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Man plays same Civilization II game over ten-year period, world disintegrates into 'Nightmare Of Suffering'


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#1
TheBlackBaron

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The original post on Reddit: http://www.reddit.co...ivilization_ii/

HuffPo article with some screens. 
http://www.huffingto...n_1589153.html 

I'd paste choice bits from the post, but the entire thing is just so incredibly grimdark that I have to post it all.

I've been playing the same game of Civ II for 10 years. Though long outdated, I grew fascinated with this particular game because by the time Civ III was released, I was already well into the distant future. I then thought that it might be interesting to see just how far into the future I could get and see what the ramifications would be. Naturally I play other games and have a life, but I often return to this game when I'm not doing anything and carry on. The results are as follows.

- The world is a hellish nightmare of suffering and devastation.

- There are 3 remaining super nations in the year 3991 A.D, each competing for the scant resources left on the planet after dozens of nuclear wars have rendered vast swaths of the world uninhabitable wastelands.

- The ice caps have melted over 20 times (somehow) due primarily to the many nuclear wars. As a result, every inch of land in the world that isn't a mountain is inundated swamp land, useless to farming. Most of which is irradiated anyway.-As a result, big cities are a thing of the distant past. Roughly 90% of the worlds population (at it's peak 2000 years ago) has died either from nuclear annihilation or famine caused by the global warming that has left absolutely zero arable land to farm. Engineers (late game worker units) are always busy continuously building roads so that new armies can reach the front lines. Roads that are destroyed the very next turn when the enemy goes. So there isn't any time to clear swamps or clean up the nuclear fallout.

- Only 3 super massive nations are left. The Celts (me), The Vikings, And the Americans. Between the three of us, we have conquered all the other nations that have ever existed and assimilated them into our respective empires.

- You've heard of the 100 year war? Try the 1700 year war. The three remaining nations have been locked in an eternal death struggle for almost 2000 years. Peace seems to be impossible. Every time a cease fire is signed, the Vikings will surprise attack me or the Americans the very next turn, often with nuclear weapons. Even when the U.N forces a peace treaty. So I can only assume that peace will come only when they're wiped out. It is this that perpetuates the war ad infinitum. Have any of you old Civ II players out there ever had this problem in the post-late game?

- Because of SDI, ICBMS are usually only used against armies outside of cities. Instead, cities are constantly attacked by spies who plant nuclear devices which then detonate (something I greatly miss from later civ games). Usually the down side to this is that every nation in the world declares war on you. But this is already the case so its no longer a deterrent to anyone. My self included.

- The only governments left are two theocracies and myself, a communist state. I wanted to stay a democracy, but the Senate would always over-rule me when I wanted to declare war before the Vikings did. This would delay my attack and render my turn and often my plans useless. And of course the Vikings would then break the cease fire like clockwork the very next turn. Something I also miss in later civ games is a little internal politics. Anyway, I was forced to do away with democracy roughly a thousand years ago because it was endangering my empire. But of course the people hate me now and every few years since then, there are massive guerrilla (late game barbarians) uprisings in the heart of my empire that I have to deal with which saps resources from the war effort.

- The military stalemate is air tight. The post-late game in civ II is perfectly balanced because all remaining nations already have all the technologies so there is no advantage. And there are so many units at once on the map that you could lose 20 tank units and not have your lines dented because you have a constant stream moving to the front. This also means that cities are not only tiny towns full of starving people, but that you can never improve the city.

- My goal for the next few years is to try and end the war and thus use the engineers to clear swamps and fallout so that farming may resume. I want to rebuild the world. But I'm not sure how. If any of you old Civ II players have any advice, I'm listening. 


This is sorely tempting me to finally figure out how to get Civ II Gold running again on my 64-bit Windows machine.

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 13 juin 2012 - 08:33 .


#2
Chromie

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Saw this on RPS and I was amazed.


" The military stalemate is air tight. The post-late game in civ II is perfectly balanced because all remaining nations already have all the technologies so there is no advantage. And there are so many units at once on the map that you could lose 20 tank units and not have your lines dented because you have a constant stream moving to the front. This also means that cities are not only tiny towns full of starving people, but that you can never improve the city."

It's 1984 except much worse.

"The ice caps have melted over 20 times (somehow) due primarily to the many nuclear wars. As a result, every inch of land in the world that isn't a mountain is inundated swamp land, useless to farming. Most of which is irradiated anyway.-"

This is just fantastic and not only doesn't he have time to drain the swamps but the land itself has already gone to hell. Incredilby low supplies of food, democracy is dead and Civs are just pumping out more troops, tanks etc. so quickly that losing troops on the front lines doesn't even matter. Best of all are the espionage troops planting nuclear devices in the cities man I hope that returns in Civ V's expac.

I'm tempted to install Civ 2 and download the save (is it up yet?) and have a crack at it.


Here are images the Redditor showed btw.




Image IPB


Image IPB
Image IPB
Image IPB

Modifié par Skelter192, 13 juin 2012 - 08:38 .


#3
Esbatty

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As long as they bring me fresh oracles from around the globe, daily, to me I care not for the machinations of the empire.

#4
Inquisitor Recon

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Reminds me of one game of the "Next War" scenario for Civ IV: BTS I had. Some incredible fighting among the repeatedly nuked cities of China's coastline. Yet the numbers of troops the AI could throw at me ensured I couldn't make much progress inland.

#5
bleetman

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So what you're saying is, there's post-repeated-apocalypse Vikings with atomic weapons.

I'm ok with this.

#6
TheBlackBaron

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There's a subreddit devoted to it now. Here's the thread with the save upload.

http://www.reddit.co...swv/here_it_is/

ReconTeam wrote...

Reminds me of one game of the "Next War" scenario for Civ IV: BTS I had. Some incredible fighting among the repeatedly nuked cities of China's coastline. Yet the numbers of troops the AI could throw at me ensured I couldn't make much progress inland.

 

I remember that scenario. Funny thing is, that one was explicity based on 1984 (with the "Great South Empire" filling in all the places that are claimed to be disputed). Like Skelter said, this one basically organically grew into that same 1984-esque set up out of necessity. It's a wonderful yet terrifying thought. 

What really impresses me about this is the farthest I've ever gotten into a Civ game - any game of any entry - is the 2090's in BTS, using the mod version of Next War on the Earth 18 Civs map. Conquered the Aztecs in the Bronze Age, the Incas in the Industrial Revolution, and spent the rest of my time terraforming the Americas and winning the Space Race. After that, I launched an invasion of England in 2077, moved onto mainland Europe in the 2080's. Finally petered out when it was taking me ten minutes just to load a turn. 

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 13 juin 2012 - 09:01 .


#7
Homebound

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If theres one glimmer of hope in this awe-inspiring simulation of what may be in store for the human race, its that democracy halted the user-player's attack by 1 turn. If all 3 big nations had that, I'd argue peace may be possible not because of the government, but by the computer peoples who more or less agreed behind the player's back not to murder each other.

Wow, I just read some of the comments, it looks like Fundamentalist Dictatorship is the way to solve this mess...Isnt that the basic governing force behind the Covenant in Halo?..

#8
Kaiser Arian XVII

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I played Civ II first, but I always prefer Civ III to Civ II.

My Civ II:Test of Time works fine on 7-64bit.

#9
Cyberarmy

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bleetman wrote...

So what you're saying is, there's post-repeated-apocalypse Vikings with atomic weapons.

I'm ok with this.



The future is so "bright" :devil:

#10
RedArmyShogun

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Hellbound555 wrote...
Wow, I just read some of the comments, it looks like Fundamentalist Dictatorship is the way to solve this mess...Isnt that the basic governing force behind the Covenant in Halo?..



Yes and no. The Covenant were a religious multi ethnical Empire. Think of the Ottoman Empire.

Minus that its on the scale of thousands of worlds. Then your faith and tech is solely built on the great jounry,and it is taught the forerunners have accended, none were left behind.

Then you find a world of this new, and to you ugly race, and after bombing the crap out of them to get the forefunner artifacts, your religous advisor half mad AI.prophet goes 

YOU FOOL THEY ARE THE ARTIFACTS THEY ARE FORERUNNER! Then given its pluged into the capital city it tries to fly aways and blow it all up. Well that can't be allowed to happen, the covienant was barely united and many revolts were crushed. If it were found out the whole nation would have fallen apart. As frankly no multi ethic state has never been a tender box unless it had common cause or culture.

As to Democracy preventing war. For a time maybe.

Put as the resources run low, the food runs out, heh even the small folks fearing for safety will decide war is safer than starving. Democracies have went to war and with each other when the means proved great enough. Of course then we get into arguments on whats a democracy and etc.

Hard times nee hard meassures to solve them at times.


Though I never ran into this problem, I tend to build large numbers of infantry, and progress as fast as I can to Armored Warfare. I tend to ignore basic democracy and keep more authoritarian ruling about. I hardly even use the infantry in battle, minus to storm cities and to stomp those cities I have that dare rise up. While promoting my culture. While most AI's focus on cultural and civilization developements I go full force military, after I have conqured the main contenant I'm on I then turn toward economic developement with massive armed forces build up. Namely Bombers and any other longe range weapons to protect the coasts, tanks on the beaches. Infantry in the cities. Then when I'm satitisfied with my level of developement I put all focus on building a navy and invasion forces. Coupled with Nukes and agirculture I wait. I also bribe other factions to peace and to war against each other.

Then whenever I see a faction who is getting stomped on with lots of Armies in the open... Well Lets let the Nukes fly lulz << >> But it only works if your conniving and willing to have a weak economy thats built solely for the Armed Forces. I forget the number of protests I had over the years. When I got nukes they stoped. After I blasted what used to be one of my own cities at least.

Modifié par Confess-A-Bear, 13 juin 2012 - 01:05 .


#11
RAF1940

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Wow, that's cool.

#12
CroGamer002

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Phaedon showed me that today.


I just cracked up.




I wonder if someone will beat that.

#13
Captain Cornhole

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Watch as people enter this thread arguing for disarming nuclear weapons and preventing "climate change"

#14
Eternal Phoenix

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This is epically funny.

#15
Giggles_Manically

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Its like 40k really.

Endless war where people suffer in battle and at home.
No hope, just bloody stalemates with foes who despise each other so much that there can be no peace.

Spooky.

#16
android654

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If ever there was a simulation for reality...

#17
CrazyRah

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Oh wow that looks kind of epic and scary as heck!

#18
rwilli80

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Confess-A-Bear wrote...

As to Democracy preventing war. For a time maybe.

Put as the resources run low, the food runs out, heh even the small folks fearing for safety will decide war is safer than starving. Democracies have went to war and with each other when the means proved great enough. Of course then we get into arguments on whats a democracy and etc.

Hard times nee hard meassures to solve them at times.


Though I never ran into this problem, I tend to build large numbers of infantry, and progress as fast as I can to Armored Warfare. I tend to ignore basic democracy and keep more authoritarian ruling about. I hardly even use the infantry in battle, minus to storm cities and to stomp those cities I have that dare rise up. While promoting my culture. While most AI's focus on cultural and civilization developements I go full force military, after I have conqured the main contenant I'm on I then turn toward economic developement with massive armed forces build up. Namely Bombers and any other longe range weapons to protect the coasts, tanks on the beaches. Infantry in the cities. Then when I'm satitisfied with my level of developement I put all focus on building a navy and invasion forces. Coupled with Nukes and agirculture I wait. I also bribe other factions to peace and to war against each other.

Then whenever I see a faction who is getting stomped on with lots of Armies in the open... Well Lets let the Nukes fly lulz << >> But it only works if your conniving and willing to have a weak economy thats built solely for the Armed Forces. I forget the number of protests I had over the years. When I got nukes they stoped. After I blasted what used to be one of my own cities at least.



Sounds to me like you're trying to set yourself up as Emperor of Man on your Golden Throne :)
BTW I totally agree and support your tactics. I've never nuked my own cities, but I have sent in my armies to put down the protests.

I wonder what our tactics say about us as leaders of men.

#19
CroGamer002

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rwilli80 wrote...

I wonder what our tactics say about us as leaders of men.


Well, it says that we are bunch of aholes.

#20
naughty99

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I had an SP session of Civ IV running for about a year that had a similar scenario; however, eventually I manged to wipe out one of the remaining civs with the help of my spies and then the last one was much easier to take down.

Really can't imagine playing the same campaign for ten years though. It gets a bit boring once you reach the end of the tech tree.

#21
Guest_Para-Medic_*

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Lol okay...

#22
Addai

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bleetman wrote...

So what you're saying is, there's post-repeated-apocalypse Vikings with atomic weapons.

I'm ok with this.

Image IPB

#23
rwilli80

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Mesina2 wrote...

rwilli80 wrote...

I wonder what our tactics say about us as leaders of men.


Well, it says that we are bunch of aholes.


Megalomaniac is more like it... considering we're willing to use nuclear fire and massive military force to put down our rivals.

#24
RedArmyShogun

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Pft I do what I do for the good of the people and the revolution Comrades!

Lulz though honestly I've had several games where after I took a "managable" area I would dump all resources into going to AC. I've won mainly Technological and Military Conquests victories. Never won Via industry and Culture though.

#25
Chromie

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Confess-A-Bear wrote...

Pft I do what I do for the good of the people and the revolution Comrades!

Lulz though honestly I've had several games where after I took a "managable" area I would dump all resources into going to AC. I've won mainly Technological and Military Conquests victories. Never won Via industry and Culture though.


Culture victory blah it's all about the Space program!