173 réponses à ce sujet

[InfamousResult]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Decreasing the damage buff = what they did to Hunter Mode which led to people saying the the GE was ruined.

What happened to the GE wasn't something anybody asked for, to my knowledge- and was a side effect of them trying to nerf the GI. I don't agree with the GE getting any of the backlash when it wasn't deserved. But decreasing the damage buff on TC isn't going to affect any class or characters except Infiltrators, so that's kind of a silly point.

[tMc Tallgeese]

I know how to make it all better....


...I was born in London.

BioWare will always make changes, some good and some bad. Hopefully they never break a class. 

Modifié par tMc Tallgeese, 13 juin 2012 - 06:28 .

[Lee80]

Just a random thought here, but I think both sides of the argument have expressed their opinions for the past 2 weeks almost non-stop. At what point are we going to be able to just move on and let Bioware make up their mind on this issue? Surely there has to be something else to talk about? Sorry to interrupt the fighting...continue on if you must.

[zeal.assassin]

If the TC gets nerf most infiltrators will probably only play GI seeing as it still gets a small boost from HM.

I rarely play Infiltrator class anymore.

[ParadoxFaet]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

InfamousResult wrote...

"Balance TC" =/= "Ruin TC"

Sorry if you believe that having ridiculous damage buffs AND cloaking are absolutely necessary to the Infiltrator and that ANY reduction to damage or cooldown would absolutely ruin the class, and the game, for you. That is truly a shame.

Taking away damage buffs = ruining TC.

Balancing damage buffs =/= taking away damage buffs.

You're not really good at that reading thing, huh?

[vivanto]

InfamousResult wrote...
But decreasing the damage buff on TC isn't going to affect any class or characters except every Infiltrator, so that's kind of a silly point.

Fixed it for you. The damage bonus is substantial, but not that gamebrakingly overpowered as a straight up multiplicative bonus.

[holdenagincourt]

I don't see how reducing the multiplicative sniper rifle damage bonus in rank 6 of TC, or making it additive instead, or making any number of other small, sensible tweaks to the way TC works currently, would make infiltrators useless or make gold too tough for players. I kill stuff fine with other classes and while I love what TC adds to gameplay I wouldn't mind if it were more about tactical placement and behaviour than about cloak cycled headshots. So a duration buff in exchange for a damage nerf seems fair, to me.

This one humbly suggests that its fellow Hanar is engaging in public hysteria for no good reason.

[Biotic_Warlock]

Biotic_Warlock wrote...

Mozts wrote...

You can't preach in public Hanar, should I ask Shepard again?

+1

Just get BW to nerf the krysae again...

edit: they should actually nerf the sniper damage bonus to +30% instead of +40% (30% is still big) and buff melee bonus to +70% damage bonus.

Fixed own post
The bonus was already 50%, yet cloak already doesn't help at
all, since heavy melee forces cloak to end before the damage is done,
and standard melee does eagle all.

Or instead of a damage bonus, they should make a quicker heavy melee which doesn't end as you are attacking.

Modifié par Biotic_Warlock, 13 juin 2012 - 06:32 .

[ParadoxFaet]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

InfamousResult wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Taking away damage buffs = ruining TC.

Decreasing the damage buff =/= Taking it away =/= Ruining TC.

Decreasing the damage buff = what they did to Hunter Mode which led to people saying the the GE was ruined.

That's ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous. My GE build totally skips hunter mode, and makes me a Tank, a Medic and what the Engineer class is supposed to be: A SUPPORT class. 

And unlike some people, I don't rely on damage buffs to kill my enemies. I rely on headshots.

[InfamousResult]

vivanto wrote...

Fixed it for you. The damage bonus is substantial, but not that gamebrakingly overpowered as a straight up multiplicative bonus.

I assumed "EVERY" Infiltrator was assumed. I mean, when I say "Infiltrators", who here is going to think I just mean one or two..?

Also, the fact that you say "not THAT gamebreakingly overpowered" says enough for me.

[Feauce]

Biotic_Warlock wrote...

they should actually nerf the sniper damage bonus to +30% instead of +40% (30% is still big) and buff melee bonus to +50% damage bonus.

There's already a +50% melee damage bonus... You have to pick between that and recharge speed at Rank 5.

InfamousResult wrote...

"Balance TC" =/= "Ruin TC"

Sorry if you believe that having ridiculous damage buffs AND cloaking are absolutely necessary to the Infiltrator and that ANY reduction to damage or cooldown would absolutely ruin the class, and the game, for you. That is truly a shame.

I'm sorry if you believe we can get both of those effects at the same time. You see, if we use the damage bonus by attacking or using a power, our Cloak breaks and we become visible almost immediately. Considering that roughly half the time the invisibility effect from the Cloak doesn't work, that leaves the one-time damage bonus as our only benefit. When the Vanguard can instantly restore their barrier to full and most Sentinels can reduce all incoming damage by half, I fail to see why people are so upset over a 40-140% one-use-at-a-time damage buff...

[ParadoxFaet]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

All I'm saying is the damage buffs are the only real advantage Infiltrators have. Nerfing them to eternity would ruin the game for a lot of people. Sniper rifles have always been the Infiltrators signature gun, it makes sense that they do more damage with them. I think that the Soldier needs a buff to be comparable with the Infiltrator. They are weapon specialists after all. I wouldn't stop playing this game because I'm not skilled enough to play it, I'd stop playing out of principle. Hurting a classes signature power is hurting the class overall. Hurting the class overall is hurting the overall play style. Hurting the overall play style hampers the fun had while implementing the play style. Does that make sense?

No, it doesn't make sense, because everything you're saying is either outright untrue or an illogical opinion. 

Even if the damage bonuses were completely removed, infiltrators are the ONLY class with the capability to turn invisible. Which makes them the best at doing what the class was meant for: infiltrating. It makes them the best candidate for doing hack objectives and the best candidate for reviving downed teammates.

They'd still be one of the most useful classes in the game. Therefore, your rant is meaningless. Sorry.

[Xx_Belzak_xX]

Schneidend wrote...

Making Tactical Cloak balanced against other powers won't make it useless. It would be very easy to make TC powerful instead of overpowered.

Personally, I think it should just follow standard cooldown/weight mechanics.

This. I cannot believe there is actually someone else out there that agrees with me.

[Curzyfish]

Feauce wrote...

Biotic_Warlock wrote...

they should actually nerf the sniper damage bonus to +30% instead of +40% (30% is still big) and buff melee bonus to +50% damage bonus.

There's already a +50% melee damage bonus... You have to pick between that and recharge speed at Rank 5.

InfamousResult wrote...

"Balance TC" =/= "Ruin TC"

Sorry if you believe that having ridiculous damage buffs AND cloaking are absolutely necessary to the Infiltrator and that ANY reduction to damage or cooldown would absolutely ruin the class, and the game, for you. That is truly a shame.

I'm sorry if you believe we can get both of those effects at the same time. You see, if we use the damage bonus by attacking or using a power, our Cloak breaks and we become visible almost immediately. Considering that roughly half the time the invisibility effect from the Cloak doesn't work, that leaves the one-time damage bonus as our only benefit. When the Vanguard can instantly restore their barrier to full and most Sentinels can reduce all incoming damage by half, I fail to see why people are so upset over a 40-140% one-use-at-a-time damage buff...

"One time" since firing off a power, and emptying 3 rounds from a sniper (yes you can do this with the krysae as well) is "one time." Not to mention "one time" every 3 seconds.  I'm not saying it needs to get thrown to the floor, stomped on, then dragged through a grimey alley or two, but it currently is the most powerful ability in the game.

Becoming visible right away is also your choice, and as for cloak bugging out, that's pretty rare unless you are using charge up weapons, where it can become uncommon rather than rare.

[Mal3fact0r]

ParadoxFaet wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

All I'm saying is the damage buffs are the only real advantage Infiltrators have. Nerfing them to eternity would ruin the game for a lot of people. Sniper rifles have always been the Infiltrators signature gun, it makes sense that they do more damage with them. I think that the Soldier needs a buff to be comparable with the Infiltrator. They are weapon specialists after all. I wouldn't stop playing this game because I'm not skilled enough to play it, I'd stop playing out of principle. Hurting a classes signature power is hurting the class overall. Hurting the class overall is hurting the overall play style. Hurting the overall play style hampers the fun had while implementing the play style. Does that make sense?

No, it doesn't make sense, because everything you're saying is either outright untrue or an illogical opinion. 

Even if the damage bonuses were completely removed, infiltrators are the ONLY class with the capability to turn invisible. Which makes them the best at doing what the class was meant for: infiltrating. It makes them the best candidate for doing hack objectives and the best candidate for reviving downed teammates.

They'd still be one of the most useful classes in the game. Therefore, your rant is meaningless. Sorry.

Why should they be relegated to objective capping/team reviving when no one else is?  Everyone likes to do damage and kill things.

It's also interesting that several posters who prefer the Soldier class beleive that Soldiers should do the "best dps". My favorite class should be the best, nerf the other class(es)! lol

[InfamousResult]

Feauce wrote...

I'm sorry if you believe we can get both of those effects at the same time. You see, if we use the damage bonus by attacking or using a power, our Cloak breaks and we become visible almost immediately. Considering that roughly half the time the invisibility effect from the Cloak doesn't work, that leaves the one-time damage bonus as our only benefit. When the Vanguard can instantly restore their barrier to full and most Sentinels can reduce all incoming damage by half, I fail to see why people are so upset over a 40-140% one-use-at-a-time damage buff...

It's not about using both at the same time. It's the fact that it is being argued that having the damage buff lessened AT ALL would suddenly make the entire ability USELESS.. Which is such a ridiculous notion.

They need to rebuff cloak so that it works properly, like it used to.. And they need to reduce the damage buff that Infiltrators have. Or, at the very least, work on the Infiltrator's cooldown; they spam DPS and don't worry about weapon weight at all, which is supposed to be the Soldier's one saving grace.

Having increased defense doesn't really give you those classes an "edge" over Infiltrators or whatever you're implying when the Infils are just behind cover and blowing enemies apart before they can reach them. The game has restorative shields- defense is less important than DPS unless you're right in the middle of enemy ranks.

[vivanto]

InfamousResult wrote...

vivanto wrote...

Fixed it for you. The damage bonus is substantial, but not that gamebrakingly overpowered as a straight up multiplicative bonus.

I assumed "EVERY" Infiltrator was assumed. I mean, when I say "Infiltrators", who here is going to think I just mean one or two..?

Also, the fact that you say "not THAT gamebreakingly overpowered" says enough for me.

Then just emphasized what you've missed, if you prefer.

The damage bonus only adds base damage. You can get a lot of base damage bonus in various form in the 20-30% range. Barrel + Racial + random class bonus (Scan, HM...), + sniper amp + ammo and you're far above 100% already. Adding an extra 90% does not change it as much as multiplying by 50%, especially if you consider squad debuff powers.

That would just pigeonhole infiltrators while not changing anything in regards to what most complaints are about.

[InfamousResult]

Mal3fact0r wrote...

Why should they be relegated to objective capping/team reviving when no one else is?  Everyone likes to do damage and kill things.

Healers in MMOs and Medics in Shooters would tend to disagree with you.

Why should Infiltrators be the only ones who get a cloak power? Everyone likes to not get shot.

[zhk3r]

Maybe you'd meet something other than Infiltrators in public games if they changed something about it. That'd be nice. Not that I care either way; But how often do you see a Sentinel compared to Infiltrators?

[ryanshowseason3]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

InfamousResult wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Taking away damage buffs = ruining TC.

Decreasing the damage buff =/= Taking it away =/= Ruining TC.

Decreasing the damage buff = what they did to Hunter Mode which led to people saying the the GE was ruined.

I guess my shield recharging flamethrower decoy was ruined because I can't see as far and I don't have quite as much weapon damage as before then?

Just because people say it doesn't make it true.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

ParadoxFaet wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

All I'm saying is the damage buffs are the only real advantage Infiltrators have. Nerfing them to eternity would ruin the game for a lot of people. Sniper rifles have always been the Infiltrators signature gun, it makes sense that they do more damage with them. I think that the Soldier needs a buff to be comparable with the Infiltrator. They are weapon specialists after all. I wouldn't stop playing this game because I'm not skilled enough to play it, I'd stop playing out of principle. Hurting a classes signature power is hurting the class overall. Hurting the class overall is hurting the overall play style. Hurting the overall play style hampers the fun had while implementing the play style. Does that make sense?

No, it doesn't make sense, because everything you're saying is either outright untrue or an illogical opinion. 

Even if the damage bonuses were completely removed, infiltrators are the ONLY class with the capability to turn invisible. Which makes them the best at doing what the class was meant for: infiltrating. It makes them the best candidate for doing hack objectives and the best candidate for reviving downed teammates.

They'd still be one of the most useful classes in the game. Therefore, your rant is meaningless. Sorry.

Um, and what exactly is the point of turning invisible, besides capping the 4 module objectives and reviving team mates? That's only about 20% of what needs to be done in a round. TC is not really all that useful in the hack circle. Taking away damage buffs takes away some of the Infiltrators lethality. So, what are Infiltrators supposed to do for the other 80% of the game? Watch their Widow NOT take out a Cannibal in one shot? Yes, I know getting headshots is the solution. But I think asking me to pull off 50 headshots in one match is a bit much. I can usually get about 20. I know score doesn't matter, it's just annoying to hit an opponent with a sniper rifle and see only two bars of health dissapear.

Is this a serious question?