They showed a lineup of a character from each main race in the series and asked us which two would we get rid of if we had to. I couldn't do it but I was sadly surprised at how many people said quarian and krogan."
Mac Walters - Creative Director : I never liked Quarians or Krogan. Let's just casually remove them from our IP.
Mac Walters takes over franchise again. Ruins it again.
Honestly, I'm actually fairly concerned that they're going to add the skeletor race (calling it that until the official name is released) and the golem race at the expense of removing 2 of the original races. I don't like the chances the quarians and krogan have...
Curious whether or not the Raloi will be referenced via dialogue in ME4 or not, tbh. As for the Virtual Aliens, I have a pretty strong feeling that that pyramid-shaped ship in the concept art is the ship that they roam around the galaxy in.
Honestly, I'm actually fairly concerned that they're going to add the skeletor race (calling it that until the official name is released) and the golem race at the expense of removing 2 of the original races. I don't like the chances the quarians and krogan have...
I'm pretty sure that there is a krogan in the video they showed at E3 '14.
Krogan are too iconic to be done away with.
Quarian and Geth seem like easy choices, given they can both be wiped out in ME3.
Honestly, I'm actually fairly concerned that they're going to add the skeletor race (calling it that until the official name is released) and the golem race at the expense of removing 2 of the original races. I don't like the chances the quarians and krogan have...
Curious whether or not the Raloi will be referenced via dialogue in ME4 or not, tbh. As for the Virtual Aliens, I have a pretty strong feeling that that pyramid-shaped ship in the concept art is the ship that they roam around the galaxy in.
As for the Raloi, I'm one of those people who believe that they will be in the game as one of the new races.
One of the newest concept arts shows a wateryfall world with houses and a dam up high - this would be quite fitting for Raloi as their homeworld.
I'm pretty sure that there is a krogan in the video they showed at E3 '14.
That IS a Krogan, but he seems to be "blurred" out by light beam for puspose, since their appearance in game might have not been finished up back then.
What gives me worry is that they would consider wiping out some of the more iconic races that make Mass Effect what it is. Its like the writers don't even know what the Mass Effect Galaxy is all about. Given the lack of continuity from what the Reapers were from ME1 to ME3 reinforces my feelings on the issue.
In ME1 we saw and spoke to Sovereign. I fought on the Citadel with Sovereign in the background. Reapers were ruthless, cunning and powerful. They dissected the Prothean Empire despite its size and advanced technology. We saw Ilos - and felt the loss. The last stand of the Protheans - a once proud Empire that spanned the entire galaxy. Quite an acheivement. They were crushed and forgotten by cold uncaring machines.
In ME3 I got this "They are my solution." trash. Reapers aren't all powerful apex forms of life, a fusion of organic and machine. Instead they are benevolent keepers of the peace - a cleansing fire that resets worlds for new life. They are the protectors of organic evolution. Most science fiction that I have read avoids blaring galactic stupidities like this. What I see is huge inconsistencies that force me to doubt the writers and mistrust them. I'm not sure if they don't know what ME is about, or if I am just totally off base as to what the MEU really is. Is it that different for each and every one of us, writers included?
I can understand it if they said ok, no more Batarians. I remember meeting them in Mass Effect 1 BDTS - and Shepard hated them. Batarians are (were) slavers, pirates, outlaws and terrorists. They were hit by the Reapers right out of the gate in ME3 and could very well be history. If they were no more, I could deal with that. The same with the Vorcha and the Hanar - and even Drell had a very small showing in the series.
Some of what makes the MEU is the diversity though! I want lots of alien races. Why can't I have them all? Why is everything we have in dealing with BioWare a compromise? I never compromised on the cash. Well, untill ME3 where I drew the line. Once I saw that ending all bets are off - and they still are until they can prove reliable - IF they can prove it. But I'll give them that chance. The question is, will they reach for greatness, or will there be lots of compromises that land us in the territory of mediocrity?
As for the Raloi, I'm one of those people who believe that they will be in the game as one of the new races.
One of the newest concept arts shows a wateryfall world with houses and a dam up high - this would be quite fitting for Raloi as their homeworld.
Birds are way too hard to animate, why would they do that when it's so much easier to make another bipedal species?
The raloi and the virtual aliens were invented for Cerberus Daily News to flesh out the lore a bit and introduce some new background stories - people have honestly been taking them way too seriously.
I'm pretty sure neither of them will be in the game. They were always intended to be a codex entry, and people have sort of misinterpreted how seriously BW regards that sort of stuff.
Why can't I have them all? Why is everything we have in dealing with BioWare a compromise?
It might literally be something as simple as "we don't have the memory capacity to have nine different species on screen at once", or "we don't have the 3D art budget to create high-resolution digital models with custom facial features for every race option", or "we don't have a spare artist to go and make an entire visual motif for this culture like the DA:I team did with every race and faction, so we have to focus on fewer species". There's a trade-off for everything.
Some compromise is inevitable, they're making a videogame and they're not magic. We can certainly hope that they don't compromise on [whatever my favourite part of the game is], but at the end of the day it's their decision to make it how they want, and they can't do everything. At launch day we'll just have to look at the sum of what the game is and decide whether it's worth the price.
They wouldn't be taking away options just to spite you, basically. There's a reason for everything, and most of the time it's not one that is obvious to people outside the company. One can argue that their priorities are wrong and that they should be focusing on [XYZ], and that's the sort of feedback they'll take into consideration when planning whatever comes next.
Also it's worth pointing out that if that PAX panel is legit (we don't know that it is), we don't know why Bioware was asking that question. It is possible that could be related to multiple playable races as well. Or maybe it has something to do with multiplayer. Or maybe it's just trying to guage the least popular races for companion characters. It could mean a lot of things beyond we're cutting two species from the game.
The truth is we don't know enough about that panel, or even if it actually happened, to draw many conclusions from it. It's fun to speculate, but don't allow yourself to get worked up over it.
Guest_CrunchyisLife_*
Krogan are too iconic to be done away with.
Quarian and Geth seem like easy choices, given they can both be wiped out in ME3.
Yes. I have a couple of saved games where the Quarians are wiped out and the Krogan still afflicted with the genophage. I can still see Krogan in the game with some being cured and some still carrying the genophage. I guess they can devise a method to bring Quarians back for the Quarian fans, but I expect the same consideration for the Geth, even if destroy was chosen.
Yes. I have a couple of saved games where the Quarians are wiped out and the Krogan still afflicted with the genophage. I can still see Krogan in the game with some being cured and some still carrying the genophage. I guess they can devise a method to bring Quarians back for the Quarian fans, but I expect the same consideration for the Geth, even if destroy was chosen.
Quarians can come back through mentioning Idenna, the ship that went to find a new homeworld for the quarians in Mass Effect: Ascension. And where the quarians are, the geth can be added
Guest_CrunchyisLife_*
Quarians can come back through mentioning Idenna, the ship that went to find a new homeworld for the quarians in Mass Effect: Ascension. And where the quarians are, the geth can be added
How many Quarians are on the Idenna though and is it enough to sustain the species? If you wiped them out to spare the Geth aren't they still doomed like the Batarians are doomed?
It might literally be something as simple as "we don't have the memory capacity to have nine different species on screen at once", or "we don't have the 3D art budget to create high-resolution digital models with custom facial features for every race option", or "we don't have a spare artist to go and make an entire visual motif for this culture like the DA:I team did with every race and faction, so we have to focus on fewer species". There's a trade-off for everything.
Some compromise is inevitable, they're making a videogame and they're not magic. We can certainly hope that they don't compromise on [whatever my favourite part of the game is], but at the end of the day it's their decision to make it how they want, and they can't do everything. At launch day we'll just have to look at the sum of what the game is and decide whether it's worth the price.
They wouldn't be taking away options just to spite you, basically. There's a reason for everything, and most of the time it's not one that is obvious to people outside the company. One can argue that their priorities are wrong and that they should be focusing on [XYZ], and that's the sort of feedback they'll take into consideration when planning whatever comes next.
My problem is that I saw all of the compromise in ME3. Bioware frankly bit off more than they could handle - and major parts of the story felt rushed; they compromised too much. After ME 1 and 2, I felt that three was a slap in the face. The compromise was on many levels, not just the polish and the overall quality, but also on the writing. Not only that, but the company had a very hard-line attitude against those of us that dared to state that their endings sucked. Frankly, they were practically giving us the helicopter trick. They didn't care because they already had my money. If they think I will ever forget that then they are sadly mistaken.
Now they want to beat the mass effect drum again and pull down that big cake (money). Is it more promisses and hype like ME3 was? Is it more compromises to the point of a watered down story wth no boss fight and a brand new bad guy in the last 15 minutes? For all of the money they made with pre-orders, day 1 DLC and hype they sure didn't deliver in my book. They just sat back laughing and counting my money, flipping me the bird.
Its a direction the company should not have gone - because I for one will not buy any more games from them without serious investigation. I felt lied to, cheated, and insulted by a game I played only once - zero replayability.
Maybe they can recapture the magic. I'm dumb enough to give them a chance - yet I will remain skeptical. If they are willing to destroy the main character and leave the galaxy in several completely divergent states then I have doubts that they have the talent to continue on with the ME franchaise. There is more to Mass Effect than artwork and alien model wireframes and voice actors. Whats is 'more' to the game is my character. My interaction. My decisions. On that note you don't mistreat my character to my face and then tell me to buzz off. Well, you will once - but only once.
I wonder if Bioware has paid any attention to the lessons learned, or if they are on the same track as before. Myself, I don't have to compromise. I'll just sit here and count the money they could have earned from me had they not compromised.
Personally, I think there are enough to found a colony. It doesn't really matter though, we don't have to see quarian cities after all. The quarian involvement in ME:Next can be limited to one mission on an uncharted world. Doesn't mean the race is extinct. Take drell, for example. We've seen 3 drell in the entire trilogy and one of them died. Doesn't mean that drell are extinct, no?How many Quarians are on the Idenna though and is it enough to sustain the species? If you wiped them out to spare the Geth aren't they still doomed like the Batarians are doomed?
David Hulegaard @HulegaardBooks
Putting this on my desk right next to Garrus. http://www.biowarestore.com/tali-bust.html
Guest_CrunchyisLife_*
Personally, I think there are enough to found a colony. It doesn't really matter though, we don't have to see quarian cities after all. The quarian involvement in ME:Next can be limited to one mission on an uncharted world. Doesn't mean the race is extinct. Take drell, for example. We've seen 3 drell in the entire trilogy and one of them died. Doesn't mean that drell are extinct, no?
No. I don't want any race extinct and I hope it did not come off that way. In my canon save everyone is alive and well, except my Shepard that is. But Batarians and Drell are not near as popular as Quarians. I just would like to see all 3 in the next game. The excuse of extinction cannot be used on one without using it on the others.
SpoilerEwok confirmed in ME:Next
I'm pretty sure that there is a krogan in the video they showed at E3 '14.
Confirmed to be a krogan by the devs.
What gives me worry is that they would consider wiping out some of the more iconic races that make Mass Effect what it is. Its like the writers don't even know what the Mass Effect Galaxy is all about. Given the lack of continuity from what the Reapers were from ME1 to ME3 reinforces my feelings on the issue.
In ME1 we saw and spoke to Sovereign. I fought on the Citadel with Sovereign in the background. Reapers were ruthless, cunning and powerful. They dissected the Prothean Empire despite its size and advanced technology. We saw Ilos - and felt the loss. The last stand of the Protheans - a once proud Empire that spanned the entire galaxy. Quite an acheivement. They were crushed and forgotten by cold uncaring machines.
In ME3 I got this "They are my solution." trash. Reapers aren't all powerful apex forms of life, a fusion of organic and machine. Instead they are benevolent keepers of the peace - a cleansing fire that resets worlds for new life. They are the protectors of organic evolution. Most science fiction that I have read avoids blaring galactic stupidities like this. What I see is huge inconsistencies that force me to doubt the writers and mistrust them. I'm not sure if they don't know what ME is about, or if I am just totally off base as to what the MEU really is. Is it that different for each and every one of us, writers included?
If you can get through Sovereign's speech about timed cycles and imposing order on the chaos of organic evolution without thinking that they're doing what they do to safeguard the galaxy in some way, then yes, it must be different for each and every one of us.
Confirmed to be a krogan by the devs.
If you can get through Sovereign's speech about timed cycles and imposing order on the chaos of organic evolution without thinking that they're doing what they do to safeguard the galaxy in some way, then yes, it must be different for each and every one of us.
Actually, Sovereign was about destroying civilliazation at their apex. It was a cycle in ME1 - a cycle of destruction. Not a cycle of stupidity about saving us from ourselves by killing us all.
You know I appreciate your inputs bro, but you have to try harder than that. 
Actually, Sovereign was about destroying civilliazation at their apex. It was a cycle in ME1 - a cycle of destruction. Not a cycle of stupidity about saving us from ourselves by killing us all.
You know I appreciate your inputs bro, but you have to try harder than that.
If the cycles were solely about destroying civilizations instead of "impos[ing] order on the chaos of organic evolution", they'd do it earlier than their "apex" and they wouldn't provide technology to further their capabilities. They'd make organic life a non-issue altogether, instead of allowing it to exist and flourish along a predetermined pattern.
because I for one will not buy any more games from them without serious investigation
I think this is a good attitude to have about any game from any company, in general 
My point about compromise wasn't to suggest we should give the developers a free pass on anything - people can and do give them very forceful feedback, and they've had three years of that feedback now in relation to ME3's ending. In situations where people are dissatisfied with the writing or the story, I think it's totally fair to say you're disappointed (or angry, or upset) with what was in the game. I do think they've well and truly got that message now, even if we're never going to see the results of it in public. Mike Gamble said ages ago that they've since reworked some processes internally, and I suspect EA will focus test future stories to death, but people who are waiting for some kind of mea culpa from the lead writer are being unreasonable.
But at the same time, they're humans and not magical developer wizards. People do well-intentioned but poorly-received things all the time, and sometimes things happen in game development because of technological limits, or budgets, or time constraints, or whatever, and I don't think we should be accusing them of basically tricking players while counting their massive piles of money.
(Because, frankly, calling developers some combination of lazy/greedy/evil is the moment they just totally ignore you.)
Someone (a team of people?) earnestly wrote ME3 and expected it to be controversial, maybe mildly polarising. It was an artistic vision for the game that, as it turns out, loads of people had huge issues with. Did BW have good intentions? Sure. Did they totally underestimate how people would react? Almost certainly. It might be considered a mistake - I definitely think it was - and I wish it was something that never happened. But it doesn't mean they set out to deliberately cause you pain and disappointment. Thinking that way leads to nowhere healthy or constructive.
If the cycles were solely about destroying civilizations instead of "impos[ing] order on the chaos of organic evolution", they'd do it earlier than their "apex" and they wouldn't provide technology to further their capabilities. They'd make organic life a non-issue altogether, instead of allowing it to exist and flourish along a predetermined pattern.
But they weren't given technology to further their capabilities. They were given technology to ensure they developed down predetermined paths. Making them dependent on that tech.
If anything, the technology stagnated civilization.
But they weren't given technology to further their capabilities. They were given technology to ensure they developed down predetermined paths. Making them dependent on that tech.
If anything, the technology stagnated civilization.
Of course they were. Things would be far simpler without the relays, or at the very least without waiting for civilizations to learn how to use them.
There's no reason to make them dependent on the technology, unless there's an underlying motive.
I still say that all of you are incorrect about how much we'll be dealing with the current species of citadel races that we're gonna have. I have seen (although I can't find it right now) that we'll be having limited contact with the asari. I think that means that we'll be having limited contact with other council races as well. Asari are the basis for biotic combat. Salarians are the basis for mech combat. Krogans are the basis for brute strength or organic combat. Turians are the basis for naval combat.
It has been pretty well established that we're going into another region of space. That means we're gonna be dealing with a whole new cadre of alien species, perhaps a whole new citadel or something like it. So, all that I'm telling is to be prepared for what you see once the game comes out.
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