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[Fingertrip]

Listen to yourself.

You're indoctrinated.

[His Name was HYR!!]

Destroy = Renegade.
Control = Paragorn.
Synthesis = UBERMENSCH!

[Han Shot First]

111987 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

111987 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

Head canon makes a poor argument for the superiority of Control.

In examining the endings you have to examine them only what we actually see in game. Based on what we actually see in game, Destroy is the only one that most resembles a win.

We are told in game that Control defeats the Reapers. It is canon that Shepard gains control of the Reapers.

You are told that by the Star Child

No, I am referring to the message at the end of the game telling me my Shepard became a legend by defeating the Reapers.

And as I pointed out earlier, that scene does not occur at the end of time. Even if it takes places thousands of years after the events of ME3, the Reapers have been around for at least a billion years. A few thousand years is the blink of a cosmic eye for them.

What is to guarantee that they won't destroy all life in another 50,000 years? Or 100,000? Or 1,000,000? All the Control and Synthesis endings have is hope that they won't, and trust in the word of Star Child. Maybe he'll prove trustworhy, and maybe he won't. The player doesn't know and neither does Shepard.

As such, Destroy is the only ending that truly guarantees that the Reaper threat is ended once and for all.

[Dusen]

The Catalyst/Starchild specifically says, ". . . do you THINK you can control us?" when he gives you the choice for control? I think that right there destroys any idea that Shepard actually being able to control the Reapers is "canon".

Now whether that is tied to something as grandiose as IT or that it is just poor writing is another debate altogether.

[Taboo]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Destroy = Renegade.
Control = Paragorn.
Synthesis = UBERMENSCH!

Ah yes Nietzche.

You understand WHO used the idea of the ubermensch?

BLEUGH.

[Erield]

Fingertrip wrote...

Listen to yourself.

You're indoctrinated.

I listen to myself all the time.  Sometimes I stop listening to other people, especially if they're delivering the exact same message I've heard a thousand times and I'm tired of it.  Don't you hate it when those traveling sales religions come knocking on your door, and you try to politely tell them to **** off, but they just won't take a hint?

But anyway.  Yeah.  Geth aren't perfect, I agree, but they're still people.  I'm pretty sure Reapers are too, but not necessarily--forgot to include that as an unknown in my last post.  If they for sure aren't, then Control suddenly takes the place of Destroy as most desirable/most moral, since Shepard can simply order them into the nearest sun.

[111987]

Han Shot First wrote...

111987 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

111987 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

Head canon makes a poor argument for the superiority of Control.

In examining the endings you have to examine them only what we actually see in game. Based on what we actually see in game, Destroy is the only one that most resembles a win.

We are told in game that Control defeats the Reapers. It is canon that Shepard gains control of the Reapers.

You are told that by the Star Child

No, I am referring to the message at the end of the game telling me my Shepard became a legend by defeating the Reapers.

And as I pointed out earlier, that scene does not occur at the end of time. Even if it takes places thousands of years after the events of ME3, the Reapers have been around for at least a billion years. A few thousand years is the blink of a cosmic eye for them.

What is to guarantee that they won't destroy all life in another 50,000 years? Or 100,000? Or 1,000,000? All the Control and Synthesis endings have is hope that they won't, and trust in the word of Star Child. Maybe he'll prove trustworhy, and maybe he won't. The player doesn't know and neither does Shepard.

As such, Destroy is the only ending that truly guarantees that the Reaper threat is ended once and for all.

I'm sorry but I completely disagree. If I was told the Reapers were defeated, that's what I'm going to believe. All your speculation is just that; speculation, and to be honest, unfounded speculation.

[jijeebo]

Dusen wrote...

The Catalyst/Starchild specifically says, ". . . do you THINK you can control us?" when he gives you the choice for control? I think that right there destroys any idea that Shepard actually being able to control the Reapers is "canon".

Now whether that is tied to something as grandiose as IT or that it is just poor writing is another debate altogether.

"You will die, you WILL control the reapers but you will lose everything you have."
"But the reapers will obey me?"
"Yes."


Seems pretty conclusive to me.

[KevShep]

111987 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

111987 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

111987 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

Head canon makes a poor argument for the superiority of Control.

In examining the endings you have to examine them only what we actually see in game. Based on what we actually see in game, Destroy is the only one that most resembles a win.

We are told in game that Control defeats the Reapers. It is canon that Shepard gains control of the Reapers.

You are told that by the Star Child

No, I am referring to the message at the end of the game telling me my Shepard became a legend by defeating the Reapers.

And as I pointed out earlier, that scene does not occur at the end of time. Even if it takes places thousands of years after the events of ME3, the Reapers have been around for at least a billion years. A few thousand years is the blink of a cosmic eye for them.

What is to guarantee that they won't destroy all life in another 50,000 years? Or 100,000? Or 1,000,000? All the Control and Synthesis endings have is hope that they won't, and trust in the word of Star Child. Maybe he'll prove trustworhy, and maybe he won't. The player doesn't know and neither does Shepard.

As such, Destroy is the only ending that truly guarantees that the Reaper threat is ended once and for all.

I'm sorry but I completely disagree. If I was told the Reapers were defeated, that's what I'm going to believe. All your speculation is just that; speculation, and to be honest, unfounded speculation.

Iam just going to throw this in here but you can see a over turned Mako in the background of the Breath scene....Its London!

[KevShep]

jijeebo wrote...

Dusen wrote...

The Catalyst/Starchild specifically says, ". . . do you THINK you can control us?" when he gives you the choice for control? I think that right there destroys any idea that Shepard actually being able to control the Reapers is "canon".

Now whether that is tied to something as grandiose as IT or that it is just poor writing is another debate altogether.

"You will die, you WILL control the reapers but you will lose everything you have."
"But the reapers will obey me?"
"Yes."


Seems pretty conclusive to me.

He has also been your enemy for the past 3 games.

[jijeebo]

KevShep wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

Dusen wrote...

The Catalyst/Starchild specifically says, ". . . do you THINK you can control us?" when he gives you the choice for control? I think that right there destroys any idea that Shepard actually being able to control the Reapers is "canon".

Now whether that is tied to something as grandiose as IT or that it is just poor writing is another debate altogether.

"You will die, you WILL control the reapers but you will lose everything you have."
"But the reapers will obey me?"
"Yes."


Seems pretty conclusive to me.

He has also been your enemy for the past 3 games.

Yeah, because he was enforcing a solution that he now knows to have failed.

He was under no obligation to tell Shepard what the Crucible can do, nor did he have to bring him up to it.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Control: You die.
Synthesis: You die.
Destroy: They die.

Seems pretty simple to me, but then I'm not a very deep person.

[KevShep]

jijeebo wrote...

KevShep wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

Dusen wrote...

The Catalyst/Starchild specifically says, ". . . do you THINK you can control us?" when he gives you the choice for control? I think that right there destroys any idea that Shepard actually being able to control the Reapers is "canon".

Now whether that is tied to something as grandiose as IT or that it is just poor writing is another debate altogether.

"You will die, you WILL control the reapers but you will lose everything you have."
"But the reapers will obey me?"
"Yes."


Seems pretty conclusive to me.

He has also been your enemy for the past 3 games.

Yeah, because he was enforcing a solution that he now knows to have failed.

He was under no obligation to tell Shepard what the Crucible can do, nor did he have to bring him up to it.

Then why dont he just let shepard run in circles untill the crucible is destroyed? Why even bring him up on the magic elevator if not to trick him? We also know that what he tells us is full of crap anyways.

[d-boy15]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Control: You die.
Synthesis: You die.
Destroy: They die.

Seems pretty simple to me, but then I'm not a very deep person.

Nah, the ending is not that deep either, it's really simple... pick your war crime and how to die.

[jijeebo]

KevShep wrote...

jijeebo wrote...


Yeah, because he was enforcing a solution that he now knows to have failed.

He was under no obligation to tell Shepard what the Crucible can do, nor did he have to bring him up to it.

Then why dont he just let shepard run in circles untill the crucible is destroyed? Why even bring him up on the magic elevator if not to trick him? We also know that what he tells us is full of crap anyways.

If he doesn't want Shepard to succeed why plant him in front of the one thing that lets Shepard succeed?

That. Makes. No. Sense.


And no, we don't "know" what he tells us is full of crap... Pretty much everything he says will happen in your choice does indeed happen in your ending.

Modifié par jijeebo, 31 mai 2012 - 02:24 .

[Taboo]

All the endings signify that we are safe for at least ten thousand years.

The Star Gazer scene proves as much.

[KevShep]

jijeebo wrote...

KevShep wrote...

jijeebo wrote...


Yeah, because he was enforcing a solution that he now knows to have failed.

He was under no obligation to tell Shepard what the Crucible can do, nor did he have to bring him up to it.

Then why dont he just let shepard run in circles untill the crucible is destroyed? Why even bring him up on the magic elevator if not to trick him? We also know that what he tells us is full of crap anyways.

If he doesn't want Shepard to succeed why plant him in front of the one thing that lets Shepard succeed?

That. Makes. No. Sense.


And no, we don't "know" what he tells us is full of crap... Pretty much everything he says will happen in your choice does indeed happen in your ending.

You mean how it shows that earth is at the galaxys edge?

not to mention all of the other messed up things that happen!

[jijeebo]

KevShep wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

KevShep wrote...

jijeebo wrote...


Yeah, because he was enforcing a solution that he now knows to have failed.

He was under no obligation to tell Shepard what the Crucible can do, nor did he have to bring him up to it.

Then why dont he just let shepard run in circles untill the crucible is destroyed? Why even bring him up on the magic elevator if not to trick him? We also know that what he tells us is full of crap anyways.

If he doesn't want Shepard to succeed why plant him in front of the one thing that lets Shepard succeed?

That. Makes. No. Sense.


And no, we don't "know" what he tells us is full of crap... Pretty much everything he says will happen in your choice does indeed happen in your ending.

You mean how it shows that earth is at the galaxys edge?

not to mention all of the other messed up things that happen!

Earth gets its shockwave BEFORE that scene even happens, that could very well be the first system that is hit by the beam that comes afterwards... Or the people who made the cutscene didn't check the galaxy map first.


And wtfrickety frack does that even have to do with the Catalyst?

[KevShep]

jijeebo wrote...

KevShep wrote...

jijeebo wrote...

KevShep wrote...

jijeebo wrote...


Yeah, because he was enforcing a solution that he now knows to have failed.

He was under no obligation to tell Shepard what the Crucible can do, nor did he have to bring him up to it.

Then why dont he just let shepard run in circles untill the crucible is destroyed? Why even bring him up on the magic elevator if not to trick him? We also know that what he tells us is full of crap anyways.

If he doesn't want Shepard to succeed why plant him in front of the one thing that lets Shepard succeed?

That. Makes. No. Sense.


And no, we don't "know" what he tells us is full of crap... Pretty much everything he says will happen in your choice does indeed happen in your ending.

You mean how it shows that earth is at the galaxys edge?

not to mention all of the other messed up things that happen!

Earth gets its shockwave BEFORE that scene even happens, that could very well be the first system that is hit by the beam that comes afterwards... Or the people who made the cutscene didn't check the galaxy map first.


And wtfrickety frack does that even have to do with the Catalyst?

No it does not, we see Sol get hit after about the third one in. Also the one in the pick shows us where Arrival DLC is...

[jijeebo]

KevShep wrote...

It took me a while because i'm tired... But I see what you're doing and i'm not playing ball.

[KevShep]

jijeebo wrote...

KevShep wrote...

It took me a while because i'm tired... But I see what you're doing and i'm not playing ball.

Thats ok, Its all speculation.

[Reign Tsumiraki]

Control is the only remotely acceptable one, and only if a BUNCH of conditions are true about it.

Synthesis causes a LOT of problems. Not going into it right now, because I'm tired.

Destroy kills ALL synthetics. Genocide. Synthetics will realize, in the future, that they are hated, and they need to destroy all organics before they destroy them. 

See, Control gives possibilities for quite a few many things.

1. Reaper threat solved without destroying Synthetics. Reapers can be thrown into a black hole after Shep takes control.

2. Shepard can use the Citadel Relay to send all the fleets home, since he now controls the Citadel. 

3. Shepard, with Reaper control, can just download the plans for the Relays, and task them on building them all back before throwing them into the sun. 

4. With the Citadel Relay, Shepard can throw all the new relays back into their old places.

5. Shepard, once he is done with throwing the Reapers into the sun, can build himself an organic body, download himself back into it, and live a happy rest of his life with his LI.

Alternately, he can live forever and help guide the galaxy.

[Taboo]

Control is the Aynd Rand ending.

The Star Gazer scene means that we won't be wiped out for at least ten thousand years. A nice grace period if you ask me.

With the Geth dead in my playthrough, I see very little downside to this. It's not my problem ten thousand years down the road. I won't rewrite the galaxy to do so nor will I assume some Objectivist wet dream with Control.

Daisy Bell will not be able to ride the bicycle built for two with after Shepard shoots the pipe.

[eddieoctane]

jijeebo wrote...

Earth gets its shockwave BEFORE that scene even happens, that could very well be the first system that is hit by the beam that comes afterwards... Or the people who made the cutscene didn't check the galaxy map first.


And wtfrickety frack does that even have to do with the Catalyst?

Charon relay blows up and sends out a pulse like every other relay. The first relay shown blowing up from the star-map view, however, was not anywhere near Sol. I never noticed this before. I was too dumbfounded by the lack of resolution. It's rather unsettling to see this level of incompetence.

[thesnake777]

...Its a good thing I'm a Mother ****ing Renegade!!!!!