131 réponses à ce sujet

[Volus Warlord]

DarkDragon777 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Confess-A-Bear wrote...

SUPER LIBERAL HYSTERIA POWERS ACTIVATE FORM OF A HIPSTER! SHAPE OF A MONKEY SUIT!


THINK OF THE CHILDREN YOU VILE SAVAGE!!!

You do know that's a politically right talking point not a left one, right?

It could be either left or right. Both sides do it.

What about center?

[RedArmyShogun]

What Dark said, its both. In my region far more often from the left, so I run with that?

If its a problem I can bring back my U Mad? link.

[Volus Warlord]

Imperial Sentinel Arian wrote...

android654 wrote...

It's censored because this place is full of whiny little b*tches who love to cry when someone says Tali's designed for star trek nerds who are a bad day away from kidnapping women in their white windowless van or that Leliana is the stereotype for American christian/catholic/republican girls. F*ckers on the internet like to cry and can't take a joke.

Confess-A-Bear wrote...

SUPER LIBERAL HYSTERIA POWERS ACTIVATE FORM OF A HIPSTER! SHAPE OF A MONKEY SUIT!


THINK OF THE CHILDREN YOU VILE SAVAGE!!!

You do know that's a politically right talking point not a left one, right?

We are the Middle. Some of us are harsh, some are moderate.

Being a moderate just ensures you never get what you want. 

[android654]

DarkDragon777 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Confess-A-Bear wrote...

SUPER LIBERAL HYSTERIA POWERS ACTIVATE FORM OF A HIPSTER! SHAPE OF A MONKEY SUIT!


THINK OF THE CHILDREN YOU VILE SAVAGE!!!

You do know that's a politically right talking point not a left one, right?

It could be either left or right. Both sides do it.

According to the left/right political paradigm, censorship is a conservative ideal, not a liberal one.

[DarkDragon777]

android654 wrote...

DarkDragon777 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Confess-A-Bear wrote...

SUPER LIBERAL HYSTERIA POWERS ACTIVATE FORM OF A HIPSTER! SHAPE OF A MONKEY SUIT!


THINK OF THE CHILDREN YOU VILE SAVAGE!!!

You do know that's a politically right talking point not a left one, right?

It could be either left or right. Both sides do it.

According to the left/right political paradigm, censorship is a conservative ideal, not a liberal one.

So? That has nothing to do with what's practiced in reality.

[android654]

DarkDragon777 wrote...

android654 wrote...

DarkDragon777 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Confess-A-Bear wrote...

SUPER LIBERAL HYSTERIA POWERS ACTIVATE FORM OF A HIPSTER! SHAPE OF A MONKEY SUIT!


THINK OF THE CHILDREN YOU VILE SAVAGE!!!

You do know that's a politically right talking point not a left one, right?

It could be either left or right. Both sides do it.

According to the left/right political paradigm, censorship is a conservative ideal, not a liberal one.

So? That has nothing to do with what's practiced in reality.

It matters because if you took a basic course in political science, you'd know that censorship is a conservative idea and not a liberal one.

[DarkDragon777]

android654 wrote...



It matters because if you took a basic course in political science, you'd know that censorship is a conservative idea and not a liberal one.

That must explain why the left is often eager to censor anything that disagrees with their view point, as does the right, but that's not what we're discussing.

Also, what greengoron said is true.

[android654]

greengoron89 wrote...

android654 wrote...

DarkDragon777 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Confess-A-Bear wrote...

SUPER LIBERAL HYSTERIA POWERS ACTIVATE FORM OF A HIPSTER! SHAPE OF A MONKEY SUIT!


THINK OF THE CHILDREN YOU VILE SAVAGE!!!

You do know that's a politically right talking point not a left one, right?

It could be either left or right. Both sides do it.

According to the left/right political paradigm, censorship is a conservative ideal, not a liberal one.

That's not entirely true - censorship is every bit a liberal ideal as it is a conservative one. The difference lies in what it is the two sides want censored - the left is more obsessed with censoring "hate speech" among other things, and the right is more obsessed with censoring "indecency."

You're confisuing liberal and conservative people with liberal and conservative ideals as listed in the left/right paradigm. People can adopt any position from either end, but censorship is a "right" concept while social liberalism is a "left" concept.

[Blacklash93]

Confess-A-Bear wrote...

What Dark said, its both. In my region far more often from the left, so I run with that?

This is censorship of explicit language, though. I see it far more in conservative stances.

We are the Middle. Some of us are harsh, some are moderate.

Are you saying political right here is the middle ground? If so, perhaps you must not know how the stances actually conflict.

Conservatism: Preserving the status quo to protect long-held values and policies.
Liberalism: Changing the status quo to expand and protect personal freedoms and reform policies.

Censoring explicit language and encouraging people to avoid it is very old, very traditional approach to the subject. Therefore it is a politically right approach.

Also you do realize calling something the middle ground, then saying you can be extreme or moderate within it is a contradiction, right?

Modifié par Blacklash93, 12 juin 2012 - 04:22 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Have fun telling libertarians that they're actually lefties. Lol.

It's always why a political spectrum that functions as a straight line (left -> centre -> right) irritates the hell out of me. It's too abstract for something that simple.

Modifié par CrustyBot, 12 juin 2012 - 02:43 .

[RedArmyShogun]

CrustyBot wrote...

Have fun telling libertarians that they're actually lefties. Lol.

It's always why a political spectrum that functions as a straight line (left -> centre -> right) irritates the hell out of me. It's too abstract for something that simple.

Or communists that they are right wing. lulz.

[android654]

CrustyBot wrote...

Have fun telling libertarians that they're actually lefties. Lol.

It's always why a political spectrum that functions as a straight line irritates the hell out of me.

When it comes to social policy, the Libertarian platform is "left/center left."

greengoron89 wrote...

android654 wrote...

You're confisuing liberal and conservative people with liberal and conservative ideals as listed in the left/right paradigm. People can adopt any position from either end, but censorship is a "right" concept while social liberalism is a "left" concept.

Let's not get too technical, here - we all know that what is taught and what is practiced are seldom one in the same, especially when it comes to political ideologies. I prefer talking about how things are conducted outside of the classroom, as that's where these things really count.

Whenever you hear it discussed by people in offices or by analysts, these are the terms they use. No one person is going to adhere to one end of the political spectrum from the answers to everything. You'll be liberal about some sh*t and conservative about other sh*t. I'm not denying that. What I am saying is that the basic idea of censorship is not liberal by any stretch of the imagination.

[Eurypterid]

Mesina2 wrote...

^What's the point of censoring it?


No political topics are allowed anyway.

Exaclty, so it's only used as an insult.

[DarkDragon777]

CrustyBot wrote...

Have fun telling libertarians that they're actually lefties. Lol.

It's always why a political spectrum that functions as a straight line (left -> centre -> right) irritates the hell out of me. It's too abstract for something that simple.

A libertarian can be technically either right or left leaning.

[DarkDragon777]

Blacklash93 wrote...

We are the Middle. Some of us are harsh, some are moderate.

Are you saying political right here is the middle ground? If so, perhaps you must not know how the stances actually conflict.

Conservatism: Preserving the status quo to protect long-held values and policies.
Liberalism: Changing the status quo to expand and protect personal freedoms and reform policies.

Censoring explicit language and encouraging people to avoid it is very old, very traditional approach to the subject. Therefore it is a politically right approach.

Also you do realize calling something the middle ground, then saying you can be extreme or moderate within it is a contradiction, right?

Yes, it is possible to be in a more extreme side of the center.

[android654]

^^The "center" can not be extreme. It contradicts the very idea of the "center." You can be extremely liberal or extremely conservative, but in the center shows you do not hold political ideals as strongly as those who devote themselves to either extreme of the spectrum.

[android654]

greengoron89 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Whenever you hear it discussed by people in offices or by analysts, these are the terms they use. No one person is going to adhere to one end of the political spectrum from the answers to everything. You'll be liberal about some sh*t and conservative about other sh*t. I'm not denying that. What I am saying is that the basic idea of censorship is not liberal by any stretch of the imagination.

LOL. How many people do you think are gonna know that and make that distinction? If you walked up to a self-proclaimed "liberal" and told them that the censorship of "hate speech" is actually rooted in conservatism, how receptive do you think they'd be to that?

The political spectrum may not be taught as strictly polarizing, but it is still often practiced as such by the average Joe and (especially) the media.

Hey, I never claimed the average "politically engaged" American was well educated. However, if we're going to discuss it, it's best we discuss it in a way that shows we know what we're talking about. Yes, hate speech is disgusting and racially charged hate speech is usually geared towards people like me, no matter what group it comes from, but being in a "Center Left" country means they should have the right to voice their opinions in a manner that does not inhibit that right towards others. Controlling speech is a concept as old as speech itself. We've seen queens and kings alike use it in the past, and you can not argue that a monarchy is anything but "right."

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

android654 wrote...

CrustyBot wrote...

Have fun telling libertarians that they're actually lefties. Lol.

It's always why a political spectrum that functions as a straight line irritates the hell out of me.

When it comes to social policy, the Libertarian platform is "left/center left."

But the Libertarian philosophy amongst both social and fiscal issues is consistent (minimisation of government, promotion of individual liberty, etc). Why then is the Libertarian social platform left, but their economic one right?

If we get down to it, the notion of censorship is inherently an authoritarian concept, not a conservative one, though it is one used by conservatives quite a bit.

A conservative viewpoint is one that seeks to maintain the status quo and traditional ideals, but censorship could easily be used as a means of breaking the status quo and pushing forward progressive policy. Like if certain works were banned if they were racist in nature. I think Tin Tin comics had this problem once.

Funny aside, Socialism is almost always Authoritarian (if only temporarily) - someone's gotta redistribute that wealth during the initial transition, whereas Communism (as an idea) is not.

So in summary, the left/right paradigm ****s me to no end. American political commentators who rely on it exclusively to push their agenda make me gag.

Modifié par CrustyBot, 12 juin 2012 - 03:08 .

[Blacklash93]

DarkDragon777 wrote...

Yes, it is possible to be in a more extreme side of the center.

Taking a "middle ground" or "center" stance is inherently not extreme. It compromises two extremes.

Theoretically a moderate can be ruthless is pushing ideals, though I've never seen it. But that is pushing for implementation of the stance and not the stance itself.

[RedArmyShogun]

Not so, you have groups like Social Conservitives, to the far left on economics, and the far right on social issues.

Or for Example Facism, seems to adopt heavily from the left while being of the far right, and communism from the far right, dispite being far left.

You have to devide social and economic issues. As while someone who may not want state control may not care about homosexuality. And someone who wants state control over the economic system, may be a staunch traditionalist.

In fact I find the polictical compass site gets it right the best.

http://politicalcompass.org/

You have Economics on the left and Right, then you have Authoritarian and Libitarian top to bottom.

You can't really use the US System of left vs Right. As frankly its stupid.

A Communist has as much in common with a say, pacifist hippy, as a Snake has with a Rat. Both are left wing on the US scale, both would stomp/stand against the other.

Modifié par Confess-A-Bear, 12 juin 2012 - 03:08 .

[android654]

^^That's because the basic tenants of Communism have never been practiced. It's impossible to because it requires those in power to have no personal ambitions and to have everything that they do be solely for the benefit of the masses at the cost of inconveniencing themselves. It'll never happen.

CrustyBot wrote...

android654 wrote...

CrustyBot wrote...

Have fun telling libertarians that they're actually lefties. Lol.

It's always why a political spectrum that functions as a straight line irritates the hell out of me.

When it comes to social policy, the Libertarian platform is "left/center left."

But the Libertarian philosophy amongst both social and fiscal issues is consistent (minimisation of government, promotion of individual liberty, etc). Why then is the Libertarian social platform left, but their economic one right?

If we get down to it, the notion of censorship is inherently an authoritarian concept, not a conservative one, though it is one used by conservatives quite a bit.

A conservative viewpoint is one that seeks to maintain the status quo and traditional ideals, but censorship could easily be used as a means of breaking the status quo and pushing forward progressive policy. Like if certain works were banned if they were racist in nature. I think Tin Tin comics had this problem once.

Funny aside, Socialism is almost always Authoritarian (if only temporarily) - someone's gotta redistribute that wealth during the initial transition, whereas Communism (as an idea) is not.

So in summary, the left/right paradigm ****s me to no end. American political commentators who rely on it exclusively to push their agenda make me gag.

That's the entire idea. Libertarianism is supposed to be the "traditional" American political platform. That means that we should be socially liberal at all times since it's a part of the core concept the country was founded on. The economic part is simply because it seems to be the best way to eradicate debt and make America an economic super-power. That's all it boils down to.

Modifié par android654, 12 juin 2012 - 03:14 .