9962 réponses à ce sujet

[fluffywalrus]

Cmdr. Ken Shepard wrote...

Hi all, Not sure this is the place for this, but figured if anything this is the place. I've done writing in the past but nothing "creative" like fanfic, so to say I'm a noob at it is being nice. Have some stuff I've jotted down but nothing I ultimately feel deserves to be added as my own personal epilogue. Would anyone with experience be willing to aid in advice and some help?

Welcome to the thread 
What kind of help/advice are you looking for?


You say you have some ideas jotted down, but that it's nothing you feell is worth writing up as your own story right now.
So, are you looking for help expanding it? Building characters? I'm not sure exactly what you're asking.

Some clarification could go a long way

Modifié par fluffywalrus, 14 août 2012 - 11:17 .

[hot_heart]

Cmdr. Ken Shepard wrote...

Hi all, Not sure this is the place for this, but figured if anything this is the place. I've done writing in the past but nothing "creative" like fanfic so to say I'm a noob at it is being nice. Have some stuff I've jotted down but nothing I ultimately feel deserves to be added as my own personal epilogue. Would anyone with experience be willing to aid in advice and some help?

We can try! The first part is figuring out what sort of epilogue you want to write.

In broad terms (i.e. doesn't have to be Mass Effect-related), what sort of stuff interests you, character and story-wise?

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

Refining characters and not straying too far from established canon. I'm willing to stretch it a bit for personal happiness but don't wanna go overboard.

I'd thinking chapter one will be something along the lines of discovering the body of Shepard, and after-crucible coordination using Hacket's point of view until I can tie in a conscious Shepard. Not sure how I should explain Shep's injuries, or ability to live with blown cybernetics (might leave this as a miracle sorta thing). My main thoughts were building into the new government that must come into play, rebuilding and Shep's role to the council and new promotion (in retirement) to Admiral. I've thought of making him Earth's Councilor or maybe even a Prime Minister type figure, and adding the Quarian's, rebuilt/salvaged Geth (which I'm not technical enough to even imagine if it might be possible). I wanna touch on politics, especially with everything being so new, plus it allows for an analyzation of where we are as a culture of how we view government.

I want the happy story stuff, white picket fence, marriage to LI, kid on the way...perfect life and then problem within the story. Issue is whats left? Reaper creators are semi-Missing in Action...do I have them come looking for their creation? Maybe this creator-Reaper is a God-like reaper?

My concern is doing something that feels connected to the story. I've read some fanfic (haven't read anyone's here yet tho) that is like all filler, and no real story. I don't want that.

Sorry for my ramblings, been up for a few hours in the early am staring at a rough draft and playing ME3 (again)

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

Forgot to add:

Have considered the ending already: After whatever problem I encounter in my story I will make that the end of problems for some decades. Shep and LI have children, Twin boys, and a girl...(thought this would be nice since Miranda will be LI). Want to do a Kane and Able type set up for the boys. Want something to be evil/renegade-ish with the one. Something evil but not sure how to connect this deep inner evil to the Reapers while having them destroyed. Likely something connected to the antagonist of my fanfic.

And since I didn't introduce myself, I'm Ken...

Modifié par Cmdr. Ken Shepard, 14 août 2012 - 11:29 .

[fluffywalrus]

Cmdr. Ken Shepard wrote...

Refining characters and not straying too far from established canon. I'm willing to stretch it a bit for personal happiness but don't wanna go overboard.

I'd thinking chapter one will be something along the lines of discovering the body of Shepard, and after-crucible coordination using Hacket's point of view until I can tie in a conscious Shepard. Not sure how I should explain Shep's injuries, or ability to live with blown cybernetics (might leave this as a miracle sorta thing). My main thoughts were building into the new government that must come into play, rebuilding and Shep's role to the council and new promotion (in retirement) to Admiral. I've thought of making him Earth's Councilor or maybe even a Prime Minister type figure, and adding the Quarian's, rebuilt/salvaged Geth (which I'm not technical enough to even imagine if it might be possible). I wanna touch on politics, especially with everything being so new, plus it allows for an analyzation of where we are as a culture of how we view government.

I want the happy story stuff, white picket fence, marriage to LI, kid on the way...perfect life and then problem within the story. Issue is whats left? Reaper creators are semi-Missing in Action...do I have them come looking for their creation? Maybe this creator-Reaper is a God-like reaper?

My concern is doing something that feels connected to the story. I've read some fanfic (haven't read anyone's here yet tho) that is like all filler, and no real story. I don't want that.

Sorry for my ramblings, been up for a few hours in the early am staring at a rough draft and playing ME3 (again)

Hrm, well, it seems you have a decent idea of what you want to do, just with missing details and unmade decisions and whatnot that would give your story wheels.

In terms of a villain after the reapers...I would say that trying to upstage the reapers would be difficult. Recall that the Reapers were the tools of the Starkid AI, and IIRC the reapers were based off of the primary space-faring lifeforms at the time. Don't know what reaper creators other than the Starkid AI that would exist. That, and the AI stated the Reapers don't really serve a worthwhile purpose anymore once Shepard makes it to the top.

I think that, while it's a popular post-ME3 story arc, the most logical course of action for a villain would be galactic politics. The reapers have been destroyed due to everyone banding together, but can that peace hold? Is cerberus still functional? What about other species' spec ops and Cerberus equivalents?
There are a lot of twists that you can do with it. Some stories utilize ME3 plot arcs to expand the post-ME3 political realm. Some have the council collapse under the weight of their previous mistakes, sometimes bringing Shepard in to fix it...sometimes bringing Shepard in as a scapegoat to sentence to death for war crimes in order for them to show some semblance of control over the galaxy. Some have Cerberus return with a vengeance. Some have mysterious organizations emerge with mysterious tech. Some have all the species battling indoctrinated forces on their homeworlds. Some have Shepard and co helping take back Omega, rebuilding Tuchanka, keeping the peace between certain species, bringing up new species under council space, Etc. Etc.

It might seem smaller in scope, but it's quite interesting stuff, and can be made out to be as dangerous. Deception and backstabbing are harder to fight than Reaper forces in some ways because you can't see it coming. It's not something you can fire a gun at.

Of course, if you want to have a god-reaper, I'd say go ahead, but the Reapers WERE crafted as gods by Bioware. Their concepts were heavily influenced by HP Lovecrafts creations, like Cthulhu and so forth. One upping gods is...it would require some amazing level of rationalization to sell me on the idea. That's just me though. *shrug*

There doesn't need to be a single overarching villain, or even a stable enemy. it could very well come in bursts across the story, certain challenges arise. There are a lot of open plot threads after ME3. Writing about Shep and co closing those threads isn't the worst idea, and it would allow you to stick close to the canon.

[hot_heart]

Cmdr. Ken Shepard wrote...
Shep and LI have children, Twin boys, and a girl...(thought this would be nice since Miranda will be LI).

I assume you've figured this into that part of the story as well.

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

fluffywalrus wrote...

Cmdr. Ken Shepard wrote...

Refining characters and not straying too far from established canon. I'm willing to stretch it a bit for personal happiness but don't wanna go overboard.

I'd thinking chapter one will be something along the lines of discovering the body of Shepard, and after-crucible coordination using Hacket's point of view until I can tie in a conscious Shepard. Not sure how I should explain Shep's injuries, or ability to live with blown cybernetics (might leave this as a miracle sorta thing). My main thoughts were building into the new government that must come into play, rebuilding and Shep's role to the council and new promotion (in retirement) to Admiral. I've thought of making him Earth's Councilor or maybe even a Prime Minister type figure, and adding the Quarian's, rebuilt/salvaged Geth (which I'm not technical enough to even imagine if it might be possible). I wanna touch on politics, especially with everything being so new, plus it allows for an analyzation of where we are as a culture of how we view government.

I want the happy story stuff, white picket fence, marriage to LI, kid on the way...perfect life and then problem within the story. Issue is whats left? Reaper creators are semi-Missing in Action...do I have them come looking for their creation? Maybe this creator-Reaper is a God-like reaper?

My concern is doing something that feels connected to the story. I've read some fanfic (haven't read anyone's here yet tho) that is like all filler, and no real story. I don't want that.

Sorry for my ramblings, been up for a few hours in the early am staring at a rough draft and playing ME3 (again)

Hrm, well, it seems you have a decent idea of what you want to do, just with missing details and unmade decisions and whatnot that would give your story wheels.

In terms of a villain after the reapers...I would say that trying to upstage the reapers would be difficult. Recall that the Reapers were the tools of the Starkid AI, and IIRC the reapers were based off of the primary space-faring lifeforms at the time. Don't know what reaper creators other than the Starkid AI that would exist. That, and the AI stated the Reapers don't really serve a worthwhile purpose anymore once Shepard makes it to the top.

I think that, while it's a popular post-ME3 story arc, the most logical course of action for a villain would be galactic politics. The reapers have been destroyed due to everyone banding together, but can that peace hold? Is cerberus still functional? What about other species' spec ops and Cerberus equivalents?
There are a lot of twists that you can do with it. Some stories utilize ME3 plot arcs to expand the post-ME3 political realm. Some have the council collapse under the weight of their previous mistakes, sometimes bringing Shepard in to fix it...sometimes bringing Shepard in as a scapegoat to sentence to death for war crimes in order for them to show some semblance of control over the galaxy. Some have Cerberus return with a vengeance. Some have mysterious organizations emerge with mysterious tech. Some have all the species battling indoctrinated forces on their homeworlds. Some have Shepard and co helping take back Omega, rebuilding Tuchanka, keeping the peace between certain species, bringing up new species under council space, Etc. Etc.

It might seem smaller in scope, but it's quite interesting stuff, and can be made out to be as dangerous. Deception and backstabbing are harder to fight than Reaper forces in some ways because you can't see it coming. It's not something you can fire a gun at.

Of course, if you want to have a god-reaper, I'd say go ahead, but the Reapers WERE crafted as gods by Bioware. Their concepts were heavily influenced by HP Lovecrafts creations, like Cthulhu and so forth. One upping gods is...it would require some amazing level of rationalization to sell me on the idea. That's just me though. *shrug*

There doesn't need to be a single overarching villain, or even a stable enemy. it could very well come in bursts across the story, certain challenges arise. There are a lot of open plot threads after ME3. Writing about Shep and co closing those threads isn't the worst idea, and it would allow you to stick close to the canon.

This appears to degree of getting started simpler, so brainstorming out loud I'm thinking Cerberus returns with a hand in politics. Maybe war with Krogan and Salarian's over the genophage cure? Council races splitting sides and shepard must play peace maker as a sort of Prime Minister? As for Cerberus, I like bringing them back with a vengence, have their new leader in a position of government (not sure where) maybe as President of Earth or something like that? A long supported beloved, benevolent democratic leader with an ugly hidden cerberus backing under TIM who now is able to front the organization? Especially since Cerberus funding is off the charts and unknown? Cerberus could start the Krogan-Salarian war...

Thanks to Cerberus, Earth gets a bad rep, Shepard must play cleanup..other races aside from Turians complain over Citadel being in Earth space and struggle with Human's being top dog? Don't know how Asari would pick sides, and if Krogan vs Salarian is gonna be a war, how in the world aside from tech-smarts do the Salarian's not get wiped out? Shep and council must step in to avoid mass genocide?

Or:

Maybe Kaiden Alenko isn't really dead, and is now the head of Cerberus? Although I guess Ashley might make more sense...hmm...

Not sure how to set up this character, never liked how Kei Lang was handled, such a cool character but no development really, although I can tell why.


Thanks for allowing my ramblings, and the help!

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

hot_heart wrote...

Cmdr. Ken Shepard wrote...
Shep and LI have children, Twin boys, and a girl...(thought this would be nice since Miranda will be LI).

I assume you've figured this into that part of the story as well.

Yes, wanted to develop and solve this early on. Figured the Asari owe Shep a few favors. Maybe Javik can help...

[hot_heart]

OK, I just figure you can mine that for story potential as well, rather than just 'skip over' it (though that's understandable).

And if your story concerns Cerberus, there are other characters you can bring into play. Miranda would most definitely have something to say. Plus, I don't really buy someone like Kaidan or Ashley as becoming part of (especially leading) Cerberus. That seems out of character.

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

hot_heart wrote...

OK, I just figure you can mine that for story potential as well, rather than just 'skip over' it (though that's understandable).

And if your story concerns Cerberus, there are other characters you can bring into play. Miranda would most definitely have something to say. Plus, I don't really buy someone like Kaidan or Ashley as becoming part of (especially leading) Cerberus. That seems out of character.

I figured a human government leader was the way to go, issue is do you figure Earth would have a President or what since it is still autonomous, but still falls under the Council...It dont figure its too hard to see a President of Earth who was a funder and supporter of Cerberus, and especially now sees a chance for human dominance riding on the coat tails of Shepard...problem is Shepard is in the position he wants, so descrediting Shepard must happen...maybe Reaper tech (that Cerberus still possesses) is used on one of the boys Shepard has? Take down his legacy from the inside seems Cerberus like, plus two birds one stone for going after Miranda.

Silly question: Would a darker type of tone work for a story like this? and If so how? Darker being like the latest batman trilogy. The writing for those films was amazingly done.

[fluffywalrus]

I would not buy Ash or Kaidan as members of Cerberus. Kaidan's too accepting of everyone, and Ash is Alliance to the bone, and hates terrorists and Cerberus' past.

A new character would work better, imo.

A darker tone would work. So would a moderate to light one. Make it what you will. Just try not to be too hamfisted about it.

As for how to take Shepard down, there are plenty of options. Through his family, his actions during the war, the involvement with Cerberus, the time spent around reaper tech, etc.

[hot_heart]

Hmm, well the relationships between the Earth nations themselves seem a little fractious, but that's not to say you could try and establish some story arc involving a move to institute a president of Earth in the wake of the Reaper war.

I would check stuff on the wiki for a little background though.

There's nothing wrong with a darker tone (I embrace it myself) but I always thought the important thing to recognise with the Nolan Batman films (the first two anyway) is that they strongly adhere to a 'theme'. There is a strong undercurrent that sort of defines the story. If you're looking at corruption and such, especially if it involves politics and Cerberus, there are some interesting things to consider from there.

[Lilivati]

lillitheris wrote...

@Lilivati: for me (and, I suspect, for many others) the problem isn’t the Catalyst, but the I SAID FEEL SAD DAMNIT railroading of emotion toward the human child in the beginning and throughout. (Edit: not that the Catalyst is helping, mind.)

It sounds like it worked OK for you, which is great. Also, CSR/PTSD doesn’t really ask what you’d like to be haunted by, but even still, it’s so contrived for me. Some say it should have been the VVictim, or the Li, or whatever, but in truth none of those would have satisfied everyone. The LI would have been safest…but personally I think it should have been handled by showing Shepard tossing and turning, eventually waking, then talking about “those dreams” to whomever—or just muttering it to themselves. This would leave the content either completely up to the player, or it could pivot so that Shepard can reply kid/Vv/LI and then that could be used for the twoother sequences. Or something. Anything, really.

It’s an unfortunate aspect of the ME3: The John Shepard Story motif they went with. Forgot it was a game, not a movie.

Apologies, typing on the pad.

I can agree that they forgot it's not a movie- that was actually my biggest problem with ME3.  I also think that's a big part of the reason Kai Leng fails to connect as a villain.  They're just like "here, look how awesome this guy is!" with no reason for him to be, regardless of the books.

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear, but I wasn't specifically discussing anything related to Shepard having PTSD.  You don't have to be mentally traumatized to be impacted by things in life.  I didn't see the dreams etc. as signs of specific mental illness but as evidence that after four years even Shepard is losing their cool- the stress is becoming too much.  If that's the way you interpret the dream sequences though, I can see why you'd dislike how it was handled.  The child doesn't seem to have high enough symbolic value, or is (as you said) too specific for an individual Shepard under those circumstances.

I also didn't get the "I FEEL SAD DAMMIT" vibe.  I mean, it could go that way, sure, but mostly what my main Shepard felt during the dreams was foreboding and horror.  A different Shepard was angry and resentful.  My paragon primarily felt regret.  I guess my experience on the whole was more open-feeling than yours.  

Anyway, it's interesting to see how different people reacted to the game.  It helps me reconsider and alter or solidify my own impressions.

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

fluffywalrus wrote...

I would not buy Ash or Kaidan as members of Cerberus. Kaidan's too accepting of everyone, and Ash is Alliance to the bone, and hates terrorists and Cerberus' past.

A new character would work better, imo.

A darker tone would work. So would a moderate to light one. Make it what you will. Just try not to be too hamfisted about it.

As for how to take Shepard down, there are plenty of options. Through his family, his actions during the war, the involvement with Cerberus, the time spent around reaper tech, etc.

Do you think Reaper tech aiding Cerberus, or Prothean Tech aiding them would work better? Regardless of if I find a role for Javik..?

Hmm, well the relationships between the Earth nations themselves seem a little fractious, but that's not to say you could try and establish some story arc involving a move to institute a president of Earth in the wake of the Reaper war.
I would check stuff on the wiki for a little background though.
There's nothing wrong with a darker tone (I embrace it myself) but I always thought the important thing to recognise with the Nolan Batman films (the first two anyway) is that they strongly adhere to a 'theme'. There is a strong undercurrent that sort of defines the story. If you're looking at corruption and such, especially if it involves politics and Cerberus, there are some interesting things to consider from there.

What sort of theme could you see working? I would like to avoid anything to close to the Batman trilogy but there are a lot of similarities, especially considering the events of the Reaper War. An incorruptable symbol. Other than that the only things that ever rang true for my Shep was Garrus' comment about him being a peacemaker, and Grunt's "Arm one hand, offer the other" comment in ME2.

Also, If I plan to dig into a biography sort of beginning/early Military career of Shep do I do that ASAP to build a story line up, or do I work on epilogue ME3 stuff since it is fresh?

[Spiritwolf1]

double post

Modifié par Spiritwolf1, 14 août 2012 - 12:55 .

[Spiritwolf1]

Lilivati wrote...

lillitheris wrote...

@Lilivati: for me (and, I suspect, for many others) the problem isn’t the Catalyst, but the I SAID FEEL SAD DAMNIT railroading of emotion toward the human child in the beginning and throughout. (Edit: not that the Catalyst is helping, mind.)

It sounds like it worked OK for you, which is great. Also, CSR/PTSD doesn’t really ask what you’d like to be haunted by, but even still, it’s so contrived for me. Some say it should have been the VVictim, or the Li, or whatever, but in truth none of those would have satisfied everyone. The LI would have been safest…but personally I think it should have been handled by showing Shepard tossing and turning, eventually waking, then talking about “those dreams” to whomever—or just muttering it to themselves. This would leave the content either completely up to the player, or it could pivot so that Shepard can reply kid/Vv/LI and then that could be used for the twoother sequences. Or something. Anything, really.

It’s an unfortunate aspect of the ME3: The John Shepard Story motif they went with. Forgot it was a game, not a movie.

Apologies, typing on the pad.

I can agree that they forgot it's not a movie- that was actually my biggest problem with ME3.  I also think that's a big part of the reason Kai Leng fails to connect as a villain.  They're just like "here, look how awesome this guy is!" with no reason for him to be, regardless of the books.

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear, but I wasn't specifically discussing anything related to Shepard having PTSD.  You don't have to be mentally traumatized to be impacted by things in life.  I didn't see the dreams etc. as signs of specific mental illness but as evidence that after four years even Shepard is losing their cool- the stress is becoming too much.  If that's the way you interpret the dream sequences though, I can see why you'd dislike how it was handled.  The child doesn't seem to have high enough symbolic value, or is (as you said) too specific for an individual Shepard under those circumstances.

I also didn't get the "I FEEL SAD DAMMIT" vibe.  I mean, it could go that way, sure, but mostly what my main Shepard felt during the dreams was foreboding and horror.  A different Shepard was angry and resentful.  My paragon primarily felt regret.  I guess my experience on the whole was more open-feeling than yours.  

Anyway, it's interesting to see how different people reacted to the game.  It helps me reconsider and alter or solidify my own impressions.

I'm not big and flowery with words (Really just a simple person) I don't read alot into thing. My interpretation of why it was the kid Shepard saw and not one of her friends was the  following:

Shepard had tried and wanted to save the boy but in her eyes failed. This relfected into her dream because Shepard wanted to save everyone and is slowly realizing she will not be able to. With the boy burning, in the last dream I always figured that was her fear of complete failure.

Again just a simple interpretation of the dream sequences

Modifié par Spiritwolf1, 14 août 2012 - 12:56 .

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

Agreed with Spiritwolf1

Every service member I have ever spoken to says its not the ones they kill that haunts them, but the ones they can't save. Know of a police officer who has similar dreams as Shep's of an young child he tried to save but couldn't, years later it still gives him nightmares.

The mind doesn't let go of things like that...

[hot_heart]

Cmdr. Ken Shepard wrote...
What sort of theme could you see working? I would like to avoid anything to close to the Batman trilogy but there are a lot of similarities, especially considering the events of the Reaper War. An incorruptable symbol. Other than that the only things that ever rang true for my Shep was Garrus' comment about him being a peacemaker, and Grunt's "Arm one hand, offer the other" comment in ME2.

Also, If I plan to dig into a biography sort of beginning/early Military career of Shep do I do that ASAP to build a story line up, or do I work on epilogue ME3 stuff since it is fresh?

I think immediate aftermath stuff would work. You can always lay some groundwork and skip ahead.

As for themes, that's up to you. Even filtering the Batman stuff through your own writing style and the ME universe will make it different enough. And a lot of it will depend on the end-state in which you left the galaxy. Earth is in ruins; What's going on with the Citadel?; Are the krogan cured? Do they know about the salarian dalatass' last minute attempt at subterfuge? The salarians appear to have suffered the least from the Reaper invasion.

Things could get pretty complicated.

[lillitheris]

Spiritwolf1 wrote...

Shepard had tried and wanted to save the boy but in her eyes failed. This relfected into her dream because Shepard wanted to save everyone and is slowly realizing she will not be able to. With the boy burning, in the last dream I always figured that was her fear of complete failure.

Again just a simple interpretation of the dream sequences

Sure, but that’s not the point You can always come up with an explanation for why something ‘should’ be the way it is. The point is that not every Shepard should have to be made to feel this way.

Just think of an uber-Renegade Shepard, for example. It’s just lazy movie writing.

[lillitheris]

Eek! Many postings, and I have to dash out…Cmdr. Ke(e)n, you’re in better hands in my absence

[hot_heart]

lillitheris wrote...
you’re in better hands in my absence

Lies. ALL LIES.

Modifié par hot_heart, 14 août 2012 - 02:31 .

[Spiritwolf1]

lillitheris wrote...

Spiritwolf1 wrote...

Shepard had tried and wanted to save the boy but in her eyes failed. This relfected into her dream because Shepard wanted to save everyone and is slowly realizing she will not be able to. With the boy burning, in the last dream I always figured that was her fear of complete failure.

Again just a simple interpretation of the dream sequences

Sure, but that’s not the point You can always come up with an explanation for why something ‘should’ be the way it is. The point is that not every Shepard should have to be made to feel this way.

Just think of an uber-Renegade Shepard, for example. It’s just lazy movie writing.

Well, really I think the point would be that everyone has their own interpretation of the dream, some are better then others coming up with reasons why Shepard is having that dream... That was my simple way of interpreting it. I always thought of my Shep as having deep feelings and fears that she hides from everyone if she has nightmares because of this then that just defines her even more.

Not saying everyone should feel that way, but I didn't feel sad about it either. I think a better term on how my Shep would feel with the dreams is weighted, and honestly it didn't feel forced on me.

I think there will be several different interpretation or meanings behind the dreams and honestly I dont think any of them are wrong

Modifié par Spiritwolf1, 14 août 2012 - 03:15 .

[MrStoob]

lillitheris wrote...

Cmdr. Ke(e)n

I got Commmander Keen with the ID pack I bought off Steam (absolute ****g bargain, 5 quid for ALL HL/HL2, Doom, Quake, Hexen, etc, etc).  Let's just say the old 2d platformer hadn't aged well lol.

[lillitheris]

hot_heart wrote...

lillitheris wrote...
Or pink if you’re an asari…

OK, now you've lost me.

There’s an as-yet explained oddity that the Crucible pulse and beam seemed crimson or purple to the human POVs, and pink to the asari…the other races are also unknown.

Modifié par lillitheris, 14 août 2012 - 07:23 .

[hot_heart]

Interesting. Very interesting...

Add more Miranda and I may just have to catch up on your story.