97 réponses à ce sujet

[GGW KillerTiger]

Oh my justicar pulls all the aggro on the battlefield
Damn right she's better than you
Damn right she's better than you

:innocent:

Modifié par GGW KillerTiger, 29 mai 2012 - 12:10 .

[msantos]

dnaxv wrote...

Ikilledkillab wrote...

deadpixel92 wrote...

Good tips, on a quick note: you dont need 200% cooldown with the AJ at all IMO. Reave and bubble cooldowns are fast enough, i dont use pull, i think is worthless with the AJ on Gold but thats just me.
I use GPS with my AJ and works better than using a carnifex, i focus more in gunplay and my cooldows works perfectly with it.

As I just said, 5A is broken on the Justicar and as far as I know, headshot bonus is useless on a GPS. Unless you are wasting 5 points on Justicar just to get the 10% extra weapon damage which, IMHO, is absolutely useless. You have to make sure that extra 10% is actually allowing you to fire less shots at enemies. I highly doubt it would be more useful than some points in pull. If the 5A justicar branch worked though I would definitely drop 3 to pull and use it.

I'd be better off going 5B with my carnifex than you as that gun does get headshots.

If you intend to use Carnifex X with AJA, you actually don't need Justicar 4B to get to 200% cooldown. Seriously, try it out. You could have +7.5% weapon damage instead.

I'm running:
Biotic Sphere: 4B, 5B, 6B
Reave: 4B, 5B, 6B (why do people not like 5B? too short a cooldown reduction? I spam the heck out of reave)
Pull: 3
Asari Justicar: 4A, 5B
Fitness: 4B, 5B, 6B

With Carnifex x (Piercing Mod and High-Caliber Barrel). Without the weight reduction from Justicar 4B, you're still at 200% cooldown.

Note that do you need Justicar 1 to get to 200% cooldown with Carnifex X, but if that's the only weapon you are using, Justicar 4B is a waste of points.

Totally agree.  Justicar 4B is certainly not needed to be in the 200% CD zone with a carnifex X.

I've been running the AJ over the last month and scoring tops in the scoreboard has become a very common thing especially after I went with the full offensive configuration (bubble+reave) with the best CD possible.  

And I still ABSOLUTELY reject the idea that anything less 200% is OK.  Maybe some folks do not notice the difference, but to me the diffrence is very noticeable especially after you go with an offensive setup and your your reave+bubble spamming rate increases.  At first I carried the Disciple X along with the Carnifex X and that gave me ~170% CD which according to some folks it is more than OK.  Well, despite not using the Disciple my spamming rate was measurably worse and the results would show each and every time.

Pull is somethig I do not use as much but it is quite handy to have it especially when several gardians need to have their shield removed so that team mates can finish them off... or a lesser enemy is hiding behind cover.  in my view up to 4B in pull is not really wasted.  I only take rank 2 in pull anyway because it is so handy to have it around.

Lastly, running around with AP and extended barrel on the carni is something I stopped doing since I noticed I get much better results with a a scope instead of the AP mod.  Most of the time I just add an AP ammo bonus if I fell like it, but overall I find the frequent headshots approach to provide a much better outcome than equiping the AP mod.

[Micah3sixty]

MaximilianPower wrote...

Micah3sixty wrote...

[ I wish we gamed on same platform as I bet we'd be unstoppable with our two Justicars stomping everything.

That's my plan, eventually. I played with OP the other day in a couple of PUG matches - he is legit. Totally changed my perception of how the AJ can be played; it looked like a hell of a lot of fun (and yes, he topped the scoreboard in both games). I'm leveling back up after promoting for the weekend event, and I'm following his guide pretty faithfully.

I will say that I've found it a little tough to consistently drop the bubble in the right spot - and then get the baddies to stroll through it. Getting better at it, just need practice I guess. Defensive bubbles, of course, are far less challenging to place.

Not surprising.  We play very similar if each of our guides is any indication.  This play style makes the Justicar very deadly.

[Micah3sixty]

corporal doody wrote...

what system you all play on?

im not even sure ive played with anyone that regularly posts on this board

I'm on xbox 360 if you want to add me: micah3sixty

[Kick In The Door]

REAVE REAVE REAVE. By far my favorite ability in the game. I'm tearing you apart Lisa!

[UEG Donkey]

I use 6,6,0,6,6 Build with a Striker and a 160% cooldown I like it better than the 6,6,4,4,6 builds that use the carnifex

[DSRoy]

I use the all offensive build 66446 as seen at http://narida.pytalh...es/#03RRFFRL9@0

I can't imagine why anyone wouldn't take Reave 4: radius & Justicar 4: duration, as these maximise area of effect stacked reave damage.   A sole Justicar can do 527 damage per second to every enemy in a 3 meter radius.

Using the calculation: max stacked damage = damage * duration / recharge speed, here are the comparable damage figures for other evolutions of Reave (assuming Reave 4: radius, Justicar 4: duration, & 200% cooldowns):

5: recharge speed/6: damage & duration
527

5: damage reduction/ 6: damage & duration
475

5: recharge speed/6: barriers & armor
351 health
614 barriers & armor

5: damage reduction/6: barriers & armor
317 health
554 barriers & armor

Why are 200% cooldowns important?  UEG Donkey's 160% cooldown Striker AR build just above would only deal 416 or 468 max stacked reave damage (depending on Reave 5) vs 527 in my preferred build.  That difference adds up over 3+ enemies. In practice, I also find it more difficult landing shots with any weapon with recoil, as the offensive Justicar is sliding around in close proximity to the enemy and the recoil recovery animation seems to take time.  For example I've tried the Disciple shotgun, which seems ideal for this playstyle, but find the Justicar just feels more fluid with a Carnifex.

I can see an argument for taking damage reduction over recharge speed at Reave 5, as inside an offensive bubble it can reduce incoming damage by 20% while only reducing max stacked reave damage by 10%, which can make the difference between sliding back to cover alive (after dropping a bubble) or not. In practice, and mostly on silver, I find the extra 10% damage more valuable quickly dropping crowds of ravagers & marauders first, before bubble dueling banshee/brute bosses.

Reave seems notably weak on shields, but I'm not sure if this is a coded damage multiplier or simply because shields are the first to take damage before the reave stack builds.

Modifié par DSRoy, 29 mai 2012 - 05:05 .

[dnaxv]

msantos wrote...

*snip*

Totally agree.  Justicar 4B is certainly not needed to be in the 200% CD zone with a carnifex X.

I've been running the AJ over the last month and scoring tops in the scoreboard has become a very common thing especially after I went with the full offensive configuration (bubble+reave) with the best CD possible.  

And I still ABSOLUTELY reject the idea that anything less 200% is OK.  Maybe some folks do not notice the difference, but to me the diffrence is very noticeable especially after you go with an offensive setup and your your reave+bubble spamming rate increases.  At first I carried the Disciple X along with the Carnifex X and that gave me ~170% CD which according to some folks it is more than OK.  Well, despite not using the Disciple my spamming rate was measurably worse and the results would show each and every time.

Pull is somethig I do not use as much but it is quite handy to have it especially when several gardians need to have their shield removed so that team mates can finish them off... or a lesser enemy is hiding behind cover.  in my view up to 4B in pull is not really wasted.  I only take rank 2 in pull anyway because it is so handy to have it around.

Lastly, running around with AP and extended barrel on the carni is something I stopped doing since I noticed I get much better results with a a scope instead of the AP mod.  Most of the time I just add an AP ammo bonus if I fell like it, but overall I find the frequent headshots approach to provide a much better outcome than equiping the AP mod.

Yes, power spam AJA is a lot of fun. I can't wait until they fix the constant dubstep song that goes along with Reave spam though, and hopefully they'll fix the PS3 slowdown issues that (at least on my end) Reave seems to exacerbate.

As for scope mod, I'd been switching back and forth with that and AP mod on my AA and QE. But I've found that for me it is easier to play caster classes without the scope. I'm able to reliably get headshots without the scope mod (don't mean that as some sort of bragging statement, just adapted to not having scope) and having a scope on a non-infiltrator kinda messes up my rhythm for some reason. But I feel that scope vs AP is totally up to personal preference. They're both situationally useful.

[corporal doody]

Micah3sixty wrote...

corporal doody wrote...

what system you all play on?

im not even sure ive played with anyone that regularly posts on this board

I'm on xbox 360 if you want to add me: micah3sixty

cool beans.

my gt: Corporal Doody

[RogueWolfie]

Great guide Ikilledkillab, if only you put this much effort into your troll threads lol.

[Ikilledkillab]

RogueWolfie wrote...

Great guide Ikilledkillab, if only you put this much effort into your troll threads lol.

LOL good games the other day

[Ikilledkillab]

Well, the Reagar (sp?) X gives me a 170%CD on my AJ. I had to try it because it melts things away so fast. If you shoot at something inside the bubble with 25% damage added its unbelievable. I'm going to rock this the next few weeks of playing with power efficiency modules to see how I like it compared to the Carnifex.

Seriosuly though, I start shooting at a pyro/hunter with this gun and the die instantly. Whats it like, 3 clips for a geth prime on gold?

[southboom]

I've been trying a build like this for sometime. Usually I play it slightly more defensively, because I didn't know using the bubble proc'd reave.
I mostly feel less powerful then a regular adept, so I don't tend to play this class all that much..

buuut, I decided to try it again last night after reading this, and I just think the class seems like too much risk for not enough reward.
I'm not sure if you're using equipment to fill in the gaps or what, but most of the time enemies survived one or two biotic explosions, and ended up killing me a lot.
I quickly switched out the Carnifex to a disciple shotgun, simply to get a way to interupt enemies from shotting at me, when setting up a warp bubble.

Idk man. are you a PC player? maybe it's less console friendly and thats why I didn't do too well. Idk... in the end it just seems like so much more work and so much more risk, then just biotic artillery with a regular adept.

I'll give it a few more tries tonight. I always instantly promote any character at lv20, so been playing this setup at 12-16. Possibly the last few lvls will make a difference.

[Unnamed_Shadow]

i usually take the Mattock on the Justicar...but i might take the Harrier and try it ou

[count_4]

southboom wrote...
Idk man. are you a PC player? maybe it's less console friendly and thats why I didn't do too well. Idk... in the end it just seems like so much more work and so much more risk, then just biotic artillery with a regular adept.

Playing on PC I can tell you that this feeling is not limited to consoles. Playing AJ this way is more risk and less reward than regular AA.

It's difficult to even find any advantages of the AJ at all. The only one maybe being that setting up a BE on an unprotected target immediately takes that target out of play due to pull. Everything else a properly specced AA can do better. 

[Ikilledkillab]

count_4 wrote...

southboom wrote...
Idk man. are you a PC player? maybe it's less console friendly and thats why I didn't do too well. Idk... in the end it just seems like so much more work and so much more risk, then just biotic artillery with a regular adept.

Playing on PC I can tell you that this feeling is not limited to consoles. Playing AJ this way is more risk and less reward than regular AA.

It's difficult to even find any advantages of the AJ at all. The only one maybe being that setting up a BE on an unprotected target immediately takes that target out of play due to pull. Everything else a properly specced AA can do better.

It has plenty of advantaged:

Bubble gives allies 20%DR in hacks.
Bubble gives a 25% damage increase to any enemies in it. Great ifyou put it over bosses like I do. Speeds the game up, helps your teamamtes kill stuff.
Bubble creates an entire warp chokepoint for BE's
Pull-reave biotic is quicker than warpthrow.
Reave gives you 40%DR and does some DPS.
I have high health and sheilds and 40% DR.
I don't have to play from cover, I can play smash mouth in your face (more fun).

But the AA has stronger BEs for sure and stasis is nice. I love both characters. They work amazing together and have their strengths and eakness.

Give me an AA, AJ and a GI and any enemy on every map on  gold is easily rocked.

And its not really an advantage in a coop game but with or without biotic assistance, my AJ is usually on top.

Modifié par Ikilledkillab, 31 mai 2012 - 04:04 .

[Ikilledkillab]

southboom wrote...

I've been trying a build like this for sometime. Usually I play it slightly more defensively, because I didn't know using the bubble proc'd reave.
I mostly feel less powerful then a regular adept, so I don't tend to play this class all that much..

buuut, I decided to try it again last night after reading this, and I just think the class seems like too much risk for not enough reward.
I'm not sure if you're using equipment to fill in the gaps or what, but most of the time enemies survived one or two biotic explosions, and ended up killing me a lot.
I quickly switched out the Carnifex to a disciple shotgun, simply to get a way to interupt enemies from shotting at me, when setting up a warp bubble.

Idk man. are you a PC player? maybe it's less console friendly and thats why I didn't do too well. Idk... in the end it just seems like so much more work and so much more risk, then just biotic artillery with a regular adept.

I'll give it a few more tries tonight. I always instantly promote any character at lv20, so been playing this setup at 12-16. Possibly the last few lvls will make a difference.

Yeah, well I would say you want to be around level 20 if you are playing in your face on gold. It would help to have your fitness up, DR from reave, etc. I am assuimg you already have the bubble at 6. Play it at level 20 a bit before you judge it.

It takes a bit of practice. I've gotten a few pms here about my AJ playstyle and I get messages on psn asking how I don't die and play the AJ so well. Just a bit of practice I guess and you need to know your enemy.

Most enemies will survive one BE but again, I usually double BE enemies (reave--> Bubble-->reave) gives you two BE's from three power throws. In between this Carnifex shots and the ability to pull unshielded enemies works. You need to know your enemy though. Sometimes right after the bubble, given the situation you should be dodging backwards. Sometimes I even dodge at say a pyro and go past them because they turn slowly so I can get off that second reave. Its chaotic and fun and it is high risk/reward. But its a video game so that is what I go for. With 5 ops pacs, 5 gels and jumbo equipment packs and 5 rockets I like to play very aggressive.

[Micah3sixty]

count_4 wrote...

southboom wrote...
Idk man. are you a PC player? maybe it's less console friendly and thats why I didn't do too well. Idk... in the end it just seems like so much more work and so much more risk, then just biotic artillery with a regular adept.

Playing on PC I can tell you that this feeling is not limited to consoles. Playing AJ this way is more risk and less reward than regular AA.

It's difficult to even find any advantages of the AJ at all. The only one maybe being that setting up a BE on an unprotected target immediately takes that target out of play due to pull. Everything else a properly specced AA can do better. 

I play on xbox and I find the AJA more rewarding and damage dealing than a vanilla AA.  I played AA all of the time until I unlocked AJA.  I rarely play AA now as the in-your-face CQC tactical playstyle of the AJA is just much more satisfying to me.  Higher risk = higher emotional reward when I'm grooving and taking down heavies like a boss.  The BE are weaker, but you can spam them much quicker than Warp > Throw, and have up to 25% damage increase due to bubble debuff.  You can also setoff multiple biotic explosions with bubble if more than one Reave has been cast on multiple targets.  I've also setoff multiple explosions simultaneously from reaving multiple enemies in the bubble with warp on them.  The AJA may not be for everyone, but I sure find her the most versitile and rewarding to play among all biotic classes/characters, including the new Cerberus jokesters.

[Ikilledkillab]

Micah3sixty wrote...

count_4 wrote...

southboom wrote...
Idk man. are you a PC player? maybe it's less console friendly and thats why I didn't do too well. Idk... in the end it just seems like so much more work and so much more risk, then just biotic artillery with a regular adept.

Playing on PC I can tell you that this feeling is not limited to consoles. Playing AJ this way is more risk and less reward than regular AA.

It's difficult to even find any advantages of the AJ at all. The only one maybe being that setting up a BE on an unprotected target immediately takes that target out of play due to pull. Everything else a properly specced AA can do better. 

I play on xbox and I find the AJA more rewarding and damage dealing than a vanilla AA.  I played AA all of the time until I unlocked AJA.  I rarely play AA now as the in-your-face CQC tactical playstyle of the AJA is just much more satisfying to me.  Higher risk = higher emotional reward when I'm grooving and taking down heavies like a boss.  The BE are weaker, but you can spam them much quicker than Warp > Throw, and have up to 25% damage increase due to bubble debuff.  You can also setoff multiple biotic explosions with bubble if more than one Reave has been cast on multiple targets.  I've also setoff multiple explosions simultaneously from reaving multiple enemies in the bubble with warp on them.  The AJA may not be for everyone, but I sure find her the most versitile and rewarding to play among all biotic classes/characters, including the new Cerberus jokesters.

I yell at the enmies and carry on conversations with them when I am playing and grooving with the AJ on gold.....

"get double bubbled bi***"

"you aint coming in this room son"

Yeah, I'm weird.

And yeah, the multiple BE's is win. My bubble lasts 57 seconds if I want to just hang back when its in a very good choke point and just create BE after BE as enemies come through. Its weaker but considering the warp is out there for a minute and I just need to throw one power for continual BE's I can create more BE's and the AA.

Modifié par Ikilledkillab, 31 mai 2012 - 04:35 .

[david_demos484]

mrcanada wrote...

BoomDynamite wrote...

I hate Pull...

Me too, but 3 in it is about all you need and it can be useful.

I disagree with 200% being a must and I would say that a GPS X does the job, putting you at about 130 cooldown with only the rank 4 evolution in Justicar.  

I also agree that a 200% cd is not necesary. I get around those same scores and top out with my falcon X or a gps X

[southboom]

Ikilledkillab wrote...

Yeah, well I would say you want to be around level 20 if you are playing in your face on gold. It would help to have your fitness up, DR from reave, etc. I am assuimg you already have the bubble at 6. Play it at level 20 a bit before you judge it.

It takes a bit of practice. I've gotten a few pms here about my AJ playstyle and I get messages on psn asking how I don't die and play the AJ so well. Just a bit of practice I guess and you need to know your enemy.

Most enemies will survive one BE but again, I usually double BE enemies (reave--> Bubble-->reave) gives you two BE's from three power throws. In between this Carnifex shots and the ability to pull unshielded enemies works. You need to know your enemy though. Sometimes right after the bubble, given the situation you should be dodging backwards. Sometimes I even dodge at say a pyro and go past them because they turn slowly so I can get off that second reave. Its chaotic and fun and it is high risk/reward. But its a video game so that is what I go for. With 5 ops pacs, 5 gels and jumbo equipment packs and 5 rockets I like to play very aggressive.

I'm conflicted about the build..  spent some time with it last night, also switched and played some regular adept, and idk..
It's a fun build, but in the end, I'm not sure.
It could mostly just be me, and that I keep taking stupid risks, to simply get a reave > bubble > reave in good location. Rushing into open ground to set a bubble up etc.

I've been wondering one thing though.  Throwing a single reave on one mob, and having it "spread" to two of his buddies.. then rushing up and bubbling. Will that set off an explosion on each of them? or just the target of the reave?
Also, if there's 2 or more inside the bubble, and you throw a reave on one of them, and it also hits the other guy, will that set off both?

I'll spend some more time during the weekend with this lil smurf. Hopefully I'll turn

[Mandolin]

What do folks think of the falcon on the justicar? I've been using it since the patch and have been quite pleased with the results. Phantoms have always been a problem for me on gold with this class especially when just carrying a pistol and a few start to mob you. The falcon makes short work of them and the stagger gives your reave more time to do some real damage. With the assault rifle weight reduction cooldowns are actually pretty good - around 149% with my falcon viii.

[count_4]

Ikilledkillab wrote...
It has plenty of advantaged:

Bubble gives allies 20%DR in hacks.

Bubble gives a 25% damage increase to any enemies in it. Great ifyou put it over bosses like I do. Speeds the game up, helps your teamamtes kill stuff.
Bubble creates an entire warp chokepoint for BE's

Pull-reave biotic is quicker than warpthrow.

Reave gives you 40%DR and does some DPS.

I have high health and sheilds and 40% DR.
I don't have to play from cover, I can play smash mouth in your face (more fun).

They work amazing together and have their strengths and eakness.

 
I love them both as well and the vanguard playstyle is definitely fun. That being said...

Bubbles DR is great to generally reduce damage while Stasis is a true lifesaver when something gets too close. I'd say it is even when it comes to stationary defense.

Bubble gives damage increase as does warp. However, if you want to use the bubble that way, you loose the DR. So while AA can do both, support and offense, AJ has to choose one. Plus it is stationary. If enemies decide not to enter your bubble and you're in a hot zone(meaning offensive bubble re-deployment is not possible) you're forced into defense.


Pull-Reave might be fast but it is limited to non-protected targets. That almost always means throw + headshot can take it out, which is faster than any BE.


Reave is great no doubt and AJ is not as squishy as AA thanks to it. That's indeed an advantage as you can move around more freely. But to actually use it, you have to go high risk vanguard-style with the bubble, which is fun but deals less damage than AA from cover could.

It pretty much comes down to what I said before: Higher risk, less reward than the AA. No panic button if sh*t hits the fan and you're forced to play risky to be efficient.

Now AA and AJ, that's a whole different story. Those two on the same team and all hell breaks loose. Sadly this doesn't happen very often on PUGs...
 

Micah3sixty wrote...

I play on xbox and I find the AJA more rewarding and damage dealing than a vanilla AA.  I played AA all of the time until I unlocked AJA.  I rarely play AA now as the in-your-face CQC tactical playstyle of the AJA is just much more satisfying to me.  Higher risk = higher emotional reward when I'm grooving and taking down heavies like a boss.  The BE are weaker, but you can spam them much quicker than Warp > Throw, and have up to 25% damage increase due to bubble debuff.  You can also setoff multiple biotic explosions with bubble if more than one Reave has been cast on multiple targets.  I've also setoff multiple explosions simultaneously from reaving multiple enemies in the bubble with warp on them.  The AJA may not be for everyone, but I sure find her the most versitile and rewarding to play among all biotic classes/characters, including the new Cerberus jokesters.

I can agree on most of what you said, except that AJ is a) more damage dealing, because it is not in my opinion(although I don't have any DPS numbers at hand atm) and more versatile. AA has answers for pretty much any situation except close-up armored targets(a.k.a. Pyros) whereas AJ does not.

southboom wrote...
I've been wondering one thing though.  Throwing a single reave on one mob, and having it "spread" to two of his buddies.. then rushing up and bubbling. Will that set off an explosion on each of them? or just the target of the reave?
Also, if there's 2 or more inside the bubble, and you throw a reave on one of them, and it also hits the other guy, will that set off both?

 
It should be setting off multiple explosions but I found that the warp bubble can be quite unreliable at times. 
It seems that was nonsense, meaning one power == one explosion even with area evolution and bubble.

Modifié par count_4, 01 juin 2012 - 08:21 .

[Ikilledkillab]

It should be setting off multiple explosions but I found that the warp bubble can be quite unreliable at times. 
It seems that was nonsense, meaning one power == one explosion even with area evolution and bubble.

If you reave then bubble then reave you get 2 BEs in three power throws. Plus 25% damage buff in the bubble and a BE on anythng that walks into it.

Also, after practicing I don't know how you could ever place your bubble in a bad spot on gold and its so easy to move it with the douboe BE bubble technique.

[Ikilledkillab]

Just an FYI, if you are rocking the suggested AJ build, by veteran packs to max your gear. I have structural ergonomics IV and it gives me a 12.5% power recharge bonus. Very effective with the suicidal Justicar.