Catamantaloedis wrote...
Kid: You will die; you[/b] will control us but you will lose everything you have.
Sheperd: But the Reapers will obey me[/b]?
Kid: Yes.
Obviously Shepard isn't completely dead, or must still exist in some form. And even if he is "dead", it doesn't really matter. Good will be done for humanity.
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Kid: You will die; you[/b] will control us but you will lose everything you have.
Sheperd: But the Reapers will obey me[/b]?
Kid: Yes.
Obviously Shepard isn't completely dead, or must still exist in some form. And even if he is "dead", it doesn't really matter. Good will be done for humanity.
Or, more realistically, the ****** terrible writing blatantly contradicts itself in the same set of lines. You see Shepard disintegrate into ash. He's dead, Jim.
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Shepard's death is immaterial in relation to the fate of the galaxy. Additionally, in Control, one can wonder if Shepard truly died at all.Shadrach 88 wrote...
Taboo-XX wrote...
The real joke is that Bioware has created a massive bias here. People will still choose Destroy because the other two options were painted as ugly to begin with. No amount of information will make them choose the other two.
Not to mention that Shepard's survival will undoubtedly influence many people, and I can't say I blame them; Mass Effect has always been about its characters, and when people have put their Shepard through several circles of hell and suddenly get faced with the prospect of them kicking the bucket, it is quite difficult to put things in perspective. "The death of one man is a tragedy, a million is a statistic" comes to mind.
I'd like to think my decision was made on a more rational basis, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't bothered by the potential of my Shepards dying. I still stand by Destroy.
The Catalyst explicitly says "you will die".
There's no real way around that.
Kid: You will die; you will control us but you will lose everything you have.
Sheperd: But the Reapers will obey me?
Kid: Yes.
Obviously Shepard isn't completely dead, or must still exist in some form. And even if he is "dead", it doesn't really matter. Good will be done for humanity.
Modifié par ReXspec, 03 juin 2012 - 03:52 .
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Kid: You will die; you[/b] will control us but you will lose everything you have.
Sheperd: But the Reapers will obey me[/b]?
Kid: Yes.
Obviously Shepard isn't completely dead, or must still exist in some form. And even if he is "dead", it doesn't really matter. Good will be done for humanity.
Or, more realistically, the ****** terrible writing blatantly contradicts itself in the same set of lines. You see Shepard disintegrate into ash. He's dead, Jim.
If he's completely dead, he cant control the Reapers. Since he obviously can control the Reapers, obviously his existence or essence is continued in some way.
Control is an active word. The word used was not modify or change but control. A person who is dead cannot control anything.ReXspec wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Shepard's death is immaterial in relation to the fate of the galaxy. Additionally, in Control, one can wonder if Shepard truly died at all.Shadrach 88 wrote...
Taboo-XX wrote...
The real joke is that Bioware has created a massive bias here. People will still choose Destroy because the other two options were painted as ugly to begin with. No amount of information will make them choose the other two.
Not to mention that Shepard's survival will undoubtedly influence many people, and I can't say I blame them; Mass Effect has always been about its characters, and when people have put their Shepard through several circles of hell and suddenly get faced with the prospect of them kicking the bucket, it is quite difficult to put things in perspective. "The death of one man is a tragedy, a million is a statistic" comes to mind.
I'd like to think my decision was made on a more rational basis, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't bothered by the potential of my Shepards dying. I still stand by Destroy.
The Catalyst explicitly says "you will die".
There's no real way around that.
Kid: You will die; you will control us but you will lose everything you have.
Sheperd: But the Reapers will obey me?
Kid: Yes.
Obviously Shepard isn't completely dead, or must still exist in some form. And even if he is "dead", it doesn't really matter. Good will be done for humanity.
exist =/= not dead. Are you really wanting people to define the difference between life and death; existence and non-existence?
Shepard was vaporized. Period. No way around that. He wasn't teleported, he wasn't trancsended. By exerting his will onto the Reaper conciousness, he was vaporized for it.
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Kid: You will die; you[/b] will control us but you will lose everything you have.
Sheperd: But the Reapers will obey me[/b]?
Kid: Yes.
Obviously Shepard isn't completely dead, or must still exist in some form. And even if he is "dead", it doesn't really matter. Good will be done for humanity.
Or, more realistically, the ****** terrible writing blatantly contradicts itself in the same set of lines. You see Shepard disintegrate into ash. He's dead, Jim.
If he's completely dead, he cant control the Reapers. Since he obviously can control the Reapers, obviously his existence or essence is continued in some way.
You don't actually see Shepard do anything to the Reapers, aside from making them fly away. There's nothing preventing the Reapers form coming back down after their brief hypnosis and continuing to harvest people.
________________________________________Shadrach 88 wrote...
The idea of Synthesis is alluded to in ME1, and subsequently vanishes completely from the series
Modifié par Bill Casey, 03 juin 2012 - 03:57 .
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Kid: You will die; you[/b] will control us but you will lose everything you have.
Sheperd: But the Reapers will obey me[/b]?
Kid: Yes.
Obviously Shepard isn't completely dead, or must still exist in some form. And even if he is "dead", it doesn't really matter. Good will be done for humanity.
Or, more realistically, the ****** terrible writing blatantly contradicts itself in the same set of lines. You see Shepard disintegrate into ash. He's dead, Jim.
If he's completely dead, he cant control the Reapers. Since he obviously can control the Reapers, obviously his existence or essence is continued in some way.
You don't actually see Shepard do anything to the Reapers, aside from making them fly away. There's nothing preventing the Reapers form coming back down after their brief hypnosis and continuing to harvest people.
Except that would make absolutely no sense.
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Kid: You will die; you[/b] will control us but you will lose everything you have.
Sheperd: But the Reapers will obey me[/b]?
Kid: Yes.
Obviously Shepard isn't completely dead, or must still exist in some form. And even if he is "dead", it doesn't really matter. Good will be done for humanity.
Or, more realistically, the ****** terrible writing blatantly contradicts itself in the same set of lines. You see Shepard disintegrate into ash. He's dead, Jim.
If he's completely dead, he cant control the Reapers. Since he obviously can control the Reapers, obviously his existence or essence is continued in some way.
You don't actually see Shepard do anything to the Reapers, aside from making them fly away. There's nothing preventing the Reapers form coming back down after their brief hypnosis and continuing to harvest people.
Except that would make absolutely no sense.
Neither does Shepard being the only organic in all of existence being capable of controlling the Reapers. Or the control ending giving Shepard control over the Reapers and not the geth and EDI.
Or Synthesis.
Or Shepard surviving the control panel exploding in his face after destroying the Reapers.
Or Lazarus.
Please, don't pull a fallacy.
Zix13 wrote...
Control is stupid. Too likely to fail and get everyone killed.
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Control is an active word. The word used was not modify or change but control. A person who is dead cannot control anything.
Shepard does not modify the Reapers, he controls them.
MegaSovereign wrote...
Zix13 wrote...
Control is stupid. Too likely to fail and get everyone killed.
But you don't fail.
ReXspec wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Control is an active word. The word used was not modify or change but control. A person who is dead cannot control anything.
Shepard does not modify the Reapers, he controls them.
Stop dancing around my point. Did you, or did you not see Shepard get fried by the control interface? Did you not see his flesh get seared off? Shepard died.
Even the star brat said it: "You will die..."
The only thing Shepard did was alter the Reaper command line in the instant before he died.
That was the measure of the control. It boggles my mind how you can ignore in-game canon and a whole forty-five second sequence of Shepard getting fried.
Modifié par Catamantaloedis, 03 juin 2012 - 04:02 .
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Except that the Catalyst tells you that you can control the Reapers, not that you can control the Reapers for 5 minutes and then you can't control them anymore and they begin to reap again. That's just ridiculous, and has no evidence in the game.
ReXspec wrote...
Neither does your speculation. It is pure speculation that Shepard's concsiousness was sent into the Reaper concensus. There is no evidence for it. There is very strong evidence, however, that Shepard was killed and you are blatantly ignoring it, and replacing it with irrational headcanon.
Modifié par Catamantaloedis, 03 juin 2012 - 04:03 .
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Except that the Catalyst tells you that you can control the Reapers, not that you can control the Reapers for 5 minutes and then you can't control them anymore and they begin to reap again. That's just ridiculous, and has no evidence in the game.
The Catalyst also tells you that you will die during the Destroy ending, while you survive.
The Catalyst also tells you that Synthesis involves the complete and utter genetic rewrite of every single organism in the known galaxy at the same time, without their immediate knowledge, despite the scientific impossibility in such an act.
I'll believe what he tells me when he's given me proof.
Modifié par MegaSovereign, 03 juin 2012 - 04:04 .
Catamantaloedis wrote...
ReXspec wrote...
Neither does your speculation. It is pure speculation that Shepard's concsiousness was sent into the Reaper concensus. There is no evidence for it. There is very strong evidence, however, that Shepard was killed and you are blatantly ignoring it, and replacing it with irrational headcanon.
So in destroy, the Catalyst lets you destroy the Reapers. In synthesis, the Catalyst lets you synthesize life forms. But in control, the Catalyst is just lying, and decided to kill Shepard instead.
Okay. Can't argue with this logic.
Catamantaloedis wrote...
ReXspec wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Control is an active word. The word used was not modify or change but control. A person who is dead cannot control anything.
Shepard does not modify the Reapers, he controls them.
Stop dancing around my point. Did you, or did you not see Shepard get fried by the control interface? Did you not see his flesh get seared off? Shepard died.
Even the star brat said it: "You will die..."
The only thing Shepard did was alter the Reaper command line in the instant before he died.
That was the measure of the control. It boggles my mind how you can ignore in-game canon and a whole forty-five second sequence of Shepard getting fried.
Dead people cant control something.
And even if he was dead, I fail to see how this makes control any worse. If the Reapers gain Shepard's morals/ideals, then it is still a victory.
When you make points that actually matter, get back to me.
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Except that the Catalyst tells you that you can control the Reapers, not that you can control the Reapers for 5 minutes and then you can't control them anymore and they begin to reap again. That's just ridiculous, and has no evidence in the game.
The Catalyst also tells you that you will die during the Destroy ending, while you survive.
The Catalyst also tells you that Synthesis involves the complete and utter genetic rewrite of every single organism in the known galaxy at the same time, without their immediate knowledge, despite the scientific impossibility in such an act.
I'll believe what he tells me when he's given me proof.
Modifié par Catamantaloedis, 03 juin 2012 - 04:06 .
ReXspec wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
ReXspec wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Control is an active word. The word used was not modify or change but control. A person who is dead cannot control anything.
Shepard does not modify the Reapers, he controls them.
Stop dancing around my point. Did you, or did you not see Shepard get fried by the control interface? Did you not see his flesh get seared off? Shepard died.
Even the star brat said it: "You will die..."
The only thing Shepard did was alter the Reaper command line in the instant before he died.
That was the measure of the control. It boggles my mind how you can ignore in-game canon and a whole forty-five second sequence of Shepard getting fried.
Dead people cant control something.
And even if he was dead, I fail to see how this makes control any worse. If the Reapers gain Shepard's morals/ideals, then it is still a victory.
When you make points that actually matter, get back to me.
I am making valid points and you are ignoring them for your headcanon. If you think that Shepard's concsiousness was somehow transferred into the Reaper concensus, not only is that highly improbable, but, even if he was, what gives you the assurity that a human will like his can control the wills and thoughts of billions of organic minds poured into a immortal construct?
MegaSovereign wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Except that the Catalyst tells you that you can control the Reapers, not that you can control the Reapers for 5 minutes and then you can't control them anymore and they begin to reap again. That's just ridiculous, and has no evidence in the game.
The Catalyst also tells you that you will die during the Destroy ending, while you survive.
The Catalyst also tells you that Synthesis involves the complete and utter genetic rewrite of every single organism in the known galaxy at the same time, without their immediate knowledge, despite the scientific impossibility in such an act.
I'll believe what he tells me when he's given me proof.
He doesn''t tell you that you will die during the destroy ending. He says "even you are partly synthetic" which leaves the possibility of you dying being a nonzero probability. And considering the fact that Shepard dies in most of the Destroy endings (except the very highest tier one), the Catalyst wasn't really lying at all.
Catamantaloedis wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Except that the Catalyst tells you that you can control the Reapers, not that you can control the Reapers for 5 minutes and then you can't control them anymore and they begin to reap again. That's just ridiculous, and has no evidence in the game.
The Catalyst also tells you that you will die during the Destroy ending, while you survive.
The Catalyst also tells you that Synthesis involves the complete and utter genetic rewrite of every single organism in the known galaxy at the same time, without their immediate knowledge, despite the scientific impossibility in such an act.
I'll believe what he tells me when he's given me proof.
I don't see how real life science has anything to do with a video game.
But you can continue in whatever speculation you want. Simple fact of the matter is that there are only two things which exist in analyzing the ending: what the Catalyst says, and what everyone else wants to make up without evidence.
o Ventus wrote...
MegaSovereign wrote...
o Ventus wrote...
Catamantaloedis wrote...
Except that the Catalyst tells you that you can control the Reapers, not that you can control the Reapers for 5 minutes and then you can't control them anymore and they begin to reap again. That's just ridiculous, and has no evidence in the game.
The Catalyst also tells you that you will die during the Destroy ending, while you survive.
The Catalyst also tells you that Synthesis involves the complete and utter genetic rewrite of every single organism in the known galaxy at the same time, without their immediate knowledge, despite the scientific impossibility in such an act.
I'll believe what he tells me when he's given me proof.
He doesn''t tell you that you will die during the destroy ending. He says "even you are partly synthetic" which leaves the possibility of you dying being a nonzero probability. And considering the fact that Shepard dies in most of the Destroy endings (except the very highest tier one), the Catalyst wasn't really lying at all.
What exactly do you think the meaning of that implication is? He wasn't saying it just to blow hot air, was he? If the Catalyst had the remotest confidence that you could survive, why bother hinting at your death?
Modifié par MegaSovereign, 03 juin 2012 - 04:10 .
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