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[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Don't recall that franchise needing redemption or saving, but sure.

It does. It has been wrecked.
The only difference between you and people who are upset is that you accept the wreckage.

Different teams though, entirely different. So one shouldn't have much influence on the other.

Gaider seems to have caught on, what with his "the great thing about making your own universe is you can destroy it utterly" line.

Wat...

He said that? 

Wat.

I just...

I'm done. BW needs to go back to making stand alone games. This sequel thing was a bad idea from the start and this just makes it worse.

Sarcasm. David Gaider loves to snark. Since when is that news?

[The Angry One]

Persephone wrote...

I've been a ME fangirl since the first one came out. I did several completist runs of both games to have several "perfect saves", even replaying 1's idiotic DLC. I care a great deal. I don't care for overblown melodrama.

Who are you to say what's overblown for others?
Again, I have very narrow options when it comes to games I enjoy. BioWare presented one of those options, now unless things are truly fixed with the EC they no longer will.

Why is that overblown? Why can't I be upset that one of the few developers I had trust in failed me so badly?

Also I'd still like to know why you think Mac Walters, who did not create Mass Effect, has the right to destroy the series and go against the narrative and world contributed to by an entire writing team?

[loungeshep]

clarkusdarkus wrote...

loungeshep wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Sublyminal wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Shadrach 88 wrote...

Persephone wrote...

*Gags*

The "Pick a color" nonsense again? Yeah, 'cause the only difference between those rather extreme choices are colors. Killing is the same as merging DNAs. And ooh, domination is totally the same as killing too.

Yeah, ever so WITTY.

You're missing the point. The issue isn't the endings' implications, its the fact the represenation of three radically different concepts is almost identical in each ending, save the colours. It's lazy, especially considering the greatly differentiated endings that were promised in the pre-release marketing.

Same as in ME1 and 2 with Red and Blue. Didn't care then, don't care now.

Oh this explains a lot, cod kiddy that invested the bare minimal into all 3 games. Explains why you like ME3 so much.

COD? Never played that.

Where do you get that from again? I am puzzled. I am invested enough in this series to write fanfic among other things. Just fyi, dearie.

This almost 32 year old "kiddie" is amused by your assumptions and...well...sorry to say but....what's the deal with dissing COD players? It's not my game at all, but geez. The arrogance sure is telling.

I love ME3 because it moved me. Because I enjoyed the game. Yeah, no, scratch that...it was COD that made me do it! A game I have never even played.

COD is gamer slang, it's like calling some a **** when they've never ****d.  You could've invested years into Mass Effect, and like the ending, and you're a COD kiddie. It's like, you could be a virgin, get married a virgin, and someone will still say you're a ****.


It's really, really stupid.

Don't worry you're not the only one who was moved by 3, and loved the whole trilogy nor are you the only one who didn't play COD. 

Referencing COD in gaming is like those that reference the bieber in youtube vids. 

ew, the bieber.

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...
Sarcasm. David Gaider loves to snark. Since when is that news?

You mind giving me the full context so I can decide if it's fully snark or not? 

And all snark isn't overblown lies. You can be sarcastic while telling the truth.

[Cecilia L]

*reads thread, considers freaking out, decides not to*

*shrugs*
Meh, did that yesterday.

[loungeshep]

The Angry One wrote...

Persephone wrote...

I've been a ME fangirl since the first one came out. I did several completist runs of both games to have several "perfect saves", even replaying 1's idiotic DLC. I care a great deal. I don't care for overblown melodrama.

Who are you to say what's overblown for others?
Again, I have very narrow options when it comes to games I enjoy. BioWare presented one of those options, now unless things are truly fixed with the EC they no longer will.

Why is that overblown? Why can't I be upset that one of the few developers I had trust in failed me so badly?

Also I'd still like to know why you think Mac Walters, who did not create Mass Effect, has the right to destroy the series and go against the narrative and world contributed to by an entire writing team?

It could be worse. YOu could be a Metroid geek who hated Other M.

[The Angry One]

Persephone wrote...


I "accept the wreckage". WOW. And I thought you couldn't get more condescending.

So, you don't? You've just gone on and on about how it's their universe, they can do what they like and you won't get upset over it. I take that to mean you accept whatever they do.

As for Gaider's line, what was it you said about sarcasm? Ah, only fans may use it, I see.

That was a joke.

[comrade gando]

I dont like that word right now, "justify". How in the world are they going to JUSTIFY that fubar ending?? If this was a grimdark setting then sure I can see something like that happening, but this is mass effect everything is explained either in the codex or through in game scenes. the last 20 minutes...NOTHING is explained, insane **** just happens and shepard's like hurr durrr okey seems legit. Something's amiss here.

[Persephone]

Aeowyn wrote...

Hey Perse, I thought you gave up on the BSN months ago and called all of us who hate the game/endings "whiny self-entitled fanaticals" just because some people didn't agree with you. What are you still doin here? Are you going to make a new blog post after this argument where you cry some more because once again you could not change people's opinions? How about accepting the fact that some people despise ME3, some people despise the endings.

All of whom? Fanaticals? There are fanatics that go too far.. There are legit concerns with the endings and several folks have expressed them.

[The Angry One]

loungeshep wrote...

It could be worse. YOu could be a Metroid geek who hated Other M.

I am. A thousand poxes on Sakamoto for spitting on Gunpei Yokoi's legacy! A THOUSAND POXES!

[Village_Idiot]

loungeshep wrote...

When people who despise ME3 accept that some of us liked ME3, then we'll accept that people despise it.

It's a give and take.  I'm fine with people not liking 3, or just 3's ending, and I"m fine with people liking it all.

This. It's also the reason I never expected the ending to be changed- regardless of whether people who "like" the ending are a minority or not, to suddenly tell them the ending is invalid would be as insulting as how people how didn't like the ending felt they were treated.

The "clarification and closure" might feel bitter, but it's a compromise. The only realistic alternative is no EC, and given the furore that's no option at all.

Modifié par Shadrach 88, 12 juin 2012 - 06:48 .

[Vox Draco]

Persephone wrote...

Vox Draco wrote...

Persephone wrote...
If you dislike what they did with their OWN universe, sure, tell them that. I fail to see what constant vitriol will achieve though. *Shrugs*

Maybe it might at least save/redeem the Dragon Age universe...I prefer fantasy over scifi anyway...and I don't want to see the same lazy endings in DA3...

Don't recall that franchise needing redemption or saving, but sure.

Different teams though, entirely different. So one shouldn't have much influence on the other.

Well, DA2 could be way better in many ways, and...even though iits seperate teams I think this whole controversy won't go unnoticed *cough* and how so? I think it will heavily incluence many decisions the developers not only of this franchise/company will make...

[Rafficus III]

On a positive note, I did thoroughly enjoy her work with Ash; a character who was my favorite in all of the trilogy. Hopefully the EC turns out well and isn't too basic, I'd like to have some sweet moments so it's not all bitter.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Okay, I'm looking at our posts. I'm seeing the rage focused at BioWare. I'm seeing very little focused at those in my signature.

In all honesty, and I'll put on my flame suit here, but I rather have paid money for a LOTSB quality add on that completely replaced the ending sequence from the Battle of London onward. They could still have used some sections like the final conversation with TIM and even brought Sheen back in for another bit session (psst.... they can do that at his home these days). But everyone wanted it free so I'll say this: you get what you pay for. If they didn't have the MP we wouldn't have gotten the EC.

My rage is at Walters and Hudson for ruining the series. So okay, they can keep the endings, but they're going to have to retcon the hell out of the results of the endings if they want to save the franchise -- I'm talking about any future games with Mass Effect like an ME4 or even a ME MMO because the way it is now? I'm not buying.

At the moment we're looking at ME4: Fallout -- set 400 yrs after ME3. our wanderer of the wasteland of earth sets out on his/her journey to carry a message from Reno to San Francisco along the old Donner trail and discovers a world that is now hostile and filled with never seen before dangers. (would they have horses?)

[The Angry One]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

My rage is at Walters and Hudson for ruining the series. So okay, they can keep the endings, but they're going to have to retcon the hell out of the results of the endings if they want to save the franchise -- I'm talking about any future games with Mass Effect like an ME4 or even a ME MMO because the way it is now? I'm not buying.

That's where my ire is, and my biggest fear is that the EC is simply a giant, expensive and time consuming attempt to bolster their egos, because they refuse to admit they were wrong.

[loungeshep]

The Angry One wrote...

loungeshep wrote...

It could be worse. YOu could be a Metroid geek who hated Other M.

I am. A thousand poxes on Sakamoto for spitting on Gunpei Yokoi's legacy! A THOUSAND POXES!

It could've been better and used less cutscenes. I wanted to like it, but after beating it had no desire to play it again.

Modifié par loungeshep, 12 juin 2012 - 06:52 .

[CrutchCricket]

Mylia Stenetch wrote...
The point is simple, there is pressure/heat on Bioware that we do not see. Since ya know they need to do this to help solify certain futures they will have which Taboo has repeated many times over the past while. 

None of this disproves my point. There may have been heat from investors because this situation was getting out into the general media and we couldn't just be dismissed as nerds whining on the internet. The EC announcement alone defused that because it stopped us in our tracks and divided our opposition. Now all they have to do is wait for what little interest remains to die down and release whatever steaming pile they want. At that point it won't matter if it's more ****. They've already won.

[The Angry One]

loungeshep wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

loungeshep wrote...

It could be worse. YOu could be a Metroid geek who hated Other M.

I am. A thousand poxes on Sakamoto for spitting on Gunpei Yokoi's legacy! A THOUSAND POXES!

It could've been better and used less cutscenes.

I don't care about that so much as I care about Sakamoto turning Samus from a space hero doing her job to a battered housewife who doesn't have the cognitive ability to activate her heat resistant suit IN FREAKING LAVA without a man telling her to.
The biggest insult is Sakamoto claiming "this was always our vision for Samus' character". Yeah, right.

As an aside Adam Malkovich is one of the top 5 characters in all fiction I'd throw out of an airlock.

Modifié par The Angry One, 12 juin 2012 - 06:54 .

[Iakus]

hornedfrog87 wrote...

On a positive note, I did thoroughly enjoy her work with Ash; a character who was my favorite in all of the trilogy. Hopefully the EC turns out well and isn't too basic, I'd like to have some sweet moments so it's not all bitter.

This is true.  Ash has always been my favorite character in the series.  I really hope her work on EC allows for Ash and my Shepard to "get it done and go home"

But the statement made reopened an old wound that hasn't healed yet for a lot of folks

[Persephone]

The Angry One wrote...

Persephone wrote...

I've been a ME fangirl since the first one came out. I did several completist runs of both games to have several "perfect saves", even replaying 1's idiotic DLC. I care a great deal. I don't care for overblown melodrama.

Who are you to say what's overblown for others?
Again, I have very narrow options when it comes to games I enjoy. BioWare presented one of those options, now unless things are truly fixed with the EC they no longer will.

Why is that overblown? Why can't I be upset that one of the few developers I had trust in failed me so badly?

Also I'd still like to know why you think Mac Walters, who did not create Mass Effect, has the right to destroy the series and go against the narrative and world contributed to by an entire writing team?

You can be upset all you like.

I would still suggest to wait and see what the EC might do.

If it does nothing but making it worse for you, then you have every right to say so. Not contesting that whatsoever.

The whole team created ME. IF Walters truly wrote the endings alone and EVERYBODY else protested but got shut down (Proof, please), that sucks. It can't be changed now though. The EC stands a chance to remedy some of it. Once it's here, I'll be better informed on their intentions and if I am disappointed, I'll say so. I don't even like the endings all that much myself. They absolutely need work. If the EC can do that, good. If not, damn. I simply don't know yet, as the EC doesn't even have a release date yet.

Believe me, I do understand your frustration and the heartbreak you feel. (Not sarcasm) It sucks and I wish someone as invested in this series as you could have enjoyed it more. And maybe things will improve. I sure hope so.

[Ryzaki]

LOTSB quality? With tons of autodialogue and two dialogue choices? Yeah no. I see more of that in ME3 and I'll toss a chair.

I want a good ending, I want choice, I want actual conversations that don't funnel into paragon/renegade. I want to be able to play the Shep I played in ME1 and ME2 and not BW's canon Shep from ME3.

...Sadly I'll not get what I want. But I can dream.

[Mylia Stenetch]

Shadrach 88 wrote...
This. It's also the reason I never expected the ending to be changed- regardless of whether people who "like" the ending are a minority or not, to suddenly tell them the ending is invalid would be as insulting as how people how didn't like the ending felt they were treated.

The "clarification and closure" might feel bitter, but it's a compromise. The only realistic alternative is no EC, and given the furore that's no option at all.

Yeah I that is what I got out of this too, and informed people I know who played the game. It could do a save face and make the game bearable for people, or it could just dump more crap on people. As people have said when trying to repair bridges do not burn others. So Bioware would not do that since they are in damage control alienating more is never a good idea, this is impacted if it is intentional.

They decided the best route to take is EC with changes, clarification, and expansion of the ending without routing the entire thing. It is the best we could get in a ****storm that the ending has been. Also we do not know the politics that are in Bioware, or EA and how it affects the game. Since there is one thing working for a large company politics affect every step one makes.

[The Angry One]

Persephone wrote...

You can be upset all you like.

I would still suggest to wait and see what the EC might do.

If it does nothing but making it worse for you, then you have every right to say so. Not contesting that whatsoever.

The whole team created ME. IF Walters truly wrote the endings alone and EVERYBODY else protested but got shut down (Proof, please), that sucks. It can't be changed now though. The EC stands a chance to remedy some of it. Once it's here, I'll be better informed on their intentions and if I am disappointed, I'll say so. I don't even like the endings all that much myself. They absolutely need work. If the EC can do that, good. If not, damn. I simply don't know yet, as the EC doesn't even have a release date yet.

Believe me, I do understand your frustration and the heartbreak you feel. (Not sarcasm) It sucks and I wish someone as invested in this series as you could have enjoyed it more. And maybe things will improve. I sure hope so.

Given the notes and general attitude shown in the Final Hours app and such, along with the sheer inconsistency of the themes and tones of Rannoch/Tuchanka and the ending, I'm sure Walters did it alone, with approval/input from Hudson.
Were there protests? I can't say. 

I snark about the EC because I'm cynical, and it's my way of coping. Of course I want it to be something great, and I'm sticking around there for the (in my view) 1% chance it may be. I don't want BioWare or ME3 to fail. I just fear that they will.