395 réponses à ce sujet

[BoomDynamite]

Let's get back on topic. NO FLAMING GUYS.

[Lee80]

BoomDynamite wrote...

Let's get back on topic. NO FLAMING GUYS.

Hi Boom.  I support your dedication to keep the nerf's at bay.    I signed earlier!  

[Blind2Society]

I agree with boom and this will be the last post I make towards you Godless.

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Blind2Society wrote...
Did I say that you were dilusional for your comment on the black widow?

  You said I was delusional for saying that the opinion that it was automatic was a fact, yes.

Hmmm, I don't recall ever saying that, could you point me to where I said that?

You just repeated yourself. I called you dilusional because you think your opinions were fact. Clearly the BW being automatic wasn't your opinion but a fact. I realised I was wrong and said so long before calling you dilusional so the BW thing wouldn't really apply to the dilusional comment now would it? But then again, maybe you're just putting words in my mouth so you can continue arguing?

Modifié par Blind2Society, 14 juin 2012 - 03:01 .

[GodlessPaladin]

Blind2Society wrote...
You just repeated yourself. I called you dilusional because you think your opinions were fact. Clearly the BW being automatic wasn't your opinion but a fact.  In my opinion, the  I realised I was wrong and said so long before calling you dilusional so the BW thing wouldn't really apply to the dilusional comment now would it? But then again, maybe you're just putting words in my mouth so you can continue arguing?

You want to stop arguing?

Stop misspelling delusional, it's driving me nuts.  Stop using false dilemmas (a person's opinion about the state of something can be a fact, opinions and facts are not mutually exclusive).  Stop trying to accuse me of trying to carry on an argument / only wanting to argue / whatever misguided nonsense when you're the one making long flaming posts at me for trying to inform you, and all I do is defend myself from your nonsensical flaming that you do every time I try to communicate even the simplest of ideas to you (such as that the Black Widow is an automatic weapon, and that you should not pronounce that it's not when you clearly haven't tested it).  Yes you admitted you were wrong, but then you just went on and on and on flaming me for telling you that you were wrong.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 14 juin 2012 - 03:20 .

[Schneidend]

Going to have to disagree. At the very least, Tactical Cloak needs to follow standard weight/cooldown mechanics.

Either that, or a less obscene damage boost, like +60% with the perk. How does it make any sense for Tactical Cloak to give a bigger damage boost than Adrenaline Rush?

[soldo9149]

signed

[NOO3TASTIC]

Signed. Nerfing tactical cloak will make infiltrators useless. Nerf/Fix broken sniper rifle (Krysae) instead of hammering a whole class because of a noob friendly weapon.

[rebel5555]

Blind2Society wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Also, the Black Widow IS automatic.

Automatic means the action will cycle continuously by itself until the ammo is gone if you hold the trigger. That IS NOT how the Black Widow works. I suppose if you're on console and you have one of those controllers it's automatic because the trigger is your button.

The Black Widow is semi-automatic meaning it fires with each squeeze of the trigger.

By the way signed.

Modifié par rebel5555, 14 juin 2012 - 03:45 .

[The Milky Waver]

*Le signature

--The Milky Waver

[NOO3TASTIC]

rebel5555 wrote...

Blind2Society wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Also, the Black Widow IS automatic.

Automatic means the action will cycle continuously by itself until the ammo is gone if you hold the trigger. That IS NOT how the Black Widow works. I suppose if you're on console and you have one of those controllers it's automatic because the trigger is your button.

The Black Widow is semi-automatic meaning it fires with each squeeze of the trigger.

By the way signed.

If I keep the left mouse button pressed black widow will fire three shots before reloading again. I don't have to press left mouse button three times. In that context Black Widow is automatic and Valient isn't...

[KuroFye]

http://masseffect.wi...iki/Black_Widow

[AdamWeith]

NOO3TASTIC wrote...

rebel5555 wrote...

Blind2Society wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Also, the Black Widow IS automatic.

Automatic means the action will cycle continuously by itself until the ammo is gone if you hold the trigger. That IS NOT how the Black Widow works. I suppose if you're on console and you have one of those controllers it's automatic because the trigger is your button.

The Black Widow is semi-automatic meaning it fires with each squeeze of the trigger.

By the way signed.

If I keep the left mouse button pressed black widow will fire three shots before reloading again. I don't have to press left mouse button three times. In that context Black Widow is automatic and Valient isn't...

So basically, in the "lore" the Black Widow is a semi-automatic rifle, while in game mechanics it's actually a slow-firing automatic rifle.

[Immortal Strife]

Schneidend wrote...

Going to have to disagree. At the very least, Tactical Cloak needs to follow standard weight/cooldown mechanics.

Either that, or a less obscene damage boost, like +60% with the perk. How does it make any sense for Tactical Cloak to give a bigger damage boost than Adrenaline Rush?

Why shouldn't TC have a bigger damage boost than Adrenaline Rush?

Let me guess, because Soldiers are a pure combat class while infiltrators are combat/tech classes.  That argument is a stale as me saying the infiltrator is designed to do burst damage and the soldier is designed to do sustained damage, so they should not have equal damage outputs. How about you compare all the soldier class characters (HS,KS,TS,BS,VS) to all the infiltrator class characters (HI,SI,QFI,GI,QMI) if you are going to look for balance instead of isolating one.

Modifié par Immortal Strife, 14 juin 2012 - 04:27 .

[KuroFye]

Immortal Strife wrote...

Schneidend wrote...

Going to have to disagree. At the very least, Tactical Cloak needs to follow standard weight/cooldown mechanics.

Either that, or a less obscene damage boost, like +60% with the perk. How does it make any sense for Tactical Cloak to give a bigger damage boost than Adrenaline Rush?

Why shouldn't TC have a bigger damage boost than Adrenaline Rush?

Let me guess, because Soldiers are a pure combat class while infiltrators are combat/tech classes.  That argument is a stale as me saying the infiltrator is designed to do burst damage and the soldier is designed to do sustained damage, so they should not have equal damage outputs. How about you compare the whole soldier class to the whole infiltrator class if you are going to look for balance. 

also TC just give the bonus to 1 shot 

[Schneidend]

Immortal Strife wrote...

Let me guess, because Soldiers are a pure combat class while infiltrators are combat/tech classes.  That argument is a stale as me saying the infiltrator is designed to do burst damage and the soldier is designed to do sustained damage, so they should not have equal damage outputs. How about you compare the whole soldier class to the whole infiltrator class if your going to look for balance. 

You know what they say about assumptions...

But, no. A better argument would be that Tactical Cloak has more benefits and utility than Adrenaline Rush. Tactical Cloak is safer, can come back extremely quickly regardless of weight, buffs all damage instead of just weapon damage, and can potentially apply a huge multiplicative bonus to weapon damage.

Your own argument is flawed, by the way. Infiltrators provide the better sustained DPS as well, given that Tactical Cloak's bonus will last for an entire Black Widow or Valiant clip and still cooldown nearly as fast as Adrenaline Rush with an Avenger X. Haven't tested an Infi with the Indra, but you could probably empty the Indra's clip, as well.

KuroFye wrote...

also TC just give the bonus to 1 shot 

Only if it's a one-shot weapon like the Widow or Claymore. The Black Widow and Geth Plasma Shotgun have no such weakness.

Modifié par Schneidend, 14 juin 2012 - 04:30 .

[Immortal Strife]

Schneidend wrote...

Immortal Strife wrote...

Let me guess, because Soldiers are a pure combat class while infiltrators are combat/tech classes.  That argument is a stale as me saying the infiltrator is designed to do burst damage and the soldier is designed to do sustained damage, so they should not have equal damage outputs. How about you compare the whole soldier class to the whole infiltrator class if your going to look for balance. 

You know what they say about assumptions...

But, no. A better argument would be that Tactical Cloak has more benefits and utility than Adrenaline Rush. Tactical Cloak is safer, can come back extremely quickly regardless of weight, buffs all damage instead of just weapon damage, and can potentially apply a huge multiplicative bonus to weapon damage.

Your own argument is flawed, by the way. Infiltrators provide the better sustained DPS as well, given that Tactical Cloak's bonus will last for an entire Black Widow or Valiant clip and still cooldown nearly as fast as Adrenaline Rush with an Avenger X. Haven't tested an Infi with the Indra, but you could probably empty the Indra's clip, as well.

KuroFye wrote...

also TC just give the bonus to 1 shot 

Only if it's a one-shot weapon like the Widow or Claymore. The Black Widow and Geth Plasma Shotgun have no such weakness.

Honestly if you removed all the bonus damage and all you left was tactiacl cloak's escapability, revive capability, and objective capping (1/4 random objectives), how many players would use the infiltrator class? IMO the class would immediatly go from one of the most played to the least played.

As far as your projected damage bonus of 60%, why 60%? Your suggestion still leaves the infiltrator with a higher  damage output then all but one of the soldiers. 

Actually, I don't care anymore, make all the suggestions you want. I just say I'm glad Bioware does the balancing, and I don't see a mechanical change to TC's cool-down mechanic anytime soon as not once has such a change occured on a power or gun todate.

Modifié par Immortal Strife, 14 juin 2012 - 04:50 .

[Subtle Riot]

Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd /signed.

[KuroFye]

Schneidend wrote...

Immortal Strife wrote...

Let me guess, because Soldiers are a pure combat class while infiltrators are combat/tech classes.  That argument is a stale as me saying the infiltrator is designed to do burst damage and the soldier is designed to do sustained damage, so they should not have equal damage outputs. How about you compare the whole soldier class to the whole infiltrator class if your going to look for balance. 

You know what they say about assumptions...

But, no. A better argument would be that Tactical Cloak has more benefits and utility than Adrenaline Rush. Tactical Cloak is safer, can come back extremely quickly regardless of weight, buffs all damage instead of just weapon damage, and can potentially apply a huge multiplicative bonus to weapon damage.

Your own argument is flawed, by the way. Infiltrators provide the better sustained DPS as well, given that Tactical Cloak's bonus will last for an entire Black Widow or Valiant clip and still cooldown nearly as fast as Adrenaline Rush with an Avenger X. Haven't tested an Infi with the Indra, but you could probably empty the Indra's clip, as well.

KuroFye wrote...

also TC just give the bonus to 1 shot 

Only if it's a one-shot weapon like the Widow or Claymore. The Black Widow and Geth Plasma Shotgun have no such weakness.

hahaha just tried it out with shepard and i see your point, the problem is not the bonus, the problem is WHEN the bonus applies, you should get the bonus with just 1 shot, not the entire clip, and i tried the black-widow it is automatic not semi-automatic.

Now i think the TC needs to be fixed so just 1 single shot gets the bonus xd as it should be.

edit: now that i tested it a bit, the bonus aplies by time, you get the bonus the entire time you are cloacked and a bit before it, that time before is what is wrong (also the area of the krysae, i think should be less, but not less damage)

Modifié par KuroFye, 14 juin 2012 - 04:59 .

[Mal3fact0r]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Mal3fact0r wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

BoomDynamite wrote...

The Infiltrator class has a lot of firepower, but that's it. They've got nothing else besides firepower

...What Infiltrators are you looking at?  They have some of the best all around utility in the game.

And yet hardly anyone ever suggests lessening or removing some of their utility, the vast majority of the crying and complaining is about their damage. I'd wager that most Infiltrators would be willing to give up some utility to retain their damage, it would be a more difficult task to convince the nerf callers though, I suspect.

What about the suggestion to adjust Tactical Cloak to make the rank 4 choice between utility and damage more meaningful (and make TC Evolution 1 actually worth considering), which many people voiced support for?

You loudly and categorically proclaim that nothing should be changed, without even knowing what those changes are, and then claim that it's the people asking for changes who are unwilling to be convinced to support changes.  <_<

If you disagree with some specific suggested change, you go ahead and tell that person suggesting that change that they're full of it.  You don't go and start yelling at some nebulous "them" about how all changes are bad.  That's not reasonable or civil.

Who's yelling? I've seen your proposed changes and feel they are uneccessary. TC and Infiltrators are working as intended as per BioWare's design: A stealth based class with high damage first strike capability. That's exactly what they are.

Also curious why you single out Infiltrators to try and force them to make "meaningful choices" when the entire game is littered with "no brainer" skill choices for every class and race. <_<

Modifié par Mal3fact0r, 14 juin 2012 - 05:32 .

[Kickiluxxx]

Signed

[kevchy]

SIGNED

[Lexa_D]

Bahahaha, "how dare you assume your opinion is more important than mine just because it's a fact (= true)" - oh, what an amusing person.

Not signed, clearly, this whiny entitlement-ridden petition. Go out there and do a 20 min gold solo with any other class - heck, even 25 min will do! "Oh, don't touch my Win button"

[holdenagincourt]

BoomDynamite wrote...

Let's get back on topic. NO FLAMING GUYS.

Ah well. Robert Verdi, you heard the man. I'm going to have to escort you out of this thread. No...no, Robert, please don't make a scene. Yes, we can stop at the Starbucks drive-thru on the way to the studio.

[paperbook]

Not signed. TC must be seriously nerfed.