your logic works here. Anyway i wasnt saying im top of the table to swing my dick and say look how big i am. I was using it to prove i was still holding my own whilst being the person who has also died the most

I think when i said i dont have a problem with dying (i got it right) people took me the wrong way. I dont die to the point it annoys people and if i do go down more times than I would exoect I apologize and use a medigel so no one has to break cover. I dont go down in early Waves as its easy and i dont go down 2 or 3 times in latter waves. I never go down on extraction through playing recklessly and again this is what the medigel is for. All i am saying is dying isnt that big of an issue if the person is also blowing the crap out of everything that moves and isnt the other end of the map

Who waits for shields to recover?

[Karstedt]

All the time you spend on the ground is time you're not contributing... and then causing someone else to not contribute for the time it takes to revive you if they choose to do so.

Yeah, it happens, and sometimes it even happens a lot. But it should be avoided, not embraced. The same way missing your target should be avoided... otherwise we'd all just shoot the sky and ctrl+f+u.

[Neegs]

Karstedt wrote...

All the time you spend on the ground is time you're not contributing... and then causing someone else to not contribute for the time it takes to revive you if they choose to do so.

Yeah, it happens, and sometimes it even happens a lot. But it should be avoided, not embraced. The same way missing your target should be avoided... otherwise we'd all just shoot the sky and ctrl+f+u.

Missing a target and dying through taking a risk are not comparable. I risked dying to achieve something that would help me/team. Missing the target achieves nothing.

I do understand you point tho about being down means you are not contributing. Except i try to weigh up the pros and cons. For example Is getting my bubble in the killzone and dying on the way back worth the time it takes for a team member to rez me. Most of the time yes expecially if playing with other Adepts as that bubble in a choke point becomes very benificail for the team for longer than it takes to pick me up

[Mizzie466]

Neegs wrote...

I think when i said i dont have a problem with dying (i got it right) people took me the wrong way. I dont die to the point it annoys people and if i do go down more times than I would exoect I apologize and use a medigel so no one has to break cover. I dont go down in early Waves as its easy and i dont go down 2 or 3 times in latter waves. I never go down on extraction through playing recklessly and again this is what the medigel is for. All i am saying is dying isnt that big of an issue if the person is also blowing the crap out of everything that moves and isnt the other end of the map

What you're describing is actually that you're not dying all that much, and I don't think anybody actually has an issue with that in the first place.

But saying that dying is no problem just revive, go 0 fitness and take risk? If anything, I want my team to reduce their risk-taking behavior. As long as you're alive, if you do not completely suck, you'll be doing something, shooting something, or at least making that banshee run after you instead of me so I can shoot it. If you're dead, you're doing absolutely nothing, and someone else has to revive you even if it's just 3 secs and 3 meters away.

So yeah, dying once in a while is ok. We all do that. But we strive not to die, and every time you die because you were doing something, you should reflect on it and see how you could've done it differently. Whether you 0 fitness or not comes from knowing if you can handle it.

Edit:

Neegs wrote...

I do understand you point tho about being down means you are not contributing. Except i try to weigh up the pros and cons. For example Is getting my bubble in the killzone and dying on the way back worth the time it takes for a team member to rez me. Most of the time yes expecially if playing with other Adepts as that bubble in a choke point becomes very benificail for the team for longer than it takes to pick me up

Ok I can see what you're getting at now, but maybe a few points in fitness will allow you to come back alive from that bubble. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/grin.png[/smilie]

I'm guilty of doing that kind of things sometimes (mostly involving a grab hotspot) but I still I don't really like the dying part.

Modifié par Mizzie466, 24 mai 2012 - 11:05 .

[Neegs]

Mizzie466 wrote...
What you're describing is actually that you're not dying all that much, and I don't think anybody actually has an issue with that in the first place.

But saying that dying is no problem just revive, go 0 fitness and take risk? If anything, I want my team to reduce their risk-taking behavior. As long as you're alive, if you do not completely suck, you'll be doing something, shooting something, or at least making that banshee run after you instead of me so I can shoot it. If you're dead, you're doing absolutely nothing, and someone else has to revive you even if it's just 3 secs and 3 meters away.

So yeah, dying once in a while is ok. We all do that. But we strive not to die, and every time you die because you were doing something, you should reflect on it and see how you could've done it differently. Whether you 0 fitness or not comes from knowing if you can handle it.

I see you point i do know my limits. Except i am a risk taker when it comes to my AJ as i feel its worth it to get the bubble in place for the most part. Although what you said about your team i also take into consideration. I enjoy the risky gamelplay, it makes things more fun and i enjoy playing with a team of risk takers. Again dont get me wrong if we are all down in wave 3 you know there is something wrong.

It becomes aparent very quickly if your team would rather you not get that bubble in place . Im not that selfish that i would carry on this tactic as then neither of us enjoy the game.

[Mizzie466]

Ah yes, the enjoyment part. Considering it from that angle, it is a worthy trade off. That's why I risk going for grab hotspots too.

[Karstedt]

Neegs wrote...

Missing a target and dying through taking a risk are not comparable. I risked dying to achieve something that would help me/team. Missing the target achieves nothing.

I was not talking about dying through taking risk. I was talking about treating dying as no big deal, in other words, making survival a low priority. Charging a turret on your own with a phantom, engineer and trooper lurking, (because we're here to kill stuff, not survive right?) is about as a effective as missing your target.

[Neegs]

Karstedt wrote...

Neegs wrote...

Missing a target and dying through taking a risk are not comparable. I risked dying to achieve something that would help me/team. Missing the target achieves nothing.

I was not talking about dying through taking risk. I was talking about treating dying as no big deal, in other words, making survival a low priority. Charging a turret on your own with a phantom, engineer and trooper lurking, (because we're here to kill stuff, not survive right?) is about as a effective as missing your target.

Get ya i totally got you wrong. Yer im not that reckless. I should edit my OP to read dying through a calculated risk is not a big deal. I came across as someone who doesnt mind people dying all the time which was incorrect. I dont mind people dying all the time if i know they are trying to do something for the team. 

[CrimsonN7]

Maria Caliban wrote...

If you're dying so much that your teammates 'have an issue' with it, then I don't care where you are on the scoreboard.

There's a reason human vanguards have a bad rap and it's not because they can't kill stuff.

Human vanguards are usually the worst hoggers, they just spam nova and biotic charge constantly, been in a few games where some people just left the mission because they were stealing kills<_<

But usually if you end up being your party's paramedic it pays off when you go down, they'll rush over to help you unless their douches:P

[Neegs]

CrimsonN7 wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

If you're dying so much that your teammates 'have an issue' with it, then I don't care where you are on the scoreboard.

There's a reason human vanguards have a bad rap and it's not because they can't kill stuff.

Human vanguards are usually the worst hoggers, they just spam nova and biotic charge constantly, been in a few games where some people just left the mission because they were stealing kills<_<

But usually if you end up being your party's paramedic it pays off when you go down, they'll rush over to help you unless their douches:P

No such thing as stealing kills imo, as a team you are trying to kill everything in sight simple as. If i have been shooting that atlass for ages and someone comes along with a widow/bw/valiant and oneshot kills it i dont complain. i move on to the next target

Being the medic can sometimes be fun but i have been in a lobby with good vanguads and bad vanguads. The good was imense as they set of a million and one BE with my AJ. The bad i spent the game running all over the map and it got a little annoying but was a fun challenge

[Biotic_Warlock]

Hold the line!

[MrRag]

I have no problem with experienced players taking risks to get the job done. But I don't appreciate players who go all out and then inevitably go down all the time. Especially players with a 0 fitness build should know what they're doing, or else they'll become a liability to their team.