143 réponses à ce sujet

[Leviathan898]

Nereithr wrote...

You know what? I actually reconsidered. PA doesn't need armored BEs. He is not your "spam BEs all day long" adept. He is a more classical adept, using his powers to damage/throw stuff directly.

Also, lash is what i have always wanted pull to be. Works on shielded targets, and flings, rather than pulls.

^Problem is, lash is VERY strong. It deals a ton of damage and flings enemies a freaking mile away from enemies. The BEs would be wasted most of the time, and being able to throw phantoms/hunters/liutenants is invaluable.

This. BEs are not the end goal of any class with biotics. Killing enemies are, and Lash deals pretty high damage by itself and can be used long range. Smash damage is so high by itself too.

[Sgt SuperWae]

I played with this new adept all day and I totally get the OP's concerns. However, after spending so much time with the class I managed to get into a pretty good groove with it. The learning curve for the ex-cerberus adept is definately high, and I don't see the class topping gold scoreboards anytime soon, but the potential is there.

[Ogrinash]

I have the Vanguard, which is pretty much the same thing.

I can see why people used to the "usual" Adapts would have problems adjusting. You really aren't going to rely on BE, even though you can pull them off; your main goal is to kill nearly everything the enemy throws at you, and with Smash and Lash, you can do that.

I throw a Reegar IX on him and it's a mob killing machine. Whilst it's not that good at open crowd control, it's a kill an enemy one after another style, and when they get too close to you, Smash and Heavy Melee them all to death.

Modifié par Ogrinash, 30 mai 2012 - 11:11 .

[fallingseraph]

ghey it up wrote...

It's okay if this class is terribad because BioWare will just buff them down the road. Just look at all the strides they've made in the last month and a half or so with underpowered classes/weapons/skills/etc

You mean wait 6 months?

[Bloodleash]

Although I enjoy the look and feel of the class, I find it's seriously hard to play and achieve high scores. Heavily dependant on CQB and doesn't have to Health + Barrier to survive that encounter, more specifically on Gold difficulty. It requires more in the way of Biotic Explosions or possibly switching Singularity for Stasis just so you can line up that devastating smash attack without being gunned down within seconds.

Although I will persist, give him a few more attempts/respecs just to see if there is a viable spec for a truly awesome looking class.

[Seerezaro]

Ogrinash wrote...

I have the Vanguard, which is pretty much the same thing.

I can see why people used to the "usual" Adapts would have problems adjusting. You really aren't going to rely on BE, even though you can pull them off; your main goal is to kill nearly everything the enemy throws at you, and with Smash and Lash, you can do that.

I throw a Reegar IX on him and it's a mob killing machine. Whilst it's not that good at open crowd control, it's a kill an enemy one after another style, and when they get too close to you, Smash and Heavy Melee them all to death.

Throw a high level Reegar on anything and its a killing machine

[MrScottBear]

I tossed on my Krysae...heavy Melee Smash Heavy Melee Cancel Shoot repeat. It's...wow.

[dsprado956]

They should replace singularity with stasis...could play off slash and smash better

[Dream-Maker]

I've tried a few runs but I still can't figure how to use this class... These characters have some pretty heavy flaws of conception or I'm missing something big.

First of all animations for smash and lash are way too long. Sure, you can cancel the latter part of the animations into heavy melee or rolling, which can be useful, however when using them under cover you are exposing yourself for too long, and cancelling there makes you leave your cover which is nearly as bad as taking shots during the animations. I think they should have made animations way shorter, right now it just doesn't make any sense.

Lash in itself is a great power no doubt, only thing that bugs me about it is the fact that it pulls the enemies BEHIND you and the animation is way too long.

Smash looks great at first glance, does awesome damage and can hit through walls. However the range is way too short and here again the animation is way too long, not to mention that the actual attack takes years to come out.

Overall I think the animations on both attacks are hurting the phoenixes too much to make them viable. And I don't know why the hell they didn't provide them with any form of added survability since smash suggests these guys are meant to be played at very close range...

Sure the vanguard has charge to refill his shields but he is left pretty much open afterwards, not mentioning that neither smash nor lash synergizes well with the charge.

Until I see someone doing something really good with these guys I can't keep thinking they need some drastic tweaks to make them more viable... Right now surviving while trying to put their powers to good use is hell of a challenge.

Modifié par Dream-Maker, 30 mai 2012 - 12:49 .

[fallingseraph]

Dieing during animations is not fun

[Johnny B. Goode]

smash range just need to be further, it is too short!

[mrcanada]

marshalleck wrote...

the class is just fine

now batarian sentinel, there's a guy who had troubles in the beginning. people are already ripping it up with both phoenix classes, and more will figure it out soon

Except the Batarian Sentinel is still terrible on gold.  Bronze/Silver doesn't really come into play with measuring a characters worth, they're too easy.

[mrcanada]

Adhok42 wrote...

Major Durza wrote...

You must be new here.  The forums are flooded with Gold  players, and that is the usual accepted standard.  Guns and characters are compared by what they can do on Gold on higher levels.  It is hard to understand how to be effective with this guy on Gold, in the later waves most enemies are shielded or armored.

Dude. NEVER start from the top when you're going into a situation with stuff you don't understand. You start from the bottom and work you way up. That's probably why people are getting frustrated.

No, you're wrong.  

[mrcanada]

ParanoidDrone wrote...

Disclaimer: I haven't unlocked either Phoenix class yet.

Every time people talk about Lash, someone mentions how the final evolution to ignore shields and barriers is amazing, which is probably true. But what about the alternate evolution to extend the detonation window by 100%? Is it worth it but inferior to ignoring 2/3 of the protection types? Or is there some other reason no one seems to opt for it?

If you're playing gold, then you can't take the BE extension evolution no matter how nice it sounds.  You need to be able to use it against shield/barriers.

[xROLLxTIDEx]

I've logged many, many hours as the human adept (which this forum hates on). I can easily run the HA on gold against any faction with any team make up without any worries. I say that to say that this new Phoenix Adept seems very similar to the human adept (to me at first impression.)

Singularity is Singularity. (I actually love singularity but to each their own)
Smash is similar to Shockwave. (Short range, hits multiple enemies)
Lash is similar to Warp (Long range, DOT in rank 5)

The main difference I noticed is that the PA does so much damage straight up that you do not have to rely on the biotic explosions. Smash hits extremely, extremely hard. The biggest drawback of Smash is how you are vulnerable during the animation. I have not tried the heavy melee cancel, but the length of the animation means that the player must be smart about when and where to use smash. You do not want to stand in the open using smash on enemies. Better to use it when you have isolated an enemy or from soft cover around corners.

Lash is hard to control, esp at first and takes some time to get used to. The rank 6 evolution plays a huge role in how you use it. Most people have been taking the "pull shield/barrier enemies" in rank 6 and I did as well with the PA. I went with the other option for the vanguard so I can Lash>Biotic Charge.

Any non-armored enemy = Lash
Any enemy up close = Smash spam
Lash and Smash both detonate singularity.

Also, I was using singularity on shielded mobs and then lashing them which would remove their shield but instead of flinging them off the map or flying in some random direction, the singularity grabbed them and then lash would detonate the singularity.

Singularity>Lash>Lash works for creating BE on mobs at a distance.

[nomad311]

Leviathan898 wrote...

BeardyMcGoo wrote...

A Wild Snorlax wrote...

their powers seem to lack synergy to me.

This is my problem with the class.
Sure, you can detonate enemies you've lashed with smash...but you get no collateral damage with your explosion considering you toss enemies too far away from the group they're in.

I understand synergy is great for those who prefer to be able to play effectively and set up their own BEs but I really don't think PAs need it. I cannot say enough how much Lash rocks by itself and Smash is relatively strong in terms of damage when used against heavies. Long range and short range sorted. If there's a long range armoured enemy then either shoot or let your team deal while you pick on other enemies.

Here's what happens on Bronze against the "heaviess" brutes/banshees/atlas/phantoms with smash. You get close enough to smash, hit button, animation starts, by the time it has finished brutes/banshees have picked you up and eaten you, atlas has stomped on you, phantom has assassinated you. Silver/Gold everything else has taken down your shield by the time you finished the animation then while trying to grab cover you die. Hunters knock you out of the animation before you even finish it. It's a cool looking power, I just haven't figured out where it's really useful yet. 

Modifié par nomad311, 30 mai 2012 - 01:21 .

[Shrubbery]

This class on it's own is terrible, I can agree with that. But it can be a valuable asset in a biotic death squad, depending on your teammates (I don't suggest PuGs) of course. I have found it most effective when my friends and I run Reapers on Glacier, with 2 Justicars, and either 2 Phoenix Adepts or 1 Phoenix/1 Asari or Sentinel). Camp the top middle room (yes, the smallest room on the map), put your bubbles up, and let the annihilation begin. Granted, the first 4 waves you can just run through and wipe out the enemy (which I do suggest). After wave 5 when you start getting banshees, then start camping that room. As long as your team is in-sync with reaving/smash/throwing, you will dominate anything and everything that steps foot in that bubble.

[Pitznik]

nomad311 wrote...



Here's what happens on Bronze against the "heaviess" brutes/banshees/atlas/phantoms with smash. You get close enough to smash, hit button, animation starts, by the time it has finished brutes/banshees have picked you up and eaten you, atlas has stomped on you, phantom has assassinated you. Silver/Gold everything else has taken down your shield by the time you finished the animation then while trying to grab cover you die. Hunters knock you out of the animation before you even finish it. It's a cool looking power, I just haven't figured out where it's really useful yet. 

Find some nice corner or not too thick wall, stand there with no eye contact with the enemy and spam Smash.

[Descy_]

Wow, enemies can interrupt you during your power animations.

Yeah, Im starting to not like this class more and more.

[GGW KillerTiger]

 Told ya the Phoenix classes are uber bad yesterday ...... Yea he gets a broked version of shockwave and pull that are actually worse than shockwave and pull .... Woopty do .....

[John123453242]

I really like the new class. If you go with other Adepts, it is great. I played Condor and lashed like 30 guys off the cliff by the LZ on my first time trying it.

[GGW KillerTiger]

The Great and Powerful Trixie wrote...

I got the vanguard. I never play that class but gave it a test run to see all the new abilities. I really don't like smash. :/ When I play adept I pretty much do the biotic artillery thing and stay back so I find it useless personally. Lash is fun though. GET OVER HERE.

I guess if I do get the adept I'll put the points in Singularity and name him Scorpion.

Only difference between vangaurd and adept Phoenix class is vangaurd has Biotic Charge has Adept has Singularity ..... Other than that they're literally exactly the same

Modifié par GGW KillerTiger, 30 mai 2012 - 01:56 .

[theadjectivenoun]

 After unlocking both classes the vanguard and Adept...they both suck, they both are melee, the Kroguard and Vanguard are still the best classes to play on Melee biotic part. 

the Vanguard one needs to be tweaked badly, the combo of Charge and Smash needs not  to share the same cooldown, which results you getting killed nearly all the damn time. it needs to be charge, then RB. not Charge...wait for it...wait for it...wait for it...RB...wait for it...S.O.B. dead.

those two classes are horrible don't think BW knew what they were doing when they created that class.

[GGW KillerTiger]

theadjectivenoun wrote...

 After unlocking both classes the vanguard and Adept...they both suck, they both are melee, the Kroguard and Vanguard are still the best classes to play on Melee biotic part. 

the Vanguard one needs to be tweaked badly, the combo of Charge and Smash needs not  to share the same cooldown, which results you getting killed nearly all the damn time. it needs to be charge, then RB. not Charge...wait for it...wait for it...wait for it...RB...wait for it...S.O.B. dead.

those two classes are horrible don't think BW knew what they were doing when they created that class.

The fact that this DLC "new" charachters was 3 sets of 2 where they all have the same skills except 1 didn't say anything to you about it?

[Tankcommander]

Seerezaro wrote...

Ogrinash wrote...

I have the Vanguard, which is pretty much the same thing.

I can see why people used to the "usual" Adapts would have problems adjusting. You really aren't going to rely on BE, even though you can pull them off; your main goal is to kill nearly everything the enemy throws at you, and with Smash and Lash, you can do that.

I throw a Reegar IX on him and it's a mob killing machine. Whilst it's not that good at open crowd control, it's a kill an enemy one after another style, and when they get too close to you, Smash and Heavy Melee them all to death.

Throw a high level Reegar on anything and its a killing machine

This.

On topic tho, I feel as if he is gold worthy, definitely more so than a Krogan Soldier, for example. You can play any class on gold if you do it right. I died a lot with the PA my first gold round, but the more I play with him the better I do. He is weird, but def gold material. I skipped Singularity and am currently using a Harrier, but think I'm going to use a Reegar instead.