320 réponses à ce sujet

[TheGreatDayne]

Stump01 wrote...

As I said in the comments on the poll, while I don't necessarily think all LIs should be bi, it would be cool to at least try to pick them up, if you wanted to. At least give the players the option to try, it was interesting to see broshep get shot down by Traynor during the chess scene.

I agree with this one. It would have been hilarious to hit on Miranda as a femShep, only to be shot down! 

[Fox In The Box]

In all honesty, yes. Though the game should take care to make it very obvious when Shepard is flirting with someone, otherwise it might get awkward speaking with characters that the player would rather have a platonic relationship with.

[EsterCloat]

Total Biscuit wrote...

Except it doesn't come up unless you engage in a romance with that character. Unless you romance Garrus, you have no idea he can find humans attractive for instance. That fact doesn't change a single thing about his character.

Sexual orientation only makes people who they are when it comes to real people.

Fictional characters are what they are written to be, and that won't change because thei writer gives two slight bits of variation for optional dialogue in a scene dependant on the players gender. They are what they are written to be, and that's all that matters. It no more changes their dialogue or personality outside the romance than any other romance would.

This here is the fundamental difference between us.

I see these characters as real people and you see them as malleable constructs for the purpose of a narrative.

I don't agree with being able to change an aspect of their's, whether it be relevant or not, on a whim to suit my needs anymore than I would a real person. You don't see a problem with it. This conversation has reached an impasse.

Modifié par EsterCloat, 28 mai 2012 - 11:36 .

[The Invisible Commando]

Total Biscuit wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

Total Biscuit wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

No! That is unrealistic. Some people are straight and some are gay. It's not fair to say you can "turn" a person either way. It's also ignorant too. Strongly against.

Fine, make them straight when in a heterosexual romance and gay/lesbian when in a homosexual one. All it takes is for the romance to flag up one of two lines to use depending on which gender Shepard you chose.

That way in which ever universe that character was in they were always that way inclined. Problem solved.

Why not make it so Garrus asks you what you think his background is and that way you can have him be either a tough renegade cop or a former florist? Why not have Jack be a choice of either a Cerberus lab rat or a mercenary on Omega?

Sexual orientation is a part of what a person is. Making it change on your whim is the same as changing their past to suit your needs.

Except it doesn't come up unless you engage in a romance with that character. Unless you romance Garrus, you have no idea he can find humans attractive for instance. That fact doesn't change a single thing about his character.

Sexual orientation only makes people who they are when it comes to real people.

Fictional characters are what they are written to be, and that won't change because thei writer gives two slight bits of variation for optional dialogue in a scene dependant on the players gender. They are what they are written to be, and that's all that matters. It no more changes their dialogue or personality outside the romance than any other romance would.

Kaiden was already rewritten to be bisexual. That does not mean they all have to be. If everyone on the Normandy was written to be bisexual, people of all orientations would laugh at that. It's just not how the world works. Only the Asari are written as omnisexual.

[NUM13ER]

NoUserNameHere wrote...
Tali has a pretty lengthy les yay entry on TV Tropes. Kinda surprised she doesn't have some kind of option with femshep 

Slash fic fans can and will look at any given scenario as evidence to the fact. Tali showing any signs of perfectly normal affection found in most friendships is seen as her wanting FemShep as a lover. It's wishful thinking.

The same type of fans think the brothers from Supernatural are into each other sexually. Which is outright delusion as anyone with brothers will tell you their relationship is a fairly realistic depiction of two siblings getting on each others nerves all the time but not letting anyone else mess with them. But with demons and stuff.

Sometimes people see just what they want to see, not what's actually there. Tali is no different.

Modifié par NUM13ER, 28 mai 2012 - 11:39 .

[mauro2222]

The Invisible Commando wrote...

Kaiden was already rewritten to be bisexual. That does not mean they all have to be. If everyone on the Normandy was written to be bisexual, people of all orientations would laugh at that. It's just not how the world works. Only the Asari are written as omnisexual.

Real life =/= fictional life.

And if they laugh, they seriously have a problem.

[Made Nightwing]

NUM13ER wrote...

NoUserNameHere wrote...
Tali has a pretty lengthy les yay entry on TV Tropes. Kinda surprised she doesn't have some kind of option with femshep 

Slash fic fans can and will look at any given scenario as evidence to the fact. Tali showing any signs of perfectly normal affection found in most friendships is seen as her wanting FemShep as a lover. It's wishful thinking.

The same type of fans think the brothers from Supernatural are into each other sexually. Which is outright delusion as anyone with brothers will tell you their relationship is a fairly realistic depiction of two siblings getting on each others nerves all the time but not letting anyone else mess with them. But with demons and stuff.

Sometimes people see just what they want to see, not what's actually there. Tali is no different.

Yep. If Sam and Dean are meant to be romantically linked, then my brothers and I have serious problems.

I would have liked to say that making everyone bi was the biggest of DAII's failings. Unfortunately, that would be a lie. But it was a major one.

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

No Thanks one Dragon Age 2 is enough, thank you very much

[The Invisible Commando]

Made Nightwing wrote...

NUM13ER wrote...

NoUserNameHere wrote...
Tali has a pretty lengthy les yay entry on TV Tropes. Kinda surprised she doesn't have some kind of option with femshep 

Slash fic fans can and will look at any given scenario as evidence to the fact. Tali showing any signs of perfectly normal affection found in most friendships is seen as her wanting FemShep as a lover. It's wishful thinking.

The same type of fans think the brothers from Supernatural are into each other sexually. Which is outright delusion as anyone with brothers will tell you their relationship is a fairly realistic depiction of two siblings getting on each others nerves all the time but not letting anyone else mess with them. But with demons and stuff.

Sometimes people see just what they want to see, not what's actually there. Tali is no different.

Yep. If Sam and Dean are meant to be romantically linked, then my brothers and I have serious problems.

I would have liked to say that making everyone bi was the biggest of DAII's failings. Unfortunately, that would be a lie. But it was a major one.

Supernatural! Pretty sure they wanted them to be brothers so they never had to confront the gay issue. That would be my guess.

[Ronin09]

No, on a side note this is yet another reason why I always let Kaidan die on Virmire. Outside of his tragic mutant childhood, his back round was ambiguous and boring enough in my view, to just sort of drop in during ME3 that oh yeah he happens to be Bi. It's also why I perfectly happy with my own canon Femshep romancing Traynor, instead of one of the other female squad members.

[mauro2222]

I fail to see how DA2 is proof of failure. Everyone had a fully developed interaction with a romanced or a non romanced Hawke.

[Clown Eater]

I think the main problem that comes up if they all swing both ways is that practically EVERY single party member would hit on Shepard at the same time.

Modifié par Clown Eater, 28 mai 2012 - 11:51 .

[Spitfire017]

Well, both Kaidan and Ashley were meant to be bisexual when they were written back in ME1, but that was dropped before the game was launched for some unknown reason. But, the audio files were left in the game when it was released, so it was possible to have a gay relationship with both characters if modded.

So, in my opinion, Ash and Kaidan should be bisexual options throughout all three games. Why just Kaidan in ME3? They should give that option for Ash as well since they already had it back in the first game...though unofficial of course!

Other characters, such as Thane, Tali or Garrus...not really seeing it. Would love to see Garrus turn down MShep, run to the main battery, and then lock the door behind him 

[mauro2222]

Clown Eater wrote...

I think the main problem that comes up if they all swing both ways is that practically EVERY single party member would hit on Shepard at the same time.

That's a problem with the game, if someone hits on you, you decide if you take it as a friendly flirt or as something more.

[NUM13ER]

The Invisible Commando wrote...
Supernatural! Pretty sure they wanted them to be brothers so they never had to confront the gay issue. That would be my guess.

They clearly underestimated the lengths shippers and slash fic writers will go to. Even blood isn't enough to deter all of them lol.

Modifié par NUM13ER, 28 mai 2012 - 11:58 .

[capn233]

No.

[M Hedonist]

Having all of the love interests be available to you no matter your gender makes the decisions during your character creation seem more pointless. The decisions you make while creating your character should actually have some consequence and make your game different every time you play. That adds replay value.
This way you actually have to play both genders if you want to get everything out of the game. Just like you have to play each origin and background. Well, in ME1 you had to do that if you didn't want to miss out on anything, at least.

[Clown Eater]

mauro2222 wrote...

Clown Eater wrote...

I think the main problem that comes up if they all swing both ways is that practically EVERY single party member would hit on Shepard at the same time.

That's a problem with the game, if someone hits on you, you decide if you take it as a friendly flirt or as something more.

Right, and if you're a male Shepard under the circumstances where all love interests can go both ways, you'll find that every one of your male party members is gay for you.  Vice versa for female Shepard of course.  I feel like that would be kind of strange.

[Mev186]

I think Tali would have been a great FemShep love interest mainly because Jennifer Hale does a very good job of playfully teasing the other characters.and Tali being very nervous and insecure as she is would have been fun to see play out

[Made Nightwing]

Spitfire017 wrote...

Well, both Kaidan and Ashley were meant to be bisexual when they were written back in ME1, but that was dropped before the game was launched for some unknown reason. But, the audio files were left in the game when it was released, so it was possible to have a gay relationship with both characters if modded.

So, in my opinion, Ash and Kaidan should be bisexual options throughout all three games. Why just Kaidan in ME3? They should give that option for Ash as well since they already had it back in the first game...though unofficial of course!

Other characters, such as Thane, Tali or Garrus...not really seeing it. Would love to see Garrus turn down MShep, run to the main battery, and then lock the door behind him 

No, they weren't. It was discussed during development but decided against. The lines are in the game because Hale and Meer read from the same script.

[VirtualSoldier27]

in Fallout:New Vegas, I was sure that I would fall in love with Veronica, she was my first companion, and I really liked her once I got to talking to her, but got a dosed of cold water when I found out she was a lesbian, but still had a loving and supportive relationship with her, I helped her with her problems in the brotherhood,and even tracked down her former mentor and girlfriend(at great leangths and risks and frustrations to myself), but she will always be just a close friend, no matter how much I love her,becuase she is who she is, and that makes the immersion just that much more, I am not going to ask Bethsda/Obsidian to rewrite her has bisexual anytime soon

Modifié par VirtualSoldier27, 29 mai 2012 - 12:14 .

[frylock23]

Total Biscuit wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

Total Biscuit wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

No! That is unrealistic. Some people are straight and some are gay. It's not fair to say you can "turn" a person either way. It's also ignorant too. Strongly against.

Fine, make them straight when in a heterosexual romance and gay/lesbian when in a homosexual one. All it takes is for the romance to flag up one of two lines to use depending on which gender Shepard you chose.

That way in which ever universe that character was in they were always that way inclined. Problem solved.

Why not make it so Garrus asks you what you think his background is and that way you can have him be either a tough renegade cop or a former florist? Why not have Jack be a choice of either a Cerberus lab rat or a mercenary on Omega?

Sexual orientation is a part of what a person is. Making it change on your whim is the same as changing their past to suit your needs.

Except it doesn't come up unless you engage in a romance with that character. Unless you romance Garrus, you have no idea he can find humans attractive for instance. That fact doesn't change a single thing about his character.

Sexual orientation only makes people who they are when it comes to real people.

Fictional characters are what they are written to be, and that won't change because thei writer gives two slight bits of variation for optional dialogue in a scene dependant on the players gender. They are what they are written to be, and that's all that matters. It no more changes their dialogue or personality outside the romance than any other romance would.

As a writer, the only way it could possibly work the way you want it to is if they wrote two (or three) versions of each character, one for each orientation. Then they had the writers get together and pow-wow on which bits could realistically be dialogue in common across the orientations. Those dialogue bits, the VA only has to say once; the rest has to be said separately and then flagged to go depending on which options your PC chooses (gender/romance etc.). At some point, they might as well make the character three separate characters or make them superficial. Either way, the character will likely suffer just so the fans can have whatever their fanservice lust of the moment is.

I would prefer that they make the characters, decide what and who they are and write them that way.

Because, yeah, Cortez is an attractive guy, but I don't play broSheps and he doesn't swing my way, so I'll just have to admire from a distance and be happy with Kaidan. Oh, well, we can't always get what we want in life.

And I'm sure there are broSheps who thought Traynor was hot.

And no matter how many romances they inject, there will always be people who will opt for none of thee above and come here and b**** and moan about that, too.

[Muhkida]

Yes because there shouldn't be any limitations as long as it doesn't effect the realism or lore of the game. Dragon Age 2 did just fine IMO

But at the same time, DA2 =/= ME3. Can't imagine Ashley swinging both ways because of her being somewhat heavy with her religion (Christian?).

[Made Nightwing]

@Munkida. It's never mentioned what religion Ash is. She simply wasn't written that way.

[poundoffleshaa]

A Sexual preference does not a character make, why would a person attitudes, likes, personality and character change just because they like a different type of tail (unless you suggesting because a character is gay he suddenly needs to become camp, which in consider predjudiced) . Other than the flirtatious lines I don't see why any other lines would need to be changed.

Modifié par poundoffleshaa, 29 mai 2012 - 12:30 .