192 réponses à ce sujet

[joshko]

gwenhilde wrote...

http://twitter.com/d...400739149877251

Just read this on twitter.Wonder who his reffering to.?

He's talking about the fish he had for lunch.

[LolaLei]

joshko wrote...

gwenhilde wrote...

http://twitter.com/d...400739149877251

Just read this on twitter.Wonder who his reffering to.?

He's talking about the fish he had for lunch.

Best not to look into it too deeply.

[Dakota Strider]

Yrkoon wrote...

Dakota Strider wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

Dakota Strider wrote...

Quick and Good cannot go together. .

They can, and they have.

Baldur's Gate 2's development time was just as quick as DA2's  (ie. less than 2 years), and it was good.  The Best.

Some differences though.  BG2 was made with the same game engine and same game mechanics of BG. 

Are you claiming that by contrast, DA2 uses a different engine and different game mechanics than DA:O?

And of course there are massive differences -   I can give you a list of about a hundred reasons why BG2 succeeded in being *great*  inspite of  a short development time, while DA2  failed.  But we weren't discussing "whys".  We were debating whether or not a  good game can be made quick.

Trying to compare what is needed to make a great game 15 years ago to today, on the basis of time, is a non sequitur.  The "formula" or outline to make a great game may be the same, but the time and resources to make a game that will be competitive in today's market is is not even close.

Baldur's Gate 2 was made only for the Windows and MacIntosh computers and had the following system requirements:

• 233 MHz CPU
• 32 MB RAM
• 4 MB DirectX-certified video card
• 4x CD-ROM drive
• DirectX 7.0
• 750 MB available hard disk space
• Windows 95

Compared to Dragon Age 2, which was made for computers and gaming consoles with the following requirements for the PC:



Minimum:

• OS: Windows XP with SP3
• OS: Windows Vista with SP2
• OS: Windows 7
• CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo (or equivalent) running at 1.8 GHz or greater
• CPU: AMD Athlon 64 X2 (or equivalent) running at 1.8 GHz or greater
• RAM: 1 GB (1.5 GB Vista and Windows 7)
• Video: Radeon HD 2600 Pro 256 MB
• Video: NVIDIA GeForce 7900 GS 256 MB cards
• Disc Drive: DVD ROM drive required
• Hard Drive: 7 GB
• Sound: Direct X 9.0c Compatible Sound Card Windows Experience Index: 4.5

And while technically the engine was the same for DA2 as DAO, they made a lot of changes that BG2 did not make after BG.  DA2 used a different combat system, different armor types, different spells, different combat specializations, different conversation style, different artwork and graphics, and an almost completely new cast of voice actors.  BG2 used almost the same mechanics as its predecessor.  It kept many of the original voice actors, and had far fewer new ones to add.   Back then two years of development, when all those factors are identical, except the script, and perhaps a few new monsters, was much easier than what DA2 tried to do in a similar amount of time.  And in this day and age, 2 years is not nearly enough to do it right.

[rapscallioness]

LolaLei wrote...

joshko wrote...

gwenhilde wrote...

http://twitter.com/d...400739149877251

Just read this on twitter.Wonder who his reffering to.?

He's talking about the fish he had for lunch.

Best not to look into it too deeply.

yes, i think that would be best...hmmm. I...hmmm. yes..we'll leave that alone.

Ah, lol, purebbredcorn. don't ever change, baby.

David, don't go blandset on us. blandset stinks. at the same time....don't expect us to go blandset either.

it's just a family affair, que no? dysfunctional family, but hey, whose isn't. this is the only kitchen table we got to hash it out.

And you got alot of grissle on your bones. i ain't worried about you. you're not tender. you can take it and dish it out. you old warlock, you.

But at the end of the day, you know we love you. we wouldn't be here if we didn't. and i think you guys still love us? i....think...? i guess you wouldn't be here if you didn't?

we both get on each other's nerves. but if you really get peeved, the devs can always stab us in the gut and feast on our sweet, sweet fan tears...while they cackle. you guys always get the last laugh. amiright?

Interesting thread you got here. I should go.

[Kroitz]

David Gaider wrote...
Which I didn't think was hard to understand, but evidently some people have trouble with this sort of thing.

One would wish you are one day as able as you are arrogant.

[slashthedragon]

Was that Twitter message...wow...

[Yrkoon]

Dakota Strider wrote...


Trying to compare what is needed to make a great game 15 years ago to today, on the basis of time, is a non sequitur. 

A comparison wasn't being made.    Instead, you simply  made an (absolute) claim and I Proved it wrong.  Kindly scroll back and read the quote pyramid again.

The "formula" or outline to make a great game may be the same, but the time and resources to make a game that will be competitive in today's market is is not even close.

Baldur's Gate 2 was made only for the Windows and MacIntosh computers and had the following system requirements:

• 233 MHz CPU
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• 32 MB RAM
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• 4 MB DirectX-certified video card
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• 4x CD-ROM drive
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• DirectX 7.0
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• 750 MB available hard disk space
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• Windows 95

Compared to Dragon Age 2, which was made for computers and gaming consoles with the following requirements for the PC:



Minimum:

• OS: Windows XP with SP3
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• OS: Windows Vista with SP2
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• OS: Windows 7
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo (or equivalent) running at 1.8 GHz or greater
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• CPU: AMD Athlon 64 X2 (or equivalent) running at 1.8 GHz or greater
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• RAM: 1 GB (1.5 GB Vista and Windows 7)
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• Video: Radeon HD 2600 Pro 256 MB
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• Video: NVIDIA GeForce 7900 GS 256 MB cards
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• Disc Drive: DVD ROM drive required
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• Hard Drive: 7 GB
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• Sound: Direct X 9.0c Compatible Sound Card Windows Experience Index: 4.5

And while technically the engine was the same for DA2 as DAO, they made a lot of changes that BG2 did not make after BG.  DA2 used a different combat system, different armor types, different spells, different combat specializations, different conversation style, different artwork and graphics, and an almost completely new cast of voice actors.  BG2 used almost the same mechanics as its predecessor.  It kept many of the original voice actors, and had far fewer new ones to add.   Back then two years of development, when all those factors are identical, except the script, and perhaps a few new monsters, was much easier than what DA2 tried to do in a similar amount of time.  And in this day and age, 2 years is not nearly enough to do it right.

Again, We weren't discussing "whys".  If you're going to claim that a *great* game cannot be made quickly, then do  so.  And I'll counter with proof otherwise, like I already did  (BG2).  There are other examples (much more 'modern" examples)  we can point to as well, if such a thing is important  in your eyes.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 07 juin 2012 - 06:49 .

[mrgc]

joshko wrote...

gwenhilde wrote...

http://twitter.com/d...400739149877251

Just read this on twitter.Wonder who his reffering to.?

He's talking about the fish he had for lunch.

Sorry I dont understand? Is the fish petty and mean and he hopes that its just stupid? Or am I missing something?

[Kidd]

BioWare PR gives a completely dry and impersonal message.
- BSN complains the PR doesn't feel alive and doesn't seem to care.

BioWare employee speaks his mind as a normal human being.
- BSN complains said employee isn't polite enough.

Can we please stop throwing verbal fecal matter around every time a BioWare-tagged post comes up in a topic? We should be happy David (and the others) even bothers to come around here and discuss with us. It means they can get a feel for what we want and what we like to make us a better product, not to mention they're human beings as well who might simply want to talk for a bit.

And thinking a comment is snide, then responding with hostility? Please, you do not have the moral high ground.

Message not directed at any one individual. If you feel I was speaking to you personally, then that's your own opinion and not my intent. I merely want to remind people to be fabulous to one another.

[nightscrawl]

rapscallioness wrote...

... but if you really get peeved, the devs can always stab us in the gut and feast on our sweet, sweet fan tears...while they cackle. you guys always get the last laugh. amiright?

I don't know... it's certainly within his power to kill off some popular NPC (Alistair?) in a very messy way, and just be all "I hope you people are happy now." Or like, have the last two Blights happen at the same time and just obliterate Thedas, making us start fresh on another continent. >

Perhaps I should go build a DG shrine with my three books to try and prevent this.

All kidding aside, I really don't understand why he rises to the bait, or even responds in any way to such posts, since it only gets him more riled up than he was before he made his original quoted statement. Poor John was driven from the forums and is only doing status updates now. I see this on the WoW forums too, and I don't understand.

Modifié par nightscrawl, 07 juin 2012 - 01:35 .

[Kidd]

nightscrawl wrote...

Poor John was driven from the forums and is only doing status updates now. I see this on the WoW forums too, and I don't understand.

We scared John away!? But I always loved his posts =(

[AkiKishi]

nightscrawl wrote...

All kidding aside, I really don't understand why he rises to the bait, or even responds in any way to such posts, since it only gets him more riled up than he was before he made his original quoted statement. Poor John was driven from the forums and is only doing status updates now. I see this on the WoW forums too, and I don't understand.

I thought he may have been roped in to either TOR or ME3 being a cinematics guy. Being a cinematics guy I guess he is the natural enemy of a certain view point.

Modifié par BobSmith101, 07 juin 2012 - 02:28 .

[Jerrybnsn]

So how does a topic about E3 and bioware end up becoming about Mr. Gaider having a fish intolerance?

[Kaosbuddy]

KiddDaBeauty wrote...

nightscrawl wrote...

Poor John was driven from the forums and is only doing status updates now. I see this on the WoW forums too, and I don't understand.

We scared John away!? But I always loved his posts =(

He popped up in another thread earlier. *Goes looking* -  http://social.biowar...512/14#12490419

Modifié par Kaosbuddy, 09 juin 2012 - 08:08 .

[devSin]

Dakota Strider wrote...

And while technically the engine was the same for DA2 as DAO, they made a lot of changes that BG2 did not make after BG.  DA2 used a different combat system, different armor types, different spells, different combat specializations, different conversation style, different artwork and graphics, and an almost completely new cast of voice actors.  BG2 used almost the same mechanics as its predecessor.  It kept many of the original voice actors, and had far fewer new ones to add.   Back then two years of development, when all those factors are identical, except the script, and perhaps a few new monsters, was much easier than what DA2 tried to do in a similar amount of time.  And in this day and age, 2 years is not nearly enough to do it right.

I have come two days later to declare this false.

Nearly every resource in BG2 was new. Most of the area art was new. All the character animations were re-rendered with additional frames. New weapon and armor graphics were added. All the major new monsters had new animations (BG had almost none, but they did take a lot from BIS as well as doing their own). Almost all of the interface graphics were new or updated. Most spells and items were new (several hundred spells and over a thousand items IIRC). All the area and creature definitions were new (over three hundred and nearly two thousand, respectively). All the scripts were new (there are several thousand of them). All the dialogues were new (there are almost a thousand). Almost all of the text was original (somewhere over 50,000 individual strings in SoA, and over 70,000 by ToB). The kits were added, along with new class mechanics. There were a number of engine enhancements and additions. Nearly all soundsets were new, and every voiced line of dialogue was new (even if they had returning actors, of which they had plenty between Origins and DA2). All the music was new. A lot of the sound effects were new.

Now, the cost of changes these days is much higher, and they tried to do too much in DA2 with too little time. But you can't use BG2 to make that argument. They changed everything in BG2 in a short amount of time (with only 1.3 million in advance royalties IIRC), and they walked away with one of the best video games ever made.

Modifié par devSin, 09 juin 2012 - 10:01 .

[Kroitz]

David Gaider wrote...

You left out the beginning of you're statement, "Do people really think...?" As if to say "How could people be so stupid?"

Which is why I asked, "Why so snide?" Meaning why are you being so snide to the people in this specific thread who are just expressing their excitement for the DA franchise. Most of which were not making any demands, so don't try to say it's about how we're being so damn demanding and want something from the devs, because that wasn't it. But honestly I didn't think that was hard to understand, but apparently you have trouble with this sort of thing.

But I will drop this now. We all make mistakes, and fortunately I don't have to like you in order to enjoy your writing.

This is an excellent example of why PR people use the blandest, most neutral text possible whenever they address the public.

two of a kind blaming each other. hilarious.