139 réponses à ce sujet

[jbrand2002uk]

I dont think a direct comparison is possible between Hawke and The Warden as The Warden's prestige and respect is given by default because he is a Grey Warden its not earned in the HN Origin in particular as its made quite clear Duncan had already made you his top choice before having even met you and by the end of the Origin you either join of your own accord or your forcibly conscripted.

Hawke on the other hand doesnt get it so easy as he doesn't have the benefit of being part of an esteemed order at best he has his mother's name though given Gamlen's fall from grace(cough) that doesnt count for much in Kirkwall , He may not be the superhuman god like being the saves the entire world and all its people like many think The Warden is, However what power/respect Hawke does get is earned through skill and hard work.

[DiebytheSword]

Dave of Canada wrote...

I thought the point of the entire game was to demonstrate that Hawke wasn't the most important person on Thedas, he/she was just some every man who got caught up in events which they couldn't control as they spiraled and dragged everybody into it.

The most important on Thedas is just the legend which spawned from it (and Varric's retellings).

That is honestly how I took it.  The lie has propagated and the game is Varric setting the record straight to Cassandra.

When he's telling the truth, of course.

I see it more, as Hawke being at the right place at the right time, and the Kirkwall incident as the most important event in Thedas.

Modifié par DiebytheSword, 06 juin 2012 - 03:37 .

[darthnick427]

Hawke? The most important person in Dragon Age? Good joke. The Warden was more than Hawke could ever hope to be.

[Dakota Strider]

jbrand2002uk wrote...

I dont think a direct comparison is possible between Hawke and The Warden as The Warden's prestige and respect is given by default because he is a Grey Warden its not earned in the HN Origin in particular as its made quite clear Duncan had already made you his top choice before having even met you and by the end of the Origin you either join of your own accord or your forcibly conscripted.

Hawke on the other hand doesnt get it so easy as he doesn't have the benefit of being part of an esteemed order at best he has his mother's name though given Gamlen's fall from grace(cough) that doesnt count for much in Kirkwall , He may not be the superhuman god like being the saves the entire world and all its people like many think The Warden is, However what power/respect Hawke does get is earned through skill and hard work.

The comparison between the two is not fair....to the Warden.  The Warden was chosen to become a recruit in a respected order.  But all the ceremoney gave him was an immunity to the Taint (at least the Taint that kills you immediately), a ring that gave a minor boost to his health, and a scroll case full of old papers that are basically directions of where to find allies.  Not to mention, being a Warden survivor of Ostagar, meant he/she was hunted throughout the country.   Hawke lands in Kirkwall, does well enough to make a little money, and regains his/her family's inheritance.  It is Hawke's inheritance that makes him/her important in Kirkwall.  If Hawke's mother had not come from an important family, hardly anyone would have given respect to a Ferelden refugee, who had made a fairly decent living as a mercenary.  Even the "untold wealth" of the Deep Roads trip, would not have been enough to buy Hawke the respect he/she was given.   The Warden earned the respect he/she gained.  Hawke's respect was gained through an accident of birth.

Modifié par Dakota Strider, 06 juin 2012 - 05:18 .

[ElitePinecone]

DiebytheSword wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

I thought the point of the entire game was to demonstrate that Hawke wasn't the most important person on Thedas, he/she was just some every man who got caught up in events which they couldn't control as they spiraled and dragged everybody into it.

The most important on Thedas is just the legend which spawned from it (and Varric's retellings).

That is honestly how I took it.  The lie has propagated and the game is Varric setting the record straight to Cassandra.

When he's telling the truth, of course.

I see it more, as Hawke being at the right place at the right time, and the Kirkwall incident as the most important event in Thedas.

I interpreted Varric's retelling of the legend as setting the record straight, but what prompted Hawke's apparent importance (even if only in reputation) in the first place? Surely not just stopping one invasion and being forced to kill a few powerful local leaders? How does being tangentially involved in the big Kirkwall event place them above everybody else as tjhe single most important person in the world? Aren't any number of other leaders or figures (the Divine, the head of the Cumberland mage thing-y, the Lord Seeker, even Cassandra) all *way* more 'important' in determining the outcome of the conflict?

What's with Hawke's disappearance? Or Cassandra's desperation to find them?

With Exalted March not taking place and the plot elements being folded into The Next Thing, there's a chance that we'll never get to see why Hawke was so important - and it's kinda strange that such a huge and specific claim was made in the first place.

Edit: Also

Kail Ashton wrote...
fetching people's skeletons for money~!"

Best description of sidequests EVER.

Modifié par ElitePinecone, 06 juin 2012 - 05:20 .

[joshko]

Comparing Hawke to the Warden is comparing apples and oranges.

The Warden was offered and, accepted, a specific role and task and did it.

Hawke was a victim of circumstance and was able to manipulate that to get ahead.

It is unlikely that Hawke would have been able to defeat the Archdaemon, but I also doubt that the Warden would have been able to achieve the level or prestige and power that Hawke did in Kirkwall. The only real exception being the Cousland Warden, but that family first, lost everything, and second, is not native to the Free Marches.

Modifié par joshko, 06 juin 2012 - 05:26 .

[AppealToReason]

It makes sense to me with his role in the mage-templar-chantry thing. A ****storm thats been brewing for centuries and then he comes along and is all "See, if you chop everyones head off then you're problems are solved." Now, depending if you side with the templars or the mages, leads to them using violence to bang the other.

[rapscallioness]

I think it's a fine distinction between legend and the truth.

Apparently, legend is building Hawke up into something even Hawke never intended. We know the truth. Hawke was simply swept up in events. Trying to...how did the viscount say?.."head off a stampede"? That's what I felt like.

Forces at work beyond my control to stop.

I confess, at the end when I had to pick sides, my first response was "I don't really want to be involved in this." Lol. I didn't. I was so fed up with both of them by that point.

Then Meredith said, "B*tch, please!" Or something like that. And the whole time I was thinking, Isabella please bring that pirate ship around. I don't care about the mustard colored satin. I wanted to shout to my companions, "Run! To the ship! Go!"......But no.

So, yeah, legends and the truth. Was BW telling us about the legend in the pre launch stuff?

nah, I think they were just hyping.

Modifié par rapscallioness, 07 juin 2012 - 03:26 .

[ianvillan]

If you class most important person in all Thedas as a person that releases a centuary old magister from a greywarden prison then I guess Hawke is that person.

[iheartbob]

The statement is an exaggeration to be sure, but let's not completely write off Hawke.

We keep talking about Hawke accidently stumbling into things, but we need to really look at Act I before we commit to that statement.

Hawke had a deliberate goal at the start of the game. Survive. Buy himself (or herself, as it so happens to be in my case) out of debt and chase after glory and treasure. The only accident Hawke comes across is Varric, after that ... who knows what would have happened had a few things been ignored. Hawke deliberately recruits Anders. It's true that Hawke uses the maps Anders had from the Wardens as leverage to get into the expedition, but Hawke could have easily found another way. Had Hawke left Anders to his devises in his clinic healing refugees, Anders might never have been exposed to the Templar/Mage politics that continued to fuel his desire for justice/vengeance. He could have still been there ten years later and none the wiser.

And then there's Legacy, which Hawke sort of stumbles into, but without Hawke's blood, Hawke and party would have just been another group of victims doomed to die in that fortress. In retrospect, the world might be the worse for it in the end, because now we've got the first intelligent darkspawn/former maggister running lose on the world in the body of a former Warden. I for one really hope this storyline has some signifigance down the road.

So accident, or deliberate ... doesn't really matter in the end. Hawke was important in some way, shape, or form. We just never got to see it develop fully, which is a shame. The game mechanics, recycled maps, etc. were redundant and boring, and I don't need to be told about the lack of choice at the end of the game ... I'm right there with most of you. But I really did enjoy playing as Hawke, and I was incredibely bummed when Exalted March was scrapped.

That said, I'd rather just have obscure codex entries at this point. I don't want a definitive ending to the story since we can't play it. I'd rather leave it to my own imagination.

Modifié par iheartbob, 07 juin 2012 - 10:02 .

[The Night Haunter]

Hawke was the most important because his actions directly lead to the civil war that is the main plot (presumably) of DA3, and thus without Hawke DA3 would not have occurred.

[rapscallioness]

I'm going to be honest. Truth is I would love to see Hawke as the MC in DA: The Next Thing. I would love that. Mainly because it felt as if Hawke's story had really just begun.

DA2 really felt like a really long...Origin story for Hawke. Like the Origin stories for the Warden, the Warden was swept up in events. Later the Warden started down a far more serious and grueling path. A path with clear objectives and high stakes.

The Warden's story felt complete by the end. Mission accomplished. Hawke's story in DA2 seemed more like just the beginning. I would like to see Hawke continue. See how situations affect, even change, Hawke's character.

Hawke was yet to be presented with the kind of path the Warden had to take.

I don't think that's going to happen, and that makes me feel like I missed out on a big story yet to be told.

[HiroVoid]

ghostmessiah202 wrote...

Hawke was the most important because his actions directly lead to the civil war that is the main plot (presumably) of DA3, and thus without Hawke DA3 would not have occurred.

Actually, his actions indirectly lead there and are pretty much just one piece of how it gets there.  We could technically say the Darkspawn are the most important people since if they hadn't invaded Ferelden, Hawke wouldn't be in Kirkwall.

[ElitePinecone]

rapscallioness wrote...

I'm going to be honest. Truth is I would love to see Hawke as the MC in DA: The Next Thing. I would love that. Mainly because it felt as if Hawke's story had really just begun.

DA2 really felt like a really long...Origin story for Hawke. Like the Origin stories for the Warden, the Warden was swept up in events. Later the Warden started down a far more serious and grueling path. A path with clear objectives and high stakes.

The Warden's story felt complete by the end. Mission accomplished. Hawke's story in DA2 seemed more like just the beginning. I would like to see Hawke continue. See how situations affect, even change, Hawke's character.

Hawke was yet to be presented with the kind of path the Warden had to take.

I don't think that's going to happen, and that makes me feel like I missed out on a big story yet to be told.

Yeah, it sounded like Exalted March would be post-story DLC, given that fans were asking for some resolution to the Hawke character arc. I'm kinda disappointed that this character (and all the events surrounding Kirkwall) are apparenty going to be kinda... left by the wayside, just because the game surrounding it didn't sell well enough to justify the DLC, or whatever the reason was behind EM's cancellation.

It did appear the Exalted March would have been a 'crucible moment' for Hawke, and offered a chance to explain what happened after the events of DA2. 

[Sabriana]

Hawke was nothing but reacting to everything. In the beginning it was not so bad, as long as you (as in me) don't play MageHawke. Most stupid thing I've ever seen. Yes, the tension is so high, mages vs templars all over the place, but MageHawke is somehow exempt. For some reason.

She couldn't stop anything from happening. She was helplessly watching and twiddling her thumbs. No way to stop Anders. No way to stop what was happening to her surviving family members, mom and in my case, Carver. Anders would have happened with or without her, and in my playthrough it did. She never paid any attention to him, but still he did what he did in the end.

She was simply there and reacted. Always. Everyone steamrolled over her, and she just took it. Please, for the love of all the gods and their mothers, don't bring her back. Of course, that's just my personal opinion.