39 réponses à ce sujet

[TEWR]

LobselVith8 wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

They have. They said the new design is here to stay -- and really, I'm glad for that -- and would be tweaked if deemed necessary.

Thanks for the information and the quote, although it seems to me like Orana wasn't worked on as much as elves like Merrill, Fenris, and Athenril. Which is likely the case for the Nosferatu looking elven NPCs that dot Kirkwall. What's your expert opinion?

Damn, had a post all worked out and I stupidly went to google on the tab it was in.

Anyway, I'd say time constraints mostly. You can see that a fair deal of Elves weren't given their due -- and indeed, the design itself is incomplete in some areas for some Elves. Some Elves will have design features that don't mesh well -- Jethann's hair and eyes, for me -- that seems to indicate Bioware was in a hurry to craft Elves to the design rather then actually craft the design to the Elves.

Or something like that. Hopefully, my point came across well enough in that it seems like some Elves just don't look right due to certain things not going together well. Their overall design may be right per what Bioware wanted, but their individual design is conflicting on how well they look.

Take for instance Orana and Zevran. I personally find both Elves to be okay in the new style, but not without their flaws. Zevran and Orana both lack eyebrows, which I'd say is a factor in why they don't quite look right. Another factor for Zevran is that his skin tone seems to have gotten lighter, but that's ultimately irrelevant to the overall design and is only pertinent to his individual design.

Additionally, Orana's make-up doesn't do her much justice. The colors themselves look... well... ugly. They just don't mix well. I'd say that with a change of make-up, she'd be better looking. Indeed, she appears to have a body I'd expect from a slave of the Tevinter Imperium.

Finally, I'd say another factor is due to the nose some Elves have.



Orana's nose is a style that very few Elves pull off well for me. I'd rather see this particular style scrapped, because while some pull it off -- Varania and Marethari, for instance -- others look like it was crushed by a brick -- Orana and Tomwise, as two other examples.

So change Orana's make-up/lipstick, give her some eyebrows, and change her nose to something else and she might look better to people.

I'd also add in that ears like Tomwise has -- jutting out completely to the side -- do look silly. Ilen has them too, but for me personally he pulls them off. Don't know why.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 01 juillet 2012 - 02:23 .

[TEWR]

renjility wrote...

I think the problem is not that their necks are long, but that they tend to bend in what seems to be an anatomically impossible way, as in the screenshot of Fenris in the opening post. It looks wrong and is distracting.

If so -- and I would hope that's it, rather then the length itself -- then that falls more to being an animation issue rather then a design issue. It's no different then the Merrill cutscene being poorly designed or Morrigan's DR love scene being a bit... wonky to say the least.

Faerunner wrote...

Going out of their way to make elves and kossith look like walking deer and oxen (respectively) while allowing dwarves and humans to look like average people we all see in real life seems really inconsistent to me

Well, considering humans are defined worldwide as appearing as what we all look like in real life and Dwarves are called so because of their short stature -- never mind the idea of "dwarfism" being related -- I don't see any inconsistency whatsoever. I mean, whoever heard of a human that had 8 limbs, antlers, a gelatinous body structure, and was asexual to boot?
 
Elves have never had a unanimous appearance -- indeed, Tolkien's design wasn't original either. The most popular, but not original -- and Kossith are an original race. So why they should bend to some abstract rule of what they look like by some fans is beyond me.

I started a Noble Dwarf origin recently and have had to stop playing it because I am soooo bothered by her oranguatan arms ... I don't even know how Alistair is supposed to fall in love with monkey-girl here >.<

Dwarf Noble Males don't seem to suffer from that

The concept art for Dwarven females in DAII seems to also have remedied that problem. Indeed, talking to many Dwarf females in Origins made me laugh at the nature of them having long orangutan arms.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 01 juillet 2012 - 02:49 .

[berelinde]

 Actually, I'd say just loose the makeup and she'd be fine. She wouldn't be stunningly gorgeous, but not every elf (nor every human) is required to be. If you play on a PC, there's a mod that takes her makeup off, and she looks perfectly acceptable. Pretty, even. Then again, tastes vary. I think she looks fine, but others might not.

[TEWR]

berelinde wrote...

 Actually, I'd say just loose the makeup and she'd be fine. She wouldn't be stunningly gorgeous, but not every elf (nor every human) is required to be. If you play on a PC, there's a mod that takes her makeup off, and she looks perfectly acceptable. Pretty, even. Then again, tastes vary. I think she looks fine, but others might not.

Well, that mod also changed her facial structure a bit as well it seems. Not just the makeup. Or maybe I'm imagining that.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 01 juillet 2012 - 02:27 .

[Fast Jimmy]

Her cheeks do seem a bit less "starving third world country"-esque. Which is a good thing.

There's limber and waif-like elves... and then there is starving meat sacks. Ugh.

[Salaya]

 It's funny how people keep defending -which is true- that beauty is a perspective based concept. But, at the same time, they irritate when someone calls "ugly" any particular trait or a character. Certainly, you can understand that those people are only talking about their tastes.

Anyway, as I always have said with this topic, for me, the elven design is ugly by itself; there are certain things common to all elves that simply make them horrible to my eyes. Especially, that nose. The effect of the long neck, the big eyes, the general thinness and the alien foreheads... ugh. 

Merrill, Fenris, Marethari... all of them are better designed than other elves. But they are still horrible to look at, and are extremely weird compared to the "human with pointy ears" that, for some reason, the new DA developers seem to dislike. 

I know they have stated that the new art style is not going to disappear; but BW has said many things in the past that at the end, turned to be false. I hope this is one of them.

[Fast Jimmy]

Salaya wrote...

 It's funny how people keep defending -which is true- that beauty is a perspective based concept. But, at the same time, they irritate when someone calls "ugly" any particular trait or a character. Certainly, you can understand that those people are only talking about their tastes.

Anyway, as I always have said with this topic, for me, the elven design is ugly by itself; there are certain things common to all elves that simply make them horrible to my eyes. Especially, that nose. The effect of the long neck, the big eyes, the general thinness and the alien foreheads... ugh. 

Merrill, Fenris, Marethari... all of them are better designed than other elves. But they are still horrible to look at, and are extremely weird compared to the "human with pointy ears" that, for some reason, the new DA developers seem to dislike. 

I know they have stated that the new art style is not going to disappear; but BW has said many things in the past that at the end, turned to be false. I hope this is one of them.

Yet it always seems its the things we DON'T want to be true that are, and the things we want to be true are false. 

Maybe that's a biased view, not sure. 

[TEWR]

Salaya wrote...

It's funny how people keep defending -which is true- that beauty is a perspective based concept. But, at the same time, they irritate when someone calls "ugly" any particular trait or a character. Certainly, you can understand that those people are only talking about their tastes.

I tend to get irritated when people apply it to everyone and say something is inherently ugly or inherently disturbing, rather then say "It's not inherently ugly, but I don't like this trait on these people".

When it's talked as if it's inherently something that's downright disturbing, then it tends to irritate me. Because then it's no longer talking about a person's perspective but is trying to pass it off as fact.

[CuriousArtemis]

Most of the elves don't look so bad because they wear collars over their necks, so you can't really tell how freakishly long they are. It is just bizarre. It really is giraffe like, considering how lanky they are, and how large and bulbous their heads are, too. So they have thin, lanky, almost anorexic bodies, a long thin neck, and a bulbous head. There's really nothing "pretty" about that, and methinks any human with an elf-fetish has a serious problem! The males aren't as bad as the females because the females are the ones with the almost sick-looking anorexic arms and shoulders. They REALLY need to fix that.

Modifié par motomotogirl, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:06 .

[TEWR]

Eh, I don't really see them as being fawn-like, despite Shane Hawco's comments saying that was what they look like now -- which could theoretically be just his personal opinion and not that of the entire team.

[PizzaThe Hutt]

I actually liked the elf re-design. It was different from DAO's design(I liked that one too) The thing about DAO's design was that they only seemed like humans with pointy ears and that was it. What I didn't like about the re-design was the neck and the fact that they mildly failed at the concept of being waif-like instead of just plain starved. While I have no problem with a long neck it's just how it moves that bothered me, it's like watching a door-hinge move or something. I'm hoping in DA3 they check how the body properly moves while animating...

As for the Kossith, I like their design too, the only problem with them that I thought was wrong was how many of them looked completely alike, there was really no difference between them. While Sten had copper-coloured skin all the Kossith in DA2 had were that gray colour, I hope they fix that in DA3 and give more of a variety of appearance and skintone.

It would also be nice if they gave more variety in things like clothing(I know, I'm shallow) Everyone in Kirkwall shopped at the same clothing store! As for the Qunari, I really like their armour it was a great touch to throw in the game. though for the other Qunari, I was hoping for more variety given that not everyone in the compound had the same role, I was rather surprised that they weren't given something a little different to signify their role in the Qun. Besides that, they still have a ways to go before they release DA3(or whatever they will call it) and I'm sure they'll change the re-design as graphics and whatnot will no-doubtly change in DA3 and future titles for DA also given the fact that a lot of people didn't like the change...

[Chiramu]

That's not a giraffe neck :< that's a broken neck :<.

[TEWR]

PizzatheHutt wrote...

I was hoping for more variety given that not everyone in the compound had the same role, I was rather surprised that they weren't given something a little different to signify their role in the Qun.

Consider though that their ship was destroyed in the storm, and that if you're wearing some heavy-like armor you're... well... going to sink.

In terms of body and facial design, I agree though that how uniform they all were needs to be rectified. In terms of actual clothing and armor... well... I've addressed that.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 24 juillet 2012 - 08:20 .

[Xilizhra]

Personally, I don't quite see anything wrong with either design. I wouldn't be opposed to going back to the earlier one if it appeased more people, though.

Though I will say that it's not attraction to anorexia if one likes elf women; they're supposed to look like that and it's not unhealthy for them.