250 réponses à ce sujet

[Drake-Shepard]

Mcfly616 wrote...

Gyroscopic_Trout wrote...

Drake-Shepard wrote...

Tealjaker94 wrote...

Leafs43 wrote...

In literary terms, if you do a huge twist like the catalyst, you do it in the middle of the series, not at the end.


Even the Matrix got that right.

This is a great point. Look at star wars, the big twist happens at the end of the empire strikes back, not return of the Jedi.

That said, the 'twist' in the matrix was not a new concept. Being dependent on the system and then Control were the main long running themes of Matrix 1 and 2.
At the end of 2, Neo says 'it was just ANOTHER form of control'. imdb matrix quotes, the film is littered with them.

It was in the middle of the trilogy.. and the architect still answered a crap load of questions and you got to see what happened after.
The catalyst introduces a small story arc as the main plot and contradicts 66% of players rannoch story arc telling you this in 14 lines.


I just had a thought..imagine matrix ended at the end of that architect screen...he walks through the door and boom...random cutscene of trinity and morpheus in the garden of eden. There would of been blood!

Imagine if the identity of Revan wasn't revealed until the end of Knights of the Old Republic and they didn't spend a third of the game exploring that idea.  Can you imagine how unsatisfying and confusing that would have been?  Who made that game by the way, I can't remember...?

Oh.  Right.  

No...sorry....the Matrix sequals didn't get anything right. Unless their goal was to ruin the series....then yes, I.guess they got that right....the Architect single-handedly ruins that trilogy....oh and Bioware literally copied the Architect.....VOMIT.

I thought I would hold ME in high regard, like the Star Wars original.trilogy.....but no....I have to.relive the same exact thing that ruined the Matrix.....

The Matrix sequals should be a lesson in WHAT NOT TO DO when concluding a trilogy.....instead Bioware literally copied and pasted it. Makes me sick


The catalyst is the architect....ridiculous logic and all....make no mistake

Apart from that one architect scene nothing in the matrix can be compared to Mass effect. what are you talking about. you missed the point entirely.
People say the catalyst was an architect rip-off ..and they have a point....i am inclined to agree,,the point me and the other guy are making are the differences in introducing a character like that in the 2nd part of the trilogy then the 3rd part. The other point was the concept the architect explained was a long running main theme..wheras the catalyst contrived a contradicting theme up in 14 lines.

That is a massive difference. The matrix also gave a crap load of closure..a lot of questions trying to understand the clusterf*ck but atleast they gave closure because the audience deserved it. So the matrix didn't do everything wrong. Mass effect did everything wrong

[Landon7001]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

IMO the writers of the ending made sure that ME3 will be forgotten. The Mass Effect series will be forgotten. Because "art".

The one saving grace for the series right now is the multiplayer. I know... I'm speaking sacrilege on a RPG board, but it's true. It's damned true. If it weren't for the MP the game would have gone into the bargain bin. I'm seeing new players entering nightly. I'm seeing people who have had the game since the beginning nightly. It's easy to find a match, and I'm hoping this trend continues at least until the EC is out.

I'm hoping the EC is really really good. I'm hoping that EA sees that this franchise is a money maker by looking at ME2 and initial sales of ME3, and actually does something positive with it for a change instead of what I've seen happen to other franchises of theirs.

My question to Hudson and Walters is "Why? Why did you do this to the ending? Nevermind that, Why did you do this to the story?" Did they hate us that much? Is this a pissing contest with EA's deadline setting policy and we're stuck in the middle of it? But indications are this ****ty ending was planned.

I've come up with four possible alternatives that are better. I've read at least two dozen more here that are better. We don't get paid for this. Was it that difficult to figure out a better ending? No.

Bottom line? This is a pissing contest and we're stuck in the middle of it. It is so illogical to trash an entire franchise like this. Even if you liked the ending, you do have to admit it could have been executed a lot better. There are things you just don't do. I know what they'd say. "We introduced the catalyst. You were dreaming about it. You just didn't know it.?" There wasn't enough ryncol on Tuchanka to get Shepard to buy that.

"Fill in the blanks with your imagination." I remember this line vividly. This is an excuse for bad writing. Yes there are going to be blanks. Just not blanks that have a giant sucking sound to them. Sure you want to leave your audience discussing the game, and you want them discussing the philosophical ramifications of their decisions. What you don't want is them discussing "what the **** just happened?"

You don't want to leave people like that. That's a mind **** without resolution, and I hate writers who do that.

People here have talked about the "Disney Ending". Walt Disney was the king of the bittersweet ending. Something bitter always happened (remember when Old Yeller died?), but he always left you with hope. I don't know how he got remembered for the "happy all is well ending". I think it's because the movies were "family entertainment."

And what's wrong with have the trilogy have one ending where Shepard survives and gets reunited with his/her LI and all that rot? Nothing. It's still a bittersweet ending. Just look around at the state of things.

So no I don't think anything was sacrified for short term profits. I think what we got was a pissing contest between the lead writers and marketing/sales, and we got stuck in the middle of it. The "artistic integrity" was a bull**** line thrown out to cover asses. The EC is an attempt to fix this, and that's why it's free.

its possible

[The Angry One]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Oooooooh, someone who is predjiduced against FPS's and their fans! How unique you are! I'm only slightly kidding. Halo's world was probably the most interesting FPS world post-2005. It's pretty much the icon world for the Xbox 360. Even though it might not be as fleshed out as the Mass Effect universe, it still has a lot to offer. Hell, I even watched the anime. Not half bad.

Yes, I don't think much of FPSs.
I said nothing about the fans however...

Ahem, "CoD deadhead crowd"

Ah well you see I don't consider CoD fans to be FPS fans as much as... well I don't know what they are, really.

[Landon7001]

Drake-Shepard wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

Gyroscopic_Trout wrote...

Drake-Shepard wrote...

Tealjaker94 wrote...

Leafs43 wrote...

In literary terms, if you do a huge twist like the catalyst, you do it in the middle of the series, not at the end.


Even the Matrix got that right.

This is a great point. Look at star wars, the big twist happens at the end of the empire strikes back, not return of the Jedi.

That said, the 'twist' in the matrix was not a new concept. Being dependent on the system and then Control were the main long running themes of Matrix 1 and 2.
At the end of 2, Neo says 'it was just ANOTHER form of control'. imdb matrix quotes, the film is littered with them.

It was in the middle of the trilogy.. and the architect still answered a crap load of questions and you got to see what happened after.
The catalyst introduces a small story arc as the main plot and contradicts 66% of players rannoch story arc telling you this in 14 lines.


I just had a thought..imagine matrix ended at the end of that architect screen...he walks through the door and boom...random cutscene of trinity and morpheus in the garden of eden. There would of been blood!

Imagine if the identity of Revan wasn't revealed until the end of Knights of the Old Republic and they didn't spend a third of the game exploring that idea.  Can you imagine how unsatisfying and confusing that would have been?  Who made that game by the way, I can't remember...?

Oh.  Right.  

No...sorry....the Matrix sequals didn't get anything right. Unless their goal was to ruin the series....then yes, I.guess they got that right....the Architect single-handedly ruins that trilogy....oh and Bioware literally copied the Architect.....VOMIT.

I thought I would hold ME in high regard, like the Star Wars original.trilogy.....but no....I have to.relive the same exact thing that ruined the Matrix.....

The Matrix sequals should be a lesson in WHAT NOT TO DO when concluding a trilogy.....instead Bioware literally copied and pasted it. Makes me sick


The catalyst is the architect....ridiculous logic and all....make no mistake

Apart from that one architect scene nothing in the matrix can be compared to Mass effect. what are you talking about. you missed the point entirely.
People say the catalyst was an architect rip-off ..and they have a point....i am inclined to agree,,the point me and the other guy are making are the differences in introducing a character like that in the 2nd part of the trilogy then the 3rd part. The other point was the concept the architect explained was a long running main theme..wheras the catalyst contrived a contradicting theme up in 14 lines.

That is a massive difference. The matrix also gave a crap load of closure..a lot of questions trying to understand the clusterf*ck but atleast they gave closure because the audience deserved it. So the matrix didn't do everything wrong. Mass effect did everything wrong

THIS

[LiarasShield]

Just saying those that want to have a sad sacrifical ending with forces being trapt in sol can stay but let people who want to have a chane to truely beat the reapers win and go home rebuild his or hers love interests world

Honestly like the collector base I honestly don't see why either side has to lose or give up ground if everybody got the ending they wanted I'm sure ending lovers and ending haters wouldn't be trying to tear each others throats out every 5 minutes

[xsdob]

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Oooooooh, someone who is predjiduced against FPS's and their fans! How unique you are! I'm only slightly kidding. Halo's world was probably the most interesting FPS world post-2005. It's pretty much the icon world for the Xbox 360. Even though it might not be as fleshed out as the Mass Effect universe, it still has a lot to offer. Hell, I even watched the anime. Not half bad.

Yes, I don't think much of FPSs.
I said nothing about the fans however...

Ahem, "CoD deadhead crowd"

Ah well you see I don't consider CoD fans to be FPS fans as much as... well I don't know what they are, really.

You make a lot of assertions about other fandoms.

Modifié par xsdob, 06 juin 2012 - 07:41 .

[LiarasShield]

bbut please this thread in particular is not about picking fights

[The Angry One]

xsdob wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Oooooooh, someone who is predjiduced against FPS's and their fans! How unique you are! I'm only slightly kidding. Halo's world was probably the most interesting FPS world post-2005. It's pretty much the icon world for the Xbox 360. Even though it might not be as fleshed out as the Mass Effect universe, it still has a lot to offer. Hell, I even watched the anime. Not half bad.

Yes, I don't think much of FPSs.
I said nothing about the fans however...

Ahem, "CoD deadhead crowd"

Ah well you see I don't consider CoD fans to be FPS fans as much as... well I don't know what they are, really.

You make a lot of assertions about other fandoms.

Not at all. Except for the CoD fandom.

[Lee80]

I haven't read this whole tread, as I've been reading for far too long today already...but if no one already pointed it out comparing the game to Star Wars would be counterproductive if you wanted a good ending. The over all feeling about Return of the Jedi was mainly negative. Many many people feel it was the weakest in the trilogy. I loved it myself, but many people loved Mass Effect 3 as well.

[xsdob]

The Angry One wrote...

xsdob wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Oooooooh, someone who is predjiduced against FPS's and their fans! How unique you are! I'm only slightly kidding. Halo's world was probably the most interesting FPS world post-2005. It's pretty much the icon world for the Xbox 360. Even though it might not be as fleshed out as the Mass Effect universe, it still has a lot to offer. Hell, I even watched the anime. Not half bad.

Yes, I don't think much of FPSs.
I said nothing about the fans however...

Ahem, "CoD deadhead crowd"

Ah well you see I don't consider CoD fans to be FPS fans as much as... well I don't know what they are, really.

You make a lot of assertions about other fandoms.

Not at all. Except for the CoD fandom.

Why?

[LiarasShield]

*Sighs* this was suppose to be a decent thread about people who love or hate the ending not about picking fights with one another


but yes They could've had a happy ending and a sad ending it didn't only just have to be sad or bittersweet it really couldv've been both

I'm mean this series as a whole has been about actions and consequences so because of these actions

Why can't their be a sad bittersweet sacrifical ending

But if I make different choices or paragon ones why can't I defeat the reapers go home with liara and rebuild thessia and give her that old good shepard smile?

[The Angry One]

xsdob wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

xsdob wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Oooooooh, someone who is predjiduced against FPS's and their fans! How unique you are! I'm only slightly kidding. Halo's world was probably the most interesting FPS world post-2005. It's pretty much the icon world for the Xbox 360. Even though it might not be as fleshed out as the Mass Effect universe, it still has a lot to offer. Hell, I even watched the anime. Not half bad.

Yes, I don't think much of FPSs.
I said nothing about the fans however...

Ahem, "CoD deadhead crowd"

Ah well you see I don't consider CoD fans to be FPS fans as much as... well I don't know what they are, really.

You make a lot of assertions about other fandoms.

Not at all. Except for the CoD fandom.

Why?

Because CoD is a blight on gaming and part of the reason ME3 has been dumbed down.

[Wulfram]

At least the reapers weren't defeated by Ewoks

[xsdob]

LiarasShield wrote...

*Sighs* this was suppose to be a decent thread about people who love or hate the ending not about picking fights with one another


but yes They could've had a happy ending and a sad ending it didn't only just have to be sad or bittersweet it really couldv've been both

I'm mean this series as a whole has been about actions and consequences so because of these actions

Why can't their be a sad bittersweet sacrifical ending

But if I make different choices or paragon ones why can't I defeat the reapers go home with liara and rebuild thessia and give her that old good shepard smile?

Alright, I'll stop being so antagonistic.

Having a happy and a sad ending would have probably been better, I just think the ending I got was happy, but I can see how those who don't see it that way would feel angry and disenfranchised.

I hope you find something that makes you feel better someday.

Oh and angryone, maybe you shouldn't try and judge an entrie fandom based on nothing put finger pointing and accusations with little proof.

It's a different series, it has it's own lore and it's own story and characters which are frankly pretty damn good. Sorry you don't even want to attempt to learn that.

Modifié par xsdob, 06 juin 2012 - 07:52 .

[LiarasShield]

just why can;t their be a good ending and a sad ending depending on our choices I just don't see why that couldn't happen when most of mass effect has been a emphasis about our choices and ewoks defeating the reapers that would be funny lol

[Alyrina]

LiarasShield wrote...

*Sighs* this was suppose to be a decent thread about people who love or hate the ending not about picking fights with one another

Happens everywhere

LiarasShield wrote... 

But if I make different choices or paragon ones why can't I defeat the reapers go home with liara and rebuild thessia and give her that old good shepard smile?

That would be so good. Hoewever pretty sure it won't ever come and my hopes are very low on the EC aswel

[The Angry One]

Yes yes Return of the Jedi had Ewoks, and Mass Effect 3 had Kai Leng. I prefer Ewoks.

Modifié par The Angry One, 06 juin 2012 - 07:52 .

[LiarasShield]

xsdob wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

*Sighs* this was suppose to be a decent thread about people who love or hate the ending not about picking fights with one another


but yes They could've had a happy ending and a sad ending it didn't only just have to be sad or bittersweet it really couldv've been both

I'm mean this series as a whole has been about actions and consequences so because of these actions

Why can't their be a sad bittersweet sacrifical ending

But if I make different choices or paragon ones why can't I defeat the reapers go home with liara and rebuild thessia and give her that old good shepard smile?

Alright, I'll stop being so antagonistic.

Having a happy and a sad ending would have probably been better, I just think the ending I got was happy, but I can see how those who don't see it that way would feel angry and disenfranchised.

I hope you find something that makes you feel better someday.

Oh and angryone, maybe you shouldn't try and judge an entrie fandom based on nothing put finger pointing and bad lies.

Because some of us feel that we only got the bitter none of the sweet I mean despite any actions or choices we make shepard always dies and all our forces are trapt in sol none of that ever changes despite what ending you pick

But like I said if we made pure paragon decision if I have the most ems why cant I say no to the reapers and have my military alliance fight them to the end and if we win why can't I go back to thessia with liara help her rebuild and have a family some day

I just can't comprehend why their can't be a good and a sad ending depending on our choices because most of mass effect was

[Mcfly616]

Drake-Shepard wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

Gyroscopic_Trout wrote...

Drake-Shepard wrote...

Tealjaker94 wrote...

Leafs43 wrote...

In literary terms, if you do a huge twist like the catalyst, you do it in the middle of the series, not at the end.


Even the Matrix got that right.

This is a great point. Look at star wars, the big twist happens at the end of the empire strikes back, not return of the Jedi.

That said, the 'twist' in the matrix was not a new concept. Being dependent on the system and then Control were the main long running themes of Matrix 1 and 2.
At the end of 2, Neo says 'it was just ANOTHER form of control'. imdb matrix quotes, the film is littered with them.

It was in the middle of the trilogy.. and the architect still answered a crap load of questions and you got to see what happened after.
The catalyst introduces a small story arc as the main plot and contradicts 66% of players rannoch story arc telling you this in 14 lines.


I just had a thought..imagine matrix ended at the end of that architect screen...he walks through the door and boom...random cutscene of trinity and morpheus in the garden of eden. There would of been blood!

Imagine if the identity of Revan wasn't revealed until the end of Knights of the Old Republic and they didn't spend a third of the game exploring that idea.  Can you imagine how unsatisfying and confusing that would have been?  Who made that game by the way, I can't remember...?

Oh.  Right.  

No...sorry....the Matrix sequals didn't get anything right. Unless their goal was to ruin the series....then yes, I.guess they got that right....the Architect single-handedly ruins that trilogy....oh and Bioware literally copied the Architect.....VOMIT.

I thought I would hold ME in high regard, like the Star Wars original.trilogy.....but no....I have to.relive the same exact thing that ruined the Matrix.....

The Matrix sequals should be a lesson in WHAT NOT TO DO when concluding a trilogy.....instead Bioware literally copied and pasted it. Makes me sick


The catalyst is the architect....ridiculous logic and all....make no mistake

Apart from that one architect scene nothing in the matrix can be compared to Mass effect. what are you talking about. you missed the point entirely.
People say the catalyst was an architect rip-off ..and they have a point....i am inclined to agree,,the point me and the other guy are making are the differences in introducing a character like that in the 2nd part of the trilogy then the 3rd part. The other point was the concept the architect explained was a long running main theme..wheras the catalyst contrived a contradicting theme up in 14 lines.

That is a massive difference. The matrix also gave a crap load of closure..a lot of questions trying to understand the clusterf*ck but atleast they gave closure because the audience deserved it. So the matrix didn't do everything wrong. Mass effect did everything wrong

Okay....i agree....the Matrix added closure....whereas ME3 just cut to the credits.....



However, the closure in the Matrix was ridiculous and had really faulty logic....which is no surprise because the Architect was part of that closure.....


Idc where you insert that character. The second part of a trilogy or the last 10 minutes.....his logic is still ridiculous and still ruins the story....


I basically look at it as two things that are basically the same ....no closure.....or ridiculously illogical closure......pick your poison....





And another reason that ME3 is a failure.....they should've came up with something truly original to itself and its universe.....Mass Effect deserved that much......instead they copied something that had already failed.....


It may be hard to remember, as time passes, it makes the mind forget some wounds.....but if you went back to when the Matrix sequals were released, you would see that there was backlash from Matrix fans around the world.....similar to ME3, everybody left the theater saying "WTF was that sh*t?!"....and then proceeded to jump on Matrix forums to figure what exactly happened.....just like ME3....

Fail

[LiarasShield]

I'm just since most of mass effect was about choices then why can't some players choose to have a sad sacrifical ending while some can choose to have a better happyer uplifting one why does either side have to lose I mean where did the player choice control that we had up until this point go?

[Drake-Shepard]

i was also disappointed by the matrix ending....i just think Mass effect was a lot crappier! for one of the same reasons as the matrix but then for like 10 more reasons completely unique to itself.

[Alyrina]

"Maybe" this was planned for a ME4, to fit the story in there that sheppard died etc ...

But then again this makes it like not woth to play/ import me,me2 > me3 when it all goes down anyway ...

[LiarasShield]

I would pay for the option for players to choose how they want to series to end I would pay for other alternatives heck I'd give bioware my purse and they can hold onto for as long as they like

[The Angry One]

I hear people say this is all to make way for an ME4 but... surely there are better ways to open it up for ME4 than... destroying the entire game's universe.

I mean, nobody was thinking Mass Effect would end after 3, only Shepard's story. So I don't get it.

[TheNexus]

The Mass Effect universe is still amazing. We shouldn't pass judgment until the EC. The fact that the EC is even being made indicates that the Bioware team, at the very least, understood that it would probably be better if there was a little more elaboration to the end. And even if it isn't that good, the game was still 99% amazing, which I can't say for most games I have played.

Modifié par TheNexus, 06 juin 2012 - 08:04 .