320 réponses à ce sujet

[Bill Casey]

Edolix wrote...

Kaidan going gay whilst Ash didn't always seemed odd to me.

Really?

................<_<

Modifié par Bill Casey, 28 mai 2012 - 11:16 .

[silentassassin264]

Mr.House wrote...

Yes. This is a game, not real life, limitations suck, more so when you have to put up with horrible va to romance a certain lady.

[Stump01]

element eater wrote...

Dendio1 wrote...
kaiden always seemed to lean a little gay on the other hand.

realy i found it odd he talks about girls more then any one in ME1. He tells u about a girl at biotic camp, likes fem shep and also liara if ur a man shep.


Jack definately should have been pretty sure she says shes been with girls b4

Yeah, she definitely should've be an option for playing for both teams.

[frylock23]

Total Biscuit wrote...



Seriously, why is it so hard to accept the idea that the same character can be gay in one universe, straight in another, or bisexual in a third? We're fine with that being 100% true for SHEPARD, why not any other character I the ME universe?

It's not that.

It's that the writer can add more detail and depth when he or she is not constrained by having to make the character work believably from all romantic angles. For example, say the PC wants Kaidan to play out as gay (not bi like he is), it wouldn't work to have the entire part of his backstory where he talks about being in love with Rahna who is female unless gay men regularly also get the hots for women (they might, I'm no expert on gay men). IMO, it makes Kaidan a weaker character to remove that part of his backstory so that he plays out as believably gay, bi, or straight.

When I say that I want my NPCs to have a definite orientation, I say that as someone who played a straight femshep and received the short end of the LI stick in this game. We only had two options available to us - Kaidan and Garrus. I say that and acknowledge that it will necessarily limit my options in terms of romanceable characters unless I decide to go after a PC who is openly either bisexual or decide to try a lesbian romance (I did romance Zevran who is very unapologetically bisexual in one of my DA:O playthroughs).

But I would rather have the chance of a romance with a character who intrigues me and engages me emotionally as much as Kaidan has and as much as Alistair did, even Zevran intrigued me. All three of those characters were far more interesting than Fenris whose most interesting detail was his voice. They could have done so much to make Fenris as deep as the first three I mentioned. They had 10 years of game time to develop him, but they didn't; they couldn't because Zevran had to be believable for PCs of all flavors, thus, his romance was very shallow and vanilla as were the other DA2 romances. Aveline's romance was more interesting and you didn't get directly take part in it.

[RagingCeltik]

The Invisible Commando wrote...

No! That is unrealistic. Some people are straight and some are gay. It's not fair to say you can "turn" a person either way. It's also ignorant too. Strongly against.

This.   I would add that the choices you make in the game are a reaction to the situation, not to define another character's personality.

[EsterCloat]

Total Biscuit wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

poundoffleshaa wrote...

I don't think everyone is bi I just think making a bunch of video game characters bi to please femal Shepard's who want to romance Tali wouldn't do any harm.

Tali don't swing that way.

Tali is actually a terrible example. She already finds both male Shepard and Garrus attractive, and there's far less of a difference between a male and female human and a male human and a metal skinned spike space raptor. Never mind the fact that if your dating outside your species, having similar genitals is really not the biggest hurdle to finding the other person shagable.

If she's that indifferent to appearence and cares primarily about the person, not the species, then there's just no reason she wouldn't want Femshep as much as Maleshep.

I'm pretty sure there are straight female players out there that are attracted to Garrus but wouldn't get with Tali.

[IoCaster]

poundoffleshaa wrote...

IoCaster wrote...

Get thee to a (preferred sexual orientation) porn site. One of the worst things that PanderWare™ have done over the years is get themselves pigeonholed into the role of puerile romance sim developers. *puke*

Thank you sir for gracing us with your balanced and objective opinion.

I'm actually being objective, so thanks. They limit their appeal to a broader audience that isn't interested in virtual romance by devoting so much attention and resources to a niche group of gamers. Some folks just want to play a game and not indulge in fantasy romance or sex. If people just want to play a game and interact with characters without having to be mindful of initiating a romance sub-plot then it becomes a minefield of unnecessarily complicated gameplay. *shrug*

[Bill Casey]

I would tend to agree that Jack should have been a bisexual love interest...

[Total Biscuit]

The Invisible Commando wrote...

No! That is unrealistic. Some people are straight and some are gay. It's not fair to say you can "turn" a person either way. It's also ignorant too. Strongly against.

Fine, make them straight when in a heterosexual romance and gay/lesbian when in a homosexual one. All it takes is for the romance to flag up one of two lines to use depending on which gender Shepard you chose.

That way in which ever universe that character was in they were always that way inclined. Problem solved.

Modifié par Total Biscuit, 28 mai 2012 - 11:17 .

[mauro2222]

element eater wrote...

Dendio1 wrote...
kaiden always seemed to lean a little gay on the other hand.

realy i found it odd he talks about girls more then any one in ME1. He tells u about a girl at biotic camp, likes fem shep and also liara if ur a man shep.


Jack definately should have been pretty sure she says shes been with girls b4

He doesn't need to like someone sexually.

[poundoffleshaa]

Liara is bi (well actually omni-sexual) but that doesn't effect her character at all, the character as a squad mate, as a friend and as a lover is segregated.

[draken-heart]

some are homosexual, some are heterosexual. very few are bisexualit would not be cool.

[Nightdragon8]

you know... thats the thing, making everyone bi seems like a cheap way to add romance. Sure you will have those that "wish" they could romance said character. But making them all by, makes it seem more like a story character than a real character. And honestly most people prefere 'real' characters.

[mauro2222]

EsterCloat wrote...

Total Biscuit wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

poundoffleshaa wrote...

I don't think everyone is bi I just think making a bunch of video game characters bi to please femal Shepard's who want to romance Tali wouldn't do any harm.

Tali don't swing that way.

Tali is actually a terrible example. She already finds both male Shepard and Garrus attractive, and there's far less of a difference between a male and female human and a male human and a metal skinned spike space raptor. Never mind the fact that if your dating outside your species, having similar genitals is really not the biggest hurdle to finding the other person shagable.

If she's that indifferent to appearence and cares primarily about the person, not the species, then there's just no reason she wouldn't want Femshep as much as Maleshep.

I'm pretty sure there are straight female players out there that are attracted to Garrus but wouldn't get with Tali.

Guess why? Because he's Garrus, is through his personality that they find attraction (also the voice obviously).
Ask them if they find a Turian attractive.

[NUM13ER]

frylock23 wrote...

I think the characters should have a definite orientation - gay, straight, bi. Yes, it does mean that it limits everyone's options because there will necessarily be a limited set of options for each orientation, but I think the character writing will be stronger without them trying to write characters to please two or three orientations at once depending on how the PC wants the NPC to play out.

This. It makes for a more believable world when it has things in common with this one. Much of the strength of  Mass Effects characters has been making them relatable. Yes whilst games are indeed escapism and shouldn't be bound too tightly by realism, I also feel writers should be trying to make characters that appeal to different people not characters that appeal to everyone.

[EsterCloat]

Total Biscuit wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

No! That is unrealistic. Some people are straight and some are gay. It's not fair to say you can "turn" a person either way. It's also ignorant too. Strongly against.

Fine, make them straight when in a heterosexual romance and gay/lesbian when in a homosexual one. All it takes is for the romance to flag up one of two lines to use depending on which gender Shepard you chose.

That way in which ever universe that character was in they were always that way inclined. Problem solved.

Why not make it so Garrus asks you what you think his background is and that way you can have him be either a tough renegade cop or a former florist? Why not have Jack be a choice of either a Cerberus lab rat or a mercenary on Omega?

Sexual orientation is a part of what a person is. Making it change on your whim is the same as changing their past to suit your needs.

[Total Biscuit]

EsterCloat wrote...

Total Biscuit wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

poundoffleshaa wrote...

I don't think everyone is bi I just think making a bunch of video game characters bi to please femal Shepard's who want to romance Tali wouldn't do any harm.

Tali don't swing that way.

Tali is actually a terrible example. She already finds both male Shepard and Garrus attractive, and there's far less of a difference between a male and female human and a male human and a metal skinned spike space raptor. Never mind the fact that if your dating outside your species, having similar genitals is really not the biggest hurdle to finding the other person shagable.

If she's that indifferent to appearence and cares primarily about the person, not the species, then there's just no reason she wouldn't want Femshep as much as Maleshep.

I'm pretty sure there are straight female players out there that are attracted to Garrus but wouldn't get with Tali.

And I doubt many of them would be turned off by Garrus's genitals looking exactly like a human vagina. Which would be vastly less disturbing than if Turians had genitals that looked like birds, as they should have given their avian analogue nature. Garrus is attractive because he's Garrus, and because of the awesome voice admittedly, not because of his junk.

[TheSixthghoul]

No that would be unrealistic.

[Edolix]

Bill Casey wrote...

Edolix wrote...

Kaidan going gay whilst Ash didn't always seemed odd to me.

Really?

................<_<

I meant in the sense that the two VS always seemed to mirror eachothers actions (not completely, obviously. But the basic trend is there). If BioWare were set on that route, I would have thought it would have made sense to make both Kaidan and Ash bisexual or not at all. Instead, they only did it to Kaidan. I don't really understand why.

Modifié par Edolix, 28 mai 2012 - 11:24 .

[IndigoWolfe]

Total Biscuit wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

No! That is unrealistic. Some people are straight and some are gay. It's not fair to say you can "turn" a person either way. It's also ignorant too. Strongly against.

Fine, make them straight when in a heterosexual romance and gay/lesbian when in a homosexual one. All it takes is for the romance to flag up one of two lines to use depending on which gender Shepard you chose.

That way in which ever universe that character was in they were always that way inclined. Problem solved.

That's dumb. Characters have overarching integrity, the only real changes to them --excluding parts where you might have a proactive role in changing their opinions-- are the different reponses they give to the different decisions you make.

For instance, I can't play KOTOR and go through the light side ending and pretend that Juhani and Jolee would have joined me had I picked the dark side ending.

Modifié par IndigoWolfe, 28 mai 2012 - 11:26 .

[NoUserNameHere]

You're already in a bromance with Garrus regardless of either character's alignment.

Tali has a pretty lengthy les yay entry on TV Tropes. Kinda surprised she doesn't have some kind of option with femshep.

While I had no real problem with the way DA2 handled things, I can't say I see, say, Miranda/Femshep working. so I guess my opinion is 'maybe more bi characters, but not neccessarily all bi characters.

[mauro2222]

EsterCloat wrote...

Total Biscuit wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

No! That is unrealistic. Some people are straight and some are gay. It's not fair to say you can "turn" a person either way. It's also ignorant too. Strongly against.

Fine, make them straight when in a heterosexual romance and gay/lesbian when in a homosexual one. All it takes is for the romance to flag up one of two lines to use depending on which gender Shepard you chose.

That way in which ever universe that character was in they were always that way inclined. Problem solved.

Why not make it so Garrus asks you what you think his background is and that way you can have him be either a tough renegade cop or a former florist? Why not have Jack be a choice of either a Cerberus lab rat or a mercenary on Omega?

Sexual orientation is a part of what a person is. Making it change on your whim is the same as changing their past to suit your needs.

Except that the romance is a total fanservice to let the player have satisfaction with the character they find most appealing to them

[Total Biscuit]

EsterCloat wrote...

Total Biscuit wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

No! That is unrealistic. Some people are straight and some are gay. It's not fair to say you can "turn" a person either way. It's also ignorant too. Strongly against.

Fine, make them straight when in a heterosexual romance and gay/lesbian when in a homosexual one. All it takes is for the romance to flag up one of two lines to use depending on which gender Shepard you chose.

That way in which ever universe that character was in they were always that way inclined. Problem solved.

Why not make it so Garrus asks you what you think his background is and that way you can have him be either a tough renegade cop or a former florist? Why not have Jack be a choice of either a Cerberus lab rat or a mercenary on Omega?

Sexual orientation is a part of what a person is. Making it change on your whim is the same as changing their past to suit your needs.

Except it doesn't come up unless you engage in a romance with that character. Unless you romance Garrus, you have no idea he can find humans attractive for instance. That fact doesn't change a single thing about his character.

Sexual orientation only makes people who they are when it comes to real people.

Fictional characters are what they are written to be, and that won't change because thei writer gives two slight bits of variation for optional dialogue in a scene dependant on the players gender. They are what they are written to be, and that's all that matters. It no more changes their dialogue or personality outside the romance than any other romance would.

[EsterCloat]

Total Biscuit wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

Total Biscuit wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

poundoffleshaa wrote...

I don't think everyone is bi I just think making a bunch of video game characters bi to please femal Shepard's who want to romance Tali wouldn't do any harm.

Tali don't swing that way.

Tali is actually a terrible example. She already finds both male Shepard and Garrus attractive, and there's far less of a difference between a male and female human and a male human and a metal skinned spike space raptor. Never mind the fact that if your dating outside your species, having similar genitals is really not the biggest hurdle to finding the other person shagable.

If she's that indifferent to appearence and cares primarily about the person, not the species, then there's just no reason she wouldn't want Femshep as much as Maleshep.

I'm pretty sure there are straight female players out there that are attracted to Garrus but wouldn't get with Tali.

And I doubt many of them would be turned off by Garrus's genitals looking exactly like a human vagina. Which would be vastly less disturbing than if Turians had genitals that looked like birds, as they should have given their avian analogue nature. Garrus is attractive because he's Garrus, and because of the awesome voice admittedly, not because of his junk.

Change Garrus to be a female turian, change his voice, leave everything else the same. A good number of those straight female players would not see her as a romantic option.

[poundoffleshaa]

A characters orientation is pretty unimportant all things said and done, if Tali had been Bi or a Lesbian she would still have a problem with the geth, have daddy issues, be dutiful and end up jumping off the cliff if the Quarian's decided to attack the upgraded Geth. She would have had the same personality, reacted the same way and behaved the same.

Modifié par poundoffleshaa, 28 mai 2012 - 11:32 .