60 réponses à ce sujet

[Karrie788]

How was it lacking? I found it perfect, tbh.

[Ronin09]

Personally, I thought it was the best of some bad situations as far as ME2 romances go, but Miranda's was kind of a let down for my maleshep and didn't seem to really matter all that much. Which is why I'm going back through the whole trilogy to get Ash instead. As far as the best goes, I loved Traynor's especially given that she's just in 3. So glad that I didn't bother with Liara when my femshep finally made it to 3.

[Julia_xo]

FaWa wrote...

If you romanced Thane, you knew he would die eventually. I don't know why you all thought differently. (Other then a little bit of hope in LOTSB)
Jacob, however, was stupidly bad.

Garrus, Ash, Kaidan (Kaidan Mshep mmm) Steve, Liara would be the best imo

Facebook initiative? Fans sent BioWare a cure Thane poster which they supported and even hung up the poster in their office. They encouraged people basically. There are articles about this. Also, I never expected BioWare would force the death of a love interest. They never have before. Many people figured the mention of the lung transplant and Thane's renewed will to live if loyal and romanced would lead to an option to at the very least extend his life.

And Thane was meant to be fanservice from the start. He was created with women in mind. Which is baffling when I consider his forced death. Why bother making him a LI at all if his romance was going to be ignored in the final game in favor of a badly done death scene which was forced on us?

There's nothing wrong with fanservice. Tali and Garrus as love interests are also fanservice. The devs had no intention of making them love interests originally but they were made love interests due to fan demand.

Why are are some people so against a simple option that would allow Thane to survive? It need not affect you at all but it would mean a lot to people who got emotionally invested in the character and did his romance. What BioWare did to Thane in ME3 is just sad.

Modifié par Julia_xo, 02 juin 2012 - 01:18 .

[lillitheris]

^ I think it would be a little much to go for a wholesale Thane Gets Lung Transplant scenario. The illness is so intrinsic to the character. I feel similarly about Samara…it seems disrespectful to the character to alter her to just abandon her code.

That said, getting him killed by Leng was just asinine (aside from all the problems with the scene to begin with). My fic actually ‘fixed’ that little detail.

They could well have let Thane make it to the end of ME3 and then leave it up to headcanon or fic to worry about long-term survival. I would certainly not actively oppose a wholesale miracle cure DLC, of course, but the ‘resolution’ that was given was just so unnecessary…

[ThatDancingTurian]

Karrie788 wrote...

How was it lacking? I found it perfect, tbh.

No shirtless Garrus.

But seriously.  It would have been perfect for me too if only he had been reading in bed next to her instead of across the room. It would have felt like he was more comfortable being there. If that had been the case I wouldn't have cared that he for some reason felt the need to get completely dressed again (all the way down to his gloves...). I'd say maybe Shepard keeps her room too cold for him, but she's laying there in underwear and no covers.

[Karrie788]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Karrie788 wrote...

How was it lacking? I found it perfect, tbh.

No shirtless Garrus.

But seriously.  It would have been perfect for me too if only he had been reading in bed next to her instead of across the room. It would have felt like he was more comfortable being there. If that had been the case I wouldn't have cared that he for some reason felt the need to get completely dressed again (all the way down to his gloves...). I'd say maybe Shepard keeps her room too cold for him, but she's laying there in underwear and no covers.

I found it incredibly sweet that he was working on her stuff while she was sleeping, so I forgave it easily, but I understand what you mean. Didn't bother me at all, personally.
What does baffle me though, but that's not restricted to Garrus, is that FemShep wakes up in her underwear. Why did she feel the need to get back in her underwear? A blanket would have been fine.

[hot_heart]

I can only assume people like Liara, Garrus and Tali got the best by virtue of being in the squad and favourites among fans and writing staff.

I wasn't too miffed with the romance aspect of Miranda's story. Sure, you'll always want more and being in the squad would be ideal, but there were some decent exchanges. Plus, she played a fairly significant role...even if she didn't intend to.

From the sounds of it, Jacob and Thane fans got the worst of it. It's a bold move to have that sort of change in relationship status, and it's interesting, but with Jacob it felt out of character. I'm guessing he had a different writer. That "Can you feel it?" line always sounds really odd to me.

I didn't exactly expect Thane to survive much longer, but I think more could've been done with him. And, even if they went with the same course, the 'presentation' of the action could've been a little better. I seem to recall his writer had left the dev team, which may explain some of it.

[Julia_xo]

@ lillitheris I think it was more disrespectful to the character that BioWare ignored his established characterization from the previous game. The climax of his ME2 romance was him admitting he's scared and he doesn't want to die. In ME3 that was ignored and we got Stepford Thane who is all too happy to die. The illness isn't all he is and it saddens me that so many people define him by it. Even BioWare did it in ME3 by having it be all he talks about before he dies. I wish Thane's ME2 writer had never left because the character definitely suffered for it.

Even if he got the lung transplant it would not have been a cure. It would just have improved his quality of life and given him more time. It's not a permanent solution but as you said fans could headcanon the rest. I'd take that over a forced death any day and it was already established that he was eligible for the transplant in the game.

I'd be interested to read your fic! Link? So much about the Kai Leng fight bothers me. It was very poorly thought out.

Modifié par Julia_xo, 02 juin 2012 - 12:38 .

[ThatDancingTurian]

Karrie788 wrote...

What does baffle me though, but that's not restricted to Garrus, is that FemShep wakes up in her underwear. Why did she feel the need to get back in her underwear? A blanket would have been fine.

Some people feel more comfortable in underwear, but I don't know anyone who feels comfortable sleeping in a bra.

[Karrie788]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Some people feel more comfortable in underwear, but I don't know anyone who feels comfortable sleeping in a bra.

That was what I meant, sorry. And I dunno, getting back in your panties and bra right after sex seems... weird. At least to me.

Modifié par Karrie788, 02 juin 2012 - 12:49 .

[FeralEwok]

Most satisfying would be Liara probably. Doesn't hurt that her relationship with Shepard spans all three games.

The worst one is Jacob without question. I feel for the ME2 romances, but no one else breaks up with you and gets another woman preggers. I don't understand why people get mad that Thane dies. If there was anyone from the ME2 squad that was guaranteed to bite the bullet it was him. In fact, I'm surprised he made it to ME3. From there I'd say the next in line in disappointment was Jack. She has some great moments with Shepard in ME3, but the relationship is so short that it comes off as an after thought.

The most disappointing one though has to go to Miranda. While all those other ones I mentioned above were not very good, I think Miranda's had the most potential going into ME3. She (if romanced in Me2) holds a rather large and significant role in ME2. She begins to develop an arc towards the end of the game, and with her resigning from Cerberus it really seemed to me like she was going to tie in heavily to the Cerberus as an enemy aspect in ME3. Instead of maybe focusing on Miranda growing as a person while at the same time having to deal with going up against her former organization, they decided to make Miranda solely focused on her sister. Oriana is her "weakness" but it really damages that professional "in it for humanity" attitude of Miranda when she abandons all of that to go looking for her. If they had beefed up her role and gone a different route with her I seriously believe she could have given Liara some competition.

[lillitheris]

Julia_xo wrote...

@ lillitheris I think it was more disrespectful to the character that BioWare ignored his established characterization from the previous game. The climax of his ME2 romance was him admitting he's scared and he doesn't want to die. In ME3 that was ignored and we got Stepford Thane who is all too happy to die. The illness isn't all he is and it saddens me that so many people define him by it. Even BioWare did it in ME3 by having it be all he talks about before he dies. I wish Thane's ME2 writer had never left because the character definitely suffered for it.

I agree that the change to wanting to live was integral; perhaps I should soften my statement a little…I don’t think the possible cure within the game is as essential because if it’s left open in the end, you can always fill in the rest. The big thing was the whole Leng scene, which removed that possibility without going AU. That was just…ugh.

I'd be interested to read your fic! Link? So much about the Kai Leng fight bothers me. It was very poorly thought out.

Unity is linked in my signature; it’s not a Thane thing, though! It’s obviously awesome in all other ways so you should read it (<_<) but thus far I’ve only referenced his survival.

[Versidious]

All the romances were at least slightly botched. I know everyone thinks Liara's was perfect, but it really wasn't. Out of all the ones I've played, Kaidan's is actually the best.

Thane was done badly. It's not that he died (I know, Bioware gave you some hope post-ME2's release with LotSB and CDN, but you can't have entered into that romance with the expectation that he would be cured), but that everyone ignores that. You wouldn't expect people to grieve, per se - Thane was by his own admissions, not particularly social, and there's only a few crewmembers who knew him anyway - but that everyone ignores the fact that Shepard's boyfriend has just died. Even Liara, who pretty much asks Shepard if he/she's OK after just about everything else. Thane dies, after a brief reunion, and then that's the last mention of him until you finally kill Kai Leng. Even the death scene is literally no different, besides Thane calling Shepard Siha.

Ashley basically doesn't talk to you on the Normandy, ever.

Liara constantly tries to 'friendzone' you, and Bioware has not flagged LotSB properly - there is dialogue in the files for if you've rekindled your romance in the DLC (In which you sleep together and discuss kids), but Liara acts like you've not been together since before you died.

Jacob... Well, you don't even have the option to punch Mr 'I'm So Goddamned Loyal, Except For When You've Been Under House Arrest For Six Months' Taylor in his balls, or tell him to go **** himself when he's telling you how happy he is and that he's having a baby. I mean, come on, that wouldn't have taken a long time to put in, surely? Maybe if they hadn't given him such a ridiculous Kanye-West jaw, he'd have had more fans (His early concept sketches are actually pretty damned handsome).

Tali... You still don't get to see her actual face. Sorry, but a photoshopped picture just doesn't cut it.

Garrus... I've not played through his romance, so I couldn't say. Not heard any major complaints about him, though.

Miranda... Actually, I didn't find this one all that bad. All your encounters with her take into account that you're together. It's just a shame you can't spend more time with her. It's my opinion that she should have been more heavily involved in the game regardless of the player romancing her or not.

Jack... Not romanced her in ME3. But from what I've heard, she suffers from the same lack of face time as Miranda or Thane. Again, she should've had a greater presence regardless of the player romancing her - perhaps some side missions in which you join her in 'biotic artillery strikes'/reinforcing Alliance defensive lines, etc. In particular, it would be interesting to see her actually meet her parents.

Samara.... You still don't get to romance her. Which is a shame, because I thought she had quite the following, which worked for the Tali/Garrusmancers, and she's also one of the most interesting characters and potential romances in the game, not least because she actually is the only team-mate who is genuinely more experienced in just about everything than Commander Shepard. It would've been nice to see an angsty Her-Denying-Herself-Happiness-With-Shepard-Continuously plot throughout the game.

Modifié par Versidious, 02 juin 2012 - 01:29 .

[Seleya_LL]

Versidious wrote...
[...]
Garrus... I've not played through his romance, so I couldn't say. Not heard any major complaints about him, though.
[...]

Well, I'd go so far to say that there is no reason for major complaints in Garrus' romance. From a personal point of view: Beautifully written romance arc, no trust issues anywhere, but perfect reliable and available for nearly the whole saga. In ME3, many, many conversations have a slight change if he's romanced ("Because I need you", "I know where you sleep", "Your confidence is... inspiring"...), in addition he gives a ton of after-mission comments, gives mission-sensitive background information in most turian-krogan related missions and has touching scenes regarding first-hello, locking-in and final-goodbye.
The relatively short romance scene didn't upset me, I was actually relieved since I have yet to see a 'true romance scene' (as in 'more skin shown') that doesn't seem totally awkward.

Back to topic:
Best story / conclusion: Garrus
Second-best(s): Liara (too much friend-zone feeling, very little after-mission dialogue in comparison),
Kaidan (more dialogues, comments would have been nice; very fast transition from 'how can you work with Cerberus' to comfort regarding past Cerberus work on the Illusive Man's station)

Worst story / conclusion: Jack, Thane. Way too little interaction, in both cases. I could have lived with Thane's death, but that early, without proper romantic dialogue and reactions from the others?

Not counting Jacob, for obvious reasons. That was not a romance in ME3, but a bad joke. Not blaming the character, though, for being assassinated.

Modifié par Seleya_LL, 02 juin 2012 - 01:51 .

[Demoiselle]

Jacob. Thane.

Done.

[MegaBadExample]

Apathy1989 wrote...

Best: Liara, Kaiden, Garrus

Good: Tali, Ash, Traynor, Cortez

Meh: Miranda

Bad: Jack, Kelly

Worse: Jacob or Thane

This.

And yeah, I can be annoyed that Ashley got crappy treatment compared to Kaidan. After me2? Then she doesn't say anything once you get her back.

[Shajar]

Well Liara ofc got most focused and longest, big surprise here tadaaa.

But anyway, Tali romance was very emotional, and i mean it. It was so strong and deep, not rush rush thing like many are (tell girl/boy you want sex and ZAP its done, no building releationship). They made good story for it, Tali fall in love to Shep in ME1 like Liara, but she is not open about it like Liara is. then Tali decides to try tell Shepard about it in ME2 etc... Very well done and continues even better in ME3

Negative points are that Bioware focused all their efforts to Liara and VS while letting all unique LI arcs in side line. There is not simply enough content in them, little parts are best what whole Trilogy can offer for me, but there is not simply enough them.

Modifié par Shajar, 02 juin 2012 - 08:50 .

[o Ventus]

Anyone from ME2, and Ashley (Not sure about Kaidan's romances).

[Yuqi]

I thought all of the romances lacked TBH.

Best Goodbye/Conclusion Scenes.

1: Ashley,Kaidan,Garus, Tali.
2: Liara because,well,(Shepards WTF expression says it all.)
3: Miranda
4: Jack

[Joy Sauce]

Best to Worst (or the ones Bioware put the most-least amount of thought into, my opinion obviously):

1. Liara
2. Kaidan/Ashley
3. Garrus
4. Tali (should've joined the team sooner)
5. Cortez/Traynor
6. Miranda
7. Jack
8. Kelly
9. Thane
10. Jacob
11. Samara (romance hinted at in ME2, obviously no follow up here)

[Spitfire017]

Shajar wrote...
Negative points are that Bioware focused all their efforts to Liara and VS while letting all unique LI arcs in side line. There is not simply enough content in them, little parts are best what whole Trilogy can offer for me, but there is not simply enough them.

Sorry, but this is wrong. Bioware was really damn sloppy when it came to Ashley's romance, from most of the writing to graphic bugs. She got shafted and Bioware did not focus much of any effort. (can't say much for Kaidan...haven't played ME3 with him yet.) This could be said for most of the romances, that Bioware got sloppy or ran out of time.

Too much content got caught from the game. That is why ME3 feels like a 1st draft of a masterpiece...if they only had more time and recources, and every LI got the same treatment and attention as Liara does (despite the problems with her romance).

[Padt]

Han Shot First wrote...

Padt wrote...

Jacob definitely got the short (well, shortest) end of the stick. I mean, the way Thane's romance played out was pretty bad (and as someone who loves Thane, I believe I've gone on record stating that I don't necessarily have an issue with him dying, but even with that...), but Jacob's? Man...Jacob's romance has technically ended even before Mass Effect 3 starts. Worse, it's ended with him cheating on Shepard. And then the insurmountable awkwardness and tone-deafness of the conversations that follow, where Jacob talks to Shepard as if they'd never been involved at all.  I can only imagine the outrage if they'd done something like that with any of the other love interests, let alone one of the popular ones.

I think Jacob not being popular is what got his romance arc axed. Bioware had all these characters to account for and too many variables, and figured they could get away with dropping his romance all together, because he had comparatively few fans. They'd have never tried it with Tali, Liara, or Garrus. The boards would have been flooded with rage. Jacob's fans got the shaft by virture of there being so few of them.

Absolutely. I mean...I'm not saying the devs had some sort of axe to grind with Jacob or the people who pursued him in ME2, but I do get the sense that his relative unpopularity had a lot to do with their decision to not differentiate between Jacob's romanced and unromanced character arcs. Maybe they didn't have enough time or resources to devote to it, and they figured few people would care.

[Landon7001]

Spitfire017 wrote...

Shajar wrote...
Negative points are that Bioware focused all their efforts to Liara and VS while letting all unique LI arcs in side line. There is not simply enough content in them, little parts are best what whole Trilogy can offer for me, but there is not simply enough them.

Sorry, but this is wrong. Bioware was really damn sloppy when it came to Ashley's romance, from most of the writing to graphic bugs. She got shafted and Bioware did not focus much of any effort. (can't say much for Kaidan...haven't played ME3 with him yet.) This could be said for most of the romances, that Bioware got sloppy or ran out of time.

Too much content got caught from the game. That is why ME3 feels like a 1st draft of a masterpiece...if they only had more time and recources, and every LI got the same treatment and attention as Liara does (despite the problems with her romance).

Speaking as someone who simutaneously has Ash as my main LI and favorite overall character, her me 3 romance could have been better but overall I was satisfied. The main problem is lack of real, full conversation with her once on board the normandy. But the mars-hospital thing was good and unexpected, plus the scene where she got drunk.....she was in me 3 alot if alive, i think it was just enough but i still would love to have some full normandy cpnvos w her

[lillitheris]

I watched the youtubes for the various romances. Essentially:

OK: Garrus, Liara, Tali, Kaidan, Steve
Meh: Ash, Traynor, Kelly, Miranda
Bad: Jack, Thane, Jacob

On review, I think Garrus had it the best, and almost in the “great” category. Tali and Liara come about even for the romance content (although as has been pointed out, the other characters get much less overall screentime than Liara).

[Premier Bromanov]

Regarding Jack's romance conclusion - Courtenay Taylor did an incredible job as always, but there simply isn't enough material for her to work with. With certain lines, she makes Jack sound like she desires Shepard sexually, which is fine, because that means she is comfortable with him. The Paragon interrupt after the Grissom Academy mission is good, because, again, it shows us that she's comfortable enough with him to smile when he grabs her for a kiss.

There's little emotional depth, though, and this is where I think the Jack romance conclusion falls apart. You could argue that Jack would die before she'd let someone see her feelings for Shepard in public, but that just increases demand for a private scene, and makes me really want one. That the final romance scene concludes no differently than if Shepard had just been her friend is disappointing.

The conclusion to the Jack romance is not as bad as what the Thane and Jacob romancers got, because those really just feel like an afterthought. But all of the ME2 LI arcs are just lacking in ME3.