When we first reach Lothering we find the place in disarray. The Bann has deserted his lieges, highwaymen prey on those coming to seek refuge, and food is in scarce supply. Only the Chantry and its Templars remain to serve the people of the village.
The scarcity of food might lead one to believe that what little food the villagers did have was of poor quality. It is likely to have been food taken from the proverbial ‘bottom of the barrel.’ So while the people of Lothering may have known that cereals and grains could go ‘bad’ and cause those who ate such food to become ill, they may have felt themselves forced by necessity to use every scrap of food, no matter how suspect it looked, in order to survive.
When grain becomes infested with the parasitic fungus Claviceps purpurea it can cause what was known in the Middle Ages as St. Anthony’s fire, or ergot poisoning. Symptoms of ergot poisoning may include dizziness, seizures, and hallucinations.
So I suppose a question one might ask about Leliana’s visions is this: were they induced in whole or in part by an illness such as ergot poisoning? Did she eat some bad grain and have auditory hallucinations (i.e., hear voices) and have vivid hallucinatory visions of roses?
Or did the Maker speak to her?
Leliana's visions
Débuté par
gandanlin
, juin 01 2012 09:10
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#2
Guest_Faerunner_*
Posté 01 juin 2012 - 09:51
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I don't think the devs have released an official explanation for Leliana's vision. It could have been from the Maker, it could have just been a dream, it could have been indigestion. It just depends on how you want to interpret it.
#3
Posté 02 juin 2012 - 12:11
DeathScepter
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within context of the game, it was the Maker. Given what happen in the end.
#4
Posté 02 juin 2012 - 11:50
Wulfram
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Leliana didn't hear any voices. She had a dream and saw a rose. Doesn't need ergot poisoning the explain it, even if you're not inclined to accept a divine cause.
It's sort of implied that Alistair picked that rose and gives it to a romanced Warden. In which case it obviously wouldn't be a hallucination.
It's sort of implied that Alistair picked that rose and gives it to a romanced Warden. In which case it obviously wouldn't be a hallucination.
#5
Posté 02 juin 2012 - 04:07
Get Magna Carter
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Leliana is not diseased or insane, she just has a fanciful imagination
(and possibly guidance from the maker [who apparently likes beautiful women with good singing voices])
(and possibly guidance from the maker [who apparently likes beautiful women with good singing voices])
#6
Posté 02 juin 2012 - 09:52
gandanlin
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Well, it is always good to consider all possible natural causes for events.
Leliana is a character that I find a challenge to understand. She is interesting and complex. Her faith is unorthodox, so much so that other characters in the story are sometimes taken aback.
There is a distinction sometimes made in religion between a personal God who intervenes in one's life and an impersonal God which created the Universe and then departed -- leaving creation to its own devices. There is an article in wikipedia about that distinction and its problematics here:
http://en.wikipedia....ki/Personal_god
So Leliana is the character in DAO who struggles most with this religious problem, I would say. Her belief in the Maker is personalized, and she therefore is compelled to act in accordance with the way she feels the Maker would have her act. Her conscience tells her what to do, and this requires a personal God that can be relied on in the present moment to inform her conscience.
An impersonal God who has abandoned creation can no longer interact with creation.
So yeah, maybe it wasn't bad grain. But always good to consider such possibilities.
Leliana is a character that I find a challenge to understand. She is interesting and complex. Her faith is unorthodox, so much so that other characters in the story are sometimes taken aback.
There is a distinction sometimes made in religion between a personal God who intervenes in one's life and an impersonal God which created the Universe and then departed -- leaving creation to its own devices. There is an article in wikipedia about that distinction and its problematics here:
http://en.wikipedia....ki/Personal_god
So Leliana is the character in DAO who struggles most with this religious problem, I would say. Her belief in the Maker is personalized, and she therefore is compelled to act in accordance with the way she feels the Maker would have her act. Her conscience tells her what to do, and this requires a personal God that can be relied on in the present moment to inform her conscience.
An impersonal God who has abandoned creation can no longer interact with creation.
So yeah, maybe it wasn't bad grain. But always good to consider such possibilities.
#7
Posté 04 juin 2012 - 07:06
gandanlin
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Some related musings:
In her old life with Marjolaine, Leliana treated life as a grand Game and people as pawns in that Game. But when Marjolaine betrays her, Leliana becomes a victim of that Game. She experiences “the Game” from the perspective of the other person -- and understands that her life is not a game, nor is she a pawn for others to abuse and betray. This experience causes her to change. She renounces her old life and joins the Chantry as a penitent sister.
Leliana can be compared to Caradin in this respect. Caradin turns living souls into an army of golems on the Anvil of the Void. It is only when Caradin himself is turned into a stone golem that he understands the magnitude of his wrongdoing. It is only because of this experience, this change in perspective, that Caradin wishes to have the Anvil destroyed. He repents of what he has done.
Repentance and the seeking of redemption are recurring themes in DAO. There is an old life which leads to a transformative event, a crisis of some sort, and out of this transformative crisis a new person is created. The old life is an unexamined one. The crisis causes the character to examine the old life and, finding that old life to be lacking, the character then seeks out a way to set right the wrongdoings of the past.
So I think that the questions that Leliana asks herself are these: Is this crisis and its ensuing transformation the Maker speaking to me? Is this the Maker directly intervening in my life? I would say that Leliana answers these questions with a Yes. She sees the Maker as a personal God. I think her view of the Maker is akin to that of a visionary. In Leliana’s way of thinking, the spiritual life and the everyday life intersect -- their purposes are intertwined. She sees the Maker as being present in her life.
In her old life with Marjolaine, Leliana treated life as a grand Game and people as pawns in that Game. But when Marjolaine betrays her, Leliana becomes a victim of that Game. She experiences “the Game” from the perspective of the other person -- and understands that her life is not a game, nor is she a pawn for others to abuse and betray. This experience causes her to change. She renounces her old life and joins the Chantry as a penitent sister.
Leliana can be compared to Caradin in this respect. Caradin turns living souls into an army of golems on the Anvil of the Void. It is only when Caradin himself is turned into a stone golem that he understands the magnitude of his wrongdoing. It is only because of this experience, this change in perspective, that Caradin wishes to have the Anvil destroyed. He repents of what he has done.
Repentance and the seeking of redemption are recurring themes in DAO. There is an old life which leads to a transformative event, a crisis of some sort, and out of this transformative crisis a new person is created. The old life is an unexamined one. The crisis causes the character to examine the old life and, finding that old life to be lacking, the character then seeks out a way to set right the wrongdoings of the past.
So I think that the questions that Leliana asks herself are these: Is this crisis and its ensuing transformation the Maker speaking to me? Is this the Maker directly intervening in my life? I would say that Leliana answers these questions with a Yes. She sees the Maker as a personal God. I think her view of the Maker is akin to that of a visionary. In Leliana’s way of thinking, the spiritual life and the everyday life intersect -- their purposes are intertwined. She sees the Maker as being present in her life.
