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[Efvie]

YurigirlzCrush wrote...

i'm confused by some of the recent posts here. I thought biotics were basically the manipulation of mass effect fields, which basically limits them to altering weight, gravity, momentium, and applying or dispersing force. was I wrong? could you actually use biotics to sign a name or pour yourself a glass of water? I didn't think they worked like telekinesis. did I misunderstand the whole thing throughout the games? or did I miss something? *pouts*

They only manipulate gravity, essentially.  And yes, in the gameplay lots of biotics doesn’t make much sense. It’s just a substitute for magic. Still, while the applications of such manipulation are limited, they’re not insubstantial… a variety of effects can be created.


Edit: oh, top.

An idle musing as I watch a nature documentary. One thing I meant to… well, mean to explore is the toll the Reaper war took on ecosystems. Silly as it might be, I figured that one distinctive factor Earth may have would be the ecosystem—despite the staggering amount of extinction of species that would happen in the next two hundred years, Earth would still have had an order of magnitude more species of flora and fauna than any of the other cultures. Lots of the aftermath in the story will because of reasons take place around Earth and involve many of the alien species. Figured it may have made an interesting detour. Of course the story’s promising to be a bit sprawling as it is, so…

Modifié par Efvie, 18 septembre 2013 - 07:50 .

[MrStoob]

Indeed, 'lift' basically inverts gravity, 'singularity' creates a gravity well, throw, etc. Warp/Reave/etc are a bit less in with this theme, except it could be said they manipulate the gravity fields on a molecular level. Or something...

But yea, a biotic might affect the gravity around themselves to be able to jump from great heights, or leap further, hit harder, etc. Scenes like Morinth vs Samara are a good example, Samara planting Morinth on the window, then them using the environment (furniture) as a weapon, trying to affect each other with fields and cancelling out each other's attempt, then finally the 'biotic punch' that Samara despatches Morinth with. All that can be 'explained' with mass effect fields / gravity manipulation.

Modifié par MrStoob, 18 septembre 2013 - 08:52 .

[Seracen]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Okay, first time posting in this thread. I took on a very long rewrite of the main story, like a lot of people did. I incorporated my character's backstory. I found I like to write. I'm probably not good at it. Some people think I am. I'm okay at suspense and character. Settings and descriptions could be a lot better. I can go back and re-do those.

Here's what happened. I was on my final two chapters and summer hit. This meant golf, and a couple of projects came up, and I never got around to finishing them. I completely lost interest in finishing it. 250 pages later. So I forced an ending and it's a complete lame parody, because I've written myself into a corner. I realized that due to the way the codex was set up, and the was the MEU was set up there is no way to defeat the reapers conventionally. There is clean up to do afterward.

How do you know when a reaper is dead? I guess that's when you've destroyed that thing they pumped the goop into, right? Otherwise you've just got a derelict reaper that'll indoctrinate everyone that goes on board, and you've got a mess again. So this means that every final shot has to be placed perfectly at each reaper, and that just isn't going to happen. Because if just one of those things isn't destroyed someone will find it and haul it to their home planet, research it and the whole cycle will start over again. Is this what Bioware ran into with them? Is this why we couldn't have a conventional victory? The only other way was to introduce a virus that would destroy that part of those things, but then you'd have to make sure you got every one of them, or make them a networked intelligence and use a computer type virus that spreads via their communications, but then it still has to kill the syntho-organic part and make sense. My brain started hurting.

Fortunately I had left the Crucible in, but it was supposed to do something else, but at the last second I said f*** it, had it attach to the Citadel. Had Shepard's entire crew doing squad banter debating the entire time while it was entering the system (different squad) on the Citadel and did this ever get lame -- it was more of a parody than anything, And Tali works the panel opens to figure out how the thing works, and a button drops down and Javik pushes it and all the reapers blow up. The End. This after a serious story. Lame. That is how much I stopped caring about the story. I'm ashamed of myself.

I still wonder if this is what BW ran into with the reapers. They couldn't write a decent ending without a HUGE retcon. You know one that made the one they did look like Mary Poppins.

Well, I suppose if they could figure a way to inoculate vs Indoctrination, that's one way...or if they found a way to block the Reaper signal.

I personally always viewed the Crucible as a giant EMP that fries the Reapers much like what Legion does to the Geth in ME2.

Sorry about your ending.  I am trying to avoid a similar problem in my own story.  Luckily for me, I have it plotted out, I just have to flesh in the details.  It's as much for myself as for the readers I hope to entertain.  I would kick myself if I got 50 chapters in and faltered at the last 2. 

Best of luck in your future writing, but the whole point is to have fun.  There's no reason to force yourself otherwise. 

[Seracen]

Efvie wrote...

YurigirlzCrush wrote...

i'm confused by some of the recent posts here. I thought biotics were basically the manipulation of mass effect fields, which basically limits them to altering weight, gravity, momentium, and applying or dispersing force. was I wrong? could you actually use biotics to sign a name or pour yourself a glass of water? I didn't think they worked like telekinesis. did I misunderstand the whole thing throughout the games? or did I miss something? *pouts*

They only manipulate gravity, essentially.  And yes, in the gameplay lots of biotics doesn’t make much sense. It’s just a substitute for magic. Still, while the applications of such manipulation are limited, they’re not insubstantial… a variety of effects can be created.


Edit: oh, top.

An idle musing as I watch a nature documentary. One thing I meant to… well, mean to explore is the toll the Reaper war took on ecosystems. Silly as it might be, I figured that one distinctive factor Earth may have would be the ecosystem—despite the staggering amount of extinction of species that would happen in the next two hundred years, Earth would still have had an order of magnitude more species of flora and fauna than any of the other cultures. Lots of the aftermath in the story will because of reasons take place around Earth and involve many of the alien species. Figured it may have made an interesting detour. Of course the story’s promising to be a bit sprawling as it is, so…

I always got the feeling that gameplay started messing with how biotics actually were written in the canon.

Gravity manipulation would certainly give the appearance of telekenesis (per the Citadel DLC party scene).  I suppose some explanation of EM currents could be used to explain Reav and Dominate.

Again, this is where the disconnect came with a lot of the "space magic" that appeared in ME3.

Per the ecosystem debate: certainly an interesting and pertinent idea.  I can see, however, howa galactic scale epic might have litle time to afford for such nuance.

Still, it's scary to think of how the bee population is being affected in modern times, and how a devastation in their numbers could lead to worldwide negative repurcussions.  A Reaper attack would absolutely decimate such an ecosystem.

For that matter, it remids me of the Quarians, and how THEIR ecosystem caused an adaptation to INCORPORATE foreign environs, and how this basically screwed them when the coming onto the galactic stage.

Modifié par Seracen, 18 septembre 2013 - 09:07 .

[MrStoob]

On a separate note... I was just looking at my FF stuff and it always looks like the first two characters mentioned are the 'ship'. So on one of mine it looks like 'Liara/Miranda' but it's not, they're just the main characters. I've no particular pairings in mind for this one, except possibly an OC with someone other than the crew of Miranda's craft. Hm. Wonder how many have been put off by that?

[Seracen]

MrStoob wrote...

On a separate note... I was just looking at my FF stuff and it always looks like the first two characters mentioned are the 'ship'. So on one of mine it looks like 'Liara/Miranda' but it's not, they're just the main characters. I've no particular pairings in mind for this one, except possibly an OC with someone other than the crew of Miranda's craft. Hm. Wonder how many have been put off by that?

I know what you mean, this happened to me when uploading my stories as well, lol.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Seracen wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Okay, first time posting in this thread. I took on a very long rewrite of the main story, like a lot of people did. I incorporated my character's backstory. I found I like to write. I'm probably not good at it. Some people think I am. I'm okay at suspense and character. Settings and descriptions could be a lot better. I can go back and re-do those.

Here's what happened. I was on my final two chapters and summer hit. This meant golf, and a couple of projects came up, and I never got around to finishing them. I completely lost interest in finishing it. 250 pages later. So I forced an ending and it's a complete lame parody, because I've written myself into a corner. I realized that due to the way the codex was set up, and the was the MEU was set up there is no way to defeat the reapers conventionally. There is clean up to do afterward.

How do you know when a reaper is dead? I guess that's when you've destroyed that thing they pumped the goop into, right? Otherwise you've just got a derelict reaper that'll indoctrinate everyone that goes on board, and you've got a mess again. So this means that every final shot has to be placed perfectly at each reaper, and that just isn't going to happen. Because if just one of those things isn't destroyed someone will find it and haul it to their home planet, research it and the whole cycle will start over again. Is this what Bioware ran into with them? Is this why we couldn't have a conventional victory? The only other way was to introduce a virus that would destroy that part of those things, but then you'd have to make sure you got every one of them, or make them a networked intelligence and use a computer type virus that spreads via their communications, but then it still has to kill the syntho-organic part and make sense. My brain started hurting.

Fortunately I had left the Crucible in, but it was supposed to do something else, but at the last second I said f*** it, had it attach to the Citadel. Had Shepard's entire crew doing squad banter debating the entire time while it was entering the system (different squad) on the Citadel and did this ever get lame -- it was more of a parody than anything, And Tali works the panel opens to figure out how the thing works, and a button drops down and Javik pushes it and all the reapers blow up. The End. This after a serious story. Lame. That is how much I stopped caring about the story. I'm ashamed of myself.

I still wonder if this is what BW ran into with the reapers. They couldn't write a decent ending without a HUGE retcon. You know one that made the one they did look like Mary Poppins.

Well, I suppose if they could figure a way to inoculate vs Indoctrination, that's one way...or if they found a way to block the Reaper signal.

I personally always viewed the Crucible as a giant EMP that fries the Reapers much like what Legion does to the Geth in ME2.

Sorry about your ending.  I am trying to avoid a similar problem in my own story.  Luckily for me, I have it plotted out, I just have to flesh in the details.  It's as much for myself as for the readers I hope to entertain.  I would kick myself if I got 50 chapters in and faltered at the last 2. 

Best of luck in your future writing, but the whole point is to have fun.  There's no reason to force yourself otherwise. 

Yeah, I thought I had everything perfectly set up. A nice battle plan. The Geth-Quarian arc was totally different. PTSD Shepard was very well researched. No Mary Sues. (I took the "writer's Mary Sue Test" for each) I beat up each character sufficiently. Shepard smoked a lot and drank and felt the "benefits". Dr. Chakwas smoked. Okay, I had a writer's pet for a while. I had the indoctrination covered, so I thought, then I got to the end and realized that 2000 capital ships (I figured losses), plus destroyers scattered throughout the galaxy plus 18000 derelict ships all over the galaxy that we didn't know about from previous cycles. I sat there at my keyboard with at WTF look on my face I was looking at:

"Wake up."
"Where am I?"
"The Citadel. It is my home."

But since we already blew up that part of the Citadel.... 

So I pushed the button and blew up the reapers. The end.

"There has to be another way."

It's almost like now after doing this I can look at the plot for the series when we hit Arrival and see a crap ending coming. There is no way out. Can you imagine if we got the ending that could actually lead to a sequel? Forget this catalyst crap.

1. Get your team to the Citadel & Dock the Crucible
2. Fight the posessed Illusive Man  
3. Push the button - blow up all the organo-slushie parts of the reapers in the Galaxy, and leave the mass relays and everything else intact. No reaper tech can indoctrinate anymore.
4. Epilogue - Shepard and LI fly off into the sunset.  
5. Credits - 80's Hard Rock Music.
6. Commander Shepard has become a legend. Buy DLC. 

Yeah, this would have been better than we got. Still lame, but better.

I'm glad the reaper plot is over.

[Seracen]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

(snip)

It's almost like now after doing this I can look at the plot for the series when we hit Arrival and see a crap ending coming. There is no way out. Can you imagine if we got the ending that could actually lead to a sequel? Forget this catalyst crap.

1. Get your team to the Citadel & Dock the Crucible
2. Fight the posessed Illusive Man  
3. Push the button - blow up all the organo-slushie parts of the reapers in the Galaxy, and leave the mass relays and everything else intact. No reaper tech can indoctrinate anymore.
4. Epilogue - Shepard and LI fly off into the sunset.  
5. Credits - 80's Hard Rock Music.
6. Commander Shepard has become a legend. Buy DLC. 

Yeah, this would have been better than we got. Still lame, but better.

I'm glad the reaper plot is over.

I've said this before, but I found the Reapers much more interesting when they were an enigma.  Nor do I feel they NEEDED to be explained.

Heck, the original ending would have rendered the series unplayable for me, if I hadn't wrote my own (even with the plot BW presented preserved, I still feel there was stuff worth salvaging).

I am writing my supposed ME4 ending, but the story is still dealing with repurcussions from ME3, and loose plot threads from ME2.

It'll be interesting to see how the ME universe moves on after the Reaper threat.  Honestly, I don't feel this need to make some universe threatening baddie again, as that can lead to the original trilogy feeling cheap.

Arguably, I feel that Star Trek will have benefitted from the reboot by this reasoning.

Anyhoo, I figure one can make an interesting progression given enough material, and ME gave us plenty.  I never really felt that it was beyond salvaging.  Honestly, I've seen a ton of fan creations that make an amazing bookend to the story, and I wrote one myself as well.

Its debatable whether we like it more b/c of what we got, or if we'd have hated these works otherwise, but that's what interactive fiction is all about.

We are crafting our own worlds, after all.  However long it takes me to write my last two chapters, this thought alone will keep warm feelings in my heart concerning this project, and ME in general.

Modifié par Seracen, 18 septembre 2013 - 10:47 .

[MrStoob]

In other news...

As I've said, been updating 'Blue' as I post it to AO3, nothing extreme so far, just 'tidying'.  So in some parts I'd called the Minagen-X3 'red sand', which I know annoys some so I've updated it.  I did the same mistake by saying that an Eclipse Sister used red sand to boost her biotics, which I now know is incorrect.  But having hardened mercs saying 'Minagen-X3' or even 'Minagen' all the time seemed a mouthful and not snappy enough for them.  So: Minagen X3>Minagen Triple X>Triple X>Trips.  I've them all calling it 'trips' now.  The words 'plan' and 'together' spring to mind.

Modifié par MrStoob, 19 septembre 2013 - 10:13 .

[Fatiguesdualism]

@BlueMoonSeraphim - Good Luck.  I hope you enjoy yourself and please let us now when and where you post (talking of, has anyone seen Drussius recently?)  

@Seracen - I agree with you about the Reapers remaining unexplained, but (sorry ) I'm toying with an explanation of their motives (AU not Canon) and it's just soo tempting to run with it.  Maybe that's what happened to the Bioware Staff too?

YurigirlzCrush wrote...

i'm confused by some of the recent posts here. I thought biotics were basically the manipulation of mass effect fields, which basically limits them to altering weight, gravity, momentium, and applying or dispersing force. was I wrong? could you actually use biotics to sign a name or pour yourself a glass of water? I didn't think they worked like telekinesis. did I misunderstand the whole thing throughout the games? or did I miss something? *pouts*

This has always been my take on biotics as well, which has been inconsistently applied (IMHO) throughout ME2 and ME3 (Dominate it the worst culprit for me).  Though I think for your examples (name signing and water pouring) could be done via multiple, almost microscopic mass effect fields (think micro-singularities - 1 to lift and hold the pen above the paper, then a series at the nib to actually 'write') the amount of control and finesse needed would be scary - you'd probably also have to nail the piece of paper to the desk as well!  

Or more simply it's not about manipulating the object - it's more about manipulating the space around the object.  Of course that's all personal head-canon (of course)

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

How do you know when a reaper is dead? I guess that's when you've destroyed that thing they pumped the goop into, right? Otherwise you've just got a derelict reaper that'll indoctrinate everyone that goes on board, and you've got a mess again.

I would say a Reaper's only fully dead once the bally thing has been disassembled - completely.  How you would go about doing that...well I believed that what was ME3 was going to be about.  I learned my lesson, though!   To be honest I expected Dark Energy to have a more prevalent part to play (warning what comes next is head-canon and cartoon physics - I studied Biology at school instead) 
Basically IF Dark Energy (DE) is accelerating the expansion of the universe AND matter is not really solid - just particles held together by energy fields (the word magnet comes to mind for some reason). COULD you not manipulate DE to effect a nominated target - say a Reaper until the energy fields holding it together fizzled (technical term ) and the thing basically disintegrates?
Which would mean when the Relay in Arrival goes boom, the DE it manipulates doesn't blow up the system - it disintegrates [the matter in the system] instead?

I apologise to physicists and my Science Teacher (sorry I forgot your name) if that is complete nonsense though!

Modifié par Fatiguesdualism, 19 septembre 2013 - 02:12 .

[Seracen]

@ Stoob: seems reasonable, and fitting...tripping on "trips."  Although, I think Femshep would much rather lick Thane and get her groovy chemicals that way...lol

@ Fatigue: no worries! Also, the DE thing depends on how we consider antimatter reactions to work. IIRC, Eezo functions similarly to antimatter, which is why relay destruction = death. Dark Energy, therefore, might react violently and nullify whatever it contacts.

Now, whether this nullification comes as a violent reaction, a disintegration, or increases gravity so high things cave into black-holes, we just don't know; and I don't think ME canon has an official answer. As such, I think artistic license is allowable.

Modifié par Seracen, 19 septembre 2013 - 08:12 .

[YurigirlzCrush]

I dunno. I guess I missed the stuff with the asari biotically levitating scrap metal. but what Kaidan said about his friend in training was that she reached for a glass of water instead of pulling it biotically. which I guess is sort of telekinesis, but I thought it fit within the framework of what biotics did. I just don't think it could be used like telekinesis or the force, to type on a keyboard or do super-fine manipulation. *shrugs*

still can't find the thing I was looking for about the leaked ending that was scrapped for ME3. I wish I could remember more about it, but it was all about dark energy buildup throughout the galaxy, and that the reapers harvested the species for some sort of process that sort of reset the progression of the dark energy buildup. and the final choice in the game was supposed to be how the reapers could harvest the current cycle and begin again in 50,000 years, or that something was special about humanity that would let them fix the problem permanently, but only if the human race would volunteer to be harvested. something like that. *sighs* I don't remember all the details. but I do remember that the dark energy buildup was supposed to be the focus of the entire issue. and then they just nixed that and went a whole different direction with space magic.

but anyways, I agree with you guys that the reapers were better when they were unexplained. they're machines. maybe they harvest everything because they use the material as confetti in dark space cthulu-themed parties! *grins* who cares? they wanna kill everything. that's reason enough to stop them!

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

YurigirlzCrush wrote...

I dunno. I guess I missed the stuff with the asari biotically levitating scrap metal. but what Kaidan said about his friend in training was that she reached for a glass of water instead of pulling it biotically. which I guess is sort of telekinesis, but I thought it fit within the framework of what biotics did. I just don't think it could be used like telekinesis or the force, to type on a keyboard or do super-fine manipulation. *shrugs*

still can't find the thing I was looking for about the leaked ending that was scrapped for ME3. I wish I could remember more about it, but it was all about dark energy buildup throughout the galaxy, and that the reapers harvested the species for some sort of process that sort of reset the progression of the dark energy buildup. and the final choice in the game was supposed to be how the reapers could harvest the current cycle and begin again in 50,000 years, or that something was special about humanity that would let them fix the problem permanently, but only if the human race would volunteer to be harvested. something like that. *sighs* I don't remember all the details. but I do remember that the dark energy buildup was supposed to be the focus of the entire issue. and then they just nixed that and went a whole different direction with space magic.

but anyways, I agree with you guys that the reapers were better when they were unexplained. they're machines. maybe they harvest everything because they use the material as confetti in dark space cthulu-themed parties! *grins* who cares? they wanna kill everything. that's reason enough to stop them!

It is basically this ending used in this mod. 

http://social.biowar...7750/1#14377750

The problem is that since it is the final story in the series with Shepard surviving the ending where you destroy the reapers which was in the original script, since I tend to not play "paragons" ever but rather conniving characters which got taken totally out of my hands in the third installment, I would destroy the reapers, because it was the final installment and who cares afterward? My character would be dead by the time the end of the galaxy happened.

I'm just glad the reaper plot is over. We're working on yet another rewrite where we've severely nerfed the reapers and are using more hard science. Shepard has to choose sides and alliances. Tech trees need to be researched. The story is going to be dark. But indoctrination is being nerfed severely. 

I found my favorite types of characters to write are the conniving sociopaths that have some redeeming qualities. They're the most interesting. Good characters are boring as hell. Same with evil characters.... boring.

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 19 septembre 2013 - 09:26 .

[Rixatrix]

YurigirlzCrush wrote...
still can't find the thing I was looking for about the leaked ending that was scrapped for ME3. I wish I could remember more about it, but it was all about dark energy buildup throughout the galaxy, and that the reapers harvested the species for some sort of process that sort of reset the progression of the dark energy buildup. and the final choice in the game was supposed to be how the reapers could harvest the current cycle and begin again in 50,000 years, or that something was special about humanity that would let them fix the problem permanently, but only if the human race would volunteer to be harvested. something like that. *sighs* I don't remember all the details. but I do remember that the dark energy buildup was supposed to be the focus of the entire issue. and then they just nixed that and went a whole different direction with space magic.

This article explains the gist of it: Mass Effect 3: series’ former lead writer reveals original ending ideas, but this is the leaked script I know of.

[MrStoob]

Ah, was just about to post that article BlueMoon. Indeedly, basically confirmed that they threw a lot of ideas in the air and saw what stuck, or something.

[Seracen]

Yep, remember reading both of those. I read the leaked script a month before the game came out. I was glad some of the stuff got cut, saddened other stuff didn't make it.

The ending, to be honest, NEVER looked like it was going to please me, whether it was the Dark Energy Plot, or the Deus Ex knockoffs in the leaked script (not this one, but another draft). I suppose it would have been less jarring if the ending to ME2 hadn't been so perfect. I mean, for a "dark 2nd act," one could potentially avoid ANY sacrifice.

What concerns me more is that there was no clear vision of what the ending would be, even so far into production.  That is like...the second thing I think of when writing a story!

Well, at least the Dark Energy Plot would have roped in ME2 a little better. Still, as I've said before, it's all fodder for fanfic at this point, and an easier way to "legitimize" anything I write.

Modifié par Seracen, 20 septembre 2013 - 03:43 .

[Ignis Mors]

Seracen wrote...

Yep, remember reading both of those. I read the leaked script a month before the game came out. I was glad some of the stuff got cut, saddened other stuff didn't make it.

The ending, to be honest, NEVER looked like it was going to please me, whether it was the Dark Energy Plot, or the Deus Ex knockoffs in the leaked script (not this one, but another draft). I suppose it would have been less jarring if the ending to ME2 hadn't been so perfect. I mean, for a "dark 2nd act," one could potentially avoid ANY sacrifice.

What concerns me more is that there was no clear vision of what the ending would be, even so far into production.  That is like...the second thing I think of when writing a story!

Well, at least the Dark Energy Plot would have roped in ME2 a little better. Still, as I've said before, it's all fodder for fanfic at this point, and an easier way to "legitimize" anything I write.

Hmm. What if that was Bioware's plan all along? They knew that they couldn't create enough different endings to the Mass Effect franchise to satisfy even a majority of their fanbase. So, they made a garbage ending to more legitimize the fan-made stuff. That way the fanbase could create a plethora of endings, to (hopefully) satisfy everyone. 

[YurigirlzCrush]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

I'm just glad the reaper plot is over. We're working on yet another rewrite where we've severely nerfed the reapers and are using more hard science. Shepard has to choose sides and alliances. Tech trees need to be researched. The story is going to be dark. But indoctrination is being nerfed severely. 

see, I liked the idea of the reapers as a mysterious and insanely powerful force that couldn't be directly defeated. nerfing them, and especially taking the sting out of indoctrination, which is their most frightening and versatile tool, just cheapens the entire series imo.

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

I found my favorite types of characters to write are the conniving sociopaths that have some redeeming qualities. They're the most interesting. Good characters are boring as hell. Same with evil characters.... boring.

sadly I have to disagree here too. not that I can say such a character isn't fun for you to write. you say it is, so i'm sure that's true. *smiles* but as a reader primarily, conniving sociopaths don't make for very immersive reading. characters need to be relatable, and for me, a conniving sociopath with just a few redeeming (and presumably relatable) qualities is a character I wouldn't be invested enough in to care what happens to them. I doubt i'd read more than a few chapters about anyone who could be described as a sociopath. I just can't see myself caring about them. except perhaps in seeing them get what they deserve (read: something bad) *shrug*

I agree that 100% good characters are boring. there's nothing interesting or compelling about them. they're not realistic. the same with 100% evil. but for me, as a reader, relatable protagonists are the key. if I can't relate to them, I can't really care about them. and if the reader doesn't care about the protagonist, the whole story falls down.

[Efvie]

YurigirlzCrush wrote...

I dunno. I guess I missed the stuff with the asari biotically levitating scrap metal. but what Kaidan said about his friend in training was that she reached for a glass of water instead of pulling it biotically. which I guess is sort of telekinesis, but I thought it fit within the framework of what biotics did. I just don't think it could be used like telekinesis or the force, to type on a keyboard or do super-fine manipulation. *shrugs*

It would be extremely difficult to generate gravity fields that sufficiently affect an object without affecting things around it, especially moving one. I suppose theoretically possible, though.

[Seracen]

Ignis Mors wrote...

Seracen wrote...

Yep, remember reading both of those. I read the leaked script a month before the game came out. I was glad some of the stuff got cut, saddened other stuff didn't make it.

The ending, to be honest, NEVER looked like it was going to please me, whether it was the Dark Energy Plot, or the Deus Ex knockoffs in the leaked script (not this one, but another draft). I suppose it would have been less jarring if the ending to ME2 hadn't been so perfect. I mean, for a "dark 2nd act," one could potentially avoid ANY sacrifice.

What concerns me more is that there was no clear vision of what the ending would be, even so far into production.  That is like...the second thing I think of when writing a story!

Well, at least the Dark Energy Plot would have roped in ME2 a little better. Still, as I've said before, it's all fodder for fanfic at this point, and an easier way to "legitimize" anything I write.

Hmm. What if that was Bioware's plan all along? They knew that they couldn't create enough different endings to the Mass Effect franchise to satisfy even a majority of their fanbase. So, they made a garbage ending to more legitimize the fan-made stuff. That way the fanbase could create a plethora of endings, to (hopefully) satisfy everyone. 

Heh, that would be an amazing troll.  Actually, that was some of the reasoning behind the Indoctrination Theory.

While an interesting idea, I am unsure whether this is a sound strategy to endear oneself to the fanbase.

Having said that, I think an interesting twist is what I suggest Valve does to avoid digging themselves into a hole with Halflife 3.  Honestly, this far after HL2, there's no way to meet fan expectation.

Therefore, why not release it in two parts, and then release dev kits for fan creations?  Then, the community votes on the best ones, and the top 10 or so are bundled in a "complete" edition, along with the main dev team's ending.

By this logic, in addition the the EC DLC, we could also have gotten MEHEM, MEEM, Archengeia's Ending, IT, Mad Hamlet's Ending, and the amazing works of Lady Insanity.

Sure, these are on youtube already, but with dev kits and teams behind such ideas, we may have gotten large productions out of these projects (perhaps even Marauder Shields)!

This is, in part, why I created my DVD compilation of endings, so I could have a DISK to bundle in with my game boxes.

I can respect the "speculations by everyone" sentiment, to allow us to come to our own endings, but not the way in which is was presented.

Still, as I said before, I am grateful that enough gold hit the cutting room floor that I have been able to co-opt the Dark Energy plot for my "ME4" fic.

[MrStoob]

Seracen wrote...
Having said that, I think an interesting twist is what I suggest Valve does to avoid digging themselves into a hole with Halflife 3.  Honestly, this far after HL2, there's no way to meet fan expectation.

Jimquisition did a good bit about this.  There's a lot of singing and dancing and shouting from the roof tops from publishers/developers about how amazing and immersive and innovatinve a new game is going to be, but Valve don't get involved in all that.  Every now and again they'll just say, "Oh, the new Portal/L4D/Half Life/thing is coming out soon." and let the games speak for themselves.

Some of the hype for Alien: Space Marines was shocking, just misrepresentation and blatant lies about the game.  While not quite so bad, Bioshock: Infinite was guilty of this too.  So eager to show off all their ideas but not actually knowing which ideas are going to make the cut, leaving a bad taste for the consumer as we feel 'ripped off'.

Modifié par MrStoob, 20 septembre 2013 - 10:39 .

[Efvie]

Baby steps… I just did an edit pass of one of my chapters. Perhaps one day I’ll actually be able to write again :/

[hot_heart]

Efvie wrote...

Baby steps… I just did an edit pass of one of my chapters. Perhaps one day I’ll actually be able to write again :/

Hooray!

[Fatiguesdualism]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

*snip* (apologies)

I found my favorite types of characters to write are the conniving sociopaths that have some redeeming qualities. They're the most interesting.

What children?    (I'm sure there was a psych paper written a few years back about how children have to learn/grow into developing empathy etc - that it's not something that comes 'pre-programmed' so to speak.  Although the paper has probably been discredited/debunked by now!) 

Seriously though - can't remember who said it, but they basically claimed it's the character's flaws that make a character believable and interesting to write.  I suppose flaws lead to characters making mistakes, which creates drama.  Hmm...Flaws lead to mistakes, mistakes lead to drama, drama leads to....(that last sentence probably works best when read aloud in a certain green muppety manner. NO not Kermit, the other one!  )

Modifié par Fatiguesdualism, 22 septembre 2013 - 10:58 .

[hot_heart]

Though, really, he should be saying it more like, "To anger, fear leads. To hate, anger leads. To suffering, hate leads." Only it would've sounded even more like nonsense.

And, yeah, flawed characters are interesting because that creates story and a good story 'comes from character'.