212 réponses à ce sujet

[Nitrocuban]

Awwwww Infiltrator Predator would be SO awesome!

[Zhuinden]

molecularman wrote...

Enough with these boring humans! Protheans woulda been much better

Protheans wouldn't make sense and would remove the importance of Javik.

That's just stupid. Don't. No.
No.

[Rifneno]

gigliani60 wrote...

A) Protheans would render the lore null, and i quite like the lore.
We havent played these classes yet, so stop jumping to conclusions as to how boring humans are. Plus the humans we already have are alright. Soldier, Vanguard and Engineer, all good

A) Apparently not enough to keep up on it.
Human soldier is terrible. Adrenaline rush without the time dither is just... no. Instant reload is good but it doesn't begin to make up for the rest of the failings. Human engineer is laughable compared to salarian and geth. Don't know about quarian as it's the only gold card the RNG has decided I may never have. Human vanguard is jawdroppingly broken. The only way you can bring down a decent human vanguard is with kryptonite. It's the opposite of soldier & engineer but just as poorly tuned.

zambingo wrote...

If the Mordins of the universe can clone kakliosaurs faster than it takes to make microwave popcorn, why can't they pleasure Javi- I mean get a sample of DNA from Javik to recreate Protheans? If you except Grunt as a true being, and most players do and if we do Javik mentions how awesome Grunt must have been, then ergo Javik should love providing DNA to recreate Protheans.

AND BAM! Acceptable reintroduction of Prothies than doesn't invalidate canon.

Afterthought:

AND BAM! Here we have a base idea of Mass Effect 4. The Prothean Empire returns. "Ha, Those primitives are so stupid for cloning me."

Hehe. I was wondering if anyone else was thinking that. Protheans are like space qunari. People think they're interesting and enlightened with a fascinating culture. Until they start mass murdering and enslaving everyone else. That's one reason that while I adamantly believe "phoenix" was hinting towards Protheans, I'm certainly not sad that it didn't come to pass. The galaxy is far, far better off without them.

[Babi_Siha]

Because there's only on prothean alive and it wouldn't make sense if suddenly more showed up. Simple as that.

[LeandroBraz]

I have no problems with protheans in MP, IF they fit it in the SP. We have dialogues with Javik, about he being the last prothean, they will make no sense if there's a lot of protheans through the galaxy, fighting against reapers. It can't be done without changes in the SP.


One of the things that made the MP acceptable when it was announced, was that it would respect and work with the SP, now you guys ask that they throw the lore away just for a new character?

[TheKingBoar]

Babi_Siha wrote...

Because there's only on prothean alive and it wouldn't make sense if suddenly more showed up. Simple as that.

There have been no less than 6 or 7 posts explaining why it would make perfect sense for more Protheans to show up.

Among them:
"Hey we found more stasis pods!" - not like we haven't done this twice already
cloning - which the salarians can and do use.
Whatever else Bioware's writers can come up with (liberated collectors, or what have you)

Protheans make perfect sense if you bother to use your noggin. End of story.

Modifié par TheKingBoar, 24 mai 2012 - 08:33 .

[withneelandi]

I think the point a lot of people are missing about "lore" is that it isn't about having a set of un breakable rules that can't be broken without the fans raging.

The point is that mass effect is a story based game, with a really fun multi-player element, "respecting the lore" doesn't mean shoe-horning any old character that might get a few hours of enjoyment via some cheesy plot exposition (OMG! A million prothean pods that we didn't find before, LOLZ).

It means putting the universe you have creafted before a multiplayer skin, the full scale return of the protheans is a literal game changer and deserves far more exposition than a few lines in a DLC desciption explaining that they found some hidden pods.

Its not about being an angry lore protective looney fanboy, its about saying if you are going to do something like bring back the protheans, do it properly, thats like a whole game plot in itself and realistically that isn't going to happen any time soon.

[gigliani60]

[quote]Rifneno wrote...

[quote]gigliani60 wrote...

A) Protheans would render the lore null, and i quite like the lore.
We havent played these classes yet, so stop jumping to conclusions as to how boring humans are. Plus the humans we already have are alright. Soldier, Vanguard and Engineer, all good[/quote]

A) Apparently not enough to keep up on it.
Human soldier is terrible. Adrenaline rush without the time dither is just... no. Instant reload is good but it doesn't begin to make up for the rest of the failings. Human engineer is laughable compared to salarian and geth. Don't know about quarian as it's the only gold card the RNG has decided I may never have. Human vanguard is jawdroppingly broken. The only way you can bring down a decent human vanguard is with kryptonite. It's the opposite of soldier & engineer but just as poorly tuned.

[quote]

A) What am i not keeping up on? We have discovered 1 Prothean. Yes, we could find stasis pods somewhere but not enough to make them join the n7 squad. Theyd want to repopulate and you wouldnt find a lot
Human Soldier is not terrible at all. Im not saying its the best, but its certainly good enough. Human engineer with an overload, incinerate combo is amazing. And they have a decent bit of health, unlike the Geth. Human vanguard in the hands of the right player is amazing. You obviously havent see anyone good use a Human. They can be utilised very well

[PluralAces]

Maybe because you dont type in English??

[greghorvath]

(cant be arsed to read everything so its probably been said)

@op: because there is only one of them left and he is busy with his being the avatar of vengeance.

[SGC Reaper SV]

Protheans can easily fit into lore.

/thread

[greghorvath]

TheKingBoar wrote...

Protheans make perfect sense if you bother to use your noggin. End of story.

So would the ending, still there are thousands of people who choose not to do it.

[gigliani60]

SGC Reaper SV wrote...

Protheans can easily fit into lore.

/thread

 
I just dont think so. Just saying 'Hey we found more pods and they immediately joined the alliance, without giving a damn about repopulation or finding somewhere to live' Protheans are smart, they wouldnt jump straight into a war without thinking about survivability. The whole reason we found pods in the first place is that they were this determined to survive

[jaydubs67]

TheKingBoar wrote...

Protheans make perfect sense if you bother to use your noggin. End of story.

So do Cerberus.  

Also, Cerberus defectors are a constant theme throughout the storyline, while Javik's character is primarily based upon his status as the last of his species.  

So even if both are lore-acceptable, Cerberus is a better fit to the story.  

[dekkerd]

Ah this again.
How many Ardat-Yakshi were in that damn monastery anyway?
Lore was out the window in MP on day 1. They should officially decouple it and all would be well.

[TheKingBoar]

gigliani60 wrote...

SGC Reaper SV wrote...

Protheans can easily fit into lore.

/thread

 
I
just dont think so. Just saying 'Hey we found more pods and they
immediately joined the alliance, without giving a damn about
repopulation or finding somewhere to live' Protheans are smart, they
wouldnt jump straight into a war without thinking about survivability.
The whole reason we found pods in the first place is that they were this
determined to survive

What point is there to try
repopulating a planet if the Reapers are just going to find and destroy
it? Better to deal with the bigger problem at hand first, although it
could be an interesting quest dealing with a split among the Protheans
on what to do.

jaydubs67 wrote...

TheKingBoar wrote...

Protheans make perfect sense if you bother to use your noggin. End of story.

So do Cerberus.  

Also, Cerberus defectors are a constant theme throughout the storyline, while Javik's character is primarily based upon his status as the last of his species.  

So even if both are lore-acceptable, Cerberus is a better fit to the story.  

At this point, I think it is best to say that we agree to disagree. Javik's character is based upon his belief that he is the last of the Protheans. Given that they had many undocumented worlds, it isn't that much of a stretch to think they had more. I'll give you that Cerberus defectors are present through the storyline, but they don't match with the ideals of Cerberus that I remember. Not to mention the fact when defectors have been retconned in, they are dealt with swiftly and severely.

[jaydubs67]

dekkerd wrote...

Ah this again.
How many Ardat-Yakshi were in that damn monastery anyway?
Lore was out the window in MP on day 1. They should officially decouple it and all would be well.

Ah this again.  Your objection has been explained many, many times.  Banshees are made from Asari who are Ardat-Yakshii or have latent predispositions to becoming Ardat-Yakshii.  

Lots of Asari have the recessive genes for it, but it's kept in check by their practice of mostly breeding with alien races.  Ergo, more Banshees than Ardat-Yakshii.  

[Babi_Siha]

TheKingBoar wrote...

Babi_Siha wrote...

Because there's only on prothean alive and it wouldn't make sense if suddenly more showed up. Simple as that.

There have been no less than 6 or 7 posts explaining why it would make perfect sense for more Protheans to show up.

Among them:
"Hey we found more stasis pods!" - not like we haven't done this twice already
cloning - which the salarians can and do use.
Whatever else Bioware's writers can come up with (liberated collectors, or what have you)

Protheans make perfect sense if you bother to use your noggin. End of story.

And at what point during the biggest war the galaxy had ever seen would the salarians have time to clone a whole species? I'm sure if cloning was that simple every race would clone their species in order not to go instinct and to have more soldiers to fight the Reapers.

About finding more stasis pods, if something like that had happened Shepard would probably learn about. Or at least something should be mentioned on the SP, since it wasn't, again it makes no sense to add them to MP since it never happened on the SP. Also, just because they were lucky enough to find one still functioning doesn't mean there are others.

[Indenter]

Rifneno wrote...

Human soldier is ter...

Learn to play.

The rest of your post is like a bad twilight fanfic.

Just like these threads.

[Rifneno]

withneelandi wrote...

I think the point a lot of people are missing about "lore" is that it isn't about having a set of un breakable rules that can't be broken without the fans raging.

The point is that mass effect is a story based game, with a really fun multi-player element, "respecting the lore" doesn't mean shoe-horning any old character that might get a few hours of enjoyment via some cheesy plot exposition (OMG! A million prothean pods that we didn't find before, LOLZ).

It means putting the universe you have creafted before a multiplayer skin, the full scale return of the protheans is a literal game changer and deserves far more exposition than a few lines in a DLC desciption explaining that they found some hidden pods.

Its not about being an angry lore protective looney fanboy, its about saying if you are going to do something like bring back the protheans, do it properly, thats like a whole game plot in itself and realistically that isn't going to happen any time soon.

I agree completely that they would have to add SP content as well to explain it. Even if it was just 5 minutes of dialogue with Javik, they couldn't do it without something there.

The idea that they'd have to have a gazillion Protheans to add them to MP is a false assumption IMO. We already have several extremely rare characters for MP. Asari justicars are incredibly rare from what we've been told. Only a few hundred thousand drell survived Rakhana's apocalypse and let's face it, the only skill most of them have been taught is how to open jars for the hanar. I can't imagine more than a few hundred became some of the galaxy's best assassins. IIRC, Wrex's class description in ME1 said krogan battlemasters are also damned rare. So I can definitely see them only needing a small number of Protheans to justify their usage in MP.

gigliani60 wrote...

A) What am i not keeping up on? We have discovered 1 Prothean. Yes, we could find stasis pods somewhere but not enough to make them join the n7 squad. Theyd want to repopulate and you wouldnt find a lot
Human Soldier is not terrible at all. Im not saying its the best, but its certainly good enough. Human engineer with an overload, incinerate combo is amazing. And they have a decent bit of health, unlike the Geth. Human vanguard in the hands of the right player is amazing. You obviously havent see anyone good use a Human. They can be utilised very well

A) Because the original lore has already been nullified. Arguably twice. IMO they planned those plot twists from the start but the fact of the matter remains that "Protheans are extinct" was the lore and it is simply not true anymore. Adding Protheans would be a plot twist, not a retcon, and plot twists aren't a bad thing. As for repopulating, that's ridiculous. The Reapers are invading. If the Reapers aren't defeated, everyone dies. Concentrating on repopulating while the Reapers are invading would be counterproductive, not reproductive. Also, the Protheans were a very warlike society. I don't see them backing down so they can screw. Lastly, if they went with the "cloning Javik" option for it, there'd be no way to repopulate because they'd all be male.
Human soldier, like any character, is sufficent in the hands of a skilled enough player. Doesn't mean it's on par with other characters. Geth tend to take much less damage because nothing takes them by surprise, so more health isn't as big a deal. I sure as hell never said human vanguard wasn't amazing. It's overpowered as hell. How was I not clear on that?!

[TheKingBoar]

Babi_Siha wrote...

TheKingBoar wrote...

Babi_Siha wrote...

Because there's only on prothean alive and it wouldn't make sense if suddenly more showed up. Simple as that.

There have been no less than 6 or 7 posts explaining why it would make perfect sense for more Protheans to show up.

Among them:
"Hey we found more stasis pods!" - not like we haven't done this twice already
cloning - which the salarians can and do use.
Whatever else Bioware's writers can come up with (liberated collectors, or what have you)

Protheans make perfect sense if you bother to use your noggin. End of story.

And at what point during the biggest war the galaxy had ever seen would the salarians have time to clone a whole species? I'm sure if cloning was that simple every race would clone their species in order not to go instinct and to have more soldiers to fight the Reapers.

About finding more stasis pods, if something like that had happened Shepard would probably learn about. Or at least something should be mentioned on the SP, since it wasn't, again it makes no sense to add them to MP since it never happened on the SP. Also, just because they were lucky enough to find one still functioning doesn't mean there are others.

No one ever said they had to clone the whole species, just enough to use them in powerful biotic strike forces. As for your other cloning point, it makes sense. I don't disagree with that, but that's for Bioware.

As for stasis pods, what precudes Prothean MP characters being realeased along side a SP DLC that explains their orgins?

"Also, just because they were lucky enough to find one still functioning doesn't mean there are others." It also doesn't mean that there can't be others.

[jaydubs67]

TheKingBoar wrote...
At this point, I think it is best to say that we agree to disagree. 

Okay.  

TheKingBoar wrote...
Javik's character is based upon his belief that he is the last of the Protheans. Given that they had many undocumented worlds, it isn't that much of a stretch to think they had more. 

 

I just want to see the MP match the SP.  If Protheans are found, Javik would find out about it through Shepard or Liara.  And I think it would require more content then a simple "oh I was wrong, I'm not the last Prothean" insert to make it fit.  If Bioware wants to actually add DLC content that deals with Javik coming to terms with finding more of his people, and whether that will fundamentally change his character, I would be very interested.  At that point I would also want Protheans in MP.  

TheKingBoar wrote...
I'll give you that Cerberus defectors are present through the storyline, but they don't match with the ideals of Cerberus that I remember. Not to mention the fact when defectors have been retconned in, they are dealt with swiftly and severely. 

 

The Alliance has generally seemed more than happy to get help from ex-Cerberus once the Reapers started showing up.  Accepting a place as indoctrinated servants of the Reapers seems counter to Cerberus's stated goals as ensuring human supremacy in the galaxy.  I guess I just don't really know what you mean.  

[JasonSic]

Protheans will come eventually.

[Nitrocuban]

How about an email to shepard "LOL we found like 1000 Protheans, they`ll fit with us. And they demand salarian livers."
Would that justify Protheans in MP?

[DRTJR]

You know what, Geth fighting Geth on an obscure transmission base is stretching the lore pretty thin, but I wanted Javicks powers in MP, so maybe genetically engineered adepts that are part Prothean.