154 réponses à ce sujet

[Allan Schumacher]

Was that the first Splinter Cell that introduced the Mercs vs. Agents? My god, I loved that. Thought it was a incredibly innovative MP. The game basically had two completely different playstyles. Agents were for those careful, stealthy players in third-person and Mercs were for FPS twitch gamers. It was really cool how when you played as one or the other, they operated completely different. I liked running around as Mercs, it made me feel like Predator with all those different vision scans looking for agents. But nothing was more satisfying than running around as a Agent and outwitting your opponents with guns, while all you could do is distort their electronics and knock them out.

THat was the adversarial mode introduced in Pandora Tomorrow (the second one), and yes it was amaze-balls too.

Chaos Theory had specific co-op missions against AI with some neat mechanics and plots that related to Fisher's main campaign. I also loved how using the in game voice chat made a noise for your character, which could be heard by characters in game.

[deuce985]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Anything more specific about what you'd look for from multiplayer?

Like ME 3 MP, but with swords and spells instead of guns and powers.

Your level of specificity remains unparalleled!!

I am a simple woman with simple tastes.

I like the Mass Effect MP; it is fun. Give me that kind of fun with a Dragon Age flavor and I'll like it. I leave the rest to you. You're the developer, not me.

ZombieGerbil wrote...

Skelter192 wrote...

Did you pull that number out of your ass?

Its called reviewing and observing.

Translation: "Yep, I totally pulled that out my rear."

This. I'm the same way, as I said above, what makes ME3's MP so addictive is how simple it is. I never thought I'd enjoy ME3's MP but outside Diablo 3, it's the only MP I've been playing since ME3 launched.

I play many other MP games that are far more complex but somehow, I still find the formula in ME3 very satisfying. The community doesn't seem to be shrinking either as it's easy to find games. It does get a little repetitive by only being one game mode and survival isn't exactly the most innovative idea. Games like Gears of War do it better. However, where ME3 gets most of it's unique charm is the class+race combos and customization with those. I think that's the biggest bonus for me, IMO. I like running around as a Asari Adept and just feeling completely overpowered spamming biotic explosions. You could argue that's a balance issue even in co-op but who cares? You're suppose to feel overpowered in an RPG and it isn't like you're playing it competitive against human players.

[Allan Schumacher]

The biotic explosion is exceptionally satisfying... LOL.

[deuce985]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Was that the first Splinter Cell that introduced the Mercs vs. Agents? My god, I loved that. Thought it was a incredibly innovative MP. The game basically had two completely different playstyles. Agents were for those careful, stealthy players in third-person and Mercs were for FPS twitch gamers. It was really cool how when you played as one or the other, they operated completely different. I liked running around as Mercs, it made me feel like Predator with all those different vision scans looking for agents. But nothing was more satisfying than running around as a Agent and outwitting your opponents with guns, while all you could do is distort their electronics and knock them out.

THat was the adversarial mode introduced in Pandora Tomorrow (the second one), and yes it was amaze-balls too.

Chaos Theory had specific co-op missions against AI with some neat mechanics and plots that related to Fisher's main campaign. I also loved how using the in game voice chat made a noise for your character, which could be heard by characters in game.

Ah, yes, now I remember.

I think Pandora Tomorrow is a great example of how MP worked for the SC franchise. It was also VERY different from anything else on the market. Perhaps Bioware can look at that? 

What a shame Ubisoft no longer does that MP in their SC games...

What personally frustrates me in MP games today is how most games seem to focus too much into the CoD formula, or they don't put much effort into it. Something like Bioshock 2 or Dead Space 2. Uncharted 3 is a great example of a game that went a little too far trying to CoD their core formula they made in UC2's MP. Bioshock 2, Assassin's Creed and Dead Space 2 are games that looked like they just wanted MP thrown in to make the product more attractive. All three of those games are more SP oriented but their MP was abandoned within the first month of retail...mostly because they weren't done well at all. You rarely seem to get a product today that has both great SP and MP. Not sure if it's resource constraints or what.

Too many MP games today feel similar. Something like Dead Space 2 or AC:Revelations MP was very different, it just didn't have any meat behind it to give enough depth to keep you playing.  Now, if both devs focused a little more into creating depth behind their concepts in MP, maybe they'd have real winners there. The concept was excellent, the execution wasn't.

Modifié par deuce985, 13 juin 2012 - 06:16 .

[Uccio]

iakus wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

If multiplayer is included, which I don't really have a problem with, please don't make it necessary to play to get a certain ending (good or bad).

IMO, for the record I'm 99.9999% sure that the ME3 issue wasn't actually intended (not that that excuses it. It sucks and I do sympathize) and is actually a bug.

Regardless, I do know for a fact that it's something we're very aware of on the DA team and we understand that it was frustrating for fans. If any sort of multiplayer does manifest, I would be very surprised if it had a tie back into the single player experience.

No offense, but I simply can't trust that.  Not anfter being promised that fro ME3 (and I was very skeptical even then)

As such any multiplayer in DA3=no buy for me.

Regretfully  

Same here. MP requirement for best SP in ME3 was one of the reasons why I didn´t buy the game. If DA goes for the same route then its a no-no too.

[ZombieGerbil]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Translation: "Yep, I totally pulled that out my rear."

Wrong. I did not.
Just because I do things that you cannot do in your life doesn't mean you are allowed to assume something as low and idiotic as your pathetic translation attempt.

But nice try, I know you're that small percent that doesn't matter.
If you want to stick with MP, go back to that thing you call ME3.
To continue to prove that you're the small percent that doesn't matter after this,
I am no longer responding to someone as low you.
You cease to exist on this forum to me.

As I said for the MP.

90% including me says:

NO TO  MULTIPLAYER

Keep Dragon Age as it is and was.

Modifié par ZombieGerbil, 13 juin 2012 - 08:09 .

[Kickiluxxx]

I think I'm leaning on a "No to multiplayer" for now.

First and foremost, because I find it harder to mod and use mods in games with multiplayer.
Also, I hate it when multiplayers have a tie-in in a single player story driven game.

A lot of story driven games, including Dragon Age: Origins, have sold well despite having no multiplayer.

In my opinion, I think it would be better to use the budget intended for multiplayer in improving the story and quality control. :innocent:

[KDD-0063]

For the MP affecting SP part, it should be done like this:
I'm using ME3 as an example;
For people who made good major decisions, such as ME2 squad survives, most major assets acquired and etc, getting to a good ending is not very hard even without MP and you can even skip a few side missions.
Now, for a save that quite a few assets and squadmates are missing, you have the option to grind up you military strength through MP.
Say, 20 MS per character promoted and that's the only difference. Not the 50% vs 100% readiness crap.

Plus it'll be a win-win situation; new players to ME3 are probably the ones who like MP better anyways.

Modifié par KDD-0063, 13 juin 2012 - 10:49 .

[Archer]

KDD-0063 wrote...

For the MP affecting SP part, it should be done like this:
I'm using ME3 as an example;
For people who made good major decisions, such as ME2 squad survives, most major assets acquired and etc, getting to a good ending is not very hard even without MP and you can even skip a few side missions.
Now, for a save that quite a few assets and squadmates are missing, you have the option to grind up you military strength through MP.
Say, 20 MS per character promoted and that's the only difference. Not the 50% vs 100% readiness crap.

Plus it'll be a win-win situation; new players to ME3 are probably the ones who like MP better anyways.

No offence but i have to disagree with that

The problem with MP in ME3 is that it has an impact on the SP game so people are in essence forced to play it.

That is a very bad idea.

I appreciate some people do enjoy MP, TBH i hated the thought of MP for ME3 and had no plans to play it myself. Im just not a big MP fan. However because of the EMS issues with ME3 i HAVE to play MP if i want to get that "certain scene" when i finish a SP game.

That said surprsingly i am actually starting to enjoy MP in ME3 and currently im not that adverse to playing it. It makes for a nice change to break up a SP playthrough (especialy when your on playthrough number 5 or so lol) But i still begrudge the fact that i have to play it to get the SP ending i want.

IMO as i indictaed earlier in the thread i personaly have no issues with MP in Dragon Age per se, but if it is implemented it needs to be an entirley seperate aspect of the game, i.e it should have no impact,effect or relation to the SP game. It should effectivley be a fun game option that doesnt add or take away anything from a SP game.

Although again i do have concerns that adding a MP element to DA would take away budgets that would be better used for the SP game. I know ME3's multiplayer was developed by a seperate team, but again as i said earlier IMHO i think splitting some of the budget for MP took away resources for the SP game. ME3 is a relativley good game overall but i dont feel it was up to the standard we have come to expect from Bioware and i honestly believe some of that is down to the focus on MP (you can look me up in the ME forums for the other issues i had with ME3 lol)

So adding MP to DA wouldnt stop me buying it, but given a choice i would probably prefer that it wasnt present. If it is, PLEASE PLEASE keep it as a completley seperate element of gameplay from the SP game.

[Kingthlayer]

I say no to MP, I don't think it's needed. People buy Dragon Age games for the single player story, nobody is going to buy the game just for MP, but there are people who will not buy DA3 because it includes MP.

[deuce985]

Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...

I say no to MP, I don't think it's needed. People buy Dragon Age games for the single player story, nobody is going to buy the game just for MP, but there are people who will not buy DA3 because it includes MP.

Well, by that logic, this means people will buy DA3 for MP too. The point of putting MP in a game like this is make it a more attractive product. And if it's done well, I can see it happening.

People have good points on forcing MP on SP players though. It shouldn't take away SP development either. Way I understand it, ME3's MP was done by a separate team anyway, so it never took resources from SP development. Perhaps budget? I have no idea. But I was definitely one of those people super skeptical about ME3 getting MP and honestly didn't want it. After playing it though, I can say I was wrong. But never once did I think in my mind, "just because it has MP, I refuse to play this game".

If Bioware can do something unique for the DA franchise with MP, I wouldn't mind seeing it at all. I'm not going to be close-minded enough to think just because it has MP, I refuse to play the package.

Modifié par deuce985, 13 juin 2012 - 06:10 .

[KDD-0063]

eveynameiwantisfekintaken wrote...

KDD-0063 wrote...

For the MP affecting SP part, it should be done like this:
I'm using ME3 as an example;
For people who made good major decisions, such as ME2 squad survives, most major assets acquired and etc, getting to a good ending is not very hard even without MP and you can even skip a few side missions.
Now, for a save that quite a few assets and squadmates are missing, you have the option to grind up you military strength through MP.
Say, 20 MS per character promoted and that's the only difference. Not the 50% vs 100% readiness crap.

Plus it'll be a win-win situation; new players to ME3 are probably the ones who like MP better anyways.

No offence but i have to disagree with that

The problem with MP in ME3 is that it has an impact on the SP game so people are in essence forced to play it.

That is a very bad idea.

I appreciate some people do enjoy MP, TBH i hated the thought of MP for ME3 and had no plans to play it myself. Im just not a big MP fan. However because of the EMS issues with ME3 i HAVE to play MP if i want to get that "certain scene" when i finish a SP game.

That said surprsingly i am actually starting to enjoy MP in ME3 and currently im not that adverse to playing it. It makes for a nice change to break up a SP playthrough (especialy when your on playthrough number 5 or so lol) But i still begrudge the fact that i have to play it to get the SP ending i want.

IMO as i indictaed earlier in the thread i personaly have no issues with MP in Dragon Age per se, but if it is implemented it needs to be an entirley seperate aspect of the game, i.e it should have no impact,effect or relation to the SP game. It should effectivley be a fun game option that doesnt add or take away anything from a SP game.

Although again i do have concerns that adding a MP element to DA would take away budgets that would be better used for the SP game. I know ME3's multiplayer was developed by a seperate team, but again as i said earlier IMHO i think splitting some of the budget for MP took away resources for the SP game. ME3 is a relativley good game overall but i dont feel it was up to the standard we have come to expect from Bioware and i honestly believe some of that is down to the focus on MP (you can look me up in the ME forums for the other issues i had with ME3 lol)

So adding MP to DA wouldnt stop me buying it, but given a choice i would probably prefer that it wasnt present. If it is, PLEASE PLEASE keep it as a completley seperate element of gameplay from the SP game.

That's what I meant in the first place:

MP's influence to SP should be minimal, an extra chance for people who screwed up in previous games, or did not play previous games, to grind up assets, instead of the deciding factor (50% vs 100%) as it is in current ME3. Nor should it be necessary for a good playthrough to acquire the best ending.

And that is what Bioware advertised before the game, which I thought is fine; instead we got that 50% vs 100% crap.

Modifié par KDD-0063, 13 juin 2012 - 06:53 .

[Archer]

KDD-0063 wrote...

eveynameiwantisfekintaken wrote...

KDD-0063 wrote...

For the MP affecting SP part, it should be done like this:
I'm using ME3 as an example;
For people who made good major decisions, such as ME2 squad survives, most major assets acquired and etc, getting to a good ending is not very hard even without MP and you can even skip a few side missions.
Now, for a save that quite a few assets and squadmates are missing, you have the option to grind up you military strength through MP.
Say, 20 MS per character promoted and that's the only difference. Not the 50% vs 100% readiness crap.

Plus it'll be a win-win situation; new players to ME3 are probably the ones who like MP better anyways.

No offence but i have to disagree with that

The problem with MP in ME3 is that it has an impact on the SP game so people are in essence forced to play it.

That is a very bad idea.

I appreciate some people do enjoy MP, TBH i hated the thought of MP for ME3 and had no plans to play it myself. Im just not a big MP fan. However because of the EMS issues with ME3 i HAVE to play MP if i want to get that "certain scene" when i finish a SP game.

That said surprsingly i am actually starting to enjoy MP in ME3 and currently im not that adverse to playing it. It makes for a nice change to break up a SP playthrough (especialy when your on playthrough number 5 or so lol) But i still begrudge the fact that i have to play it to get the SP ending i want.

IMO as i indictaed earlier in the thread i personaly have no issues with MP in Dragon Age per se, but if it is implemented it needs to be an entirley seperate aspect of the game, i.e it should have no impact,effect or relation to the SP game. It should effectivley be a fun game option that doesnt add or take away anything from a SP game.

Although again i do have concerns that adding a MP element to DA would take away budgets that would be better used for the SP game. I know ME3's multiplayer was developed by a seperate team, but again as i said earlier IMHO i think splitting some of the budget for MP took away resources for the SP game. ME3 is a relativley good game overall but i dont feel it was up to the standard we have come to expect from Bioware and i honestly believe some of that is down to the focus on MP (you can look me up in the ME forums for the other issues i had with ME3 lol)

So adding MP to DA wouldnt stop me buying it, but given a choice i would probably prefer that it wasnt present. If it is, PLEASE PLEASE keep it as a completley seperate element of gameplay from the SP game.

That's what I meant in the first place:

MP's influence to SP should be minimal, an extra chance for people who screwed up in previous games, or did not play previous games, to grind up assets, instead of the deciding factor (50% vs 100%) as it is in current ME3. Nor should it be necessary for a good playthrough to acquire the best ending.

And that is what Bioware advertised before the game, which I thought is fine; instead we got that 50% vs 100% crap.

I Must stop skim reading before replying

See what your saying there, im just firmly of the opinion that MP should have zero impact on the SP game. But your suggestion would work well for ME3, much better than the system as it stands. For me DA should be no MP or a toolset and the option to host games ala Never Winter Nights (as i mentioned earlier in the thread) If MP was to be added to DA, i think the team should use the ME3 model as an example of what NOT to do,certainly in terms of affecting SP games anyway. 

MP should be an optional compnent and not a system that has to be played to improve a SP game, which is where ME3 goes wrong.

My feelings for MP in DA are probably skewed by my opinions of ME3 at present, but to be fair to the Bioware team its something they should consider. IMHO MP can be a lot like marmite, either love it or hate it

[KDD-0063]

deuce985 wrote...

Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...

I say no to MP, I don't think it's needed. People buy Dragon Age games for the single player story, nobody is going to buy the game just for MP, but there are people who will not buy DA3 because it includes MP.

Well, by that logic, this means people will buy DA3 for MP too. The point of putting MP in a game like this is make it a more attractive product. And if it's done well, I can see it happening.

People have good points on forcing MP on SP players though. It shouldn't take away SP development either. Way I understand it, ME3's MP was done by a separate team anyway, so it never took resources from SP development. Perhaps budget? I have no idea. But I was definitely one of those people super skeptical about ME3 getting MP and honestly didn't want it. After playing it though, I can say I was wrong. But never once did I think in my mind, "just because it has MP, I refuse to play this game".

If Bioware can do something unique for the DA franchise with MP, I wouldn't mind seeing it at all. I'm not going to be close-minded enough to think just because it has MP, I refuse to play the package.

I don't think anybody would mean that: if the SP part of the game is great, sure, why not buy it. MP is simply another option.
However, the news of MP will get people worried about taking resources away from SP. Then, it's certainly time to be cautious, postpone ordering and adopt a wait-and-see approach, and consider both the opinions of critics as well as users on metacritic. A lot of preorder reward? Even more reason to postpone ordering. That's what I did with DA2.

[Vormaerin]

ZombieGerbil wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Translation: "Yep, I totally pulled that out my rear."

Wrong. I did not.
Just because I do things that you cannot do in your life doesn't mean you are allowed to assume something as low and idiotic as your pathetic translation attempt.

But nice try, I know you're that small percent that doesn't matter.
If you want to stick with MP, go back to that thing you call ME3.
To continue to prove that you're the small percent that doesn't matter after this,
I am no longer responding to someone as low you.
You cease to exist on this forum to me.

As I said for the MP.

90% including me says:

NO TO  MULTIPLAYER

Keep Dragon Age as it is and was.

I'd love to see the methodology you used to achieve this remarkable insight.   How you accounted for selection bias, what 'neutral' questions you asked, the same size involved, the margin for error, and so on.

If you just listened to a bunch of random people on random internet sites, you don't have any basis for a valid conclusion.  That's call anecdotal evidence.  Its generally worthless.

[Gtacatalina]

DA3 will be the first Bioware game in a long time I will NOT be pre ordering .

One of the many reasons is that Bioware said in ME3 that the multiplayer would not effect the single player game in anyway.
Well they lied,  and after 3 months of Bioware devs either locking down the threads about the issue and having  no official response from a Bioware dev about the issue (Not a way to treat your customers Bioware).
I have decided to wait for player reviews for DA3 to make sure that any promises Bioware make especially on issues about multiplayer(if it is included) are true or not. 

''Of course you don’t have to play multiplayer, you can choose to play
all the side-quests in single-player and do all that stuff you’ll
still get all the same endings and same information, it’s just a
totally different way of playing"
Mike Gamble
http://www.nowgamer....ry_details.html


As you may have guessed,  no I don't want multiplayer for DA3.

Modifié par Gtacatalina, 14 juin 2012 - 03:34 .

[Forsythia]

I'd love to play DA3, but the inclusion of multiplayer would really be a big turn off for me. I've seen what has been done to Mass Effect. The multiplayer would not affect the singleplayer in any way, yeah right.

I'm getting tired of people wanting multiplayer in every freaking game, and even more of publishers shoehorning it into every game just so they can milk us dry (microtransactions).

[Uccio]

Who in their right mind would want be ordered around by bunch of teens who don´t have their pubes on yet? I mean come on, there are tons of mp games out there. Go play one and enjoy the bossy douches, leavy DA alone.

[Allan Schumacher]

To be fair, 100% of my ME3 MP experience has been with actual friends. I know there were a couple groups of people that would stick around after work and play for an hour together, or play during lunch and so forth.

Random dropin and match making are services I don't actually use.

Modifié par Allan Schumacher, 14 juin 2012 - 06:27 .

[AkiKishi]

PurebredCorn wrote...

I was surprised at how much I enjoyed the multplayer aspect of ME3. Before trying it I really didn't have an opinion about it's inclusion either way, but I think including something similar for the DA games would only enhance the fun of the game.

ME changes very little MP , leaving the companions out makes no real difference. In DA like in BG MP completely changes how the game plays. Playing one character is not that interesting in that sort of system.

[Uzzy]

Given how lacking in development time and resources DA2 proved to be, seeing those scant resources being spent on a multiplayer mode that'll swiftly be forgotten about for DA3 would be the height of stupidity, really.

[Loc'n'lol]

Uzzy wrote...
that'll swiftly be forgotten

You don't know that... It could just as easily be played more than the SP in the long run.