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[AmazingOlivia]

 Thanks to the release of "The Silent Grove" we know that Bioware has a canon for Dragon Age, which among possible other things(Dark Ritual?) has established Alistair as the King.

However, this is not set in stone in the games themselves as DAIII will still import from the previous titles, meaning a player could have a Thedas where Alistair is dead, or a drunk, or a Warden. None of those scenarios lend themselves to the search he is on for Maric in TSG. This search is obvioulsy important to the Lore, and isn't going to be just some sidestory, so there will need to be some way to explain how the search happened in a world where Alistair was not involved.

Now, if Loghain was still alive, there is the possibilty he might be the one to search for his friend.
What do you guys think they will do?

[robertthebard]

I tend to look at the books as an alternate universe to the game universe, due to conflicts, or possible conflicts with in game events.

[Face of Evil]

I don't really see how the search for Maric is important to the lore. It would only be significant if he was a) alive and wanted to resume his throne. Aside from being personally important to Alistair, what else does it matter?

[Emzamination]

You do realize morrigan gave a special book to hunt flemeth at the end of witch hunt don't you? Perhaps the warden takes the place of Alistair in the game universe hunting flemeth's daughters.Anyways the silent grove didn't really reveal anything earth shattering so it could hardly be called critical lore.

[Gervaise]

I felt this storyline would have made a good DLC. The way to accommodate different fates for Alistair would be to substitute a loyal retainer of Anora (Fergus Cousland?) who has been asked to follow up rumours that Maric is still alive. This is plausible as if Maric were still around this would represent a possibilty for a challenge to her rule. So I would imagine that it would require only a bit of tweeking to introduce this into DA3 historical background or even as a sub-plot within the game.

[WhiteKnyght]

DarkPikmin wrote...

 Thanks to the release of "The Silent Grove" we know that Bioware has a canon for Dragon Age, which among possible other things(Dark Ritual?) has established Alistair as the King.

However, this is not set in stone in the games themselves as DAIII will still import from the previous titles, meaning a player could have a Thedas where Alistair is dead, or a drunk, or a Warden. None of those scenarios lend themselves to the search he is on for Maric in TSG. This search is obvioulsy important to the Lore, and isn't going to be just some sidestory, so there will need to be some way to explain how the search happened in a world where Alistair was not involved.

Now, if Loghain was still alive, there is the possibilty he might be the one to search for his friend.
What do you guys think they will do?

The Silent Grove's story arguably can happen in pretty much any case.

Alistair can learn about his father being alive and go search for him in any capacity. Be it King, Grey Warden, or Dunken Bum(having sobered up.)

If Alistair is dead, Loghain could easily be the one searching, provided that you didn't sacrifice him.

If Alistair and Loghain are both dead, Arl Eamon could have found out about Maric possibly being alive and has someone searching for him in hopes of preserving the Theirin bloodline.

[WhiteKnyght]

Emzamination wrote...

You do realize morrigan gave a special book to hunt flemeth at the end of witch hunt don't you? Perhaps the warden takes the place of Alistair in the game universe hunting flemeth's daughters.Anyways the silent grove didn't really reveal anything earth shattering so it could hardly be called critical lore.

That was the book about the Eluvian she stole from Ariane's clan, not any special witch hunting text

Ariane: "Ask her about our book."

Modifié par The Grey Nayr, 02 juin 2012 - 12:32 .

[Kulyok]

It will probably come down to "the scholars found out anyway". Frankly, I don't think books and comics with self-imposed canon(Silent Grove, Asunder) added anything to the story. Rather, they detract from the magnificent legend of the games:
- "Fiona is leading mages now? Come on, everyone knows that Anders and Hawke freed the mages, and they started the mage-templar war! Why would anyone want to rewrite that?"
- "Alistair? He didn't go anywhere with Varric, of course. Alistair is a traitor! He refused to defend Ferelden from the Blight when we spared Loghain, and was executed on Queen Anora's orders. My Warden said nothing - very sad, but Duncan would've done the same, I'm sure."

... Unlike the Stolen Throne, for example, where the existing universe is made wider and deeper and much more interesting, and the existing characters - more amazing and multidimensional(Loghain practically becomes Snape, only Cailan is no Harry), to the point where you'll never look at Katriel's Grasp gauntlets the same way again.

[nightscrawl]

The Grey Nayr wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

You do realize morrigan gave a special book to hunt flemeth at the end of witch hunt don't you? Perhaps the warden takes the place of Alistair in the game universe hunting flemeth's daughters.Anyways the silent grove didn't really reveal anything earth shattering so it could hardly be called critical lore.

That was the book about the Eluvian she stole from Ariane's clan, not any special witch hunting text

Ariane: "Ask her about our book."

You're both only partly right. Yes, the book was the same belonging to Ariane's clan. However, Morrigan also says there are other items/information of interest (I don't remember her exact wording, I can load up a save if it's absolutely required...) along with the borrowed book. The other interesting bits could concern any range of topics: dragons, Flemeth, Grey Warden lore, a cure for the GW taint, any knowledge of the possible upcoming mage/templar conflict, etc. We can't really know, until such time as Bioware feels like using that as a plot device in a future game.

DarkPikmin wrote...

Thanks to the release of "The Silent Grove" we know that Bioware has a canon for Dragon Age, which among possible other things(Dark Ritual?) has established Alistair as the King.

Pretty much the only 100% established thing is that Alistair is king. This happens at an undermined time, so we don't know if Isabela and Varric are post or peri Kirkwall/DA2. It could conceivably be happening during either of the three year gaps. I'm inclined to think that all of the comic takes place between Act 2 and 3 since Isabela is known to have disappeared for an undetermined amount of time (if you saved her from the Arishok), and Alistair's appearance as king in Act 3 -- if you do a DAO import -- seems to have him being more accepting of the role.

During his final conversation with the witch Alistair makes a vague reference to "rituals" which could be said to allude to the Dark Ritual. However, that would only be a vague hint and it's never confirmed if that is the reason he is alive, nor is there no confirmation that the Warden is also alive (in fact no mention of our Waren at all), which would be a further indication that the DR did in fact happen.

Face of Evil wrote...

I don't really see how the search for Maric is important to the lore. It would only be significant if he was a) alive and wanted to resume his throne. Aside from being personally important to Alistair, what else does it matter?

We can only think that because the storyline isn't finished. Even if he's dead, that doesn't prohibit Alistair from learning important/significant information along the way that would be important to the lore (or at least meaningful to players.)


From things David Gaider has said, and from other things said at PAX East I really get the impression that they are trying to let the player maintain control/influence of their own world. However successful they are with that (see: Leliana and Anders) is certainly up to debate, but they are aware that too much retconning or established canon in other (non-game) media is a problem for players.

[nightscrawl]

Kulyok wrote...

"Fiona is leading mages now? Come on, everyone knows that Anders and Hawke freed the mages, and they started the mage-templar war! Why would anyone want to rewrite that?"

If people are looking at it that way then they are wrong because nothing was "rewritten." The one and only fact about the events of DA2 that is mentioned is Anders (directly by name) and his act against the Chantry. That's all. And that is a fact that happens in any play of DA2 regardless of the choices you make.

Just because Anders and Hawke ignited a rebellion doesn't mean they want to be leaders. To be honest, I think Anders would make a poor leader. And too, Fiona in Asunder is acting in an official capacity at the mage conference thing they have, which Anders and Hawke are incapable of doing because they would be/are wanted individuals after the events in Kirkwall. So really, it's not "rewriting" anything, it's showing events afterward, an entire year afterward in fact, which Anders and Hawke have nothing to do with.

From a mage perspective, Anders did a "great" thing (actually, DG takes pains to show that not all mages, whether or not they like the Circle/Chantry, agree with what Anders did). But a single act by a single person means nothing unless mages throughout Thedas also take it upon themselves to rebel in their own way, which Fiona is contributing to. This is part of the reason Rhys decision at the end is so significant. Throughout most of the book he is against outright rebellion, but is convinced by the end that there is no other way; the Chantry won't change their stance (too many old guard, no matter how open the Divine herself is), and attempts to work from within the Circle have been futile.