166 réponses à ce sujet

[molecularman]

Let's not forget that GI melee is like 3 times more powerful than nova! And most geth players still skip it so apparently guns do even better than that

[sirjimmus86]

Just to say that I love having a vanguard on my team during the pizza delivery objective, because they can basically run interference all over the map and keep the delivery guy safe without needing to stay in cover like the other guys do.

[tutzdes]

1k damage is widow bodyshot without any passive bonuses or active abilities.

[GodlessPaladin]

molecularman wrote...

Let's not forget that GI melee is
like 3 times more powerful than nova! And most geth players still skip
it so apparently guns do even better than that

Let's examine just how much damage a Geth Infiltrator does.  Heck I'll even be really really nice and focus on a build that DOES NOT go for maximum single target damage.

Krysae base damage:  664
Geth Infiltrator bonuses:  22.5% damage (Networked AI), 25% damage (Hunter Mode), 90% damage (Cloak), 35% damage (Warp ammo, just to keep it simple.  Other ammos will actually be better and do even more damage.  I'm just not exactly sure on all the numbers/mechanics for Disruptor and Inferno ammo), 30% damage (Sniper rail amp), 15% damage (Sniper gear amp), 25% (High Caliber Barrel), 1.4x multiplier (TC Sniper Evolution), 1.2x multiplier (possibly more than one, because Prox Mine stacks with itself.  It also provides the bonus to the whole party).  x3 shots (you can get all 3 during one cloak cycle)

End results?  11,462 damage + Proximity Mine damage (which is AT LEAST 1462 damage).  In an area.  Across the map.  Now add in the fact that I could switch that Warp Ammo for Incendiary or Disruptor ammo and throw a Tech Burst or Fire Explosion in there.  Now consider that I could actually do a lot more single target damage if I used something like a Hurricane or Reegar.

This is all in the space of less than 3 seconds.  So no, I am not impressed by your Nova damage, Vivanto.  At all.  Nobody is ignoring anything, nobody is missing the point.  We know that you think a hosting Human Vanguard using full nova does impressive DPS and is "overpowered compared to everything."  The problem is that you are simply wrong.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 09 juin 2012 - 01:49 .

[Ghostfc3s]

I play HHV as my main go to guy. I am just now getting into the swing of silver and not being a Bronze Hero. The Y Charge bug (when not hosting) is just infuriating. Went down in round one of my first Silver game as I wasn't host.

One of the interesting things about the charge bug is ramps and door frames.

For door frames: If you are on an area of the level where two different floor models connect, Charge glitches or refuses to work, best example is a spot in Glacier. Inside the room with all the consoles, at the back of that room is a door way that has a small boxed in room with a ramp on your right. If you are in the room with the consoles/computers you can't charge into the section of the map with the boxed in room/ramp.

Ramps: easiest spot to see this is on Hydra and Dagger. If a target is on any of those ramps, cover or not, Charge will mostly fail host and non-host.

Once/if it is fixed we can talk about buffing, lets get him not broken first. In silver in pug non-host I make him work despite the glitches. I might change my mind when I hit gold.

Modifié par Ghostfc3s, 09 juin 2012 - 01:29 .

[Serkevan]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

molecularman wrote...

Let's not forget that GI melee is
like 3 times more powerful than nova! And most geth players still skip
it so apparently guns do even better than that

Let's examine just how much damage a Geth Infiltrator does.  Heck I'll even be really really nice and focus on a build that DOES NOT go for maximum single target damage.

Krysae base damage:  664
Geth Infiltrator bonuses:  22.5% damage (Networked AI), 25% damage (Hunter Mode), 90% damage (Cloak), 35% damage (Warp ammo, just to keep it simple.  Other ammos will actually be better and do even more damage.  I'm just not exactly sure on all the numbers/mechanics for Disruptor and Inferno ammo), 30% damage (Sniper rail amp), 15% damage (Sniper gear amp), 25% (High Caliber Barrel), 1.4x multiplier (TC Sniper Evolution), 1.2x multiplier (possibly more than one, because Prox Mine stacks with itself.  It also provides the bonus to the whole party).  x3 shots (you can get all 3 during one cloak cycle)

End results?  11,462 damage + Proximity Mine damage (which is AT LEAST 1462 damage).  In an area.  Across the map.  Now add in the fact that I could switch that Warp Ammo for Incendiary or Disruptor ammo and throw a Tech Burst or Fire Explosion in there.

This is all in the space of less than 3 seconds.  So no, I am not impressed by your Nova damage, Vivanto.  At all.  Nobody is ignoring anything, nobody is missing the point.  We know that you think a hosting Human Vanguard using full nova does impressive DPS and is, "overpowered compared to everything."  The problem is that you are simply wrong.

Someone go get this man a medal for using maths and logic, please.

[molecularman]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

molecularman wrote...

Let's not forget that GI melee is
like 3 times more powerful than nova! And most geth players still skip
it so apparently guns do even better than that

Let's examine just how much damage a Geth Infiltrator does.  Heck I'll even be really really nice and focus on a build that DOES NOT go for maximum single target damage.

Krysae base damage:  664
Geth Infiltrator bonuses:  22.5% damage (Networked AI), 25% damage (Hunter Mode), 90% damage (Cloak), 35% damage (Warp ammo, just to keep it simple.  Other ammos will actually be better and do even more damage.  I'm just not exactly sure on all the numbers/mechanics for Disruptor and Inferno ammo), 30% damage (Sniper rail amp), 15% damage (Sniper gear amp), 25% (High Caliber Barrel), 1.4x multiplier (TC Sniper Evolution), 1.2x multiplier (possibly more than one, because Prox Mine stacks with itself.  It also provides the bonus to the whole party).  x3 shots (you can get all 3 during one cloak cycle)

End results?  11,462 damage + Proximity Mine damage (which is AT LEAST 1462 damage).  In an area.  Across the map.  Now add in the fact that I could switch that Warp Ammo for Incendiary or Disruptor ammo and throw a Tech Burst or Fire Explosion in there.  Now consider that I could actually do a lot more single target damage if I used something like a Hurricane or Reegar.

This is all in the space of less than 3 seconds.  So no, I am not impressed by your Nova damage, Vivanto.  At all.  Nobody is ignoring anything, nobody is missing the point.  We know that you think a hosting Human Vanguard using full nova does impressive DPS and is "overpowered compared to everything."  The problem is that you are simply wrong.

And so the myth about nova doing crazy dps has been disproved once and for all!

[GodlessPaladin]

Serkevan wrote...
Someone go get this man a medal for using maths and logic, please.

molecularman wrote...
And so the myth about nova doing crazy dps has been disproved once and for all!

Also let's look at Geth Melee.

Base damage: 375. Doesn't sound like much right? But wait!
Fitness bonuses: +135% melee damage.
Cloak bonuses: +140% melee damage.
Hunter Mode: +25% melee damage.
Proximity Mine: 1.2x multiplier and of course its own not inconsiderable damage.
Gear: +115% melee damage (Hydraulic Joints, Melee Amp III)
Bayonet:  1.25x multiplier.

So now that 375 gets turned into... 2430 damage. Which can be fired off in rapid succession and affects a 5 meter radius.  I am not sure exactly how long the animation is, but you can get multiple melees easily within the cloak bonus window.  This is of course in addition to the proximity mine's damage.  Which, I might add, gets a 30% boost from melee synergy.

Edit:  Made a mistake... forgot that the bayonet was a multiplier.  Really wish the tooltips would note these things.  That makes it 2897 damage instead.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 09 juin 2012 - 02:35 .

[Serkevan]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Also let's look at Geth Melee.

Base damage: 375. Doesn't sound like much right? But wait!
Fitness bonuses: +135% melee damage.
Cloak bonuses: +140% melee damage.
Hunter Mode: +25% melee damage.
Proximity Mine: 1.2x multiplier and of course its own not inconsiderable damage.
Gear: +140% melee damage (Hydraulic Joints, Melee Amp III, bayonet or stunner)

So now that 375 gets turned into... 2430 damage. Which can be fired off in rapid succession and affects a 5 meter radius.  I am not sure exactly how long the animation is, but you're getting a handful of melees off in 3 seconds (in addition to the proximity mine's damage.  Which, I might add, gets a 30% boost from melee synergy.

Enough to melt a Prime's shield, I can tell you that.

[molecularman]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Also let's look at Geth Melee.

Base damage: 375. Doesn't sound like much right? But wait!
Fitness bonuses: +135% melee damage.
Cloak bonuses: +140% melee damage.
Hunter Mode: +25% melee damage.
Proximity Mine: 1.2x multiplier and of course its own not inconsiderable damage.
Gear: +140% melee damage (Hydraulic Joints, Melee Amp III, bayonet or stunner)

So now that 375 gets turned into... 2430 damage. Which can be fired off in rapid succession and affects a 5 meter radius.

I think you get that cloak-boosted melee 3 times per cycle. That's a bit more than nova does...

Also, 5 total melees per cloak cooldown, I think

Modifié par molecularman, 09 juin 2012 - 02:02 .

[GodlessPaladin]

Likewise, the Drell Adept also makes nova damage look like nothing. Now, I don't actually know how much damage Biotic Explosions are doing, but this should give you a decent idea of the damage we're talking about.

www.youtube.com/watch  Nowadays blowing up a wave 9 Gold Reapers spawn point with 2 banshees doesn't even use up all of his grenades.  I can just do it over and over.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 09 juin 2012 - 02:08 .

[R0Gun13]

Nitrocuban wrote...

First fix permastuntodeath vs Geth please

this ^ 
The Kroguard is not stunned by rocket troopers or hunters so why should the other Krogans be? And its not because of biotic shield as I dont get stun locked when I forget to turn it on.

Krogans should be able to handle staggers better than other characters, not worse! 

Make biotic shield on the Kroguard have a different cooldown from charge and fix the broken rage.

Two health blocks for Krogans therefore getting a partial regeneration, or some sort of regeneration in rage mode, does not need to be as powerful as Vorchas.

[molecularman]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Likewise, the Drell Adept also makes nova damage look like nothing. Now, I don't actually know how much damage Biotic Explosions are doing, but this should give you a decent idea of the damage we're talking about.

www.youtube.com/watch  Yeah, that was 2 banshees and the rest of a crowded wave 9 spawn, and nowadays that doesn't even use up all of his grenades.

Full level warp+throw combo is ~3000 so 1 cluster + reave should be 1500.

[Lexa_D]

Guys, never argue with religious people. They just know that the holy Novaguard descends upon thine enemies with full wrath of Heavens.

[GodlessPaladin]

molecularman wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Likewise, the Drell Adept also makes nova damage look like nothing. Now, I don't actually know how much damage Biotic Explosions are doing, but this should give you a decent idea of the damage we're talking about.

www.youtube.com/watch  Yeah, that was 2 banshees and the rest of a crowded wave 9 spawn, and nowadays that doesn't even use up all of his grenades.

Full level warp+throw combo is ~3000 so 1 cluster + reave should be 1500.

Source?

[molecularman]

Lexa_D wrote...

Guys, never argue with religious people. They just know that the holy Novaguard descends upon thine enemies with full wrath of Heavens.

But he does!



@GP: Source is using warp + throw on various enemies. Brutes, for instance are left with 2 health bar on gold after 2 combos which means about 3000 damage per combo when we take away that 300 damage warp does

Now I know that ain't 100% accurate but that's the best we can get.

Modifié par molecularman, 09 juin 2012 - 02:12 .

[GodlessPaladin]

molecularman wrote...

Lexa_D wrote...

Guys, never argue with religious people. They just know that the holy Novaguard descends upon thine enemies with full wrath of Heavens.

But he does!

The problem is just that the full wrath of the heavens could use a buff if it wants to compete with the MACHINES. 

[SinerAthin]

The Krogan could do with an instakill immunity (being THE tank class, biggest and most cumbersome unit in the game).


It's just a shame to see a Sentinel, specced full health and fitness, get taken down just as easily as a squishy little Salarian without a single point in fitness...

[Biotic_Warlock]

KROGAN ARE ALREADY VIABLE.

I scored second place on FBJ-Gold-Reaper with krogan sentinel...
The two double ammo boxes help a lot.

edit:
Krogan sentinel build:
6,6,6,5,3

Modifié par Biotic_Warlock, 09 juin 2012 - 02:18 .

[molecularman]

molecularman wrote...

@GP: Source is using warp + throw on various enemies. Brutes, for instance are left with 2 health bar on gold after 2 combos which means about 3000 damage per combo when we take away that 300 damage warp does

Now I know that ain't 100% accurate but that's the best we can get.

Not quite sure how warp's armor weakening affects the results, though

[GodlessPaladin]

Now let's see how much damage Nova does.

Base damage: 350.

Bonuses: 30% (rank 3) + 40% (rank 4) + 100% (rank 6 vs armor, shields, barriers only) + 30% (power amp III) + 12% (Mental Focuser V) + 35% (Alliance Training all power damage) + 25% (Power damage bonus from Biotic Charge =

1302 damage without half blast.  1162 damage with half blast.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 09 juin 2012 - 02:24 .

[R0Gun13]

SinerAthin wrote...

The Krogan could do with an instakill immunity (being THE tank class, biggest and most cumbersome unit in the game).


It's just a shame to see a Sentinel, specced full health and fitness, get taken down just as easily as a squishy little Salarian without a single point in fitness...

Instakill immunity would be too much I think. Although that poxy phantom sword toothpick instantly killing a Krogan is kind of bs

Modifié par R0Gun13, 09 juin 2012 - 02:23 .

[Lexa_D]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

molecularman wrote...

Lexa_D wrote...

Guys, never argue with religious people. They just know that the holy Novaguard descends upon thine enemies with full wrath of Heavens.

But he does!

The problem is just that the full wrath of the heavens could use a buff if it wants to compete with the MACHINES. 

Burn the heretic, I say!

[GodlessPaladin]

Lexa_D wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

molecularman wrote...

Lexa_D wrote...

Guys, never argue with religious people. They just know that the holy Novaguard descends upon thine enemies with full wrath of Heavens.

But he does!

The problem is just that the full wrath of the heavens could use a buff if it wants to compete with the MACHINES. 

Burn the heretic, I say!

Yeah... I get that a lot... and often they aren't even joking. 

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 09 juin 2012 - 02:41 .

[molecularman]

I hope Eric of Fagnan reads this, maybe he'd even give little buffs here and there?

Modifié par molecularman, 09 juin 2012 - 02:52 .