4520 réponses à ce sujet

[Seival]

Bocks wrote...

HagarIshay wrote...

... And destroy doesn't force itself on the galaxy...?

The only choice that doesn't force anyone is refuse. And well... We all know how that ended.

Do you remember what everyone expected the Crucible to do?

Destroy the Reapers.

That's why ME Trilogy ending concept is brilliant. You never expected what may happen in the end, and the final decision will be really tough.

[Seival]

Ieldra2 wrote...

jtav wrote...
Because I am not a moral relativist. Some things are objectively good or evil. And there are a few phrases in the description that are worrying. Control's outcome hinges on the continuing goodness and sanity of one entity. I wouldn't give a human that kind of power, let alone an AI.

I disagree about the objective morality. Morality is nothing without context, and being a human is a context. Human morality is structured in a certain way because we're a hypersocial species whose primary evolutionary advantage is our extremely developed ability to co-operate. No other known species develops so complex social interdependencies. Hive-mind species like the Rachni would develop a completely different morality, though with some overlap.

As for Control, I would rather give an AI such power than a human. The reason why autocrats aren't liked in many human cultures is that (a) their rule is never impartial and ( they are usually backed by interest groups who expect privileges. The Control entity wouldn't have that problem. 

I believe that a human being (or someone similar in terms of overall properties and abilities) is just physically unable to Control the Reapers. That's why you need a super-advanced AI with unlimited processing power as the collective mind of all Reapers.

Modifié par Seival, 23 juillet 2012 - 11:44 .

[obZen DF]

pirate1802 wrote...

I find paragon control to be the second-best ending after synthesis (according to me). Renegade control, however I think is quite scary. When my reapershepard was talking of how she will lead an army none would dare oppose I wished I'd selected destroy.

I'm sure he's talking about leading the Reapers and protecting the Galaxy to an outside force, maybe from another galaxy. Or, [For instance], If the Krogan are rising into numbers and getting dangerous. Shepard will protect the galaxy from the 2nd Krogan Rebellions. The Krogan wouldn't dare oppose the Reapers on their one. That's how I interpret that sentence.

Modifié par obZen DF, 23 juillet 2012 - 12:18 .

[Seival]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

I have noticed about this thread that there always seems to be Destoyers coming in and trying to justify their decision.

Anyway I never picked Control, a Synthesis guy here, but Control is definately my second favourite ending and the one with the most awesome narrator.

Yes, this looks rather strange. Instead of supporting Destroy in their own support thread, some Destroyers prefer to do so in Control or Synthesis support threads. Maybe they don't know they have their own support thread? I think I should help them to find it: http://social.biowar.../index/12264531

Modifié par Seival, 23 juillet 2012 - 08:16 .

[Seival]

pirate1802 wrote...

I find paragon control to be the second-best ending after synthesis (according to me). Renegade control, however I think is quite scary. When my reapershepard was talking of how she will lead an army none would dare oppose I wished I'd selected destroy.

Well, I didn't include Renegade Control in my personal rating at all, because I just can't play Renegade... As I said, I tried it several times, but each time stopped in the first quarter of ME1. Renegade is just not my way.

Modifié par Seival, 23 juillet 2012 - 08:31 .

[Seival]

Hmm... Some other interesting thoughts. Hasks... There are many types of them, each with its own advantages. Which peaceful jobs can they perform easily?

I think that:
- Human hasks will be great builders.
- Brutes also builders, but for some heavy tasks.
- Banshees... A part special police force maybe?
- Turian hasks and Batarian hasks... They clearly can't fit any peaceful profession, so will remain pure millitary.

- Salarian hasks... Like someone already said - they will eat flys
- Volus hasks... Not sure about those...
- Quarian hasks... Not sure if there are any, because of that terrible allergic reaction on everything (reapers included).

...Any thoughts on those ones and some others, like Hanar or Elcor?

Modifié par Seival, 23 juillet 2012 - 10:03 .

[DirtyPhoenix]

Mesina2 wrote...
She hates what was done to her, but had to dealt with it and put it to good use at least.

Maybe I don't remember everything but i didn't get the idea that she explicitly hates being perfected genetically. The way she describes herself in her cabin in ME2 indicates that she is pleased that her modifications have allowed her to be a step ahead of everybody. Yeah i know she hates not being able to mother a child, but most of the time she seems upbead about her modifications; in ME2 atleast. Her hate is more towards the fact that her father controlled every aspect of her life.

I'm not changing anyone forcibly in other endings to something else.

You are killing the geth in destroy, and probably some organics too. Also you become omnipotent reaper-god in control, you force your will on the whole galaxy. You can enforce synthesis if you want, or something far more nasty. the galaxy basically becomes your plaything. you have the power to change anything and everything. And how is synthesis worse that refuse? You change (kill) everything.

If everyone get's everything and everyone is peaceful, where would new challenges come?
From other galaxy?

Maybe. Its a big universe, the threat doesn't even have to be sentient; could be an apocalypse. Two galaxies colliding? Exploring other galaxies? The opportunities are limitless. Regardless, I didn't say nor do I expect everything to be peaceful after synthesis.

And your example doesn't even ad up.

Maybe I worded it badly, I wanted to show that people have unrealistic fear about the future (what you said about immortality leading to problems). What I meant to say that people in the past have expressed fear about many things, none of which have happened.

Bocks wrote...

tl;dr: You can sugarcoat it, but it's objectively morally wrong.

You can avoid it, but no two persons have the exact same idea of what is morally right and morally wrong.

Seival wrote...


Well, I didn't include Renegade Control in my personal rating at all, because I just can't play Renegade... As I said, I tried it several times, but each time stopped in the first quarter of ME1. Renegade is just not my way.

I didn't play full renegade either, it was 55-45 in favor of renegade. xD

[Seival]

pirate1802 wrote...

I didn't play full renegade either, it was 55-45 in favor of renegade. xD

Well, I couldn't play even that kind of renegade. Most renegade decisions (even some minor ones) are completely alien to me. So, each time I play ME Trilogy, I get full Paragon progress-bar, and about 15% of Renegade progress-bar in the end of each part.

[Lord Goose]

Also you become omnipotent reaper-god in control, you force your will on the whole galaxy. You can enforce synthesis if you want, or something far more nasty. the

You're mixing up potential to force will on the others, and act of forcing will on the others. We only know that Shepard using Reapers to rebuild Relays. Doesn't mean that Reapers are going to do everything, from fighting smugglers and fixing roofs.

Modifié par Lord Goose, 24 juillet 2012 - 10:51 .

[LennethValkyrie]

I think control is the true paragon ending..
An heroic self sacrifice to bring true peace and progress to the galaxy..

While destroy ending is the true renegade choice..
The true problem of humans (in reality alike) you see.. is that they almost always take destruction as the only and final solution to everything.. and this precludes them to find any other solution to a conflict..

[Seival]

Lord Goose wrote...

Also you become omnipotent reaper-god in control, you force your will on the whole galaxy. You can enforce synthesis if you want, or something far more nasty. the

You're mixing up potential to force will on the others, and act of forcing will on the others. We only know that Shepard using Reapers to rebuild Relays. Doesn't mean that Reapers are going to do everything, from fighting smugglers and fixing roofs.

I believe that after repairing all damage done to Galactic Civilization by the original Catalist, Shepard-Catalist will only be involved in some major events. But there will be some exceptions. For example, Shepard-Catalist might help its friends and LI even if it's not about something really major.

Modifié par Seival, 24 juillet 2012 - 11:46 .

[DirtyPhoenix]

Lord Goose wrote...

Also you become omnipotent reaper-god in control, you force your will on the whole galaxy. You can enforce synthesis if you want, or something far more nasty. the

You're mixing up potential to force will on the others, and act of forcing will on the others. We only know that Shepard using Reapers to rebuild Relays. Doesn't mean that Reapers are going to do everything, from fighting smugglers and fixing roofs.

We do see Reapers in London, and around the citadel. How will she "protect, preserve, act as a guardian, build a limitless future, to ensure all have a voice in the future" ? If not by intervening?
By the way I have nothing against control, its my second-best ending. I was just trying to show the other person that in each ending you infringe upon someone's rights, the difference is just whose and how.

LennethValkyrie wrote...

I think control is the true paragon ending..
An heroic self sacrifice to bring true peace and progress to the galaxy..

While destroy ending is the true renegade choice..
The
true problem of humans (in reality alike) you see.. is that they almost
always take destruction as the only and final solution to everything..
and this precludes them to find any other solution to a
conflict..

Yes but not everyone sees it that way. Why? Because control is supported by TIM. So it has to be totally the worst of the worst a person  can fall, nevermind if I end up saving everyone and not send the galaxy in a technological dark age.

And destroy is the bestest of the bestest ending. Why? Because I be a good son and listen to papa Anderson. I be a good soldier and follow orders, and I'd conveniently ignore that I just massacred a newly-sentient species, killed a crew member who is the equivalent of a curious child (EDI),  and created a massive dent of the galaxy's combined technology.

I thought renegade was the "shoot first and ask questions later" attitude, while paragon was being nice to everyone trying to save all. What did I know..

[CHALET]

Seival wrote...

Hmm... Some other interesting thoughts. Hasks... There are many types of them, each with its own advantages. Which peaceful jobs can they perform easily?

I think that:
- Human hasks will be great builders.
- Brutes also builders, but for some heavy tasks.
- Banshees... A part special police force maybe?
- Turian hasks and Batarian hasks... They clearly can't fit any peaceful profession, so will remain pure millitary.

- Salarian hasks... Like someone already said - they will eat flys
- Volus hasks... Not sure about those...
- Quarian hasks... Not sure if there are any, because of that terrible allergic reaction on everything (reapers included).

...Any thoughts on those ones and some others, like Hanar or Elcor?

Or put them out of their misery and have them self-destruct. 

[Seival]

CHALET wrote...

Seival wrote...

Hmm... Some other interesting thoughts. Hasks... There are many types of them, each with its own advantages. Which peaceful jobs can they perform easily?

I think that:
- Human hasks will be great builders.
- Brutes also builders, but for some heavy tasks.
- Banshees... A part special police force maybe?
- Turian hasks and Batarian hasks... They clearly can't fit any peaceful profession, so will remain pure millitary.

- Salarian hasks... Like someone already said - they will eat flys
- Volus hasks... Not sure about those...
- Quarian hasks... Not sure if there are any, because of that terrible allergic reaction on everything (reapers included).

...Any thoughts on those ones and some others, like Hanar or Elcor?

Or put them out of their misery and have them self-destruct. 

All Reapers and hasks have the same collective mind. "The Reapers" is actually one creature consisting of millions different half-organic mobile platforms. I think the Catalist has no reason to get rid of some of those mobile platforms. So, after helping Galactic Civilization to rebuild, those mobile platforms will not be used very often. I think they will disappear from sight, but remain close enough to provide some help when needed.

[DirtyPhoenix]

According to my headcanon, in my synthesis ending they would be "repaired", if you may.

Modifié par pirate1802, 24 juillet 2012 - 06:04 .

[CrutchCricket]

Husks serve no purpose once the war is over. They are also a symbol of the atrocities the Reapers inflicted. They are all destroyed.

[JeffZero]

Seival wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

I didn't play full renegade either, it was 55-45 in favor of renegade. xD

Well, I couldn't play even that kind of renegade. Most renegade decisions (even some minor ones) are completely alien to me. So, each time I play ME Trilogy, I get full Paragon progress-bar, and about 15% of Renegade progress-bar in the end of each part.

You're not alone... I'm the exact same way. Just can't do it.

[MisterJB]

CrutchCricket wrote...

Husks serve no purpose once the war is over. They are also a symbol of the atrocities the Reapers inflicted. They are all destroyed.

They don't feel pain, exhaustion, fear or ask for renumeration. Just put them to work.

[Seival]

JeffZero wrote...

Seival wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

I didn't play full renegade either, it was 55-45 in favor of renegade. xD

Well, I couldn't play even that kind of renegade. Most renegade decisions (even some minor ones) are completely alien to me. So, each time I play ME Trilogy, I get full Paragon progress-bar, and about 15% of Renegade progress-bar in the end of each part.

You're not alone... I'm the exact same way. Just can't do it.

Good to hear

[Seival]

CrutchCricket wrote...

Husks serve no purpose once the war is over. They are also a symbol of the atrocities the Reapers inflicted. They are all destroyed.

They are just mindless mobile platforms. And they can be used as workers which will help to rebuild cities. So why destroy them? They can work day and night, and will require no food or rest. And after they will help to rebuild the cities, we can hide them. But not too far away, because they might be needed later.

[nitefyre410]

MisterJB wrote...

CrutchCricket wrote...

Husks serve no purpose once the war is over. They are also a symbol of the atrocities the Reapers inflicted. They are all destroyed.

They don't feel pain, exhaustion, fear or ask for renumeration. Just put them to work.

 

I was thinking the same thing. They would great  as a labor force to assist with Search and  Rescue among other things.

[Seival]

nitefyre410 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

CrutchCricket wrote...

Husks serve no purpose once the war is over. They are also a symbol of the atrocities the Reapers inflicted. They are all destroyed.

They don't feel pain, exhaustion, fear or ask for renumeration. Just put them to work.

 

I was thinking the same thing. They would great  as a labor force to assist with Search and  Rescue among other things.

By the way, most Hasks could be really good in Search and Resque tasks, which are very important after the war... Well, only Batarian hasks aren't good for that (they have no proper hands for that).

Modifié par Seival, 25 juillet 2012 - 10:43 .

[Ageless Face]

Don't count on the husks too much. Eventually they'll start to take people's jobs away.

[DirtyPhoenix]

LOL I'd almost pay to see Husks and Brutes lining up like jobless workers xD!!

[Ageless Face]

Anyone ever wonder how does a Krogan and a Turian get into one spike that creates a Brute? Seems a bit big to me. They probably use another method to create them... God, thinking about it is just gross.

Never mind.