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[Vigilant111]

Vox Draco wrote...

Vigilant111 wrote...
Need to point out if the survival scene is real (could not confirm but very likely), and it is indeed Shepard, we must emphasize on the fact that he or she is fully human that he or she retains the most authentic self, because synthesis/control supporters might argue that Shepard also survived, just in different forms in their endings

I do not see Shepard as herself without a body. Humanity is more than just your mind. Love, Hate, Feelings in general are as much body-chemistry as things of the mind.

All I can see with Shepard "surviving" in control are her memories saved on some kind of harddrive. Maybe this will influcence the control-program she has become, but maybe these memories are insignificant for a being that can no longer relate to a physical existence. A being that no longer knows mortality, the fear to die, the joy to love, the pleasure to feel

In the worst case scenrio I see Shepard retain her emotions, together with the knowledge she will never feel again, never touch again, forced to spent eternity as a cold machine in space, with nothing but memories of her former self and what she once had been and sacrificed...

No I made it again, I depressed myself badly...

Imagine: EC presents: the rubbles moved away from the screen, Shepard's face appears, eyes open, no presense of reaper tech...

[Luviagelita]

Vox Draco wrote...

Vigilant111 wrote...
Need to point out if the survival scene is real (could not confirm but very likely), and it is indeed Shepard, we must emphasize on the fact that he or she is fully human that he or she retains the most authentic self, because synthesis/control supporters might argue that Shepard also survived, just in different forms in their endings

I do not see Shepard as herself without a body. Humanity is more than just your mind. Love, Hate, Feelings in general are as much body-chemistry as things of the mind.

All I can see with Shepard "surviving" in control are her memories saved on some kind of harddrive. Maybe this will influcence the control-program she has become, but maybe these memories are insignificant for a being that can no longer relate to a physical existence. A being that no longer knows mortality, the fear to die, the joy to love, the pleasure to feel

In the worst case scenrio I see Shepard retain her emotions, together with the knowledge she will never feel again, never touch again, forced to spent eternity as a cold machine in space, with nothing but memories of her former self and what she once had been and sacrificed...

No I made it again, I depressed myself badly...

Yes.
It's impossible for a human being no matter how strong-willed he or she is to remain herself through centuries in such a state. And I'm pretty sure that within a cycle-long period as a new Catalyst she or he will continue the cycle, and the Reapers will eventually return to do what they've been made for.
The cycle is not broken in Control.

[Vigilant111]

Luviagelita wrote...

Vox Draco wrote...

Vigilant111 wrote...
Need to point out if the survival scene is real (could not confirm but very likely), and it is indeed Shepard, we must emphasize on the fact that he or she is fully human that he or she retains the most authentic self, because synthesis/control supporters might argue that Shepard also survived, just in different forms in their endings

I do not see Shepard as herself without a body. Humanity is more than just your mind. Love, Hate, Feelings in general are as much body-chemistry as things of the mind.

All I can see with Shepard "surviving" in control are her memories saved on some kind of harddrive. Maybe this will influcence the control-program she has become, but maybe these memories are insignificant for a being that can no longer relate to a physical existence. A being that no longer knows mortality, the fear to die, the joy to love, the pleasure to feel

In the worst case scenrio I see Shepard retain her emotions, together with the knowledge she will never feel again, never touch again, forced to spent eternity as a cold machine in space, with nothing but memories of her former self and what she once had been and sacrificed...

No I made it again, I depressed myself badly...

Yes.
It's impossible for a human being no matter how strong-willed he or she is to remain herself through centuries in such a state. And I'm pretty sure that within a cycle-long period as a new Catalyst she or he will continue the cycle, and the Reapers will eventually return to do what they've been made for.
The cycle is not broken in Control.

Agreed, this so called soul survival is just a poetic pipe dream, a mirage at best

[Vox Draco]

Vigilant111 wrote...
Imagine: EC presents: the rubbles moved away from the screen, Shepard's face appears, eyes open, no presense of reaper tech...

And her Kaidan is presenting her the last red rose on Earth/London, just as good as unicorns and rainbows!

Yeah! Screw you catalyst, screw you, galaxy and mass relays and singularities, and sorry geth, but Shepard's survival is more importan than anything else. Shepard is hope. With shepard being dead, hope has died as well

[frylock23]

One of my other fears about Control is that Shepard might not die. There is said it. Shepard might not die. Instead, she might be trapped as some kind of AI for untold billions of years with only the Reapers for real company.

The mortal consciousness is NOT designed for that.

I have severe doubts about its ability to retain its sanity under those conditions. I have severe doubts about its ability to maintain its morality and the perspectives that made it human under those conditions, and yes, I'd be very worried that it would go insane or turn into something with a perspective so alien that it would either restart the cycle eventually or potentially something worse. It might even become the tech singularity the Star Brat fears.

[Vigilant111]

Vox Draco wrote...

Vigilant111 wrote...
Imagine: EC presents: the rubbles moved away from the screen, Shepard's face appears, eyes open, no presense of reaper tech...

And her Kaidan is presenting her the last red rose on Earth/London, just as good as unicorns and rainbows!

Yeah! Screw you catalyst, screw you, galaxy and mass relays and singularities, and sorry geth, but Shepard's survival is more importan than anything else. Shepard is hope. With shepard being dead, hope has died as well

His Kaidan also, though I think it would be dog tags this time:D

Modifié par Vigilant111, 28 mai 2012 - 01:43 .

[Naamah_bb]

Destroy all the way

[Rafficus III]

It was always our goal to stop the Reapers at any cost and to destroy them. Saren was a tool of Synthesis, TIM was a tool for control, and Anderson was the image of destroy. I'd like to retain my own mentality and set out to finish what I started in the first game without succumbing to a mysterious light being who may or may not be lying to me. How 'bout you?

[Luviagelita]

Vigilant111 wrote...

Luviagelita wrote...

Vox Draco wrote...

Vigilant111 wrote...
Need to point out if the survival scene is real (could not confirm but very likely), and it is indeed Shepard, we must emphasize on the fact that he or she is fully human that he or she retains the most authentic self, because synthesis/control supporters might argue that Shepard also survived, just in different forms in their endings

I do not see Shepard as herself without a body. Humanity is more than just your mind. Love, Hate, Feelings in general are as much body-chemistry as things of the mind.

All I can see with Shepard "surviving" in control are her memories saved on some kind of harddrive. Maybe this will influcence the control-program she has become, but maybe these memories are insignificant for a being that can no longer relate to a physical existence. A being that no longer knows mortality, the fear to die, the joy to love, the pleasure to feel

In the worst case scenrio I see Shepard retain her emotions, together with the knowledge she will never feel again, never touch again, forced to spent eternity as a cold machine in space, with nothing but memories of her former self and what she once had been and sacrificed...

No I made it again, I depressed myself badly...

Yes.
It's impossible for a human being no matter how strong-willed he or she is to remain herself through centuries in such a state. And I'm pretty sure that within a cycle-long period as a new Catalyst she or he will continue the cycle, and the Reapers will eventually return to do what they've been made for.
The cycle is not broken in Control.

Agreed, this so called soul survival is just a poetic pipe dream, a mirage at best

Sadly, as far as I can see many fans forget that Shepard is a Human first of all. Not some Maker of New Life, or Reaper God Number Two (but good one for all eternity of course). Shepard is just a human. He doesen't need to accept machine logic that killed the unthinkable amount of people.
For me, Control is better than Synthesis, because it's not violating the nature like Synthesis does, and there are good intentions in making this choice. People want to save EDI and the Geth, I can understand that. Still, it's a solution within a machine logic.
But a human who saw all these horrible things in this war, and who was listening to Javik, who fought for such a long time would pick Destroy. It's the one realistic solution.
Shepard just need to remember what s/he was fighting for. And if it's achieved by sacrificind something - it's sad, but it needs to be done.

[Mims]

I actually like control, but as people have mentioned, there are some downsides. Being imprisoned for thousands of years could severely warp Shepard's consciousness. Who is to say that he doesn't just one day decide to continue a'reapin?

I think I said this in a thread long ago, but my general thought is a reaper is like a bomb. You can disarm that bomb, or merge with that bomb, but at the end of the day you've still got a bomb in the house. I'd rather just gut the house and remove it, spending however long it takes rebuilding.

But I DO like control, as an option. Synthesis is really my only wtf is this ending.

Modifié par Mims, 28 mai 2012 - 02:05 .

[Vox Draco]

Luviagelita wrote...
Sadly, as far as I can see many fans forget that Shepard is a Human first of all. Not some Maker of New Life, or Reaper God Number Two (but good one for all eternity of course). Shepard is just a human. He doesen't need to accept machine logic that killed the unthinkable amount of people.
For me, Control is better than Synthesis, because it's not violating the nature like Synthesis does, and there are good intentions in making this choice. People want to save EDI and the Geth, I can understand that. Still, it's a solution within a machine logic.
But a human who saw all these horrible things in this war, and who was listening to Javik, who fought for such a long time would pick Destroy. It's the one realistic solution.
Shepard just need to remember what s/he was fighting for. And if it's achieved by sacrificind something - it's sad, but it needs to be done.

I..really like that. Shepard is a mortal human being. She should be aware of this, of her limitations, but also be proud of it.  And she won't forget what the Reapers did and what they are capable of. Choosing green or blue...for me it is denying your human side, with all its failures as well as powers. And it is denying the idea that humans and other organics are capable of forming their own future and destiny...My point of view, I am aware other willl surely see it differently, but they won't change my mind

[Vigilant111]

Vox Draco wrote...

Luviagelita wrote...
Sadly, as far as I can see many fans forget that Shepard is a Human first of all. Not some Maker of New Life, or Reaper God Number Two (but good one for all eternity of course). Shepard is just a human. He doesen't need to accept machine logic that killed the unthinkable amount of people.
For me, Control is better than Synthesis, because it's not violating the nature like Synthesis does, and there are good intentions in making this choice. People want to save EDI and the Geth, I can understand that. Still, it's a solution within a machine logic.
But a human who saw all these horrible things in this war, and who was listening to Javik, who fought for such a long time would pick Destroy. It's the one realistic solution.
Shepard just need to remember what s/he was fighting for. And if it's achieved by sacrificind something - it's sad, but it needs to be done.

I..really like that. Shepard is a mortal human being. She should be aware of this, of her limitations, but also be proud of it.  And she won't forget what the Reapers did and what they are capable of. Choosing green or blue...for me it is denying your human side, with all its failures as well as powers. And it is denying the idea that humans and other organics are capable of forming their own future and destiny...My point of view, I am aware other willl surely see it differently, but they won't change my mind

Synthesis/control supporters find it hard to admit that immortality makes life all that meaningful

[Joe1962]

Destroy, first, last and always for me.

As Hackett said: "Dead Reapers is how we win this".

[balance5050]

"Remember your mission Shepard, and come back in one piece."

[Uncle Jo]

mass perfection wrote...

Besides the Geth,EDI,and everyone who relies on technology to stay alive?Control doesn't harm anyone.Synthesis improves everyone.

Control: Shep becomes the greatest traitor in the history of the galaxy.
Synthesis: Shep becomes the greatest Dr M****le in the history of the Galaxy.

A good Reaper is a dead one.

[Shaani]

Would you have made the same decision if the Crucible was going to destroy the Reapers and the Quarians, instead of the Geth? Or the Turians? Or the Asari?

[balance5050]

Shaani wrote...

Would you have made the same decision if the Crucible was going to destroy the Reapers and the Quarians, instead of the Geth? Or the Turians? Or the Asari?

What's one race compared with the extinction of all sentients in the galaxy?

[Shaani]

balance5050 wrote...

Shaani wrote...

Would you have made the same decision if the Crucible was going to destroy the Reapers and the Quarians, instead of the Geth? Or the Turians? Or the Asari?

What's one race compared with the extinction of all sentients in the galaxy?

I'm just curious if people would sacrifice an organic race as willingly as the Geth  . . . possibly even their LI's race.

[balance5050]

Shaani wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Shaani wrote...

Would you have made the same decision if the Crucible was going to destroy the Reapers and the Quarians, instead of the Geth? Or the Turians? Or the Asari?

What's one race compared with the extinction of all sentients in the galaxy?

I'm just curious if people would sacrifice an organic race as willingly as the Geth  . . . possibly even their LI's race.

The Geth are a fan favorite, I don't thnk it would change most peoples decision.

[Sisterofshane]

Shaani wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Shaani wrote...

Would you have made the same decision if the Crucible was going to destroy the Reapers and the Quarians, instead of the Geth? Or the Turians? Or the Asari?

What's one race compared with the extinction of all sentients in the galaxy?

I'm just curious if people would sacrifice an organic race as willingly as the Geth  . . . possibly even their LI's race.

If it was presented in the same manner, yes.  I honestly never even expected to live myself.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I would sacrifice everyone fighting on Earth and in it's skies if it permanently ended the Reaper Threat.

[Uncle Jo]

Shaani wrote...

Would you have made the same decision if the Crucible was going to destroy the Reapers and the Quarians, instead of the Geth? Or the Turians? Or the Asari?

Hell yes. Because the space troll is a damn liar. Even if he's not, no way I'm gonna please him. With Synthesis and Control you let the Reapers survive... and you die for sure. Strange isn't it?

[Luviagelita]

Shaani wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Shaani wrote...

Would you have made the same decision if the Crucible was going to destroy the Reapers and the Quarians, instead of the Geth? Or the Turians? Or the Asari?

What's one race compared with the extinction of all sentients in the galaxy?

I'm just curious if people would sacrifice an organic race as willingly as the Geth  . . . possibly even their LI's race.

Yes.
Just a slightly different challenge to determination.

[Vox Draco]

Shaani wrote...

Would you have made the same decision if the Crucible was going to destroy the Reapers and the Quarians, instead of the Geth? Or the Turians? Or the Asari?

I'll be honest: I (the player) don't give a damn about the Geth, I never really cared for them, they do not touch me emontionally. If they survive, alright, but I would have sacrificed every single one of them in favorof the Quarians. I didn't need to, a pleasant surprise, but I hadn't shed a tear if they had to go...

If destroy would mean sacrificing, I don't know...the asari? the turians? The humans? Tough choice then...I'll resort to my favorite Shepard-Quote...I .. don't know...

Gladly it isn't like this, and gladly the Catalyst is not a neutral AI, but aligned with the Reapers. These facts make things way easier for me, I admit

[Wolder88]

destroy, always. Never compromise